The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
@ Peter
All good points. I am with you on the radio front.
@ Tim V
The ‘connection’ may be an error.
For instance, off the top of my head, MC1 may be observing SM as a favour to one of the Schutzes to see whether rumours of his philandering are true. Knowing SM’s route and the ‘reputation’ of Le Martinet he gets there early for a stake out. It being the most likely spot for an assignation.
The key point in this scenario being that MC1 is purely an observer.
If SM were meeting up with someone of the female persuasion at the carpark, then the only candidates are the two women in the back of PB’s motor. Maybe one of their husbands/boyfriends hired someone to end the affair.
A. N. Other, driving the X5, is the archetypal swarthy hit-man. He also got there early and parked further up the valley. He sneaked back down and shot up the wrong car.
The point being that the ‘real’ connection is not SM + SAH.
So, when the ONF saw him, was the amateur gumshoe holding a telephoto camera, or as Peter implies, a TETRAPOL radio?
P.S. It is also easy to construct scenarios whereby the SAH party are the actual targets and the connection with SM is a ‘mistake’.
Yesterday at 7:46pm I posted:-
“It really cannot be this simple, they would have to be insane to leave the actual MC there!”.
Anyway, I just now looked at Deadzone61/TCK and Lynda, a poster there, wrote “the white MC at the Pharmacy is TOO easy”.
Here’s the thing – she is right – it is not just insane, it is too easy.
So, either the french police know all about “goatee gumshoe” and aren’t saying, or it is some kind of honeypot.
If it is a honeypot, who are they after, bees or bears?
Just a thought
I am sure that state intelligence is able to update google street view pictures if they wanted to.
Particularly the state intelligence that works united with google.
I am not saying that they did it, but there is a possibility.
Who else lives in Grignon at this address? House in the background and house opposite of the pharmacy?
Here they are, the sapeurs volontaires of the CPI Grignon
http://www.monthion.com/fichiers/pdf/articles_de_presse13/dl_lundi_18_novembre13.pdf
None of them has a beard, which shouldn’t come as a surprise, because Google tells me that firefighters are not supposed to have beards anyway, since facial hair would interfere with the seal of their breathing apparatuses. Thus, as the mystery motorcyclist seen at the Martinet was described as having a beard, he was almost certainly not a firefighter.
There goes that hypothesis 🙁
Peter, maybe,but for the holiday period, supposing a beard is grown then?
What we have seen was a matter of a few days growth,not a fully fledged bushy beard.
This crime was committed September the 5th…at the end of the French summer holiday.
Of course they can’t all be on holiday for the August break,but this guy could have been.
1.I have always raised the issue of the Sapeurs (Sapeurs-pompiers: The rest of France has civilian fire services organized, supervised and trained by the French Ministry of the Interior; specifically, they fall under the Civil Defence and Security Directorate (Direction des défense et sécurité civiles, DDSC) getting to the scene FIRST. Indeed it is the police who are the last to arrive! Let’s put it into the a British context. A mass murder is reported in a remote spot and the first to arrive is the FIRE BRIGADE?
2.I have always questioned how it was they got the information. Was this formal notification and tasking or was it a case of OVERHEARING communication not specifically intended for them, and a team off their own bat, deciding to respond?
3.I think I might have been the first and only person to draw attention to the lie that was the 3.48 call – at least from anyone it was attributed to by the French authorities. Which poses the question who did?
4.EM pointedly excluded any involvement of the Forestry Service. We now know, from British sourced leaks that have not been contradicted, that this is also a lie. Indeed not one but TWO ONF vehicles and at least three personnel were intimately involved at precisely the same time as the events taking place, even seeing (twice) and interviewing his CHIEF SUSPECT!!!! This is quite incredible. Why did Maillaud lie about them when they were so CENTRAL to the case?
5. Given their proximity, the possibility that one or other of the forestry vehicles actually contained the killers – what better camouflage could they have? (I raised this possibility way back before the Panorama programme revealed two were in the vicinity) The revelations make it more not less a possibility.
6. If this were the case, the RHD BMW X5 rushing up could quite easily be British MI6/SAS back-up when the fatal situation becomes apparent, forestry truck having escaped back south?
7. And finally … why have we heard absolutely ZILCH from the second cyclist that apparently arrived after WBM but before the emergency services? How and why has he, an OAP, been written out of the script altogether?
