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In all these French campground thefts, not one passport has ever been reported stolen. That doesn’t mean that thieves aren’t stealing passports to sell for quick cash on the black market. It just means that French media do not report this type of activity.
Please post any and all campground robberies in France where passports have been stolen. I would like to be proven wrong.
Q
they thought the al-Hillis passports were “missing”
untill they belated looked in his jacket, which was in police hands.
I know foreign media report campground robberies of passports, but I am interested in French media reports of stolen passports. Thank you.
Does any think that Eric Devouassoux has been to court for gun offences yet?
Does anybody think that it has been determined legally that the eX-Legionnaire has commited suicide?
Does anybody know if the bicycle of Sylvain Mollier has been returned to his family so it can be sold, so probate can be granted?
https://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/forums/europe-western-europe/topics/gassed-in-tent-france/compact
There are many, many reports of tourists in French campgrounds being robbed while they slept, unaware. Passports are taken. These reports seem common on forums and campground review sites. I would like to know if the number of self-reports is reflected in French media reports.
Are the French police and campground owners in on it? Nonchalance by both seems to be the order of the day in these incidents.
Gassing is also becoming more commonplace.
Mr. J., did Claire take part in the general strike by pharmacists?
I realize she is not a pauper, but considering the vast pool of future wealth that could be lost, I think it is likely that she, like other pharmacists who are currently swimming in profits, must be concerned about the winds of change. Lifestyle changes on the upside are easy; on the downside, not so much.
@ Mr. J, 7:38 a.m.: I agree that the story of Claire and the photo of Sylvain is an odd one. I’ve thought so since it was reported. He’s an invisible man with no photos, and she drives around looking for him with one? This has never been properly explained, and the story has changed. Did the police ask her to bring one? Why? People go missing all the time, and in most places, police are reluctant to declare adults missing until quite a bit of time has elapsed. Their relatives don’t usually go out looking for them immediately with a photo in hand. This does not add up.
Did Claire get wind of something coming down the Ire for SM? As I posted, French pharmacies are known to close in midday for the lunch break, often closing at noon and reopening at 2 or 2:30 p.m. for the rest of the afternoon, until closing for the day at 6 p.m.
So 2:30 p.m. would be when Claire’s pharmacie reopened after lunch, in theory. Do we know the hours of business for the little pharmacie in Grignon in September 2012? Were the usual hours in effect on the day of the massacre?
@Michael Norton: Do French campground owners have connections on the sly to the after-market sales of passports? Police have never said the names and countries of origin on all those passports in the al-Hilli vehicle and on their person, have they? I guess they wouldn’t advertise such a service.
Would Saad al-Hilli have had any reason at all to try to purchase a gently-used passport?
Did his parents keep the passport he used as a child to enter the UK when they immigrated? Did they ever return it to him?
@ Mr. J.: The standard closing hour for a French pharmacie is 6 p.m. This is why it is important to learn the habitude of Claire’s drug store in Gringnon. This is relevant to your post.
http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=131622
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/trail/etc/fake.html
Passports are big business for international terror organizations. Stolen French passports are advantageous for entering the U.S.
Typical ploy elsewhere in the world: stay in a guesthouse, try to buy passports of all sorts. The visas are the reason.
http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=131622
A clean-cut Iranian man goes into a campground…It’s a recurring theme.
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Security-Watch/2014/0314/Stolen-passports-on-Malaysia-Airlines-plane-stark-evidence-of-security-gap
But Swedish passports are also valuable:
http://www.thelocal.se/20140412/swedish-passports-hot-property-on-black-market
Q
There’s no reason to think the open and closing times are any different “then” as they are “now” ?
Which means (as you say) they close at 12.15 and re open at 2.00.
If that is the case, then when did SM go on his bike ride ?
Claire got home (why stay in the shop) and then he went out. Seems logical.
So what time did he leave again ? 12.30 ?
Make the “over due at 5pm” strange. Wouldn’t he be “over due” around 1.30pm
James, was he not missing for 6 days before he died ? Had he gone to his appartment ? Was Saad there when he passed away ? I sincerely do not remember all that information.
But true a Nursing Home costs, it does make one wonder if there is far more money floating about than we have heard of.
James, resist waiting until the book is in the bargain bucket or charity shop, bite the bullet and have a read, Gary Aked says “When I heard that Zaid wanted part of it my reaction was ‘greedy bastard’. I mean Zaid has loads of properties, he has millions of pounds; there’s nothing he wants.” (referring to the Claygate house)
And for an odd one Dr Zaid Alabdi met Zaid for the FIRST time at the funeral.
