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I first have to digest the idea (calculation) that SM could have arrived at Martinet as much as 14 minutes before WBM
This in relation to ONF1, ONF2, LMC … where would they have encoutered SM?
@Good In Parts
9 Jul, 2015 – 11:54 am
“Was there another MC? Claude Antoine mentions two mobylettes so was there another trail bike in addition to the gentle giant?”
GIP that’s the first time I have heard that .
@Peter
9 Jul, 2015 – 12:07 pm
I will take your word for it 🙂
@all
Another thing I remember being said on Icke was that we were told there were 2 women in the car with Bossy aka PD but when BM relates the tale of going back up with with PD he only mentions a woman staying in the car not women.
Can someone check who has links to hand.
I am wondering if the PD camping trip is just a cover story for who was in the car.
EM tried to keep PB under wraps in the beginning by saying BM called the emergency services and then giving an incorrect name for PB ,again could be for operational reasons until they had checked his story ,from our point of view it may be more significant than we first thought.
Quand avez-vous compris que c’Ă©tait autre chose ?
« Environ trente minutes plus tard, deux gendarmes habillĂ©s Ă la façon des commandos, qui n’Ă©taient visiblement pas de Doussard ou de Faverges, sont descendus vers nous, l’air de rien, pour nous demander si nous n’avions rien vu d’insolite rĂ©cemment. Nous leur avons rĂ©pondu que non. Que nous n’avions vu que deux ou trois voitures et deux mobylettes passer depuis le matin, et ils sont repartis. Leur tenue m’a mis la puce Ă l’oreille mais sans plus.
http://www.lessorsavoyard.fr/Actualite/Annecy/2012/12/18/article_claude_antoine_etait_aux_premieres_loges.shtml
I posted it a few days ago, old news but worth considering.
MM is on Facebook, his bike/s look just as described a, certainly not a large motorcycle or scooter. He was apparently circulating in the Bois du Droz. He must have left via the Combette when he heard the sirens (source: him)
Two women in the rear of the car, maybe it’s Martins accent that has confused ?
Pink
At first reading Claude Antoine might be refering to the LMC and the GG.
However I think that the LMC was a large capacity machine. This seems supported by the ED soundbite about not riding a Harley.
Secondly CA states “ils sont repartis”, thus he cannot be referring to the GG because the GG was (by his own admission) still up the combe when les pompiers etc arrived. The GG then exited the valley covertly, probably via la combette and certainly not by riding down the gendarme infested combe past CA’s house.
Here is the quote I am referring to:-
“Que nous n’avions vu que deux ou trois voitures et deux mobylettes passer depuis le matin, et ils sont repartis.”
The URL is as follows :-
http://www.lessorsavoyard.fr/Actualite/Annecy/2012/12/18/article_claude_antoine_etait_aux_premieres_loges.shtml
Vwola un twasyem moto!
Melrose, ‘et ils sont repartis’, the floor is yours.
Max
To me, one of the implications of LMC being discovered and excluded is that the MC that WBM crossed was not LMC.
Another implication would seem to be that the original guestimated timings as given by ONF1 and ONF2 seem to about right i.e. 3pm onwards.
The third implication would seem to be that a third ONF vehicle was in play (ONF3).
The key take-home is that when WBM gave a different description of the MC (that was generally presumed to be LMC) it was actually because he saw a different MC.
For M
SURREY Madness
Surrey Police helicopter has spotted hundreds of migrants running across
the M25 London Ring Road
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3155087/M25-brought-standstill-illegal-immigrants-jumped-lorry-ran-eight-lanes-traffic.html
What does seem quite strange is that nobody saw or heard a thing, yet at about the time of the slaughter the place was thronged, with Forest workers, maybe three lots, at least two motorcyclists at least three cyclists, several other car loads of people, yet nothing?
@M.
” et ils sont repartis “. The gendarmes I guess.
Having been with the police for over thirty years, Claude Antoine should know the difference between a mobylette, a trial bike and a ‘real’ motorbike. But what about route du Moulin.
Oh dear this will set the cat about the nuclear pigeons.
A weakness has been discovered in a French nuclear reactor of the type set to be built at Hinkley in the UK.
France’s nuclear safety regulator told the BBC the flaw in the steel housing the reactor core at the nuclear plant being built in Normandy is “serious”.
He added that unless he was satisfied with the plans to put it right, he could stop the project.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-33469774
So the faults in the construction of the AREVA EPR Reactor Pressure vessel
(50% reduction in strength) probably mean the project is economically dead in the water.
AREVA is already broke.
@Good In Parts
9 Jul, 2015 – 4:42 pm
Bois du Droz looks quite a way away is it likely he would have seen anyone who was trying to get away using that road to Arnand.
As there are forestry vehicles in Arnand I suppose seeing one of those would not be out of the ordinary it would have drawn attention on that day though so he would have said .
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Combe+d'Ir%C3%A9,+74210+Chevaline,+France/@45.7318452,6.2246886,15z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x478bbfd6d150b0ff:0xf55e5bc184f169e1
GIP,
same answer as M: voitures is feminine in French, so is mobylettes. Gendarmes is masculine (if at least one of them is male). Hence, ILS sont repartis refers to the gendarmes, not to the various vehicles.
It’s a bad habit the French have to speak French. Ask MN.
Pink, MM lives behind one of the forestry workers, Roland D.
La Combette begins/ends there. I suspect he used it to avoid the sirens.
That road that MM used when I was looking on google maps way back in 2012 it showed an energy business a little way up it any idea what that was/is ?
M. & Melrose
Thank you both. My schoolboy french led me badly astray!
Sadly it seems I learned nothing on that day trip to Calais.
