Having complained of people posting off topic, it seems a reasonable solution to give an opportunity for people to discuss the topics I am banning from other threads – of which 9/11 seems the most popular.
I do not believe that the US government, or any of its agencies, were responsible for 9/11. It would just need too many people to be involved. Someone would have objected. There are some strange and dangerous people in America, but not in sufficient concentration for this one. They couldn’t even keep Watergate quiet, and that was a small group. Any group I can think of – even Blackwater – would contain operatives with scruples about blowing up New York. They may be sadly ready to kill people in poor countries, but Americans en masse? Somebody would say it wasn’t a good idea.
I asked a friend in the construction industry what it would take to demolish the twin towers. He replied nine months, 80 men, and 12 miles of cabling. The notion that a small team at night could plant sufficient explosives embedded at key points, is laughable.
The forces of the aircraft impacts must have been amazingly high. I have no difficulty imagining they would bring down the building. As for WTC 7, again the kinetic energy of the collapse of the twin towers must be immense.
I admit to a private speculation about WTC7. Unfortunately in construction it is extremely common for contractors not to fix or install properly all the expensive girders, ties and rebar that are supposed to be enclosed in the concrete. Supervising contractors and municipal inspectors can be corrupt. I recall vividly that in London some years ago a tragedy occurred when a simple gas oven explosion brought down the whole side of a tower block.
The inquiry found that the building contractor had simply omitted the ties that bound the girders at the corners, all encased in concrete. If a gas oven had not blown up, nobody would have found out. Buildings I strongly suspect are very often not as strong as they are supposed to be, with contractors skimping on apparently redundant protection. The sort of sordid thing you might not want too deeply investigated in the event of a national tragedy.
Precisely what happened at the Pentagon I am less sure. There is not the conclusive film and photographic evidence that there is for New York. I am particularly puzzled by the much more skilled feat of flying that would be required to hit a building virtually at ground level, in an urban area, after a lamppost clipping route – very hard to see how a non-professional pilot did that. But I can think of a number of possible scenarios where the official explanation is not quite the whole truth on the Pentagon, but which do not necessitate a belief that the US government or Dick Cheney was behind the attack.
In my view the real scandal of 9/11 was that it was blowback – the product of a malignant terrorist agency whose origins lay in CIA funding and provision. Also blowback in a more general sense that it was spawned in the nasty theocratic dictatorship of Saudi Arabia which is so close to the US and to the Bush dynasty in particular. As with almost all terrorist activity, I do not rule out any point on the whole spectrum of surveillance, penetration and agent provocateur activity by any number of possible actors.
But was 9/11 false flag and controlled demolition? No, I think not.
(Now I have given full opportunity to discuss 9/11 here, any further references on other threads will be instantly deleted).
Hey shithead,Larry!
Abuse Craig and STW one minute then cling to their coat-tails the next to bolster an argument you and the disinfo team lost utterly.
Won’t wash you nebbish!
Silverstien makes a strange big mumble in the middle.. ill transcribe again:
“i remember getting a call from the uh fire department commander..telling me that they were not sure that they were gonna be able to contain the fire. I said you know weve had such terrible loss of life ~um mus ma smn mss(??) just Pull It(!) eeer and they made tha decision to pull and den’we watched the building, collapse”
Larry: “crab,you fucking moron … you’re so deafened by the noise of your 911 religion, you can’t even hear correctly”
I got one “we” mixed up with “they” -it doesnt change the meaning. He was either advising or just being agreeable with the fire department commander.
The crux is how you choose to interpret “just pull it” and “the decision to pull”. (in the light of everything else that was remarkable about how wtc7 ‘collapsed’)
Nice work screaming moron over an irrelevent typo larry lecter.
it’s not an irrelevant typo … most conspiraloons cite it as “we made the decision”
so … are you accusing Chief Nigro of having blown up WTC 7?
it’s also what you think of the word “pull”
“pull” meant “pull out the firemen”
there are contemporaneous references to that as the meaning
jesus this shit was part of the dumb conspiracy in 2004 … the conspiraloons in the States won’t even touch this one because it’s obviously a dumb argument
I just looked up the claim of “83 cameras”
I’d love to know where that number came from originally, but I’m sure that it was some dumbass right-wing American truthtard who pulled it out of his ass.
you people are so fucking manipulated.
http://www.debunk911myths.org/topics/Larry_Silverstein
dreoilin,
In addition to the photographic evidence, what do you do with the massive mountain of other evidence?
http://debunk911myths.org/topics/Pentagon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkxRh2sXGdI
Larry there is a video of your old sweet heart, hes wearing the watch and the ring you gave him. That not him? Strange, your whitehouse released it to world claiming it was him admitting to the 911 attacks.