@James: We need to know the hours at Claire’s pharmacie. Are any days of the week “special hours”? Thinking of small businesses in small towns elsewhere that used to close on Sundays Wednesday afternoons, back in the day.
Were her closing hours noon to 2:30 p.m., and closed again at 6 p.m.?
Now, back to Saad al-Hilli. Was he there to buy or sell passports? Seems like a quick way to raise money, especially with a Swedish passport and visas for France (mother-in-law), or a visa for the U.S. (wife).
Was the trip to the bank a trip for old or current passports stashed in a deposit box? There would be nothing to stop Saad from taking a passport that belonged to him, with proper proof, of course. He may even have needed his father’s passport to settle the estate.
Was the heated discussion in the campground something the campground owner would not like known to the public A bidding war with two different groups might bring the best price, unless they came after you in an isolated parking lot when no one could agree on a price. Even worse if the two bidders came after you in an isolated parking lot.
The shop opened all day, six days a week
http://www.bing.com/local?lid=YN2000x670736883&id=YN2000x670736883&q=Pharmacie+Schutz+Grignon+73&cp=45.65171~6.376713&qpvt=pharmacie+schutz+morange
Which of course was already Pharmacie Schutz when Sylvain was murdered.
8:15 to 19:15, I don’t know where Q gets the 18:00 from, shops have always opened late, compared to the local high street shops of the UK.
Of interest on the Schutz-Morange Pharmacy, Claire and a Christine Baroud were the Assistant Pharmacists.
Claire no doubt has Assistant Pharmacists now to cover all the hours the business is open.
If on 05/09/2012,
Claire Schutz was working in her business in Pharmacie Schutz0Morange, in Grignon, common law husband Sylvain Mollier was in his home in Ugine, within walking distance of Cezus-Areva, looking after their new born infant son.
Sylvain gets a message, he has very important urgent business to attend, at Le Martinet, he calls Claire and tell’s her to shut the shop and get back to Ugine for infant care.
Claire arives back at Ugine and Sylvain says, if I am not back by four o’clock call the pigs, I will have been slaughtered.
Hence by five o’clock, Claire was at a police station with his picture in her hand.
Q. from memory only, Zaids Iraqi passport, Suhailas Swedish passport and Ikbals Iraqi passport were found in the car (of course, we now know the British ones of the couple were as well, in the car that is).
Reports said he also had his fathers ID with him, assume passport.
No doubt in FRANCE they have photographs in driving licence
so did Sylvain have his own vehicle.
If he did have his own vehicle ( quite unusual for a 45 year old man not to have at least one)
He could have put his bike on a cycle rack and driven to a place that was more convenient,
unstrapped bike and on up to Le Martinet.
On one side of the Channel, we have Zaid and Saad facing off over their father’s inheritance and the house in particular. Who knows the inheritance rules for a modern Iraqi family living in the UK, when one of the siblings in the father’s will dies intestate? What is British law and what is sharia in this case?
On the other side of the Channel, we have two siblings living quietly in the Alps. One has recently purchased the operating licence for a pharmacie from her parents. This would be something they may have wanted to attend to with haste, knowing the changes that may be coming in the French pharmacie business. Better to transfer this pharmacie’s ownership before new laws come into place. They are related to a politician with connections, so they have better-than-average knowledge of what’s to come. Like dairies and egg farms in other countries, it’s the operating licence, or marketing board membership that determines the real value of such operations. Without that, you simply can’t do business. In such places, the dairy herd (cash cow, LOL) may not even be part of the sale.
Meanwhile, the male sibling is away in Colombes, a suburb of Paris, continuing his extensive education. He completes the ingénieur d’étude phase in August 2012. There is a gap in his resume until April 2013, when he takes employment on home turf, not far from where he grew up. He is working for a company set up by municipalities to do water treatment.
What do the parents have planned to even the distribution of wealth between the two siblings, if anything? He skis — who doesn’t in the Alps? He has travelled around Europe and the U.S., as well as Tunisia and Turkey. Now that he has settled down back near home, what’s in store?
Surely the daughter’s gift of a top-notch mountain bike cannot be the cause of ire to a family with a successful business that generates millions of euros?
It’s a parallel universe, different but similar, the oldest tale ever, of rivalry between two siblings? Or not?
