The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Anders post from Icke.
Oh look there’s more:
Ms al-Hilli, 47, was born in Iran but grew up in Sweden. She met her husband in Dubai a decade ago. Her sister Fadwa al-Saffat, a pharmacist who recently finished a PhD at the University of Reading, is believed to be at Zainab’s bedside.
From http://www.anorak.co.uk/332946/news/the-lake-annecy-murders-what-annemarie-souderman-saw.html/
Just to complicate things further, Fadwa here is an “Fadwa al al saffar”
http://www.pharmacy.rdg.ac.uk/staff/khutoryanskiy/group.pdf
(she has an initial of D in her name too by the looks of her email address.
Point of clarification: The Australian did not say that Mrs. al-Hilli’s mother was born in Iran. It said that Mrs. al-Hilli herself was born in Iran, but that she was raised in Sweden. Other media outlets also stated the same thing, before it disappeared. It’s anyone’s guess if any or all media outlets are erroneous in their reporting.
No one has any idea of the sources of any of the information which was circulated in the media before it was disappeared.
As for Mrs. al-Hilli’s dental training, it varied from country to country, depending on which news site you went to. You get to pick:
Iraq:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jcT4DPQCHwtE3K16tB0Uj5hnEr7g?docId=CNG.230ef1109cfdd13762e5b185cc6bb6e8.3e1
Sweden: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2199513/Saad-Al-Hilli-shooting-French-Alps-Extraordinary-life-engineer-victim.html
Maybe someone should have asked the dentist who trained with her.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19729566
You can see here that Mrs. al-Hilli’s mother was said to be from Iraq:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/who-is-fourth-french-alps-shooting-1312804
It’s difficult to know what to believe, if anything.
Strawberry…
It must have been released somewhere on the day ?
The day after ?
Surely it must ??
Strawberry…
Mr Al Hilli married Al Saffar… BUT on the accounts I found, it is listed as (on the scan copy at Co’s House) as Ikbal Al Saffar.
Why use “Ms Al Hilli” in that quote.
Those Al- Saffars are an academic bunch aren’t they. Uni lecturer, whatever Suhaila was, dentist, chemist…
I read it in so many places that the family were from Iran and the parents went to Sweden.
Now only where cuts and pastes were used still exist. Everywhere is saying Iraq. From very early on I wondered how & where they met. Why would I do that if she was born in Iraq. Duh.
Dopey,
Hmmm, because she prefers the Iraqi family link to her actual Iranian?
Dopey…
There are loads. Check out Sweden’s Top no biz Swede’s (and watches).
And you’ll find another. I doubt they are all kinked however.
Strawberry.
Explain what you mean please ?
I think they met in Dubaishire. But what are you saying ?
Dopey
http://www.thelocal.se/gallery/news/2204/6/
Him.
Strawberry
She prefers the Iraq side ? She ? Iqbal ??
James,
Until we found out they met in Dubai, I wondered how they met as she was from Iran and him from Iraq.
Why would I have that thought if she was born in Iraq too?
Q
Again agree.
“It’s difficult to know what to believe, if anything”.
Was Iqbal trained in Iraq, Iran, Dubai, Bah’rain, Sweden ?
Jeez, what do we have ???
Straw…
We are told that they met in Dubai (the only info released !).
We are told then she is from Iran…not Iraq.
You have a thought here, what is it ?
@Q 2 Oct, 2012 – 8:56 pm
Thanks for the clarification. I just assumed it must have been the grand-mother who was born in Iran
I live in France and it has always been asserted in the French press that Iqbal Al Hilli was from Iraq. You’ll have to google translate yourself.
Le Monde.fr avec AFP | 06.09.2012 à 20h12
Saad Al-Hilli, 50 ans, identifié par des sources policières, vivait à Claygate avec sa femme, Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que lui et originaire comme lui d’Irak, et leurs deux filles
Le Parisien Publié le 07.09.2012, 06h43
Saad Al-Hilli, 50 ans, identifié par des sources policières, vivait à Claygate avec sa femme, Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que lui et originaire comme lui d’Irak, et leurs deux filles.D’ores et déjà, les médias anglais évoquent un crime prémédité, voire commandité. Pour quel motif ? Iqbal al-Hili, dentiste de profession, est irakienne d’origine, comme son mari. Elle avait d’abord émigré en Suède, sa maman, âgée de 74 ans, ayant officiellement la nationalité suédoise, avant de s’installer en Angleterre.
Libération 7 septembre 2012 à 23:09
Ce massacre «à la sauvagerie inouïe», durant lequel 4 personnes –Saad al-Hilli, 50 ans, sa femme Iqbal, originaire comme lui de Bagdad, une femme plus âgée de nationalité suédoise et un cyclise français- ont été tuées, donne lieu à une enquête «particulièrement complexe», selon le procureur.
“Murderers, war criminals and terrorists can hide behind some of the 26,000 fake passports Iraqi Embassy in Stockholm has issued.
