The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Why all the secrecy if it is just a case of some nobody going postal, as you say, and then why would the killer try to kill others, especially securocrats trying to catch him?
And I thought that we had already established that the Huffington Post blogger Shreen Ayob most likely works for the Mossad.
@Ferret
5 Oct, 2012 – 3:56 pm
What!? To find some hot young Israeli woman spies??
*interval*
meet your new future ‘leaders’ keepin it all in da family……
http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/house-of-straw-whos-who-in-labours-new-generation-8196861.html
… re: obama vs romney … anyone else feel that obama is handing over the reins? seeing as ALL ‘leaders’ are subject to Bilderberg approval…. obama acted very sheepish as if a schoolboy doing something he didnt REALLY want to do but has to …or else…
NWO say – ‘oppit obama its been emotional, now jog on….
What!? To find some hot young Israeli woman spies??
………………
He wishes
@Ferret
The Ashbys (Squadron Ltd) Eward Moses Ashby b.Battersea 6 May 1944 variously SW17 SW19
Director/Co. Sec name:
EDWARD MOSES (JUNIOR) ASHBY WEST SUSSEX GU29 0ET 11299696
Midhurst West Sussex
http://www.dellam.com/cgi-bin/main.pl?language=English&foundnumber=03926457&search=yes
See also
{http://www.dellam.com/05708870-SILVER%20FERN%20%28SUSSEX%29%20LIMITED.html} for silver fern Sussex. ( not sure if that was posted before)
James Ashby = James Frederick Ashby (brother) b 1946 April C12295140 Chichester West Sussex PO18 8HY(also PO18 8EA)
Guess you have seen all this. not sure what it means. Sussex and SW7 seem recurring threads.
I’m not sure whether this is related, but whilst trying to research whether or not Ikbal AH attended the College of Dentistry, University of Baghdad (as Dr Zaid Alabdi, who said that he went to dental school with her, did), I came across this item from 2008:
{http://www.ifdea.org/news/Pages/GunmenkilldeanofBaghdaddentalschool.aspx}
Apparently, the dean of the dental school was only one of ≥ 250 iraqi academics assassinated in Iraq since 2003
{http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_scientistkilling04.htm}
Nobody knows why there were killed or who is behind the killings.
Here is the cnn link about the killing at Eilat – what one would expect from a banana republic police state:
http://edition.cnn.com/2012/10/05/world/meast/israel-hotel-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t3
@Ferret 5 Oct, 2012- 1.37pm
“Is it likely an experienced journalist for the London times would make such a schoolboy error, and type Iraq when they mean Iran? No.”
Seems as though the French media is rather slack when it comes to fact checking ….
Radio France 5.09.2012
Il s’agit d’un famille britannique, la famille Al-Hilli venue en vacances dans un camping de Haute Savoie. Le père, âgé de 50 ans, se nomme Saad Al-Hilli. D’origine irakienne, comme sa femme Iqbal, présente dans la voiture, ils habitaient dans la banlieue sud de Londres avec leurs petites deux filles, Zainab 7 ans et Zeena, 4 ans.
Le Télégramme 6.9.2012
Vingt-quatre heures après leur mort, on en sait en renvanche un peu plus sur les al-Hilli. Saad, 50 ans, et Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que son mari, tous deux d’origine irakienne, habitaient avec leurs fillettes dans un coquet pavillon à colombages typique des banlieues britanniques.
Le Monde.fr avec AFP | 06.09.2012 à 20h12
Saad Al-Hilli, 50 ans, identifié par des sources policières, vivait à Claygate avec sa femme, Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que lui et originaire comme lui d’Irak, et leurs deux filles
Le Parisien Publié le 07.09.2012, 06h43
Saad Al-Hilli, 50 ans, identifié par des sources policières, vivait à Claygate avec sa femme, Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que lui et originaire comme lui d’Irak, et leurs deux filles.D’ores et déjà, les médias anglais évoquent un crime prémédité, voire commandité. Pour quel motif ? Iqbal al-Hili, dentiste de profession, est irakienne d’origine, comme son mari. Elle avait d’abord émigré en Suède, sa maman, âgée de 74 ans, ayant officiellement la nationalité suédoise, avant de s’installer en Angleterre.
Libération 7 septembre 2012 à 23:09 Ce massacre «à la sauvagerie inouïe», durant lequel 4 personnes –Saad al-Hilli, 50 ans, sa femme Iqbal, originaire comme lui de Bagdad, une femme plus âgée de nationalité suédoise et un cyclise français- ont été tuées, donne lieu à une enquête «particulièrement complexe», selon le procureur.
