The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Tim
If 12 is a significant number, then we should better hide in a bunker on 9/11 2013.
I dont trust numbers. I trust history and previous events.
Of course, the zionist part of Israel might not be happy with the muslim manifesto “Mein Kampf”.
There are also parts of the British government and the British society who are not happy with that anti zionist manifesto.
On the other hand, there are British and Irish members of government who secretly support anti zionism. And there are even Israelis of Israel who support anti zionism.
That is why i said: this is no international football game and these are no olympic games.
There are teams from the same nation who fight each other and who cooperate with teams from other nations who also fought versus part of their own teams.
To understand history and events we have to think different and intelligent. Today this isnt nation versus nation nor religion versus religion nor is it king versus king.
Today this is ideology versus ideology, money versus money and mafia versus mafia. In fact we are having world wide civil war, but the propaganda tries to brainwash the population and sell that as a war of country versus country and religion vs religion, what it isnt. We are having civil war. People just dont understand this due to MSM propaganda.
James
9 Sep, 2013 – 4:41 pm couldn’t u just for ONCE curb yur excruciating funny sense of humour and concentrate yur exceptionally incisive intellectual powers to the question posed: namely IF that is a genuine photograph of the Chevaline scene as it purports to be, where was the litter bin shown and where did it go? But then it may be a different crime scene altogether, but then I am sure such a possibility would never escape your infallible Glaswegian eagle eye.
Second thoughts don’t bother.
Human history has been a battle of ideas and interests. Those with interests have never been able to resist using and inflaming the differences in ideas, in furtherance of them. Unity v. Division. Uniformity v. Dissent. Toleration v. Discrimination. Co-operation v. Antagonism. Union v Division. Equality v Discrimination. Incorporation v Exclusion. Acquiescence v Resistance. Peace v War – Civil and/or International.
Like the relatively new theory of plate tectonics, the lines of contact are also the points of earthquake. Even with the passage of two thousand years and the recent development of modern science, the divisions and frictions have remained incredibly constant centred around the worlds religions.
A citizen of Constantine’s Rome would be completely at loss with the modern world but may be fairly at home with present strains between Christian, Jew and Muslim, not to mention pagan and cynic. We have yet to see how the world view of Confucian, Buddhist, Hindu, Marxist Atheist or any other will play out in world events or how they will be used in the real ongoing underlying, struggle for political hegemony and competition for ever decreasing raw materials.
As you say BB, far more complicated than politicians and popular media would have us believe.
but hasnt 9/11/13 already gone Bluebird
9 Sep, 2013 – 9:13 pm in that it reflects the American habit of month followed by day – hence 9/11 represents 11th September rather than 9th November? (I promise not to let on to James about this and your little Chessington blunder or you may be the recipient of his cruel Cockney humour as am I 😉 ) Anyhooo keep up your great researches. Where would we have been without you?
ps. as long since noted 5th September is resonant of other far more significant events in the Jewish calender than that London document but what a happy (or unhappy) coincidence it may appear to those involve both sides of the now literal “fence”?
thanks Bleb. Only a practising one. i’e. not yet fully competent at it
Tim
Your bin pic.
1. Top right. The logo “TF1”. That’s French TV.
2. Any other pics of “Scene Of Crime Officers” (SOCO) available from The Martinet car park by any other channel/Newspaper/Getty Images/AP ?
Therefore….pretty sure that your pic is “library footage” that got aired on TF1 and now it’s turned up as “screen grab”.
Going off topic again. Does anyone know if there is a list of dead remote sensing scientists? If so, this man’s name should be added:
http://ca.linkedin.com/pub/klaus-p-hochheim/43/323/905
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/Fatal-crash-in-Arctic-involving-Amundsen-223141291.html?story=U%20of%20M%20researcher%20dies%20in%20fatal%20Arctic%20crash
As we know, Saad al-Hilli did work in this field.
james (James
10 Sep, 2013 – 6:56 pm) i don’t dispute any of the points you make but you still miss the main ones for some reason.
If the image is GENUINE and of the Chevaline crime scene as PURPORTED, where was the LITTER BIN shown? As far as I am aware, it doesn’t appear on any other images. One can only surmise it was removed (which is quite understandable).
