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MN, you’re too brilliant to post here. You could easily get a job writing for the Mirror, or even for the Daily Fail. Your summary of The Slaughter Of The Horses is the best I’ve heard so far. Better than Panorama if that tells you something.
Why wait until May? I understand, from other sources, that thousands of readers are already devouring this wonder-ful book, full of exclusive interviews and other treasures.
Yep…
…nothing to play for.
Whoever the killer was (and whomever the target), you have to say…. he picked two of the most “bizarre” parties that were knocking around those hills that day.
Congrats….if you’re still alive !
The target? Saad and family were just collaterals. All their friends know this.
Today is the day
Following this complaint from the family of murdered French cyclist during the killing, the court decided to examine the complaint and the end of the deliberate setting has been set for FRIDAY 29 May 2015 .
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuerie_de_Chevaline&prev=search
Has anybody found out who is the family member of Syvain Mollier
who has caused this legal action to be initiated?
If five persons were shot, four al-Hilli family and one Frenchman,
only, apparently the French persons family have complained about the intrusion into their lives/grief.
Yet the intrusion into the life of the brother of Saad was tremnous, every detail of their history /movements/motives gone through with a fine-tooth-come, yet absolute minimum intrusion into the life of Sylvain Mollier and his family.
Yet we are told this affront was so great, they feel the need to have their day in court
In my view, this court case has been set up by the prosecutors office,
to serve their needs of secrecy.
You may be right, MN, but who cares? It is just the usual FRENCH burocratic game of smoke and mirrors. Like you say, nobody cares about the Al-Hillis, their little girls, beside their friends they lost in Claygate. Saad’s brother has always been playing games too. Don’t forget what Saad was saying on Skype.
Zaid has always said he is not going to FRANCE because he does not trust the FRENCH.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2301514/Zaid-Al-Hilli-brother-British-engineer-murdered-Alps-questioned-French-police.html
He thinks they are protecting a powerful FRENCH family
and they know who done it
Messed-up mountain feud: people with axes to grind (literally, in the middle of the night), engage in some back and forth: broadcasting recordings of “murder, murder, murder”; bizarre billboards on the lawn, verbal jousting and physical jousting with spades and pitchforks. The local goatkeeper sees a chance to knock down his adversary while he is trapped in the local phone booth and can presumably dial 9-1-1 for his own emergency. The matter comes to national attention only because this is the second time the phone booth has been destroyed by the local yahoos. Life carries on, with the spades and pitchforks settling ongoing disputes, until the phone booth is restored in time for the third coup de grace? No wonder they want it back so badly.
Does this sound like what happened at Chevaline?
No foreign ambassadors, no world media, no nuclear employees, no mass murders, no helicopters, just a bunch of local locos annoying the police and the judge, who has warned them to knock it off. Apparently, they misunderstood and knocked off the phone booth instead. Everyone knows what is going on. No mysteries there. No puzzled chief investigator scratching his head for years. No perfect crime.
No, Chevaline was not a mountain feud.
Q, you sound like a nice chap. So does M. A jolly good fellow, who knows a lot about the FFL.
But you people don’t realise what the French are capable of. The FRENCH are guilty. It’s because of them that the little girls can no longer see their friends. Mollier got killed, it could have been Meegaldo or any of them. Their like wild animals. They never drink tea.
This case is so full of red herrings; call it Billingsgate at sunset! But we are all emotionally attached to one or other of the more enticing scenarios. This hinders objective analysis.
The red herrings permit some sensational hypotheses. But the facts suggest a more mundane one:
• The murder weapon points clearly to a local killer – so goodbye Mossad et al;
• There is no evidence to link Saad and Sylvain – therefore no planned rendezvous between “spies”;
• Regardless of motive, there is no evidence that his brother hired a hitman to kill Saad and his family members, or would have known where to find him on the day of the murders.
So we conclude that either Sylvain was the target, or the killings were random and the work of a local psychopath. In the absence of any clear evidence of a motive to kill Sylvain, the “local nutter” thesis looks the most likely.
Could anything come to light that would subvert this conclusion? At this point I reveal my own prejudices:
• The “RAF guy” looks almost too good to be true in his interviews. If he was coached, who coached him, and why?
• I cannot really understand why Saad parked, front first, in the extreme top end of the parking area, unless it was to give his daughter some privacy as she relieved herself in the bushes. The natural thing to do would be to park at the other end of the area, so as to facilitate an easy exit or a U turn back down the hill.
• How long did Saad spend in the layby before the killings started? Just a few minutes, or longer?
• I am puzzled as to why Saad apparently reversed in order to escape, while leaving his daughter outside the car and thus vulnerable to the killer. (This would be the rational thing to do, but do doting fathers behave rationally under that kind of extreme pressure?)
