The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
@Nuid
Is everyone half-blinded by the propaganda coming out of the US about Iran and nukes? I think the satellite area is possibly much more fruitful.
Actually, I think it’s just me who’s into this nuclear weapon research angle, at the moment!
I am certainly not discounting the satellite angle, and Trowbridge (amongst others) has done excellent work in posting about that.
And RAL of course has a satellite wing, with which SSTL is intricately involved, so there’s a very definite link there.
I am just not DISCOUNTING the possibility of SAH having worked in nuclear weapons research, and am doing some speculative investigative work, based on the hint in the leaked D Notice.
What’s wrong with that?
“What’s wrong with that?”
Nothing! I’m not trying to steer anyone in any direction, or away from any direction. I was simply passing a comment. I have no axe to grind. I have a completely open mind on this thing. (Although I suspected Mossad from the start.)
Ah, good, that’s pretty much what I thought.
Mind you, what’s really surprising to me is that there have been so many posts on this thread telling me to stop looking into the nuclear weapons angle…
Dave B and Y both expressed certainty (more than once) that this is a dead-end, a no hoper, a wild goose chase, etc…
But how could they know?
Normal people like you and me don’t have access to the employment records of the Atomic Weapons Establishment, do they?
So either Dave B and Y are bullshitting, or they work in government circles, either as spooks of some kind, or perhaps at the Atomic Weapons Establishment.
And by the way, I’ve asked them both “how do you know” and neither has replied.
I’ve also asked Dave B why he wasn’t even curious, not even the slightest bit, and he didn’t reply to that, either.
No doubt they will both now come up with innocent-sounding explanations, and claim they were only “speculating” that there wasn’t anything in it, but if you read back over the past day’s posts you’ll see what I mean about them both expressing total and utter certainty that SAH didn’t have anything to do with nuclear weapons research… Particularly Dave B, as I gave him a lot of rope.
So guys… where do you work, exactly?
@Blue_Bear
Morning All. Back on board following another operation. The morphine’s worn off and I’m just trawling my way through the new thread. I’m less skeptical about the D notice now Ferret.
Morning!
Glad to hear that, both that you’re feeling better, and are less skeptical of the D notice.
🙂
“I’ve also asked Dave B why he wasn’t even curious, not even the slightest bit, and he didn’t reply to that, either.”
Yep, I saw that.
Maybe (some) people are influenced by the fact that 16-17 US intelligence agencies, plus the IAEA, have found no evidence that Iran is trying to make a nuke.
BUT, there’s no accounting for Israeli paranoia in that area. Or, I should say, Netanyahu and Co’s paranoia. So any involvement in nuclear weapons work could indeed be relevant.
Anyway, I’ve got to fly …
“On 25 November 2010, the Government issued a DA-Notice in relation to sensitive documents expected to be imminently released on the website Wikileaks.”
Only it’s not actually a DA Notice, it’s a memorandum reminding editors that material about to be published by Wikileaks might be covered by the 5 standing DA Notices. Naturally Wikileaks take great delight in having people believe that what they are doing has the government so frightened they were trying to silence them with a special DA Notice.
However it’s not the government or the MoD that issues DA Notices but the DA Notice Committee which is made up mainly of media representatives.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-14572768
The DPBAC maintains an official website that explains (with commendable transparency and clarity) how the system works.
http://www.dnotice.org.uk/faqs.htm#8
What is meant by ‘slapping a D-Notice on’ something?
This very dated phrase is still used by some people, and sounds dramatic, but it is no longer what actually happens! DA-Notices are not issued for particular incidents. The 5 standing Notices cover various eventualities, and, if necessary, the DA-Notice Secretary draws and editor’s’ attention to the DA-Notice Secretary to the advice in the appropriate Notice.
“I’ve also asked Dave B why he wasn’t even curious, not even the slightest bit, and he didn’t reply to that, either.”
Because we know the man he was meeting in the carpark had nothing to do with AWE.
So why go off on wild goose chases when we know who was working for who?
@Dave B
We know who Sylvain Mollier was working for, but we don’t know much about SAH’s past, nor about his possible links to nuclear weapons research, as hinted at in the leaked D Notice.
Why are you so convinced it’s a wild goose chase. Do you have access to SAH’s records? Or the employment records at Harwell, or Aldermaston? If so, how?
A new report on the investigation’s progress (or lack thereof)
http://lejt.tv8montblanc.com/Tuerie-de-Chevaline-le-point-1-mois-apres-les-faits_v5183.html
I sincerely hope that the prosecutor’s apparent defeatism is just pretended, in order to lull the prime suspect (without a doubt SAH’s brother) into a false sense of security.
@Peter @Kempe
You are merely repeating yesterday’s point (same tactic as Dave B just now).
You don’t address my point this morning, which is that these letters may be colloquially and loosely known as “D Notices” because they act in a similar way, reminding editors of their obligations and noting specific points that must be cleared before publication.
It also puts the lie to the idea that the D Notice committee never take any action in response to a specific threat, as one might think from their website.
While it’s true that they don’t change the 5 main DA Notices except at their bi-annual meetings (if then), but in between they can send “reminders” to editors as often as they like.
You don’t address my point this morning, which is that these letters may be colloquially and loosely known as “D Notices” because they act in a similar way
Actually, I confirmed your point, citing an authoritative source.
@Peter
Yeah, bet Zaid is shitting his pants now.
😀
@Peter
Actually, I confirmed your point, citing an authoritative source.
Ah OK, my bad – must’ve read it too quickly.
Yeah, bet Zaid is shitting his pants now.