However the significance of the photo if reliable, is that it shows what appears to be markers of bullet casings or shots. If we knew where the bin was located it would tell us where those casings landed and roughly where the shots were fired.
If there were a litter bin in that layby I would guess the sign area at the “top” might be the most likely place but this is in the absence of an earlier overview …..?
Tim you’ve dominated these pages, done a great deal of talking [which I admit to not reading most] & posting of multiple links, it seems to me you do get bogged down with minutia, like a litter bin, why don’t you come up with your theory [ concisely] as to why & who did it……
After a year of chasing around the world & trying to link every world event to this case you must have formed an opinion ?
Happy 9/11 everyone 🙂
@RR
A very belated reply to your comment:
In last year comments you could have seen a certain Katy asking to put on a COM_On 500 line, which is merely a command to open port 500 on your computer. With your ip, which the FSB of course can look up, it’s possible to sniff around on your computer.
Slight correction: adding “?com_num=500” (as Katie recommended) to the end of a URL when browsing the internet won’t open up any ports on your computer.
However, it could allow someone with access to internet meta-data to discover the location (IP address) of the computer issuing the request. And they could even do this through a VPN, if they had its logs.
Given Snowden’s recent revelations, I expect the NSA has access to VPN logs located in all friendly (NATO) countries and probably others as well, and they may even be able to decrypt low-level encryption (SSL) to break the security on VPN traffic in any case.
Katie’s excuse at the time (and now) for posting this “advice” was that it worked for her on another (unspecified) system, but this was scarcely believable at the time (and now) simply because it doesn’t work here and never did.
And asking me to believe that someone who knows what a “URL” is but doesn’t realise that this command would be system-specific and would post this as advice without first trying it out herself? Give me a break.
And in any case, this is *not* how you save a page, rather than a link, as Katie advised… erm that would be “file, save as”, hello???
Just for clarity, here are her exact comments from Oct last year:
Katie – 30 Oct, 2012 – 17:31
And…
Katie – 30 Oct, 2012 – 19:12
Ferret, for heavens sake….. I have explained again why I said it, though God knows why you are so weird about it !
On our SITE 4 YEARS AGO IT WORKED computers have come a long way in a short time & as I said a couple of days ago it was to place ALL comments on one page & save, which clearly it could not work here had I thought it through…. get over it & stop nit picking about a perfectly innocent comment which was meant to be helpful, nothing more.
There’s far too much suspicion here.
As for your happy 9/11 everyone, that’s sick !!!
Russia moves to next step of propaganda and calls 9/11 an inside job on Russian TV with “new facts and proof” being presented.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature…&v=N1Vi5YHxsLI
Not so much news in that propaganda TV report on RT. However, this is evidence of a next step of propaganda war.
Sorry. Here is the correct russian TV 9/11 link again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1Vi5YHxsLI
Morning BB, I’m more interested in what happened in Benghazi 12 months ago, we still have no straight forward or honest explanation on what happened that day.
Katie
A few weeks ago i did post here credible statements of a CIA insider who did tell step by step regarding Bengazi in a 3 issues statement, debunking the official line.
You should find those links here. Probably on one of the two previous pages.
I posted those links not because of Benghazi but because of the whistleblower.
BB, yes I’ve read quite a lot about it, but still no one has admitted their blunder or deliberate intent from the White House, is anyone going to be called to account, what about the parents of the three Americans,surely they will not allow it to rest as ‘unfortunate’ . Will we ever know?
I shall be glad when we get through today, hopefully unscathed !