Back to the local affair
http://www.lepoint.fr/actualites-societe/2007-01-24/la-chevauchee-des-anges-de-l-enfer/920/0/85120
There is a local wsr “Hells Angels” versus “Bandidos/Sadukarah”.
This is about prostitution control), drugs and guns.
The french and german bandidos are more or less Kurds.
Kurds from Turkey, Syria and Iran, many of them related to PKK and London kurdish mafia as discussed earlier.
Of course police and eric would not like to be involved in a rocker warfare. Of course the locals are quiet. Those who interfere with the interests of those gangs will be killed.
I am pretty sure that the “vendetta of doussard” is a kurdish (bandidos) war versus the local hells angels gang.
This is very similar to assassinations and attacks in germany.
Witnesses are being protected by police, not named and left out if that game.
So then, where does that biker belong to?
Correction typo above (sorry):
Should read: Hells Angels (81) versus Bandidos/Satudarah
The local “81” group is called: “Bad Winners de Haute-Savoie”
They are at war with the kurdish group of Satudarah (PKK drugs, weapons, racketeering, prostitution and human trafficing smuggling mafia). The “81” bosses in germany are driving BMW X5 Security.
The local vendetta is Kurds (Satudarah/Bandidos) versus “81”.
“81” are particularly local people who are often in close connection with local police and local right wing groups as well as with local companies.
If one of theirs is killed they will not ask police for help. They will solve that their way (“outlaws”, vendetta). Police knows this and they dont want to get involved.
That might be a reason for the secrets and lies, too.
There’s a lot to read (in french) that might clearify some mysteries we’ve had here about french police secrets.
http://l-idiot-provincial.e-monsite.com/pages/stop-au-free-wheels-2012/dissolution-du-hamc-france.html
“Wanted”un appel pratiquementau “meurtre”Poussé dans ses “retranchements” par l’Idiot provincial, le HAMC-France vient de démontrer son vrai visage avec la “bénédiction” du maire de Courpière et du/ou propriétaire (s) du terrain de “La Bezeix” à Courpière – et la justice le déterminera -.Puisque le HAMC a pris la responsabilité – tant sur le plan civil que pénal – de nous “attaquer” nous allons bien voir jusqu’où le HAMC a des “ramifications” en France et in fine dans d’autres pays, nous allons bien savoir – in fine – quels ont été ses modes de fonctionnement à Courpière, combien a coûté la participation financière au contribuable le Free Wheels 2010 et le Free Wheels 2011, et ce, de A à Z.Des ra
Very much information regarding a local vendetta, particularly in the 45 comments.
http://lepoint.fr/reactions/societe/commentaires-sur-les-hells-angels-sement-la-terreur-en-alsace-08-05-2011-1328122_23
http://lepoint.fr/societe/les-hells-angels-sement-la-terreur-en-alsace-08-05-2011-1328122_23.php
Just a summary here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bandidos_Motorcycle_Club
Read “Scandinavia” and “Australia” chapters above. Lots of Arab names in their leading structures.
Annecy MC is a Bandidos chapter in France. There is a local fight versus “81” Haute Savoie regarding racketeering, prostitution and drugs.
Good for you Eduardo. Best of luck with the catching up.
[Mod: sorry, “Eduardo” was a spam-bot.]
I am working on better comprehension of the recent French Non élucidé episode.
My first impressions are that it is quite well done. More interesting than the BBC’s attempt. There are many contributors in addition to the two presenters. Several journos, pschycologists, police, ex police, weapons experts and the driver with the hiker companions. The local cop Lcl Benoit Vinneman seems a straight shooter and they do discuss the the primary target options rather than dismiss Mollier as a target. I will continue to study off and on, as much an exercise to improve my French.
Also, on a what have we missed track: Remember Abiodun David John, the Nigerian who supposedly tried to access Saad’s bank account several times between July and September of 2012.
It occurred to me at the time, How on earth did this guy from Salford get Saad’s pin or it seems, his on-line password?
And why, if he did, was the case dropped?
He had exclaimed that he didn’t know what the police were talking about and that he thought his phone and computer had been hacked.
By dropping the case it would seem to validate his claim of innocence and probably his claim of being hacked.
But if you think about it, if you were an organization with resources, and you had used them to obtain passwords etc. and were curious as to activity on the account, you might well find an unsuspecting ‘Nigerian’ and his IP address to covertly hack into and remotely access Al Hilli’s account.
