The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Donald Rumsfeld gets a mention here in relation to Saad and missing loot.
Thought I’d post it incase there’s a grain of sense in these incoherent ramblings
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?hl=en-GB&q=cache:ugpOkQMfLMsJ:http://current.com/community/93945120_donald-rumsfeld-loots-surface-in-alps.htm%2Bdonald+rumsfeld+hilli&gbv=2&gs_l=heirloom-hp.12…1175.13842.0.15271.22.19.0.3.3.0.330.3781.0j4j9j3.16.0…0.0…1c.1.KsFf3plbwEk&nfpr=&spell=1&ct=clnk
First of all. We need proof psoted on Icke. Second – supposing its true – there could be all sort of reasons . Iraq was in an upheaval, – I believe the socialist Saddam was on and about already in 1969, right? The new rulers went after rich people, and the rich figured out that they would be better of — protecting their wealth — elsewhere. As simple as that.
More from this blogger here – says Saad (and wife) on is radar for nine years? Loony or…?
http://alakhtal.wordpress.com/
I dismissed that blog yesterday Dopey, I’d say : Loony.
O, boy. The guy whose ramblings you just linked to seems to be American, which was enough for me to immediately close the connection between my computer and said site. After all “why cross the water/stream to fetch a bucket of water” as the saying goes in Denmark, and no doubt people in East Anglia has a similar saying – after all they derive from us.
“One of Saddam Hussein’s cousins today denied reports that he was trying to secure permanent asylum in Britain for two of the former Iraqi dictator’s daughters.
Izzedin Al-Majid, who has set up home in the quiet Leeds suburb of Bramhope, said he also wanted to scotch stories that he was living in the UK on benefits.
According to Mr Al-Majid, who is a second cousin of Saddam, the husbands of the two women were killed in 1996 in a notorious massacre and they are victims of Saddam.
Mr Al-Majid said one of his wives and their four children died in the same incident.
Out of favour
Mr Al-Majid became an officer in the dictator’s presidential guard but fell out of favour after arguing against the invasion of Kuwait, he said.
Mr Al-Majid said reports that he was on the dole and being pursued by loan companies were totally untrue.
He said his lifestyle in the UK was supported by a sympathiser who is a sheikh from the United Arab Emirates.”
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-184334/Living-UK-Saddams-cousin-denies-dole.html#ixzz2AsjWNZep
Danish: At gå over aaen efter vand
English: To cross the stream [to fetch] after water
{http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aa_River_%28disambiguation%29}
sorensen, Saddam’s Baath in 1970 and later was a socialist party, well perhaps we should say a “nationalsocialist party”. But they were no communists, not at all. There was no law to seite properties of Iraqi people without reason and even Saddam couldn’t do that. He could kill people or let them being assassinated. But he couldn’t seize property from people with being backed up by laws. I believe that you are kidding. Do you thin that in Denmark anybody could seize your property, not even your Prime Minister, just because he doesn’t like your face or your race? You’re kidding. Iraq was a Republic. They had to obey on laws regarding properties.
However, there was a law installed in 1968 – after the 6 days war with Israel – that the properties of Jews had to be seized. There was no law at that time to seize property of Shia people, Sunnis or Kurds. No way!
DM article now has an edited headline.
Its been watered down from “The man who’s key….vital new evidence” …to “Does French cyclist hold the key?”
O, the reason why these Iraqies fled Iraq, was in order to protect their wealth, this has been mentioned many times in connection with this case. You could add to that tehat they were desillusioned with that Socialist brute – after all they were traditionalist and proad monarchists.
I know Arabs – and I love them very much. They are some of the finest specimen of human kind. Once, while travelling in Egyptean Sinai — while it was under occupation from the Devilish regime — I spend some time together with Bedouins, and they conveyed to me their great affiliation to King Farouk of Egypt – who at that time hadn’t been on the throne for about 30 years. They just knew that everything were better for them under Farouk, and so people with money in Jordan or in Iraq (same Hashemite reign) just KNOWS where their interest are better protected.
According to this Al Majid was living in London in 2003
http://www.news24.com/World/Archives/IraqiDossier/Photos-Doubts-linger-20030724
Bluebird – YOU NEED TO POST PROOF ON ICKE.