I happened to be watching yesterday’s episode of New Storage Hunters on Dave, someone had bought a jewelled Luger and found out that it devalued the gun.
He was offered to shoot a regular Luger in the indoor firing range. (about 24/25 mins)
The casings hit the ceiling with some speed and came down almost hitting the gun, maybe just a couple of inches to the left.
I then found this discussion:-
http://luger.gunboards.com/archive/index.php/t-10928.html
Here it says they eject up and to the rear, one says they hit them on the head.
This means finding the extra 10 casings cant be under Saad’s BMW unless then started firing from that position and he reversed at them.
Straw
That is an interesting theory.
So was SM the shooter and Saad used the car as his “weapon”, hitting the shooter with his car? That would suggest that SM was injured by the car’s hit, the gun probably damaged and a second guy finished that job, killing the already injured SM to cover his participation, since the second guy realised that they could not get rid of an injured SM without uncovering the identity of the shooters.
My first most logic theory was that SM was hit by the car with intention. Probably hit at high speed that caused the car to crash into the rear of the parking lot and stopping exactly where SM was starting to shoot at them.
Katie, regarding your question FYI:
http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/51400
Read part 1 and part 3, too!
http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/55502
http://www.activistpost.com/2013/08/benghazi-insiders-fear-cia-you-dont.html
In exclusive communications obtained by CNN, one insider writes, “You don’t jeopardize yourself, you jeopardize your family as well.”
Another says, “You have no idea the amount of pressure being brought to bear on anyone with knowledge of this operation.”
Thanks BB I shall read,but look it had to happen:
“A powerful blast caused serious damage to a foreign ministry building in the eastern Libyan city of Benghazi Sept.11, witnesses said.
The explosion comes on the first anniversary of an attack by militants on the United States consulate in Benghazi, which killed four Americans, including the ambassador.
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/blast-wrecks-government-office-in-libyas-benghazi-witnesses.aspx?pageID=238&nID=54239&NewsCatID=352
Yes I read that from someone who lives in Canada.BB, I understand the fear, it stinks to high heaven & I really feel for those parents.
Obama just cannot be trusted, his half brother runs the MB in Egypt I believe.
A couple of weeks ago, we reported the claims of the former Chancellor of the Constitutional Court of Egypt and current adviser, Tahani Al-Jebali. She alleged that one of the reasons Barack Obama keeps siding with the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt (Syria too, for that matter) is that his brother is a major player with the Muslim Brotherhood. CNN Arabic reported Al-Jebali’s claims as well.
http://shoebat.com/2013/08/31/photos-that-implicate-malik-obama-and-lois-lerner/137
Katie
The muslim brotherhood is an agency created by the UK (MI6 al Banna) and funded by Saudi Arabia.
MB is the Gladio/stay behind organisation in muslim countries.
There is no surprise at all when Malik Obama is an important figure of a Muslim Gladio organisation.
The MB/Gladio in Lebanon was created in 1962 by Sheikh Zaid Saad Shabaan.
It looks as if Iran sent another message to al Saud with that anniversary explosion in Benghazi.
Katie
FyI
Worth reading the complete links to understand the political situation in the middle east and in north/eastern africa.
