The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Much recommended to read that link below
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/sitemap/free/2003/3/article/iraq-debt-debate-already-under-way/239715.html
Well there you are BB, Abdul Karim Shaikhily was in Ontario in 1980, before returning to Iraq to run the Daura power station.
@ Tim
Lots of points there Tim! Where to start. . .
Firstly the general point that we haven’t been told everything. What we have been told, has been to serve the purpose of the investigators not to satisfy us.
We may also have been fed disinformation. Witnesses such as BM may have been told to omit or gloss over certain aspects.
Fortunately, we have the helicopter photos and the now-banned photos of SM lying dead in Le Martinet.
You say SM wasn’t “run over” by Al Hilli’s car. I suppose it depends on the definition of “run over”. Very early in this investigation EM stated that SM had been “hit” by the car while reversing and had a broken collarbone.
Personally, at the time I imagined that therefore SM had been injured whilst standing with or riding his bike i.e. struck by the rear of the car.
However, after looking at the banned pictures it is clear from the nature of the injury that this was unlikely. It seems more likely that, at the very least, one wheel ran over his shoulder (and possibly other parts of his body).
The best point you make is about blood flow declining with time owing to reduced blood pressure and clotting. Thus the blood stains being probably made early post injury.
I shall have to investigate further, but my view was that if there were sufficiently large or numerous wounds to obviate clotting then a horizontal corpse would indeed bleed out significantly in the time available (at least nine hours).
the notorious photos leaked by someone for a purpose here http://video.lefigaro.fr/figaro/video/les-photos-de-la-scene-du-crime-de-la-tuerie-de-chevaline/3221238187001/ show SM on is back in his final resting place. If shot in the back whilst trying to escape unlikely he would ended up this way (more likely prone face down) so this supports WBM’s story of dragging and interference.
Then it’s worth another look at the car. Notice the back window is totally black and quite different to the front one. Same angle/material/lighting etc and not tinted glass so why? Has it been doctored to hide what was there, or not there even! What if … the only ones killed were Saad and Sylvain? That the women and children were spared and never shot? That Iqbal and Suhaila had served their purpose as western agents and shopped Saad and Sylvain in the process of betraying their respective countries?
Thing is even in those photos, where because Sylvain is still on the ground prior to forensics ariving, we should be able to assume there are still four bodies in the car (three dead adults and Zeena) yet they are absolutely nowhere to be seen.
OK way out but just an idea.
Tim an awful lot to think about there.
Basically, I think you are saying anything could be untrue.
Obfuscation overload.
I have no knowledge if you can shoot a bullet through a car window, without shattering that window but if you shoot one or more bullets between a persons eyes, I would have thought the rear of their skull would be shattered and their brais explode out the back of their skull.
If the three Ali Hilli adults each had two bullets shot into the upper front of their skulls,
inside the BMW,
wouldn’t there be a mass of shattered skull/brains blood/
windsreen inside the BMW?
Tim, there’s not much doubt about the position of the body, the blood stain & that the body was definitely there.
I don’t agree with your comments about the car windows being blacked out that’s just a poor picture surely,probably taken in poor light as night approached.But maybe you have more pixels & clearer picture than my screen.
My theory that the car did not reverse in the first instance but went forward into that arc & then reversed when the exit was blocked, could also tally with SM’s shoulder being hit by the car & tie in with tyre marks.
I can’t explain why SM is on his back though, other than all the above is wrong & he was in fact leaning into the car talking to Saad, then shot in the back & falling where he’s seen in the photo.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2561919/Man-arrested-France-connection-murder-British-family-French-Alps.html
Look closer at the aerial pic , what is that white arc on the drivers side of the car,if one was being fanciful it looks like shoulders on someone crouching !
That’s all very different to this graphic…. which has the body in a very different place..
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7KC4ofekmJE/0.jpg
Katie, in that DM picture of the BMW (with the policemen adjacent)
you cannot see blood stains on the back seat?
No you can’t Michael , the seat is as clean as a whistle !
Maybe it could be explained by the mother was sitting there in a Burka which would cover all day clothes…meaning a number of layers & any blood from the head would go down the front .
Katie, from that DM article
Quote
“Eric Devouassoux, 48, a trained marksman, hoarded Second World War weapons at his home close to where the murders took place near Lake Annecy in September 2012.
Police also uncovered a trove of ‘ammunition, explosives and detonators’ at the home of his ‘friend’, an unnamed middle-aged Frenchman, who attempted to flee when police visited him.”
Why would the police release the name and details of former policeman Eric Devouassoux but not the name of his “friend”
That is absurd inconsistency, they are ( we have been told)
both likely to be charged with weapons offences.
Michael, living here in France, I have learnt three things about the French,they are inefficient ,inconsistent & thought processes are of quite a different pattern.
All this can be seen in this case.
I still say if nine bullets went through three adults, all sat in the BMW,
that the inside of the car would be smothered in brains/blood/glass
from the photos I’ve seen,
this does not seem to be the case.
This leads to the suggestion that either less people were shot than has been claimed or they were shot outside of the vehicle.