– I have lost courage, enough is enough, says Birgitta Elfstrom, Middle East expert at the Swedish Migration Board.
Police in Oslo has blown one falsifies league and revealed that the Iraqi Embassy in Stockholm issued 26,000 passports by fraudulent means.”
http://www.metro.se/nyheter/26-000-falska-pass-fran-iraks-ambassad/ObjgaE!07_5629-32/
As you can see, has the Embassy of Iraq in Stockholm issued at least 26.000 fake passports, it´s been going on for a long time ( the article is from 2007 ).
So, if a person from Sweden has Baghdad as birth city, the person could as well be from Iran, Lebanon, Syria or whatever. The Swedish Migration Board is seldom doing any check up re immigrants.
Q thanks for answering she met Alabdi while studying in Iraq. He is born in Iraq. I wondered both of those had been altered from Iran too.
Zaid Alabdi, who said he was Mr Al-Hilli’s best friend, and studied dentistry in Baghdad with his wife Ikbal, said: “They’re a lovely family who worked hard.
from here:-
http://thestar.ie/star/four-executed-by-assassin-15-bullets-fired-with-no-misses/
James,
I knew the facts in this order
1) Saad was born in Iraq
2) Iqbal was in Iran
3) They met in Dubai
Before I read 3 I wondered how and where they met. If 2 was she was born in Iraq. That thought would never have happened.
So France in the early days, is saying Iraq.
How did they get that ? (passports ? A lucky guess ?)
We now “think” Iran ?
What the hell is actually going on here (hence my belief in that Def Ad Notice).
We can not for sure even say where she was from !!!
Very odd.
The game is afoot dear Watson.
I will be writing to that QC, just to see if there is any information on Def Ad Notices that can be challenged.
Straw.
I get that (in a way).
But take one and two as the same… I guess I would still ask “how did they meet”.
But “given” three, then, when I looked at the books, I thought “yes ok, I can see where he dated her”.
But that was “given” three !
@James- 9:07 pm
The biz man Al Saffer you link to, is iraqi-lebanese.
He was flipping hamburgers in the nineties. But within a few years he was able to buy one the larger chain-stores in Sweden ( formely a part of H&M ), after doing some export&import between Sweden and Lebanon. The amount he earned in such a short period was to good to be true. There was rumours of some kind if dirty business, but never confirmed.
I don´t know if he has any relation to the killed al-Saffers in France, but it would be interesting if there was.
Strawberry
Going of you have said, here’s one for you.
Given his books, I say “he wasn’t on 60 quid an hour in England”.
So he was somewhere, I thought.
That is backed up (as far as it can be) by the postman.
I assume Dubiashire.
Why, I was “told” that.
I can not find him there. I have looked..and Dubai is “special” when finding someone.
Here’s the leap.
Say he wasn’t in Dubai. Then where ?
Iran ? (but we are unsure she is from Iran).
Iraq ?
@Thomas
hence no interest shown by the Swedish government – don’t want to reveal too much.
Thomas…
There is alot of “between Sweden and Lebanon”. I never knew that until I had a dig about.
Perhaps Dubai meeting was released early but not having been there I didnt take it on board at first.
Another f.a.a.d address:
[email protected]
Straw…
If “someone” can absolutely nail she was there..and a time period, then I will believe that.
At the moment, I am “sure” he was not in the U.K.
And neither (therefore) was she.
One other odd thing is, I am “an ex pat” for many years.
If I died, you’d have “statements” from people I knew (KNEW) years ago in England.
Not from my Dutch, Aussie, German or American friends.
And yet, when I go home, you have your “old friends” because you have probably not seen them in years (and you may not have been that close “if you’d been in the U.K.).
Hence…GAry Aked…and no one else. Just my thought. from living overseas.
“Say he wasn’t in Dubai. Then where ?”
Perhaps he worked for Cevus?
I don’t even trust that Iqbal’s reported age of 47 is right.
1) I saw on a forum in the early days a post by someone who seemed very confident that Iqbal was actually 49 not 47. I wish I could remember where I saw that. Their words were on the lines of “she’s 49 not 47” ..the post came across as though they definitely knew this.
2) Then her DOB on the company information is listed as 1970.
As I’ve said before, 40 (and 43 even more so) is risky for a (first) baby and, I know many women do marry late, but 37 is on the late side for a first marriage. Regardless, I keep an open mind as to her actual age….in fact any of their ages for that matter.
Perhaps they were….pick a spot in the world ! I don’t know.
But for sure as hell, the UK and French police know.
But they are not saying.
Check the books from the set up od SHtech.
Check the job post I got (somewhere above) for his role.
…amd check what the postman said.
He was not in the UK. That’s 100 percent.
“And neither (therefore) was she.”
She was just getting back in to her profession, so either she gave up on being a dentist here to have kids, and only gave it another go when the youngest started school, or she was overseas until now.
I think they came back here and settled in the fathers house when they first had kids, so have been back at least 6 years.