http://mediachecker.wordpress.com/2013/07/09/brief-narrative-timelines-cia-mi6-muslim-brotherhood-al-qaeda/
Quotes
Alastair Crooke. [Source: Conflicts Forum]Alastair Crooke, an agent for the British intelligence service MI6, helps out with the anti-Soviet jihad and gets “to know some of the militants who would become leaders of al-Qaeda.” [New Statesman, 4/11/2005] He also spends “years during the 1980s with Osama Bin Laden’s henchmen in Afghanistan.” [Sunday Express, 6/12/2005] Crooke, whose role is to coordinate British assistance to the mujaheddin, will later be described by CIA officer Milton Bearden as “a natural on the frontier” and “a British agent straight out of the Great Game.” Details of exactly which future al-Qaeda leaders he gets to know are not available. In the 1990s, Crooke will move to Palestine, where he will come into contact with Hamas leaders. [New Statesman, 4/11/2005]
In 1988, the Al Taqwa Bank is founded in Switzerland, and it quickly becomes one of the major funders for radical Islamic groups, including al-Qaeda (see 1988). The Al Taqwa Bank is closely associated with the Muslim Brotherhood, and one of its key founders, Said Ramadan, is one of the Muslim Brotherhood’s top leaders, and also the son-in-law of Hassan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood. Ramadan helped Saudi Arabia found the Muslim World League in 1962; the charity will go on to fund al-Qaeda and many other radical groups. But there is strong evidence that Ramadan also was a long-time CIA asset.[Dreyfuss, 2005, pp. 136] Declassified Swiss documents reveal that in the 1960s, the Swiss government considered him to be, “among other things, an intelligence agent of the British and the Americans.” The Wall Street Journal will report in 2005, “Historical evidence suggests Mr. Ramadan worked with the CIA.”
According to the 1999 book Dollars for Terror, two weeks before his abduction, Qassem was in Switzerland negotiating against Muslim Brotherhood leaders. Some Muslim Brotherhood exiles were negotiating with the Egyptian government to be allowed to return to Egypt if they agreed not to use Muslim Brotherhood Swiss bank accounts to fund Egyptian militant groups like Al-Gama’a al-Islamiyya, but Qassem and other radicals oppose this deal. So the removal of Qassem helps the Muslim Brotherhood in their conflict with more militant groups
The British intelligence service MI6 and Moroccan intelligence approach al-Qaeda operative L’Houssaine Kherchtou in an attempt to recruit him. Kherchtou is disillusioned with al-Qaeda and has been under surveillance by the Moroccans for some time. The results of the first meeting are not known, but after it Kherchtou returns to Nairobi, Kenya, where he had helped with a plot to bomb the US embassy and provided his apartment to other conspirators (see Late 1993-Late 1994), and makes contact with other cell members again in early August. He apparently does not know the precise details of the operation, but when the attack happens (see10:35-10:39 a.m., August 7, 1998), he realizes who did it. MI6 is aware that he is in Kenya and he is detained at the airport by local authorities and turned over to them. MI6 debriefs him about the embassy bombings, but this information is not immediately shared with the FBI (see Shortly After August 7, 1998), which later takes him into custody (see Summer 2000). [American Prospect, 6/19/2005]
The British intelligence agency MI6 monitors shipments made by the A. Q. Khan nuclear proliferation network from Pakistan to Libya via Dubai, United Arab Emirates. MI6 asks a British customs officer, Malcolm Nesbit, who is stationed in Dubai, to help with the operation. At MI6’s request, he finds when certain containers arrive in Dubai, how long they stay, when they leave port, and what they carry. Nesbit does not understand the full implications of this surveillance at the time, but will realize why MI6 wanted the information later, when another customs agent investigates Khan’s network in Dubai (see Late March 2000). The contents of the containers are not known, although it is known that Khan is shipping centrifuge parts to Libya through Dubai at this time (see Late March 2000). [Armstrong and Trento, 2007, pp. 189]
http://markcurtis.wordpress.com/2010/12/18/britain-and-the-muslim-brotherhood-collaboration-during-the-1940s-and-1950s/
Call me naive BB, but I can’t see Iran there at all. I have good imagination but just useless at seeing all this scheming.
Whatever the origins of the MB I know the leaders are supposed to be in jail in Egypt but O was calling for the release of Morsi, then there’s that 8 billion dollars which was secretly sent them by O with no accounting from whence it came.