Pink
Yes I am sure he was on the Bois du Droz at some stage (the origin of which name interestingly seems to be ‘Hill of the Combattants’).
However he claimed that he was actually on the other side of the valley when he heard the shots being fired. Which would make sense from an acoustic perspective. That would place him on Mont Benoit.
It is my opinion that he was on side track on the west side of the combe that leads away from the main track then back again ultimately ending up at the foot-crossing (or stepping stones) south of martinet parking.
@ GIP
I’m toying with the idea that WBM’s MC = Janin’s MC = X (and this ain’t LMC)
The whole ONF1, ONF2, LMC episode is around 15h. And WBM only saw the last bit of it. ONF2 going down.
WMC=JMC=X going counterclockwise to bump into SM. Maybe he did bump into SM beyond Martinet. SM turned around, trying to escape, MC following him, trying to make SM fall. That happened around Martinet. X got off his MC and started firing at the now running SM. Of course X didn’t see SAH. He killed them later (for being witness)
(speculative it may be, but I’ll throw it in the mix)
I’m glad Monty Python educated me about air speed velocity, but unfortunately, it never got beyond African and European swallows.
What are the French government’s pay rates for parental leave currently? Surely SM and/or CS would have applied for this benefit, kind of like l’assurance chĂ´mage. This might be why an employment lawyer is connected to this story. Could be something as simple as an employer issue over government benefits, which is never simple at all. Even if an employer must comply, some of them don’t make it easy, especially when a new program comes into effect.
Are self-employed workers entitled to parental leave benefits in France? If not, this could explain the decision for SM to take parental leave. This was his “last chance” to stay home with his baby, one that may not have come round before with his older children.
What are the occupations and employers of the SM sibs? Any new jobs since 5/9/2012? Have any of them relocated?
@ MAX 11.47 pm
in that scenario is there only one slaughterer on a motorcycle, who only wants to kill Sylvain Mollier, if that was true, it would make solving this heinous crime
much more easy to solve.
AREVA aware “as early as 2006” of serious fault in nuclear reactor destined for UK
FRENCH state-owned nuclear giant AREVA has been aware for almost a decade of critical anomalies in its new generation EPR plant in Flamanville, the same model sold to BRITAIN.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/energy/nuclearpower/11727000/Areva-aware-as-early-as-2006-of-serious-fault-in-nuclear-reactor-destined-for-UK.html
Despite this critical safety issue, according to Le Canard, AREVA had “not seen fit to alert anyone” about the problem “and continued construction as if nothing were amiss”.
That sounds like duplicity.
http://www.lepoint.fr/societe/epr-de-flamanville-areva-aurait-menti-08-07-2015-1943243_23.php
This is from 2010:
http://www.connexionfrance.com/maternity-paternity-leave-parental-rules-france-11284-news-article.html
Claire as Self-employed had 44 days which could be extended, paid at flat rate:
‘Self-employed mothers can claim parental leave pay from their social security office, called an indemnitĂ© journalière forfaitaire d’interruption d’activitĂ©.
It is paid out to women who stop work for at least 44 consecutive days, of which 14 must be before the planned date of birth. The leave can be extended by a further 15 or 30 days, and it is paid at a flat rate of €48.08 per day.’
Her company is Registered as a sole trader, she may well class herself as an employee.
Wiki has an entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_leave
Paternity Leave (for either parent) 156 weeks, paid at flat rate by Social Security.
I recall the proposals for the changes were still not law and Mollier was said to have negotiated his three year absence, when he was killed he was still inside the 3 months he was allowed.
Something for James and Max, I don’t recall who gave a time for Mollier setting off from home to go cycling, Blanvillain was asked about the reason why he was where he was, the question posed (see Max’s Sound Cloud):
JP : ‘Et est-ce qu’il avait parlĂ© Ă ses proches de son, de ce qu’il allait faire ce matin-lĂ , est-ce qu’on en sait plus sur la raison pour laquelle il s’est trouvĂ©, malheureusement pour lui, Ă cet endroit-lĂ , ce jour- lĂ ?’
THE MORNING !
If this is what happened, Mollier was on the final leg of his cycle ride, from Le Martinet to Ugine, downhill and on the flat, about 20kms, would that be about half an hour ?
Claire was not ‘self-employed’ (auto-entrepreneur). She was and is the employee, as a manager, of her own company. Her social benefits were those of any other employee.
” ce matin-lĂ ” sounds like the verbal complement of ” avait parlĂ© “. Doesn’t mean he took off in the morning, only means he might have indicated his destination earlier. No matter what, by 3.40 pm, he was certainly about to ride back home. Whether he was still uphill or already downhill cannot be deduced from that lawyer interview how would she know. Forty-five minutes would sound like a reasonable time on the way back.
Melrose, it coud be read like that, did he indicate his plans for the day before she left for work.
The problem with the timings is all about the shop opening hours, some internet sites say all day, others closed 12:15 to 2pm. (as does the new shop).
If she went home at lunchtime, it’s a bout 12kms, to see her baby, then returned to work for 2pm, she must have left almost immediately and returned to Ugine for Sylvain to go out.
That is why I wondered if it was more than a pleasantry.
@ M could you tell me what you mean “by a pleasantry”?
If as you are suggesting, she could have driven from Grignon to Ugine for her lunch break, then driven back from Ugine to her business in Grignon, she would be upset at being asked to drive back from Grignon to Ugine, yet again, unless there was a very, very good reason.
Is it possible for anybody to find out,
which fire station would Patrice Menegaldo work out of?
If Patrice Menegaldo worked out of the large Faverges fire station,
he could observe the Ugine to Faverges cycle track by looking out of the window in his flat in Ugine, or he could look at the cycle track adjacent to the Fire station whilst at work.
So that would be two opportunities to watch the cycle track.