The London Olympics are already achieving the number one aim of the politicians who brought them here, which is making our politicians feel very important indeed.
The media is quite frenetic in its efforts to make us all believe we should be terrifically proud of the fact we are hosting the Olympics, as though there were something unique in this achievement. If we can’t competently do something that Greece, Spain and China have done in recent years, that would be remarkable. Of course the Games will be on the whole well delivered, sufficient for the media and politicians to declare it an ecstatic success. Some of the sporting moments will be sublime, as ever.
But did it have to be in London? We won’t know the total cost of the Games for months, but it will cost the taxpayer at least £9 billion and I suspect a lot more. I also suspect the GDP figures will, in the event, show that the massive net fall in visitor numbers has hurt the already shrinking economy further.
But to take the most optimistic figure, holding the Olympics in London has cost every person in the country an average of £150 per head in extra taxes. That is £600 for a family of four. Actually it is in the end going to be well over £2,000, as of course the money has been borrowed on the never never, and taxpayers are going to be paying it off their whole lives, along with the sum ten times higher they are already paying direct into the pockets of the bankers through their taxes.
The very rich, of course, don’t pay much tax, so they are not worried.
But to take just the figure of £600 extra taxes for a family of four, the lowest possible amount, and not including the interest. Is having the Olympics here really worth paying out £600 for? If Tony Blair had approached the head of the family and said “We are going to have the Olympics in London, but it’s going to cost you £600, would the answer have been from most ordinary people: “Yes, great idea, this is that important to us”?
People are not disconcerted because they don’t see that they have to pay. There is no special Olympics tax, and they pay their taxes in a variety of ways, and individuals are not the sole source of taxation. But this is nonetheless real money taken from the people in pursuit of the hubris of politicians.
I love sport. I hate the corruption of the International Olympic Committee, Fifa and the rest; I hate the vicious corporatism and militarisation of our capital and absurd elitism of the transport lanes; the sport itself I love. But with the economy contracting, and the NHS being farmed out for profit, is it really worth £600 for a family – and many families are really struggling in a heartbreaking way – is it worth the money to have the Olympics here rather than in Paris?
Of course it isn’t. I think many of us will feel an extra pleasure watching the Opening ceremony because it is British. Patriotic pride will surge. It is not wrong to enjoy the spectacle tonight on TV. The corporate well connected and ruling classes will enjoy it in the stadium.
But after you have watched it on TV, ask yourself this question. How much more did you enjoy it than enjoy watching the Beijing ceremony, and was that margin of extra enjoyment something that everybody in the room would have paid out £150 for?
Because they just did.
I believe that what you did there, Clark, was ill-advised to say the least. I have never before seen an alleged private conversation between blog commenters dragged onto the public comments section by one of the parties to that alleged conversation – a moderator to boot.
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Private is private in my book. Not for reference in blog comments. If you wanted to get rid of Technicolour (you feel that Komodo is a more ‘worthy’ contributor?) you certainly went the right way about it.
Take care
Nuid, I hate this. I was sent a moderator’s login, I never asked for it. I made my suggestions about how to keep the blog spam-free and well behaved without manual maintenance, but my suggestions were not adopted. They still could be implemented.
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Technicolour wanted a fight, and got one. I stayed out of it for ages.
It appeared, Clark, but now it’s gone, which looks like a deletion to me. Anyway, delete it, queue it, do you want with it – discussion of [censored] is clearly too “boring” [ie, important, contentious, but we really don’t want to have to face up to it] for some, so best get back to the Jews, ziofuckwits and jet-fighter manoeuvres over Norfolk, before someone dies of boredom. Last time I’m commenting here, probably to everyone’s delight. Farewell.
Pictures often tell a thousand words. If you want to see racism in action, see the bewilderment in the eyes of the little Sudanese children being deported from Ben Gurion and the Eritrean who had been stabbed by a settler. Also chilling are the PA Gayton/Blair thugs in action against their brothers.
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http://electronicintifada.net/content/month-pictures-july-2012/11557
Mary,
The irony of ironies, the photo of the Prohibition Sign, overlooking the hamlet (settlers houses in all probability), fact that most of the Palestinian territories are a free fire zone is evidently lost on the sign erectors.