His origin combined with involvement in bank funny business, is a very powerful (and perhaps very clever) automatic pre-suggestion of guilt and distancing from the crime, to all?
Intp1
Regarding David John i did a pretty good investigation that was quite accurate imho. You can read this on this blog.
This is about a money exchange corporation with its head offices in london and belgium, but with other offices worldwide, particularly Malaga and iraq.
That money exchange and money cash transfer corporation (similar to western union) has a history of money laundering and it was often used by nigerian scammers before. It has a criminal history.
One of the spanish aides of arab origin of kadhim al hilli was working in the malaga office.
Therefore, with nigerians working there, tio, and with scammers, it isnt unlikely that they read about the killing in the media and tried to steal the money with the information they have had from previous money transfers of the victim.
I see that crime as to be totally unrelated and just enforced by some kind of criminal leeches who go for money of dead people.
@BB
So why do you think they dropped the case?
The DPP said because “not in the public interest”. I’m not sure when they trot that phrase out but they could have said insufficient evidence or some such.
@intp1
“The DPP said because “not in the public interest”. I’m not sure when they trot that phrase out …”
A cynic might say that means the DPP has been “leant on” by politicians on behalf of some interested party and that it really means “not in the interested parties interest”
I’m, of course, not saying that, only pointing out what a cynic might say.
On a probably unrelated subject, just watched this Sibel Edmonds interview which, with startling clarity, fills in a whole lot of blanks, especially re. Turkey, Syria, 911 and talks about Gladio B several times.
http://www.boilingfrogspost.com/2014/01/21/bfp-eyeopener-report-sibel-edmonds-on-the-cias-reverse-engineering-of-turkeys-erdogan/
@ bluebird 21 Jan, 2014 – 3:22 pm
“Therefore, with nigerians working there, tio, and with scammers, it isnt unlikely that they read about the killing in the media and tried to steal the money with the information they have had from previous money transfers of the victim.”
Unfortunately the timeline doesn’t work. The scam accounts were set up before the killings. In fact the first fraudulent withdrawal also occured before the killings.
And I can’t quite see Nigerian John organising the killings either.
Rashomon
I dont think that the scam had anything to do with SAH’s death but likely with Kadhim’s death.
The scam was based in the Malaga office of that money exchange company with one of Kadhim’s young Arab aides working there.
The timeline fits very well with Kadhim’s death and with the inheritance. Some people waited like leeches for that day when the Swiss bank did unlock that account where Kadhim had access to. And the scammers knew the account details due to Kadhim’s aide who worked for that exchange office where one of David John’s relatives worked (in Malaga) too. That Malaga money exchange office had a history in money laundering and a history in nigerian scamming. I am pretty sure that there were the roots of why David John had the bank data.
Due to the bad history of that money exchange corporation with its headquarter in London and Brussels, I suspect that its activities of money laundering are somehow protected by a government, otherwise it would have been closed long ago.
While western union is a CIA company, i suggest that this money exchange corporation in question might be a MI6 or a Mossad company. Following that suggestion, we can understand better why David John wasnt prosecuted and why his prosecution isnt supporting the “interest of the society”.
Afghanistan opium harvest at record high – UNODC
“The UNODC report said the harvest was 36% up on last year, and if fully realised would outstrip GLOBAL demand.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-24919056
“At current levels, world heroin consumption (340 tons) and seizures represent an annual flow of 430-450 tons of heroin into the global heroin market. Of that total, opium from Myanmar and the Lao People’s Democratic Republic yields some 50 tons, while the rest, some 380 tons of heroin and morphine, is produced exclusively from Afghan opium. While approximately 5 tons are consumed and seized in Afghanistan, the remaining bulk of 375 tons is trafficked worldwide via routes flowing into and through the countries neighbouring Afghanistan.”
“The Balkan and northern routes are the main heroin trafficking corridors linking Afghanistan to the huge markets of the Russian Federation and Western Europe. The Balkan route traverses the Islamic Republic of Iran (often via Pakistan), Turkey, Greece and Bulgaria across South-East Europe to the Western European market, with an annual market value of some $20 billion. The northern route runs mainly through Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan (or Uzbekistan or Turkmenistan) to Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation. The size of that market is estimated to total $13 billion per year.”