Le Matin (Switzerland) 7.9.2012
Les al-Hilli – Saad, 50 ans, et Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que son mari, tous deux d’origine irakienne – habitaient avec leurs fillettes dans un coquet pavillon à colombages typique des banlieues britanniques.
France 3 Alpes 7.9.2012
Les al-Hilli – Saad, 50 ans, et Iqbal, un peu plus jeune que son mari, tous deux d’origine irakienne – habitaient avec leurs fillettes dans un coquet pavillon à colombages typique des banlieues britanniques.
L’Express 7.09.2012
Sa femme, Iqbal al-Hilli, rencontrée à Dubaï il y a une dizaine d’années, serait également originaire d’Irak. Elle aurait d’abord immigré en Suède, où résidait ses parents, avant de rejoindre Saad al-Hilli en Grande-Bretagne.
Le Journal De Dimanche 9.9.2012
Sa femme Iqbal, une dentiste âgée de 47 ans, était également originaire d’Irak. Il l’avait rencontrée lors de vacances à Dubaï et épousée en 2003.
Le Point 12.09.2012
A l’intérieur se trouvaient le cadavre du père de famille, celui de sa femme Iqbal, originaire comme lui de Bagdad, et celui de la mère de cette dernière, Suédoise.
France 24 14.09.2012
Lors de la tuerie, la petite Zaïnab al-Hilli, grièvement blessée à la tête, a perdu son père et sa mère, Saad et Iqbal al-Hilli, des Britanniques d’origine irakienne, et sa grand-mère maternelle, Suhaila al-Allaf, abattus dans leur voiture sur un chemin forestier près de Chevaline
Libération 14.09.2012
Lors de cette fusillade, la petite Zainab al-Hilli, grièvement blessée à la tête, a perdu son père et sa mère, Saad et Iqbal al-Hilli, des Britanniques d’origine irakienne, et sa grand-mère maternelle, Suhaila al-Allaf, abattus dans leur voiture sur un chemin forestier près de Chevaline.
…. I could go on if you like.
Felix,
PO18 8HY is Bosham,
PO18 8EA is West Ashling,
I now them both very well, photogenic spots. But you lost me getting there.
Why no photos? Well, it makes extraction® easier.
From a Swiss paper – money in Geneva it seems:
http://www.tdg.ch/geneve/actu-genevoise/tuerie-chevaline–argent-saisi-banque-genevoise/story/23767629
@ BadenBrit
Thanks for that. I *knew* that SAH’s trip to that part of France was at least partially motivated by a visit to his swiss bank.
@Peter
Withdrawing money or depositing money?
Paying off Mollier?
@ Y
Who knows? I would tend towards withdrawing money, in order to pay off his brother, or towards trying to ensure that the brother could not independently access (or clear out) the account, which, as I understand the matter, originally belonged to their father.
Anyway, we must be talking about quite substantial sums here. Even with a high-street bank such as UBS (80% market share in the Geneva area), setting up an offshore account used to require a minimum deposit of CHF 300,000 (significantly more in recent years).
Re the money in Geneva in English:
http://www.brecorder.com/world/europe/83979.html
So they find an account but nothing said about the Swiss property then ?
At least we now know why they were dressed up.
But well below 6 mio. CHF in the account. This artcle also discredits the earlier Luger report.
http://www.20min.ch/ro/news/dossier/annecy/story/De-l-argent-saisi-dans-une-banque-a-Geneve-15843633
@ Y
BTW, the notion of Ikbal Al-Hilli being of iraqi descent sits much more comfortably with me than the idea that she might have iranian roots. Not only would that be a better fit with her attending the College of Dentistry, University of Baghdad (if that be true), and with her working in Arabic-speaking Dubai, it also matches what little I know of life. An iraqi friend of mine once told me his idea of the secret key to happiness: “Marry a girl from your home village, a girl who has the same values, the same outlook upon life, who knows the same people and the same stories about their lives that you do.”
I don’t know whether SAH subscribed to the same philosophy, but it would certainly make sense to me.
@ BadenBrit 5 Oct, 2012 – 5:45 pm
I’m not so sure on that point.
L’enquête porte aussi sur l’arme du crime, mais il ne s’agirait pas d’un pistolet Luger PO8 de fabrication suisse, comme mentionné par certains médias, affirme la RTS.
That’s a point with which the swiss media have had trouble before. A Luger P08 would by definition be of calibre 9 x 19 Parabellum, a weapon never used by the swiss army. (I cannot be bothered to find the original swiss media reports saying: “A swiss Luger in 9 x 19 Para? Cannot have been Swiss Army issue then, or must have been converted.”) However, all the reported facts are still consistent with the pistol being a swiss Luger-type “Pistole 00” in calibre 7.65 Parabellum.