No jet fighters or missile batteries here in Edinburgh, very civilised,but full of english ego’comedians trying tocompete with craigs blog. Ifeel that unless the changes outlined by Clark are implemented, this blog will eat itself…
Schofeild’s dream – amazing! There is only one way to resolve this…
“Nuid, I hate this. I was sent a moderator’s login, I never asked for it.”
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Clark, I know the job is far from easy, and I think I’ve complimented yourself and Jon previously for the good job you’ve been doing. (I was moderator of several Yahoogroups in my time, so I’ve a fair idea of what is involved if/when the owner is running a good ship.)
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“Technicolour wanted a fight, and got one.”
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To be fair, Technicolour was told rather patronisingly to “Calm down”. I’d probably have responded much as Tech did.
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Anyway, not surprised you’d want to shut down the immigration topic. It’s clearly very divisive. And Glenn_uk’s comments were interesting.
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Passerby, not ignoring you, sorry. I have no idea how the Irish (in particular) came to be white, but I’ll check it out.
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I’ll see you all later, sometime
There’s a change.org petition calling on the US and its allies and Russia and its to stop arming the two sides in Syria and put pressure on them to negotiate instead here
http://www.change.org/petitions/united-states-and-russian-governments-stop-escalating-hostilities-in-syria
It only has 61 signatures so far (one is Noam Chomsky’s but that still only counts as one). Everyone who agrees please sign it and forward it to anyone else you think might sign by email – and post it on facebook
Recorded from Syrian Official Tv Channel
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMOYR4Hog5o&feature=plcp
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{https://www.facebook.com/Tg24Siria}
Terrorists Killed during Attempt to Storm Aleppo TV & Radio Center… Authorities Clash with Terrorists in Several Areas.
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http://syrianfreepress.wordpress.com/2012/08/04/terrorists-killed-during-attempt-to-storm-aleppo-tv-radio-center-terroristi-neutralizzati-nel-loro-tentativo-di-assaltare-il-centro-radiotelevisivo-di-aleppo/
Duncan McFarlane,
To consider the illegitimate bunch of hooligans on their smash and grab frenzy as the other side of the equation in the Syrian “fight”, or the overblown reportage of some sort of an unrest in Syria, is indeed a leap of faith. Did anyone refer to the London rioters as the “English Free Army”?
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Then there is question of Arming of both sides. On one side a legitimate army of a country to be sanctioned against, whilst the proxy mercenaries getting funded by the various dictatorships to buy the stuff they need on the black market.
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Who set up this petition? Why don’t they just ask for UN chapter seven resolution and get Nato to attack Syria and be over and done with?
Hi Fedup – it’s not about saying either side is legitimate, it’s about trying to avoid the risk of a long civil war with a lot of civilians killed by some people on each side – and ending the chaos that’s allowing Al Qa’ida to operate in Syria.
As far as i can find out both sides have committed atrocities against civilians, with the Syrian military responsible for more because they are better armed.
I don’t see why it’s necessary to back Assad’s regime (with its long history of torture and massacres – including doing “extraordinary rendition” work for the US in the not so distant past) in order to be in favour of trying to end the war in Syria rather than make it worse.
Syria has never been a democracy either, so calling Assad’s government “legitimate” is about as convincing as calling the Saudi or Bahraini monarchy or Karimov’s dictatorship in Uzbekistan or the dictatorship of Kazakhstan which has hired Tony Blair as it’s adviser “legitimate”.
and P.S some of the Syrian opposition to Assad are not armed and are against armed rebellion – negotiations could include them, but would have to include some of the armed rebels too, just as it would have to include some of Assad’s government, since no peace negotiations will work if everyone is still fighting during them.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jul/29/syria-route-of-compromise?newsfeed=true
On the Olympics Craig Murray is spot-on. It’s a corporate jamboree. The military crack-down and police state are just around the corner.
The British public are putty in the hands of the mind-control merchants of death.
Syria is the only other news seeping through the Olympic saturation coverage. Behind the media black-out the CRASH is waiting to happen. The banking cartel are going to bale themselves out with WW3 after they’ve cleaned up on the Olympics.