• Where is the (right hand drive – British) 4 x 4 BMW? As far as I can see, this is still unaccounted for.
• Why has so much publicity been focused on the al Hilli family, whist the other victim (Sylvain Mollier) has enjoyed a relatively high degree of anonymity?
I expect that more facts will emerge, which may answer some of the questions set out above. But I doubt if they will change the central conclusion, namely that the explanation of the killings is to be found in France, not England.
Good questions, Juicy, but we dont know what Zainab told the cops. She must remember where they parked and if they ran over the dead body of the FRENCH cyclist.
Yes indeed, Bashing. Zainab could well hold a key. Why were they driving to that place? Why did they stop when they did? How long did they stop for? Why did she get out of the car? When did she get out of the car? Why didn’t she get back into the car? Why did Daddy try to leave without her? Why did the “bad man” do what he did to her? Does she remember the “good man”? Did Daddy say anything to the “bad man” or to the “good man”? What else did Daddy say?
Not sure, however, if she would have seen, or remember, if the reversing car ran over the body of Sylvain, or dragged it to its final resting place, nor if Sylvain was indeed dead when (if) this occurred.
What’s for sure, pal, is that she never saw a motorcycle or a BMW X3/5. So were left with the lone nutter theory, which prooofs that Saad or Ikbal were not the intended targets.
Sorry, you’re racing ahead of me now. How can we be sure that she never saw those vehicles? Presumably because a passing motorcycle or BMW would have made no impact on her mind, whereas the immediate events concerning the killing of her family would have been seared on her memory?
But that does not negate the evidence of other witnesses concerning the right hand drive BMW, although of course we must keep an open mind about the reliability of that evidence.
Anyway, I agree with you that case for Saad or Iqbal being the targets has steadily disintegrated since 2012. The thesis that Sylvain was the target is sustained only by the relative secrecy which surrounds him and his family.
Therefore like you, in the absence of fresh revelations, I go with the lone nutter theory.
Juicy
Re the parking of Saad….and his departure, leaving behind the child.
Taking the latter, first.
I don’t believe he did not leave her behind at all. I believe she was in the vehicle as Saad attempted to escape.
The reason for this conclusion is four fold.
1. Saad indeed was making a “full on” escape…and indeed he was injured. This injury (to me) means he was not the “initial target”. He was not shot first….and he was not shot at “point blank” range.
2. In making this escape, the vehicle (somewhat “out of control”) struck the bank. It was this that caused the locks to “pop open” (if they indeed locked in the first place). A forward gear being selected (and a “time lapse taking place thereafter) ensured that the doors were then locked.
His daughter would have had ample opportunity to escape the vehicle from the passenger side after the vehicle was halted by the bank.
3. The missing roof rail (and “white mark” on the roof).
I believe that the daughter made her escape (a reactionary escape, not “forethought” escape) when the gunman was at the drivers side window. The gunman reaction to this was to fire over the car and it was this bullet that struck the roof rail causing that damage (which seems never to get a mention).
4. His daughter did not run in the direction they had came. After escaping the vehicle, the gunman blocked the only “subconsciously” known escape route for her, that being down the road. Stunned and shocked… and in the middle of the car park, it was only her “good luck” that she was not also killed. The gunman at this point had no ammunition left.
That in itself is worthy of note as it would suggest that the gunman had fired a second time (five bullets) as Al Hilli was trying to get his vehicle off the bank.
The parking of the vehicle (initial).
I myself, if arriving at some “inconsequential” car park, would have done exactly the same as Al Hilli. He did not know the car park existed…or it’s lay out. Arriving…and looking left, you would gain perspective of this layout. The most natural position to park would be “the furtherest point” and “nose in”.
Juicy…
Given what is “known”, I would form a “primary target list” thus…
Non. It was a “lone nut” (or “serial killer”).
Mollier.
Al Hilli family.
Martin.
Both Al Hilli and Mollier.
Given that there is clearly a “first shot” and this person was the “re shot 5 more times”, I would have to elevate “Mollier” as target above “lone nut”. And purely for that reason. No other.
Chevaline JUSTICE BFMTV and Dominique Rizet sentenced to 10 thousand euro fine
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.ledauphine.com/france-monde/2015/05/29/chevaline-bfmtv-et-dominique-rizet-condamnes-a-10-000-euros-d-amende&prev=search
The managing editor of BFMTV Hervé Béroud and journalist Dominique Rizet were sentenced Friday by the Annecy court for publishing pictures of the investigation into the killing of journalist Chevaline.La chain and must pay € 10,000 fine for helping to violate the confidentiality of investigations.