Is there any record of Iqbal applying for a Green Card in the U.S.A.
Presumably the civil service will keep a record because some immigrants who are refused will try again, ( are you finger printed?)
the problem might be which identity would she use, which passport would she use,
which address would she use.
A difficult person to pin down.
http://companycheck.co.uk/director/912493763/MR-SAAD-AL-HILLI/mortgages-charges
The guy is “well out of control” methinks !
AND massively “under pressure”.
James – some data are samples – read posts over at the other place.
Michael Norton
15 Jul, 2014 – 7:25 am all this stuff was discussed at length early on as you probably know. Just to say that recent photos (if genuine) have supported the views I expressed then against considerable opposition elsewhere, and the official “script” that the attack came from the top of the layby, that hilli’s car did the big arc, that SM lay in front (shown as front right in the graphics) all of which the bullet casings, position of body and blood stains has been proved to be a lie, that must have been intentional on the part of the police/prosecutor. Now why would they misinform the public so extensively. As far as that last photo is concerned Katie compare and contrast the rear window with the front one. If what you suggested was correct both would be blacked out but they arn’t ….
Good In Parts
15 Jul, 2014 – 12:10 am once we accept the bmw didn’t make that sweeping tyre (i cant be bothered to go over all the reasons as i ve done it so many times) it is hard to conjecture any way in which the hilli car could have come into contact with SM let alone injured him. My only solution to this was that if true (and i forget the exact injuries now) was that another vehicle (the attacker’s) hit him. I have pointed out before that broken collar bone is one of the most common fractures caused by a falling person extending his arms when falling forward, so it is possible it happened immediately following being shot in the back before unconsciousness intervened. Remember also the scientific report suggested the killer came back and delivered the head shots when he was on the ground. His body position and posture strongly suggests someone (WBM?) may have moved him a bit but not as he said from in front of the car, and presumably left him lying on his back. This action on the part WBM is astonishing and his explanation for it neither convincing or supported by what evidence we have.
Brett Martin just cannot be genuine.
His stated actions were all wrong.
Firstly the first thing you would do summing up the scene, if a cars engine is running , would be to alert the driver or in this case go to the car to switch off the engine.
Martin acted as though he ‘knew’ the driver was dead & the car could not move, if he first attended the child he also put his own life on the line had the driver been alive/active .
Not only that he had time to move Mollier out of the way too.
It just does not make sense, he said he did it to get the two people out of danger from the oncoming car.
Why would you do that before trying to stop & oncoming car ?
Remember he said he did all this BEFORE going to break the window & switch off the engine.
That one point alone belies his story….he KNEW there was no danger & that the driver was dead.
If most or all the people who we have been told were shot,
were shot outside of the car,
William Brett Martin smashing the drivers window ( to turn off the engine),
would then help law officers to think the gunman shot through the drivers door window.
Most logical conclusion,
is that Brett was “the cleaner”
Yes cleaner or as I have worded it as the overseer. He was first on the scene to check,clean ,tidy up, arrange things.
The other glaring bit of script writing is the, ‘Ex RAF bit.
This was supposed to lend credibility, someone trying to play the public for fools.
The man looks ex SAS, that was my gut reaction the minute I saw him on TV….my gut is very reliable.
@ Good In Parts….
Thanks for that. It’s just a sample. (Bloomin interweb !)
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/489102/Alps-massacre-victim-brother-calls-it-cover-up
I knew she had a husband before my brother, says Zaid AH.
If true (which it probably is), that puts paid to my idea of a potential blackmail angle.
Good for Zaid, he rightly vents his spleen on the French authorities.
They have been trying to frame him.
They likely do know what happened and this investigation most certainly does not appear
to be outing the truth.
I understand how angry Zaid must feel. But at the same time reserve my judgement , if Zaid did know the family were up to something ,this is exactly what he’d say.
In the famous words of Mandy Rice Davis……’he would say that wouldn’t he’ !
He may well be right, but reading an article such as that where they can’t even get Jim Thompson occupation right, I do wonder.
They say he’s a dentist
.
Satellite engineer dentist/policeman/contractor/cleaner/legonnaire/camping owner Marie/cyclist/nuclear worker
who knows if any of these people are what they purport to be.
Peter
16 Jul, 2014 – 11:26 am As eldest son, and rather confirmed by armed police response, Zaid if anything is more likely to have MI5/6 connections than Saad, although almost certainly, he did too. In fact it appears all the “actors” , including even SM as indicated by the ultra protection he was provided by the French, have intelligence/SS connections. This could explain how Zaid was informed about the American connection of Iqbal before his brother.
if zaid knew thompson then it is ridiculous to even think and write (like the dm did) that saad didnt know.
As Katie said the French are inconsistent.
Zaid made a good point when he said the French want to know all about the British/Iraqi family but straight away they dismissed Sylvain as obviously not involved.
How could the French Authorities Know, almost at once that it was nothing to do with Sylvain?
Re: William Martin
“Operation Mincemeat” moniker was a dead giveaway.