Reckon they’ll foil a major “terror plot” at the closing ceremony to convince the sheeple that all the expensive security and trampling all over our gardens was worth it. There’s a lot of predictive programming afoot.
So taking stock as the sheeple have been whipped into a patriotic frenzy with Wimbledon Murray mania, Euro soccer, Tour de France and now the Olympics am I the only person in UK who thinks maybe this country has one massive inferiority complex?
I mean-yes, we won the Tour de France for the first time but was it necessary to drag out that appalling Lesley Garret in a Union Jack dress and have her belt out the National Anthem on the Champs Elysee? I cringed with embarrassment.
What the blazes happened to good old-fashioned English understatement?
This country, its sports and professions has been utterly proletarianized.
Bread and circuses? That’s about right!
Duncan McFarlane,
Hi there,
The Syrian government did agree to free democratic elections earlier in the year so they were obviously trying to slowly democratise themselves. But the petition can’t do any harm im sure, allthough a petition to stop the validity of Nato and the Security council would be just as worthwhile
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WI3p5sJaDxo&feature=relmfu
Hi all. Thought I’d check in to see how everyone’s doing on a somewhat “spirited” thread, but as ever, I am late to the party. I can’t compete at all with Clark’s round-the-clock effort. Moderation is indeed hard.
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For what it’s worth, I think both sides in the debate said some interesting things. Personally, I’ve traditionally taken the perspective of the socialist left, which is very hardline against even slightly racially-charged positions – that probably comes from the British traditions of strong anti-fascism. But of late I’ve seen cracks in the canvas, and am warming to the idea people should be able to state their honest view on immigration without +necessarily+ being charged with racism.
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However, this in itself reveals the difficult spot for both sides. One the one hand, progressive non-racists who express a wish to slow immigration rates are saying things that are alarmingly similar to real racists – sadly the Far Right has pushed moderate people into a very unpleasant corner. Equally, as Komodo said, the Leftist soft-spot is that all debate is shut down with trigger-sensitive “socialist McCarthyism” – and I should own up to having done that in the past.
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Similarly, one of the interesting features of the left-right +economic+ analysis of immigration is that the Right, traditionally in favour of free markets, should be entirely comfortable with unlimited immigration, since border controls are an impediment to free movement of labour. But, given that in most developed countries we have a permanent stalemate between capitalism and statism, entirely unimpeded net immigration would presumably cause such a strain on state provision (health and welfare) that it would be unable to cope. Equally uncomfortable are us Leftists, who worry – as was mentioned earlier – that our well-meaning enthusiasm for multiculturalism has become a tool of corporate capitalism. So, it’s no wonder we’re all feeling a bit raw about this! It’s a real conflict of anyone’s principles.
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I was rather interested in Komodo’s “good nationalism”. I can’t say the idea naturally appeals to me, since I think it can appeal to negative tribalism that I tend to deplore (racism, football violence, Israel/Palestine or any warring neighbours, etc). But Orwell’s Lion And The Unicorn, recently recommended on this site by a commenter, describes a “messy English socialism” that is proud of its roots and retains the Monarchy. If anyone is interested in that strand of Komodo’s suggestion, that book is relevant – and a great read anyway.
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So… hopefully we can draw a line under the little exchange of fire we’ve had here – not a new occurrence by any stretch! – and carry on as before. I’ll email Clark and offer a second opinion on the suspended posts, since I’ve not been involved in the debate. All of the regular contributors here are highly valued on this board, and I trust that Komodo, Tech and all the others will be happy to stay and offer their continued input.
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Hugs all ’round!
Jeremy and Rupert are as friendly as ever. No surprise there.
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Culture Secretary talks with News Corp head outside the Aquatics Centre
http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/politics/2012/08/video-jeremy-hunt-greets-rupert-murdoch-olympics
Apostate Thank God I missed Lesley Garrett in France. How dare they do that in a foreign country?
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The plasticized Katherine Jenkins singing it at the Derby in her inappropriate low cut evening gown in the middle of the afternoon was bad enough. She should have stayed in Amerika and continued with the dancing show.
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http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/1U2uy-4_lGf/Epsom+Races+The+Derby+Festival/7jCn8BLdqVF/Katherine+Jenkins
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I am so sick of the sound of the national anthem and the sight of the union flag.