“In 2007 and 2008, cocaine was used by some 16 to 17 million people worldwide, similar to the number of global opiate users. North America accounted for more than 40 per cent of global cocaine consumption (the total was estimated at around 470 tons), while the 27 European Union and four European Free Trade Association countries accounted for more than a quarter of total consumption. These two regions account for more than 80 per cent of the total value of the global cocaine market, which was estimated at $88 billion in 2008.”
http://www.unodc.org/unodc/en/drug-trafficking/
In 2008 over 73 metric tons of heroin was seized, more than half of which was in Iran and Turkey. It’s not quite clear what these desperate economies do with this very valuable product. One can only surmise.
So we have a global trade approximating to all the UK government expenditure, all of it illicit and therefore disguised and “laundered”. The reality that the property market, banks and governments themselves would collapse without this illegal injection of cash and they know it. Debt is provided in part from the receipts and governments are complicit in the scam. Of course this takes no account of the huge cost (social/mental disruption, police, crime, health) from the user end. As BB has proposed, this huge trade from the Iran/Iraq end could easily be part of the Chevaline mix but not all of it I feel sure.
The last time Cameron and Hollande met was the day following Chevaline. This time it is all happening at Brize Norton, which I suppose could be described as “low key” and dominated by issues of the EC, military and nuclear co-operation, particularly the development of a new “drone”. At the press conference there were questions regarding Hollande’s personal life but nothing about their earlier commitment to solve the crime and find the killers.
In the nuanced world of diplomacy, where does a day’s meeting at a military airport come? Tensions under the surface there definitely are, whilst not rocking the boat a priority. Not unlike what has been the prevailing mood of Chevaline. I wonder if Chevaline was ever discussed on this trip?
The Guardian reports:
“Britain turned on Paris after French officials made it clear that Hollande was not prepared to accelerate EU treaty negotiations to stabilise the eurozone to fit the prime minister’s EU timetable for changes. Cameron’s plans, which could allow Britain and other member states to opt out of the historic objective to achieve an “ever closer union”, need to be introduced through a treaty change.”
“Cameron and Hollande are expected to put on a friendly front as they hail Anglo-French defence co-operation at the summit. Hollande will fly into and out of the military base, which is in the prime minister’s Witney constituency, allowing him to keep a low profile after the recent revelations about his private life.”
“The two leaders, who will be accompanied by senior ministers, will announce a joint feasibility study on developing a military drone, the joint purchase of missiles, deepening collaboration on nuclear energy and a space industry agreement.”
The cover-up has been perfect. Anyone who could be interested in the Al-Hillis murder case is now sick with the bigot rants that, slower now, fill this thread.
Kudos to you. You’ve killed the MZT blog also, but that was easier.
What’s the next step? Who’s paying for this?
What a silly post. Just this thread has nearly 19,000 posts. By any standards that is quite an achievement maybe even a record. The reason contributions have fallen off is nothing to do with “rants” as you call them (in fact they have been comparatively few and far between on the whole) but because the French and British refuse to reveal anything new of significance. We have to dine on the “scraps that fall from the master’s table”. Even so, the scraps have been sufficient to blow a gigantic hole in the official stories put out. This is classic cover-up scenario, where all outside observers can hope to do is flag up the flaws, inconsistencies and blatantly ludicrous. I think by and large that has been done here quite well, and nowhere else to the same extent. More than enough has been said to prove Chevaline was a very nasty business that either or both nations don’t want to explain for reasons known to themselves. I don’t buy the argument that there are no leads and that the authorities don’t have a clue “who done it”. I believe they do know both cause and perpetrators – the organizing mind if not the identity of individuals. MZT was a closed shop that literally closed up. Why they were opened and closed, and the rules that applied to the contributions when open, still hasn’t been fully revealed. I am not convinced its purpose and identity was fully as claimed. We have had some funny contributions here, but most have been of high quality not seen elsewhere, that has shone a light into some smoky corners of international politics, where as we know nothing is quite what is painted. The Middle East is still a melting pot of super power competition for raw materials, with Syria/Iran continuing to be the focus. I don’t think the revelations or usefulness of this thread is yet exhausted.