M., I was using “standard” hours many pharmacies use in France; 6 p.m. was the closing time stated in the link I posted. This is why I wanted to know the 2012 operating hours of Claire’s pharma. The link shows the current operating hours, but were these the hours used in 2012 at the old location? What were Claire’s hours of work? We know she has other employees now, so the pharma could remain open in her absence, if one of them happens to be a pharmacist. It is also possible that the store remains open, but the pharmacist is only on duty for certain hours, as is the practice in other countries. Were Grandpa and Grandma Schutz still working full- or part-time to fill in for Claire, who had recently given birth? If so, what were their hours of work on that day?
This is the information we need.
http://www.euronews.com/2015/06/17/miss-renzi-tucks-in-french-minister-makes-a-royale-apology/
Segoline has already said sorry
for asking the FRENCH to stop eating Nutella
very quick U-Turn Segolene.
Q
Now… it’s 6 days a week.
8.30 – 12.15 then 2.00 – 7.15
No special days.
Then.. I guess it was the same.
M
I think I recall something about KAH being “missing” or something. I can’t say for certain if he was…or wasn’t. Maybe I’m getting mixed up. Maybe they meant he was taken out for a few days (he still had his little pad. If ZAH/SAH had come to see him, it would be logical to go there and spend time together). I just can’t recall, to be honest.
Some perspective on pharmacies and the income they generate:
https://www.reddit.com/r/pharmacy/comments/31x2rg/how_much_do_french_pharmacists_make/
It’s reddit, so make of it what you will.
Q
Re the above times.
I’m assuming SM went for his ride during the lunch break of CS.
That being 12.15 to 2.00.
But that cannot be right.
The murderers happened at (approx) 3.45
SM would be an hour and forty five overdue already.
Of course CS may have wanted/had longer lunch breaks ? Who knows. New child and all. Partner wanting to ride his bike etc ?
Q. It is the old premises, as a thought, when it was the Schutz-Morange, the total number of employees were between 6 and 9.
Claire and Christine Baroud were Assistant Pharmacists.
IN 2012 Pharmacy Schutz had a wages and social charges bill of 395K Euro.
Q. it is the old location, I looked it up before, maybe we need to consider before Claire bought the business, the Schutz-Morange employed between 6 and 9 people, so if we include them and Claire and Christine Baroud(Assistant Pharmacists at the time), that still leaves between 2 and 5 more employees, it will have been to cover the hours.
All I will add is for the year end 2012, the wages and social charges bill for the pharmacy was 395K Euro.
As I pointed out earlier, she probably returned to work when the baby was about six weeks old, whether full-time or part time, you will have to ask her. Taking on face value the lawyers comments, Claire took time off to go home for Sylvain to go cycling, then she was in work that day.
If she had arranged to return to the shop at a certain hour and Sylvain had not come back as promised, she called and called without response, apart from anger, she might well have thought something was wrong.
Should that be the scenario, maybe all of us would consider driving his known proposed route, hearing of a cyclist being dead, French time news broke late afternoon.
The story about the photo has changed, the last being she had telephoned the police and they said bring a photo, Maillaud now admits they knew the identity of Mollier very early on, like most French he was probably carrying his ID card, they also had his phone.
Unfortunately, much of the Press reports have been discounted now as unture or just rumour, it happens when they are so desperate for a scoop.
MN, the enquiry into the death of Menegaldo concluded suicide, this was a snippet of info amongst this, where MollieX comes from:
https://deadzone61.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/www-lasavoie-fr_2014-09-07_00-04-17.png
-le suicide ete bien etabli-
@ Q
Holy crap !
Read the comments of M
“Taking on face value the lawyers comments, Claire took time off to go home for Sylvain to go cycling, then she was in work that day”.
Was SM “well over-due” ???
A “normal day” would mean CS may mean she was due back “after lunch”.
That would mean “around” 2.00pm
There is little wonder that by 5pm SM was “well over-due”.
So…why was SM still riding at 3.45pm ? AND in an area he “was lost in” ?
The key to this is…. in SM’s eyes, it was a “normal day”.
His wife comes home (as normal) and he goes on his new bike (like normal).
But it’s not normal.
He gets lost.
He gets shot dead when he’s lost.
How “lost” can you be…when you get to the car park ?
任务已经完成了。他們沒有任何懷疑。法国阿尔卑斯山脉屠杀事件神秘的祕密是完全安全。 等待着进一步指示。多汁。
Hmm. Don’t know what happened just then. Some kind of computer glitch, I suppose – nothing to do with the ongoing discussion. Please ignore. Hopefully the moderator can delete immediately.
What I wanted to say is that I agree with all of you that it must be one of the three mainstream theories and that all the others are nonsense, particularly the idea that it’s about some nuclear espionage fantasy.