Duncan –There is no nothing whatsoever to suggest that there was or is any risk of a long civil war or anything approaching it breaking out under President Assad, less so as the ‘regime’ has mass-support, more legitimacy than any modern-era UK or US leadership ever had, cannot be described as a minority Alawite administration as there is a plurality of almost every sect in his government. The risk – the certainty – of a civil war is assured by western aligned tyrannies (UK, US, Israel,Turkish Saudi French, German etc.) pouring in arms, ammunition, explosives, and deranged hired killer mercenary scum. You tell me how on earth doing this can be interpreted as trying to end the war rather than make it worse, it is calculated to create appalling conditions and make things immeasurably worse.
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Alleged atrocities by the Syrian government forces have been overstated if not entirely bogus, the screaming lying headlines and tv reports we’ve been bombarded with are artless propaganda, particularly by the BBC which really ought to raise its own militia and go forth and fight themselves than exhort others to support such UK state-sponsored terrorism.
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What is your own definition of a democracy, because whoever we and people’s in many other so-called democracies vote for we get the same policies, which we find abhorrent and just wrong, war after war has been waged with no support or just cause, after six months of propaganda bombardment, we’re still not buying the false narratives about Syria. As for the non-fighting overwhelming Syrian majority they’ve spoken loudly and clearly in a referendum with over 80% support for Assad’s democratising reforms.
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Representative democracy has failed us, we need participatory democracy, with frequent referenda to establish the people’s will and ensure it is carried out in letter and spirit.
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However bad you or anyone might wish to paint the present Syrian government, our own, the Israeli and US goverments are incomparably infinitesimally worse by any measure.
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Blair was simply deranged, Cameron, Hague etc. are spineless puppets of a purer evil.
Hi Duncan, as you have already mentioned Assad was the darling of the US and toadies, during the early years of attacks on Iraq, and he was kept quite busy with the renditions by CIA, for torture and information extraction. In fact Assad was standing in pose in front of No. 10 with that war criminal tony blair, for photos.
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Therefore to find suddenly he is illegitimate is a bit of convenient coincidence. The fact that Kofi Annan was pulled out of the mothballs and sent to the area, is telling of the trust deficit that UN, and ultimately US and toadies Inc. are facing, further with respect to their dealings with the rest of the world, and their slight of hand in circumventing the most basic tenets of human rights, which is the right of self determination. Annan was in fact the decoy to get the Syrian war going. However Annan realising his position soon got of Dodge and left in his wake the usual double edge sword for the benefit of both sides. Although Annan had achieved in legitimising the opposition in Syria that is a fragmented hotchpotch of dissidents, criminal, terrorist, Islamists, profiteers and privateers.
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From the point of humanity, the only way forward is to stop aiding the “rebels” and funding these. Only then can there be a situation in which internal opposition groups can get involved in some kind of power brokerage agreement and dispute resolution. I do not doubt your integrity Duncan, however there are those who are using this situation for their own ends. The opposition spokesperson one Bassma Kodmani and her connections to shadowy Bilderberg speaks volumes of the depths of murky dealings surrounding the Syrian opposition in exile. Further, as we debate the said opposition in exile is being coached by various US mentors.
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Therefore the notions of introduction of sanctions against Syrian army is yet another step in the direction of stripping the fighting capabilities of the Syrian army en route to invasion of the place. There is no other reason for this bizarre petition. Chomsky the gatekeeper signing it, is a kind of an spiritual alya that he is making, because soon as the Assad falls, isreal will be annexing the Golan Heights and the fertile lands of the Golan region, if not moving further into the Syrian lands. In fact the isreali knesset has already passed the relevant laws, and these are awaiting their enforcement.
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Finally these days the cultural chauvinism of the west is the stuff of legends, evidently the matters of sovereignty and self determination are no longer up to the johnny foreigner and his kind, we in the West know what is best for them. Therefore, the petition forwarded is in fact yet another move by the belligerents in attacking Syria, this time with the weapon of kindness, there again the same sickos had devised “gayness bombs” and spent a fortune on it too. So no surprises there either.