Swiss banks play a central role for many exile Iraqis, many of those commited serious fraud during the “oil of food program”. Some exile Iraqis became millionairs, others became “just” rich by participating in money laundering schemes and smuggling of protected goods into Iraq. Their commission for the participation in the smuggling had always been something between 10% and 25% of the lump sum.
Cited:
Inevitably, as the ability and willingness of state officials to govern economic life through formal channels dissipated, new configurations of regulatory power arose to take their place. These configurations were not necessarily congruent with, or contained within, Iraq’s borders. Transnational tribal allegiances were mobilized to facilitate and regulate trade across international borders. Businessmen-politicians in neighboring countries cultivated links with members of Iraq’s Republican Guard (among others) in order to facilitate and protect networks of transport and distribution. And small-time trade networks emerged to profit from differentials between countries in prices for petroleum and other products. Major multinational corporations also took advantage of the multiple jurisdictions. Consider the case of RJ Reynolds, whose involvement in cigarette smuggling to Iraq was the subject of European Union legal action in 2002. Coordinating operations from Switzerland, home to congenial bank secrecy and business privacy laws, the company sent master cases containing 10,000 cigarettes each for loading and unloading at ports in Spain, from whence they were shipped onward through holding companies in Cyprus, before being redistributed through the free zone in Mersin, Turkey. They were then transported over the mountains between Turkey and Iraq via Silopi Pass, moving through the hands of agents operating in Kurdish-controlled regions of northern Iraq before ending up at one of the many smoke stands located along Iraq’s roads and highways.
See also:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil-for-Food_Programme
That could also be a reason why many British exile Iraqis are going to empty their Swiss bank accounts by transporting cash back home nowadays. (They can’t transfer their money without being open for tax investigation, therefore they need to carry all their money in cash).
http://thinking.grant-thornton.co.uk/bespoke/index.php/article/cuckoo_clock_is_ticking_on_swiss_bank_accounts/
@ Bluebird
That could also be a reason why many British exile Iraqis are going to empty their Swiss bank accounts by transporting cash back home nowadays.
Which would also render good, old-fashioned robbery a potential motive in this case, I should think. However, let’s wait and see what the TDG will have to say tomorrow as to whether or not SAH made any large cash withdrawals.
Peter,
according to what I read in the news article, that money should still be on that account, otherwise the money on that account couldn’t get seized. What I read is that he had apparantly “planned” to visit the bank. Apparantly he didn’t do that before he died, otherwise his money would have been deducted from that account.
List of the private Banks in Geneve:
Lombard Odier & Cie
Union Bancaire Privée
Banque Privée Edmond de Rothschild
Banque Morval
Banque Pasche SA (French bankgroup CM-CIC)
Pictet & Cie
HSBC Private Bank
http://www.20min.ch/ro/news/dossier/annecy/story/De-l-argent-saisi-dans-une-banque-a-Geneve-15843633
«serait passé à Genève peu avant le drame» = IHMO: “He would have been to Geneva shortly before the drama”.
The concept of a “private bank” is a very elastic one in Switzerland. Those (more or less) true private banks that you have mentioned in your list certainly would not have accepted an individual offshore investor (and a PEP at that) without a minimum initial deposit of CHF 1 million.
“Which would also render good, old-fashioned robbery a potential motive in this case, I should think”
But they were sat in a carpark for an hour waiting Mollier?
Had the been to the bank or were they on their way to Geneva?
What about Sharia banking Peter ?
Was it payday for Mollier?
” ‘Marry a girl from your home village, a girl who has the same values, the same outlook upon life, who knows the same people and the same stories about their lives that you do.’ ” Peter, 6:31pm, 5.10.12
Peter, I sense you may have a second career brewing, as an Agony Uncle 🙂
What about Sharia banking Peter ?
I am not quite sure what you mean by that term. Certainly, Swiss banks have offered Sharia-compliant banking (no interest declared as such, no speculation, no gambling, no investment in stocks of companies involved in defence, alcohol, pornography etc. etc.) for some time now. They even used to keep their own tame mullahs on the books to sign off these products.
Alas, they have subsequently come to realize that, the richer the individual investor, the less he could care about those religious rules. Seriously rich muslims care much more about their “portfolio performance” than about adherence to religious prescriptions.
If you mean “Hawallah” (or any of the other informal money-remittance systems, of which the system used by illegal mexican labourers in the US must be the biggest), there would be no need for a bank to be involved, and a swiss bank would not be likely to become involved in such a system.)