Its essential that we turn the thumb srews on Bluebird. He refuses to post even the slightest bit of [evidence] on Icke, so I’m afraid we will have to boycott him here, until he posts some evidence [of family relation between Saad and Hashim]
At Katie 31 Oct, 2012 – 6:55 am two points: there is a big issue with Maillaud’s credibility for all the reasons stated. Now in this instance we have conflicting official story lines – on the one hand all victims shot through the forehead (leaving aside the unlikelihood of that) it contradicts the story that some were so badly disfigured that only DNA allowed identification. As previously discussed, apart from the entry wound more damage is actually caused on exit. As to your point about shooting inside the car, I am not quite sure what real significance would have to the crime. However the official line is that the doors were locked. This comes from both WBM (for why otherwise would he smash window to turn off engine if he did) and the police, though I agree from Lieutenant-Colonel Benoit Vinnemann we understand they were under instructions not to open up or go inside. (I have already drawn attention to the rather suspicious fact that this order must have either pre-dated police arrival at the scene or or come very swiftly after, or they surely would have done so, at least to the rear near-side door where the glass had already gone – so no fear of breaking it which is advanced as the reason the order was given) Of course had they done so, little Zeena would have been spared the eight hour ordeal of cowering under her dead mother. So I see no reason to doubt that the bullet holes seen in both front door windows could relate to SAH’s headshots. The back compartment is different because the Hoskins photo does not reveal the rear off side window and I haven’t seen any that does and the nearside is completely gone. So it is perfectly possible that the killer could have leaned in or even opened the door by using the inside mechanism (BMW locking would have to be checked for that). If the account that a few casings were found INSIDE the car, it would be likely but not completely essential (they could fly through an open window for example if the trajectory was right) that the weapon was physically inside at some point but as I have said, NOT in the front I think.
Interesting question Katie
31 Oct, 2012 – 7:09 am
@ Tim V 31 Oct, 2012 – 1:51 pm
All very valid. One other unexplained issue (apologies for bringing it up again) – the delay has been ascribed to the time it took for the fornesics team to arrive from Paris, coupled with the instruction that police on the scene were not to touch anything or to open the car. No explanation has been given for why the regional forensics team based in Lyon was not called. They would have been approximately 100KM or one hour away.
Given the forensics timeline, how on earth was it possible for local police to clear WBM of any involvement so quickly?
Hi Tim.
Yes you are quite right , BM did smash a window [ he says ] to turn off the engine BUT could it be the killer did that to aim at AH & the women ?
Frankly if I were reversing out in a panic I’d have the back of my head to the window in a ducking position not looking straight at a gun.
Frankly I don’t believe the killer would take the time to walk around to the drivers side, I believe he would have had the passenger door open before AH had settled into the driving seat.
Yes once AH had got in he could have clicked the master lock , but too late with the passenger door already being opened by the killer……….only once closed would it then lock.
According to this – The Al Hillis were embalmed. Mollier was not embalmed.
http://www.marilynztomlins.com/articles/chevaline-al-hilli-sylvain-mollier-murders/
Felix,
I think the child seat in the front was only empty because Zainab got out of the car.
I meant to add : before removing the suggestion that SM ever sat in the front seat.
These Iraqies, who fled to Britain during the bouts of Socialist revolutions, were stauch Monarchists, and although republican Irishmen like James or Bluebird — not to mention the Americans Tim And Throw — will never understand this, there exists an understanding between us Monarchist, so that we in time of emergency will turn to Britain as protector of our interests. That’s what I would do if our monarchy was threatened, and that was what this al-Hilli family did way back then.
King Konstantin of Greece/a> has lived in Britain since 1967, when the Greece Junta overtrew him in acoup. His wife is Queen Margrethe of Denmarks youngest sister, and through her we also feel with this family and their longings for returning to Greece.
Maybe somewhat off-topic but illustrative of the complex and potentially dangerous interweaving of arms, oil and middle east politics is yours Mochyn69 31 Oct, 2012 – 7:26 am (as always!) I know it’s not directly related to the Al Hilli’s but nevertheless here goes. Perhaps certain characteristics have family associations as in:
“Lord Ogmore was married to Alice Alexandra Constance Wills. He had three children. His daughter, Elizabeth Rees-Williams, married the actors Richard Harris and Sir Rex Harrison, the businessman Peter Aitken, and more recently Jonathan Aitken, the former Conservative MP.”
We all remember the latter’s “sword of truth” speech in his libel action that he lost. From Wikipedia: “The joint Guardian/ Granada investigation indicated an arms deal scam involving Aitken’s friend and business partner, the Lebanese businessman Mohammed Said Ayas, a close associate of Prince Mohammed of Saudi Arabia.” “In 1999, DNA testing confirmed that Petrina Khashoggi, daughter of billionaire arms dealer Adnan Khashoggi, was Aitken’s biological child, the result of an affair with Soraya Khashoggi, née Sandra Daly, then wife of Adnan Khashoggi”
“Aitken wrote a highly confidential letter to Thatcher in early 1980, dealing with allegations that the former Director-General of MI5, Sir Roger Hollis, had been a double agent also working for the Soviet Union. This information had come to Aitken from retired CIA spymaster James Angleton. Espionage historian Chapman Pincher obtained a copy of the letter, and used former MI5 officers Peter Wright and Arthur Martin as his main additional secret sources, to write the sensational book Their Trade is Treachery in 1981. This matter raged full of controversy throughout the 1980s, and led to Wright eventually publishing his own bestselling book “Spycatcher” in 1987, despite the government’s prolonged and bitter court attempts to stop him in Australia from doing so.”