A not-so-subtle German hint for those nasty American snoopers. “Don’t forget what we know about 9/11”? Watch and note similarities.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?playlistId=1.1668002
the love of money – the route of all evil
http://www.thetotalcollapse.com/15-february-catastrophe-warned-will-shake-entire-world/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheTotalCollapse+%28The+Total+Collapse%29
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Tim V
4 Feb, 2014 – 11:21 pm
Off topic
That Feb 15 date is an interesting day. It is candlemas in the gregorian calendar that was created from the pagan Imbolc holiday.
Jewish festival day feb 15 2014:
In regular years, the 15th of Adar is Shushan Purim, the festival that celebrates — in Jerusalem and other ancient walled cities — the salvation of the Jewish people from Haman’s evil decree in the year 3405 from creation (356 BCE). In a leap year — which has two Adars — Shushan Purim is observed in Adar II, and the 15th of Adar I is designated as Shushan Purim Kattan, the “Minor Shushan Purim.”
Feb 15 2013 – the strange meteor:
A meteor explodes over Russia, injuring 1,500 people as a shock wave blows out windows and rocks buildings. This happens unexpectedly only hours before theexpected closest ever approach of the larger and unrelated asteroid 2012 DA14.
Imbolc: The Carmina Gadelica, a seminal collection of Scottish folklore, refers to a serpent coming out of the mound on Latha Fheill Bride, as the Scots call Candlemas. This rhyme is still used in the West Highlands and Hebrides.Moch maduinn Bhride, Thig an nimhir as an toll; Cha bhoin mise ris an nimhir, Cha bhoin an nimhir rium.(Early on Bride’s morn, the serpent will come from the hollow I will not molest the serpent, nor will the serpent molest me)Thig an nathair as an toll, la donn Bride Ged robh tri traighean dh’ an t-sneachd air leachd an lair.(The serpent will come from the hollow on the brown day of Bridget Though there should be three feet of snow on the flat surface of the ground).
Sailors are often reluctant to set sail on Candlemas Day, believing that any voyage begun then will end in disaster — given the frequency of severe storms in February, this is not entirely without sense.
+++++
Given the strange symbolism, loudly published in media all over the world regarding Rome and the Vatican in regards to Imbolc and Odinism, february 15 does not sound crazy at all.
“Valac will show you the traitors and show you hidden treasures” was one of the symbols published in MSM recently. This is all pointing towards the Vatican. A nuclear explosion in rome might destroy all and every proof for rightful demand for money in western banks formerly deposited by the vatican. The banks would hold and keep the vatican’s treasures then.
Feb 15th jewish holiday
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haman_(biblical_figure)
Haman (Also known as Haman the Agagiteהמן האגגי, or Haman the evil המן הרשע) is the main antagonist in the Book of Esther, who, according to Old Testament tradition, was a 5th Century BC noble and vizier of the Persian empire under King Ahasuerus, traditionally identified as Xerxes I.
Persian Haman and his wife Zeresh instigate a plot to kill all of the Jews of ancient Persia in one day only.
They failed. They created civil war in Persia and the jews were saved.
Therefore the jews celebrate Shushan Purim on feb 15 2014.
Any coincidence with current iranian-jewish rivalry?
Very interesting connections regarding february 15:
Extremely interesting. That date has got something …..
http://www.herealittletherealittle.net/index.cfm?page_name=Bible-Code-Ten-Sons-Haman
http://unitedwithisrael.org/strange-parallels-between-the-purim-story-and-the-nuremberg-trials/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rollkommando_Hamann
@Tim V
18 Jan, 2014 – 1:33 am
Have to pull you up again on your point number 1 re the Sapeurs Pompiers
“Let’s put it into the a British context. A mass murder is reported in a remote spot and the first to arrive is the FIRE BRIGADE?”
How many times do you have to be told this is France, not Britain and in France the Sapeurs Pompiers are the normal first responders to an accident or emergency, providing fire AND RESCUE SERVICES.
You let yourself down by making false analogies!
Anyway, Happy New Year to All. And on a more pleasing note, Craig’s back, check out his latest here:
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2014/01/war-criminals-on-tv/#comments
@mochyn69 – Are you saying the Sapeurs Pompiers would routinely be first responders to a reported murder?
I’ve really no idea what they do in France but that just seems odd – I would have thought medics to check the victim(s) and police to secure the area and protect the evidence would be more sensible. Or are the Sapeurs Pompiers trained to do those tasks?
Perhaps the incident wasn’t initially reported as a murder?