All hushed up as a gift from the Qatari’s but the Egyptian News was sure where it came from. Even IF it came from Qatar the reason is spurious when Qatar is an ally.
http://www.westernjournalism.com/obamas-secret-8-billion-bribe-to-the-muslim-brotherhood/
News in Ben Zygier:
Family receives millions from Israel in return for staying quiet and silent.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4428236,00.html
State to pay Zygier’s family NIS 4 million in compensation
A second prisoner X in the same jail:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4402610,00.html
Katie:
Just read the links i gave you above from canadafreepress and you’re going to understand the Iran/AQIM connection in regards to Benghazi.
Benghazi 2012 was an iranian attack because
1) this was no embassy but a CIA headquarter
2) there were AQIM mercenaries jailed in that headquarter
3) Iran also assumed that 7 of their agents were jailed there but they werent there.
4) opposed of the saudi/american financed al Qaida mercenary organisation, AQIM is being financed by Iran.
5) that CIA headquarter was used to recruit north african mercenaries to join the syrian rebels army.
6) that CIA headquarter was used to transfer libyan weapons (including chemical ones) to syria.
@Dim
for Christ sake !
“If the image is GENUINE and of the Chevaline crime scene as PURPORTED, where was the LITTER BIN shown ?”
The image is “genuine”.
They look like SOCO. They act like SOCO. They probably are SOCO.
And of Chevaline.
It’s not of The Martinet car park, no. So not “of Chevaline”.
Numerous reasons already covered.
So where is the bin ?
I don’t know. Grenoble ? Lyon ? Montpellier ?
It may even be in a park outside of Paris ? Who cares ?
Ask the “footage library” at TF1 television.
I’ll find their email address for you.
@Straw
Good point re luger and car.
Most interesting.
Re your Canadian links BB, yes I knew & believe the gun running, it’s clear the storage facility could only have been cleared by a state sponsored plan, it was vast,no private outfit could have done it…purely through the logistics .
Clinton certainly lied & yes the video had been around for a couple of years then mysteriously got translated into Arabic around that time. all very convenient.
Who planned & actually perpetrated the attack….I can’t decide because there are so many possibilities. The Obama administration should have held their hands up & said they were negligent instead of lying & it could have died down quicker,but they didn’t which implicates them further so…………
Who is going to impeach Obama ?
Out of all the comments in the online news sites, I have not read one in favour of this president now.
With all this happening it brings me back to Saddam’s arms dealer… Mr X.
With his contacts you can bet your life he’s in there somewhere.
I see O has beefed up his security,he was almost lost among the burly chaps I saw him walking with yesterday.
I’m still having trouble posting, so hence the delay.
“Innocent” Katie
11 Sep, 2013 – 9:05 am says:
“Morning BB, I’m more interested in what happened in Benghazi 12 months ago, we still have no straight forward or honest explanation on what happened that day.”
More interested in who and why the American consulate was attacked (I agree very fishy just before the Presidential election given the political capital made of it by the right wingers) than the concerted attacks on the United States causing 3000 plus deaths, long term disease in thousands, the loss of a huge amount of misfeasance information, more than a decade of war in Afghanistan, the illegal invasion of Iraq and millions of deaths, direct and indirect there, the stoking of religious hatred and division around the world, and all clearly proved to be an inside job, unrelated to Al Qaeda.
Says something about priorities I suppose and then you have the cheek to have a go at me for my posts on here. Like James you have failed the question I posed regarding the dust bin in the photo that is significant as to shooter and bullets and instead just pour scorn on it. Like your “innocent” document saving advice, and being “more interested in Benghazi than 9/11”, that too I find very suspicious.
That old chestnut Tim has been chewed over for 12 years, everything has its limits !
We’ve all read the books, the theories & the conspiracies.
I’m English I could go on about 7/7 but I don’t, how many of you spare a thought for those killed & injured in London ? I bet you didn’t even remember the date.
Benghazi was only 1 year ago.
If it’s priorities you want then why are you banging on about a litter bin………. Don’t answer, that was a rhetorical question.
As for answering your question, why don’t you answer mine ?