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If you recollect the “colour revolutions” which were the rage in the mid last decade era, and have resulted in the most brutal dictatorships that are ran from Washington DC, and London, this “Arab Spring” lark is in fact the same colour revolutions on steroids and with a considerable punch packed into these.
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Notwithstanding the above, stop qualifying your unsupport for Assad, our Government is elected through a system of parties that combined represent less than one half of a million membership, and elections that are based on two thirds of electorate boycotting these. However no one ever comes out and calls out these illegitimate bastards who are lording it over us all, perhaps it is time for maturity and care ought to be used not to echo the “thoughts” that the little nice man of Bullshit Broadcasting Corporation told us all to be our thought own “thoughts”.
Good on you Jon and All!
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Mary thankyou for the word on Gould Statement.
About those innappropriate warblers, i have an occasional grin for the farcical side. If its not one thing itll be another.
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Here is a special website with some newsfeed on the blackout of the Syrian Arab News Agency’s website and mystery Dallas server.
http://counterpsyops.com/tag/sana/
Apostate,
You have fallen for the dog and pony show there mate. As a rule the host country always gets some trophies, sort of “pity medals” to compensate for the huge expenses incurred, it is always the same, check out the host versus medals curve. and then compare the same nations achievements in other international sports gatherings. We live in an era in which everything is fucking fake/plastic. Circuses that is all, keeps the plebs happy.
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Already there has been a “terror attack” but the chap is probably white and that is why there has not been any screaming headlines; henny penny skies are falling, alkaidy on our shores and stuff, “use the missile batteries already I say”.
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In cheadle there have been three explosions, three houses have been attacked. However the Police are taking their usual measures; pretending the attacks are the work of criminals, and due to the disputes arising among the criminal fraternity. This is supposed to make the souls caught up in the vicinity of explosions area at ease, and put their mind at rest that it is karma catching up with criminals, and not the fact that the police are no longer in fucking control of the streets.
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The news about these explosions so far have been very sketchy.
I don’t make any distinction between a government killing or not its ‘own’ people and a government (ours) killing citizens of other countries. Any equivocation on that suggests that the one persons right to life is less or more than anothers. Both situations are equally depraved. Government or a cabal of government’s policy objectives which can only be obtained by any or by diffuse bloodshed, can never be anything than contemptible and the policy and those who pursued it must be purged and held to account. Let Syrians sort out Assad, we have a far greater nest of vipers in Downing Street and in the London Parliament.
So many troops to guard the obvious, but they still don’t have a clue what is inside at Sellafield silo # 38.I had no idea it was 6 sq miles in size. When I was a kid they called it Windscale, but the accident meant they had to rebrand.Well at least drones being put to good use and saving human lives.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/03/drone-probe-sellafield-silos-hexacopter?newsfeed=true
I remember a sketch from Ben Elton talking about how safe it was. They had erected barb wire fences to stop the radio activity escaping. It’s all locked in, but they don’t know what IT is.
Fedup – I certainly agree that western democracies could be a lot more democratic (e.g we need PR for elections in the UK) and have too much corruption (largely through allowing private donations to parties and election campaigns and allowing a revolving door between business and government departments regulating and giving contracts to the same business sectors)
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However we do at least have free speech and the right to vote for any party or for independent candidates, or set up our own parties and if smaller parties win an election they can govern. In Syria there is effectively a one party state in which, no matter what the election result, the governing party stays in power. Their state media are even more biased than the BBC (whose website gives decent coverage sometimes even if their TV reports are mostly pretty woeful) – and criticising Assad can get you killed, just as supporting him can now get you killed by the rebels.
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Election turnout in the UK is usually around 60% , so two thirds don’t boycott elections – unless you mean local council elections, where most people don’t bother to vote as most of local councils’ powers have been taken form them by central government.
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A boycott of the vote in a democracy in which you can vote for any party, independents or stand yourself is also frankly just lazy and pointless – the only message it sends the big parties is they don’t have to worry what the people who don’t vote anyway think. The number one reason the big parties keep winning is that it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy by the voters – plus thanks to the 40% of people who don’t bother voting against them.