Well, he did from the start, voluntarily going to the police station twice in order to protest his innocence. And if he has any sense at all, he must know that his flat and office have been bugged, his phones are tapped, his car has a GPS tracking device on it, his computers have been fiddled with.
I’m not saying that he is behind these murders, but *without a shadow of doubt*, he is the chief suspect.
Everyone is too keen to point the finger at Mossad, whoever it was must be pleased about that.
I’m pretty sure Mosad would not give warnings…..which then begs the question, why was AH scared for weeks before leaving for France ?
He was hospitalised for a night with irregular heartbeat,palpitations & he actually told someone he was ‘scared’.
Then those papers he needed to hide,change the locks. Zaid could well be behind it, but not for will the dispute.
I’m pretty sure Mosad would not give warnings…..
Oh, but they do, particularly to sensitive targets like european passport-holders. Repeated warnings, of escalating seriousness. (I recommend the excellent book “Guns, Lies & Spies” on the so-called iraqi supergun for a first-hand account of such warnings).
Peter .
OK, so give us an example of the type of warning AH ‘may’ have been getting ?
Edit. ‘the will dispute’.
@ Katie
Well, Germany also provides a rich source of such warnings. Over the years, lots of german scientists and businessmen who were up to no good (from the Mossad’s point of view) have been warned off. A common pattern would seem to be: 1. A clear verbal warning – “Stop it or we will kill you”. 2. Observation that is intended to be noticed by the target, performed by local sayanim. 3. Damage to cars or property, which the police will write off as common vandalism. 4. A burglary of the target’s home which leaves traces that the target will notice (e. g. pictures taken off the walls, objects rearranged) but no obvious damage that one could report to the police.
Just did a bit of a catch up…
Interesting re suspicions over Iraqi passports issued in Sweden.
Could it be that it was the grandmother (Suhayla) who was of Iranian birth?
Still major gaps in Saad’s (and Zaid’s?) history, mid 1980s to c.2002? Is the moving van picture (Saad and Gary) accurately dated as 1997?
Noticed a report quoted above saying three shots to each of those killed / in the car. Useful to know how many, if any, casings were found in the car, since it was said ten were found under it after it was moved. Were any of those ten the three fired at SM and the one that hit Zainab? Where did the ‘surplus’ bullets go?
I’m keeping an open mind to every possibility but I’d caution those folks who have a filter through which they analyse every event that their filter may blind them to other possibilities in this case.
So, Anders, KS et al – Yes, there may be an elephant with a lot of ‘previous’ in the room but if you dwell on the elephant you might miss his co-conspirator or perhaps the real culprit, the snake in the corner.
This thread is swilling old theories around like John Sawers brandy on a Friday afternoon!
The attack on the consulate happened on Sept 11th and is connected to al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (Hicheur was connected to this org).
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2212025/Obama-orders-CIA-Navy-SEALS-hunt-terrorists-attacked-US-consulate-Libya.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/9246045/French-CERN-scientist-jailed-for-plotting-terror-attacks.html
@ Katie
Actually, now that I have written that … The fourth and final warning, the burglary, which indicates that a Kidon team is in town and that you have only hours or at the most days left to mend your ways before the actual killers move in, that *would* motivate many people to change the locks (a futile exercise) and embark on an impromptu holiday, no?
“Actually, now that I have written that … The fourth and final warning, the burglary, which indicates that a Kidon team is in town and that you have only hours or at the most days left to mend your ways before the actual killers move in, that *would* motivate many people to change the locks (a futile exercise) and embark on an impromptu holiday, no?”
And while escaping stop to warn a partner in crime?
Y
“So does that mean the French give up all the laws that apply to media within their country … give me examples.”
Computer crashed so couldn’t get back to you sooner. I didn’t say anything about French law per se. I simply made the observation that the news really ground to a halt once the investigation moved to Britain despite it’s less rigorous rules on press secrecy compared to France and I still think that. I don’t know how much the investigation is subject to different confidentiality rules as it is now operating under the Eurojust system.
“It is interesting that they let him wander around France with no protection even though they knew he was an Israeli “sikul memukad” or high profile target. A deserted country road would have been ideal for the Israeli kill team sent after him.
Looks like he either outlived his usefulness or went ‘rogue’”
“Remember this day
Looks like they were attempting to run
06.09.2012 14:27
The local police (before they were shut up) said that the family had multiple passports including British, Iraqi, Swedish and UAE. It seems they were travelling cross country perhaps back to Iraq where they would feel safe .”
So he knows their after him, so he loads up granny and the family and does a bunk, but decides collect something off Mollier on the way?
It’s disgusting the way this zionist scum operates. I didn’t know they were giving these warnings to German scientists. What the f….! A country the size of Delaware plus Cecil county in Maryland (I’m talking about inhabited areas, therefore the mostly empty Negev desert is deducted in Israel squere area when comparing to Delaware plus Cecil county in Maryland) going around giving warnings to other countries scientists! If this f….. country didn’t exists there wouldn’t be any terror-issue to speak of. Israel is the reason why you have to take your shoes off before bording a flight an the reason why your wife needs to have her bra fumbled with (Something that women just hates, simply hates! – having complete strangers to do)
It’s disgusting the way this zionist scum operates. I didn’t know they were giving these warnings to German scientists. What the f….! A country the size of Delaware plus Cecil county in Maryland (I’m talking about inhabited areas, therefore the mostly empty Negev desert is deducted in Israel squere area when comparing to Delaware plus Cecil county in Maryland) going around giving warnings to other countries scientists!
If this country didn’t exist, there wouldn’t be any terror-issue to speak of. Israel is the reason why you have to take your shoes off before bording a flight an the reason why your wife needs to have her bra fumbled with (Something that women just hates, simply hates! – having complete strangers to do)