The prosecutor Eric MAILLAUD Annecy and family lawyers Savoyard cyclist Sylvain Mollier had complained after the broadcast of photos showing the crime scene (with the car from the al-Hilli family and the body of the cyclist lying on the ground, riddled with bullets) and the al-Hilli whole family before the killing the journalist Photos Dominique Rizet was presented and commented on the air.
Members of the family of Sylvain Mollier, who were civil parties, were dismissed, the court holding that there was no direct link between their prejudice and helping to violate the confidentiality of investigations. Note that the court acquitted the director of the publication of Parisien, Jean Hornain, and has not retained the unlawful reproduction of charges of a crime scene and affect the integrity of a corpse.
A charge that the prosecutor Eric Maillaud had tried to defend to bypass the current legislation, indicating that only the direct victim of such infringement complaint, which restricts the use of only living people.
By SB with AFP | Published 05/29/2015 15:10 | Updated there are about 1 hour
I thought Sylvain Mollier was shot seven times.
It has been said he was the first to be shot, then the slaughterer/s went on the the persons in the car, then returned to Sylvain, to be sure he was deceased?
What’s this bit of FRENCH TWADDLE mean?
“Members of the family of Sylvain Mollier, who were civil parties, were dismissed, the court holding that there was no direct link between their prejudice and helping to violate the confidentiality of investigations.”
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.lefigaro.fr/flash-eco/2015/05/29/97002-20150529FILWWW00197-chevaline-bfmtv-condamne.php&prev=search
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.dna.fr/actualite/2015/05/29/chevaline-bfmtv-et-dominique-rizet-condamnes-a-10-000-euros-d-amende&prev=search
HILARIOUS !
“Members of the family of Sylvain Mollier, who were civil parties, were dismissed, the court holding that there was no direct link between their prejudice and helping to violate the confidentiality of investigations”.
IT’S ERIC THAT’S LEAKING SHIT ALL OVER THE PLACE.. TO HIS “FRIENDS IN THE MEDIA”.
Man.. the French are fucked up !
Maybe they should use soap in the shower. It’s not the devils work.
Basically
Eric sues the media…for “unapproved” leaks
What a f***ing fiasco !
All the “news” reports from todays final hearing in Ye Olde Court House Annecy,
seem to be identical, would that mean that as this is so utterly uninteresting to the FRENCH people, that only one stringer was dispatched to Annecy for the day, that stringer then selling his shit to all the outlets.
Or are the news outlets frightened of the FRENCH courts and only put the shit out they are allowed?
This certainly does not help get to the truth of anything but shows the whole FRENCH state,
court and its servants in a very bad light
Likes
Mr.Juicy Friday May 29th 3.44pm
If only one nutter did this:
Why would the photofit of the suspected slaughterer/motorcyclist be with-held for fourteen months by Eric the Red,
Nicole Communal-Tournier then shot dead a few days later in her home in Lathuile, within spitting distance of the home of W.B.M. the person who it is claimed stumbled on the slaughter, moments after Sylvain Mollier had cycled past him, up the combe.
Why the laughable arrest of the eX-policeman from Lathuile, only to release him a couple of days later, after crowing that you probably had your man.
Why did BRUN ride his car down a combe to his death whilst sitting alone in the back seat.
Why did the eX-Legionnaire-Parachutist-Suspect-Lover-Sapeur-Pompier apparently trash his own gaff before offing himself.
Why not name the Lyon motorcyclist who was thought to be the prime Slaughterer for two years.
Why keep the life of Sylvain secret, the uncle Sylvain’s partner is Pierre Morange who was at one time a business partner in the Pharmacie-Morange,
Pierre’s best mate the chief of police was found murdered in his own home and years later NO SLAUGHTERER HAS EVER BEEN ARRESTED, yet to this day Pierre packs a piece.
No, this is not the work of a lone nutter.
Could be a “lone nut”. But even that term is “misleading”.
If this is the actions of a “lone nut”, then France is dealing (badly) with a “serial killer”.
Isolated mountain towns do attract eccentrics, wherever in the world they are. Sometimes those eccentrics turn violent. Here’s an example of another scenario. Trigger alert:
http://o.canada.com/news/mass-murderer-david-shearing-denied-parole-again
Warning: Trigger alert again.
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Canada+true+bogeymen+Johnson+Bentley+murders+soon+forgotten/7265410/story.html
What they call “Bubba Justice” !
In Texas, things like that still go on today (hence the name).
Pres LBJ was like that in the 60’s (when he was made Pres).
They seem to have a lot of senior police officers suicide or get topped in FRANCE,
November 2012
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://lci.tf1.fr/france/faits-divers/un-chef-de-la-police-municipale-tue-dans-les-yvelines-7702029.html&prev=search
A chief of the municipal police killed in the Yvelines