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While i agree there has probably been some exaggeration of Syrian government forces’ atrocities by the governments of the US and its allies and the truth is often hard to know in the middle of civil wars, there is not much doubt that Syrian government forces have used snipers on unarmed demonstrators and on mourners in funerals – and have used tanks, artillery and helicopters in fighting in cities, likely, as in the Coalition assaults on cities in Iraq, to kill lots of civilians as collateral damage – and, if they’re anything like e.g the Coalition assaults on Falluja, to involve targeting anyone and anything that moves with snipers too. (see Amnesty International’s 2012 report on Syria for instance http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/syria/report-2012 )
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Medicines Sans Frontieres volunteers in Syria have also been reporting for the last year that Syrian forces are targeting ambulances, medics, the wounded and makeshift clinics full of wounded people
http://www.msf.org.uk/Syria_repression_20120208.news
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I can’t see any logical reason to believe these sources in Bahrain and Yemen, but discount them in Syria – they have proven themselves reliable over decades.
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I don’t understand why you think the change.org petition or Chomsky are calling for Assad to be overthrown by force – they are calling for the opposite – for outside powers to stop arming the two sides and put pressure on both sides to negotiate, including those among the Syrian opposition who are entirely opposed to an armed uprising.
hi Chris – Syria remains a one party state. The elections Assad agreed to last year still didn’t allow any party except the Ba’ath party to form a government no matter the result (that’s before you even get on to the jail without trial, torture, killings of critics of Assad)
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Crytonym – i agree it’s not as simple as Assad only having the support of Christians and Alawites. Some of the clans supporting him in Aleppo for instance are Sunnis and General Tlass who defected was a senior Sunni general. There are also some Alawites among the opposition to Assad. However as soon as it becomes an armed conflict (which it has) the extremists and sectarians become involved (some of Assad’s Alawite supporters, plus Al Qa’ida, Salafists and other Sunni extremists among the rebels – these may be a minority on both sides, but that’s more than enough to risk a Lebanese or Iraq style sectarian civil war – maybe spilling over into both)
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While there has certainly been exaggeration of Syrian forces’ atrocities by western governments and some of the rebels, there are plenty of reports from Amnesty International and Medicines Sans Frontieres on torture and killings of civilians by Assad’s forces, including snipers firing on unarmed protesters and on funerals – and Syrian military targeting ambulances, medics, makeshift hospitals and wounded civilians. Both these sources have proven themselves reliable and neutral over decades , so there is no rational reason to disbelieve either of them whether on Bahrain, Yemen or Syria.
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http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/syria/report-2012
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for medicines sans frontieres see
http://www.msf.org.uk/Syria_repression_20120208.news
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I’ve no idea how you come to the strange conclusion that Chomsky or the change.org petition are calling for the violent overthrow of Assad and his government when they’re actually calling for both the US and its allies and Russia’s and it’s to stop arming the rebels and the Syrian military respectively, because a lot of civilians are being killed in the fighting, by both sides – and because in the chaos civil war could develop and Al Qa’ida are already operating freely.
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My definition of the minimum requirements for having some democracy are freedom of speech – i.e you can criticise the government without being jailed, tortured or killed for it (not true of Syria – and now not true for supporters of Assad either with rebels e.g killing state TV journalists) ; freedom from jail without trial ; being able to vote for any party or for independent candidates and with any parties or none being able to win elections (not true in Syria – only the Ba’ath party can form a government under it’s constitution).
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Western democracies are a long way from being fully democratic – largely due to private donations to parties and election campaigns being allowed and revolving door movement of people between jobs in government departments and in the businesses they regulate and give contracts to. I’d like to see public funding only of all candidates in elections and giving or recieving private political donations made a criminal offence. However we do have free speech and a relatively free media and can vote for anyone and any parties or independents elected could form a government if they win an election – the major thing preventing them being the 40% of people who don’t bother their arses voting against the big parties at elections.
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It’s not true that two thirds of people boycott elections in the UK – the usual turn-out in national elections is around 60%. Only in local elections is there a turnout of around a third – and that’s because national government has taken most of their powers away so local elections make only a minor difference.
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The only message that not voting sends the big parties’ leaders is that they don’t have to worry what you think, because you’ll never turn out to vote for any other party or candidate anyway. In a democracy where you can vote for any party, set up your own or stand as an independent, not voting is frankly lazy and pointless.