Are you sure its not him larry? Hes got that loveable beard, and hes wearing a turban!
Oh i dont know what to believe anymore.
Do you people understand your cult thinking? Do you not realize that you’ve joined a cult?
If someone had been standing at the Pentagon pointing an IMAX camera at the point that the jet smashed into the building, you wouldn’t believe it.
There’s no convincing you morons.
Lots of (officialy encouraged) fog around the pentagon attack, beware.
http://911research.wtc7.net/faq/pentagon.html
“Lots of (officialy encouraged) fog around the pentagon attack, beware.”
Crab, you’re an idiot with narcissistic personality disorder.
Yes, there are other morons out there who suggest that there was no plane at the Pentagon, or that laser beams took down the Towers, but they’re just people like you who signed on for a different aspect of the cult.
You call them disinfo agents; they call you disinfo agents.
And the rational people of the world sit back and laugh.
The government wants you to pay your taxes and not commit crimes. Otherwise, they don’t care about you. Even though you really need them to do so.
Don’t worry about the [approximate] number 83, honey, just post *your link to your best picture of the plane*.
Posted by: dreoilin at February 16, 2010 6:32 PM
Why do you think there would be a crisp picture in the first place?
You seem to be suggesting that an event did not occur if there’s not a perfect picture to document it. You’re perfectly comfortable ignoring all of the forensic evidence, other photographic evidence and all other evidence.
Do you not think that a plane hit the Pentagon? And don’t give me the “just asking questions” bullshit; you nutters have had almost 9 years to come up with something definitive.
larry wrote:
are you accusing Chief Nigro of having blown up WTC 7?
“pull” meant “pull out the firemen”
there are contemporaneous references to that as the meaning
jesus this shit was part of the dumb conspiracy in 2004 … the conspiraloons in the States won’t even touch this one because it’s obviously a dumb argument
—
It’s not a dumb arguement, it is an ambiguous but suspicious recording.
“Just pull it” could possibly mean “give up fighting the (supposed) fires”
“Just pull OUT” would have explicity meant that. (These fires that were so big that raged for 7 hours, yet there is only a handful of blurry photos of them on dummiesdebunking.org)
“They made the decision to pull”
Is a little more explicit, but still ambiguous.
The ambiguity is explained by the psychology of lying, freudian slippage, since the rest of the terror myth is bullshit larry.
Non-explosive yet rapid collapses of sturdy modern skyscrapers shooting supershrapnel 400 foot indeed!
Crab, are you accusing Chief Nigro of having blown up WTC 7? Are you also now accusing him of blowing up the Towers? (or igniting the supersecretthermite, or whatever you nuts are now claiming)
Are you holding Chief Nigro personally responsible? Did he kill hundreds of his fellow FDNY?
dreoilin,
Craig Murray doesn’t merely disagree with you … he calls you a “conspiraloon” (his term).
So why do you visit this site? You’re a nutter to him.
Before you ask … I come here because this is where the nutters are!
Larry: Did he kill hundreds of his fellow FDNY?
Larry, you shout moron at people all the time, but you ask for stupid responses. Do you think i would take Silverstien at his word?
Do you think?
“Crab, you’re an idiot with narcissistic personality disorder.”
Coming from the most disordered personality in St Louis, ill take that as a compliment thanks 😡
“Larry, you shout moron at people all the time, but you ask for stupid responses. Do you think i would take Silverstien at his word? ”
So apparently you were prepared to blame Silverstein for blowing up WTC7, right? But when I point out to you that Chief Nigro made the decision to “pull” (that is, pull out the firefighters), are you trying to run away from your obvious accusation that Chief Nigro killed hundreds of his fellow FDNY?
If you World Trade Center conspiracy nutters don’t understand that you’re accusing the Fire Department of New York of the mass murder of firefighters, then you’re dumber than I thought.
L: “But when I point out to you that Chief Nigro made the decision to “pull” ”
I see whats happened here, you have an inflated opinion of your own credibility Larry. -You may point out Chief Nigro made the decision to put sugar in his starbucks chocamocha, no one believes you until you site some reasonable source or arguement. Which you never ever do, big L
Fire! Fire!
Fire! Fire!
Fetch the engine, fetch the engine!