“Aitken became Minister of State for Defence Procurement under PM John Major in 1992.[13] He was later accused of violating ministerial rules by allowing an Arab businessman to pay for his stay in the Paris Ritz, perjured himself and was jailed (see below).[13]
Aitken had previously been a director of BMARC, an arms exporter, from 1988 to 1990.[13] In 1995 a Commons motion showed that while a Cabinet minister he had signed a controversial Public Interest Immunity Certificate (PIIC) in September 1992 relating to the Matrix Churchill trial, and that the ‘gagged’ documents included ones relating to the supply of arms to Iraq by BMARC for a period when he was a director of the company
What perhaps is less well known is the connection with the mysterious death of Stephen Milligan in spookily similar circumstances to those of James Rusbridger, Jonathan Moyle and Gareth Williams previously discussed here. Stephen Milligan, was a Tory MP and Parliamentary Private Secretary to Jonathan Aitken, then arm procurement minister in the Tory government. It was said he was unhappy with what he had discovered and was about to “spill the beans”. On 7th February 1994, he was reported to have been found tied to a chair with a plastic bag over his head and a satsuma stuffed into his mouth. Owing to the embarrassing aspects of the case many feel it was never adequately investigated and the explanation of “deviant auto eroticism” too readily accepted and MP’s were only too willing to sweep the matter under the proverbial carpet. Anything sounding familiar?
@ Tim
Stephen Milligan was found wearing nothing but stockings and suspenders too.
If you want to totally discredit/destroy someone, no better way than to link them to deviant sexual behaviour or sex crimes.
It suddenly dawned on me that we are discussing here with Moral ants (Bluebird and James from Ireland, Tim and throw from america and God knows who else and where from), with no affection towards the Family of Monarchies, in which Britain is the Natural and born Leader, personalised via our most dear and sweet Ma’am, Elizabeth II.
They have absolutely ZIL understanding of why proud Monarchist devout to the Hashemites would come to Britain in a crisis of emrgency. This is the sad reality of today. We are sorrounded by these moral ants with internet connection without any understanding of history.
NR 31 Oct, 2012 – 10:20 am – Yup anything is possible in this NR. I’m glad you picked up my point tho. Imagine yourself in this situation – it sometimes helps I find. I am no brave hero as WBM was indeed portrayed but I’m pretty certain, given the fact that he admits on BOTH occasions he (they) were fearful of a killer still on the loose, I would leave a desperately injured seven year old child on the gravel, not even covered with a coat (if they had i am sure they would have told us) It contradicts everything that would have been drummed into him as an RAF pilot to “remove a casualty” (let alone a child) from danger. There may be excuse first time around i.e. need to raise the alarm – but the second when the car was only yards away? Then again would you leave a dying(?) child alone in any circumstance? If I knew the call had been made by Didierjean (?) how could you leave the poor little thing on her own just to ride home?????????? Defeats me. If I were less charitable I might conclude they almost expected/ wanted her to expire!
at Dopey 31 Oct, 2012 – 11:46 am someone sure is burning the midnight oil to keep the Mollier photo off the newspaper pages. I wonder what they’ll do to squash the Hashim connection?
I’d go with that too Tim.
I said on the last thread I’d have been more inclined to stay to comfort the child, shout for help or hope to flag someone down . It is a busy place,it was beautiful sunny day & there would have inevitably been other people in the vicinity who would have heard the calls from such a quiet place….. clearly there were. BM could even have raised the alarm by using the car horn.
The ‘gun shots’ heard by only one person, make me think they were not gunshots she heard.
When public documents start disappearing from the internet and interviews of witnesses start losing dialogue and newspaper stories get wiped, you know you are on to something.
@ Bluebird/Sorensen
Of course Saddam used his father’s name. His full name was Saddam Hussein Abd al-Majid al-Tikriti http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein.
Rubbish – it’s just because they couldn’t voucher for the authencity of the Mollier photo. Just like we couln’t when it was up in here. The only difference is that they managed to run the story through the presses for ONE day, and ONE day — the first — is all what matters in the Newspaper business. When will you ever learn about [newspaper] business.
Kenneth, make yourself a nice cup of tea.