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The self-fulfilling prophecy attitude of most people who do vote (that only big parties can win) and the 40% who don’t bother voting are the main reason we’re stuck with the same big party governments funded by the same companies, billionaires and banks.
Jon,
Not to start the war all over again, there is a need here to visit the poor act of 1601, and the ensuing debate at the time about those poor who would have rushed to the districts with a better poor pay.
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For those whom can synthesise, the same facet of concerns apply to the immigration is all too similar. However, the poisoned well of the immigration is an explosive subject that has been further fanned by the zionist supremacists, in an attempt to bring about a reduction of the influence of the “Enemy Muslims” and deprive these from any influence on the current horribly inequitable situation in the mid east. This mode of behaviour is a kind of pre-emptive strike to disqualify the growing populations of the “Enemy Muslims” in various demographies in the West, and deprive these from exerting the proportional political pressures that would be the end of the ziofuckwits free reign in matters concerning the mid east.
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The fact that xenophobia taking hold will also adversely affect the same bunch of operators who have been promoting such irrational policies, too, never crossed their minds. Although this point is bound to be disputed, and vehemently denied but those of us whom have been fighting at the vanguard for years know the case to be otherwise.
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However to pick on the subject of immigration without addressing the causes of immigration is only a futile exercise in divisive mischief making. Further, referring back to the poor act of 1601 can you also discern the restrictions on the mass travel that have been set in place since the beginning of the current century? The fact is, too often punters forget about the best resources, that are at the disposal of the governments that can predict pretty accurately the peeks and troughs of the economic activities and correlate these to mass migrations. As well as the more obvious reasons for migration; Wars, famine, economic depression, persecution, etc.
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Finally the only way to reduce immigration is not to cause migration in the first place. Fact that a very narrow and obtuse strain of authoritarian plutocracy is the only proffered method of governance of US, UK et al, has a lot to do with the economic inactivity and despotism that is plaguing the source countries of the immigrants. I need not to go into details about the fact that Pakistan has levels of illiteracy running at 78 percent which translates to roughly seventy five million souls, and drones regularly targeting the poor bastards whom evidently are considered terrorist for wanting better sharing of the national income never gets any attention. On the other hand Ukraine post the “dash for democracy” is experiencing the worst economic down turn in its history, along with the other former eastern block countries.
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I don’t want to start the debate over again, but without taking into consideration the causes of migration, there can be no resolution other than the usual debate that almost borders racism.
Fedup wrote ” Fact that a very narrow and obtuse strain of authoritarian plutocracy is the only proffered method of governance of US, UK et al, has a lot to do with the economic inactivity and despotism that is plaguing the source countries of the immigrants.”
I agree with you there. The “developed world” governments mostly favour dictatorships and corrupt politicians in the “developing world” and Middle East because these minority governments are happy to sell out the majority of their own country by selling resources and labour dirt cheap in return for a far bigger share than they should be getting of the profits
Duncan wrote: “Syria remains a one party state. The elections Assad agreed to last year still didn’t allow any party except the Ba’ath party to form a government no matter the result (that’s before you even get on to the jail without trial, torture, killings of critics of Assad)”
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I have not seen specific evidence of that yet Duncan – have you any links? From the limited official reports i’ve seen it was a referendum on a new democratic constitution where a majority of 89% voted in favour, and according to RT for example,the resulting adopted constitution includes 14 new and 47 amended articles.
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To quote Neil Clarke from the below link: “The point is, that after five decades of one-party rule, Syrians have endorsed a new democratic constitution which provides for a new multiparty system, free elections and fixed Presidential terms. That’s something all true democrats should be lauding”
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Clark goes on to dispute whether western democracies have ever been anything but one party capitalist warmongering systems – simillar to the Ba’ath system,only subtler:
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“it’s clear that in the west there is a huge democratic deficit. The EU is fundamentally undemocratic. In the US ‘democracy’ effectively means the ‘right’ to choose between two pro-big business, pro-war parties. Ditto Australia. In Britain it means the ‘right’ to choose between three pro-big business, pro-war parties”
http://neilclark66.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/syrians-vote-for-democracy-and-western.html
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