Crab, you got lost in your own silly claims. Silverstein was on the phone with Nigro. Your video, which you linked to, from which you attempted to make a case, and which you subsequently misquoted, had Silverstein saying that they made the decision to pull. He was talking about the FDNY, you moron. And he was talking about Chief Nigro, because Nigro was in charge and he was on the phone with Nigro.
You can’t keep your crazy straight.
Larry, try and collect you thoughts. The video wasnt of the phone call, it was Silverstein recalling the supposed phone call – it doesnt prove anything, its just Silversteins strangely worded account.
Secondly YOU said, they pulled the FDNY out of wtc7, and so did Silverstein by your faithful interpretation (pull it).
So even in the strange concocted charge of yours, wtc7s collapse did not kill hundreds of FDNY.
You need to take a good break buster.
Why did you post the Silverstein video?
Larry you dingbat!
Evidently you’re bringing up 911 on the other threads as well.Seems like you lost your way big time,nebbish!
This idea you’ve taken it into your tiny mind to purvey that those who challenge the 911 story are mind manipulated is fantasy on your part.
What the Bejeez do you think 911 was if not an exercise in mass brainwashing?
Mind control research has been carried out over centuries by intelligence agencies like MI5 and the CIA.Have you never heard of Tavistock or MK Ultra?
Torture and repeated trauma on individuals yields lessons that can be applied to society at large.That’s one of the reasons they do it,dickbrain-or are you in denial re-US/UK participation in torture as well as re-911?
Such thinking re-the potential of torture,shock to control people motivated the 911 planners.German psychologist Kurt Lewin appointed Tavistock director in 1932 pioneered the idea of inducing terror on a widespread basis into society.Society would then revert to a tabula rasa=blank slate that could be used by elite planners to elicit compliance from domestic populatins.
Lewin’s plan was to use controlled chaos to induce the population to submit to greater control.Society should be driven to a state equivalent to an early childhood situation.
It’s clearly worked with this guy,Larry whose frequent infantile regressions bear eloquent witness to the efficacy of Lewin’s system.
911 was designed by elite planners like Lewin for its shock value.Its aftermath allowed them to impose a security crackdown,an expensive military build-up and wars in Afghanistan and Iraq on a stunned population.
Lewin laid out the blueprint long before 911 knowing the potential for mind control that deliberately induced fear,anxiety or excitement in a population might elicit.
Tavistock also envisaged assassinations could be used for similar shock value.JFK for example with his numerous health problems could easily have been disposed of in a less public way.Instead the shock of the President being shot down like a dog in the street delivered the US public into the near comatose state to render them susceptible to a bout of general reprogramming.Standard Tavistock modus operandi.
If anybody is the victim of mind control it’s saps like airhead Larry and angri who after nine years are still so traumatized by the events of 911 that they cling to official fantasies like the state-sanctioned account with all the tenacity of small children clinging to their favourite toy.
Degenerate dickbrains!
lry: Why did you post the Silverstein video?
Because i think he made a clear freudian slip, he should have said “pull out” or “pull them out” but he said “pull IT”
And the reason why your feigning confused questions about it larry is, it is weak evidence compared to the 400ft flying supershrapnel from wtc1, 7 hour photovoid, classic freefall footprint collapse, media’s 20minute preannouncement of its ever so neat collapse, Sonnenfeld’s story, etc..
Once upon a time, in the Land of Nod…
In Greenwich Village, there is a shop shaped like a triangle, taller than it is, long, in which at one end there sits a man on a high stool. The man is smoking a curly pipe.
Go there.
“The American oligarchy spares no pains in promoting the belief that it does not exist, but the success of its disappearing act depends on equally strenuous efforts on the part of an American public anxious to believe in egalitarian fictions and unwilling to see what is hidden in plain sight.” – Michael Lind
crab, if you could read, you’d know that there were contemporaneous expressions that day of “pull it” meaning “get the firefighters out”
“American public anxious to believe in egalitarian fictions”
You see, that’s why I bring up the fact that Craig Murray and the anti-war movement in the UK want nothing to do with you.
You’re trying to twist the fact that Americans don’t tend to believe in conspiracies on the naivety of Americans. This has happened many times before.
What people like you forget to think about is that the same percentage of people in the UK don’t believe in this nonsense. Craig Murray and the vast majority of the anti-war movement serve as evidence of this.
And dreoilin – Michael Lind doesn’t remotely believe in your dumbass Pentagon conspiracy theory. Try again.