My post on the shootings in France has brought tens of thousands of people to this site – but not to read my dull contribution. People are coming to read the comments from other readers.
Today’s development of the bomb squad descending on the al-Hilli house does not in itself worry me enormously. You may recall the massive terror scare that was ramped up when some Muslim students in Manchester were found to own a bag of sugar.
In fact we have the opposite phenomenon today, with the spook-fed “security correspondents” on TV lining up to tell us it is probably just everyday household stuff. This deviation from the standard Islamophobic “Muslims = bombs” narrative is so startling it makes me wonder why the “move along, nothing to see here” line is being taken so quickly.
My own security services sources insist that al-Hilli was not a person of current interest to the UK intelligence agencies and was not involved in anything clandestine. I have no reason to disbelieve them. On the other hand, the limited and confusing information in the media is almost entirely from official sources. I find it very strange indeed how little attention has been paid to the murdered French cyclist, and how easily it is presumed he was just a passerby. Surely it is as likely he was the intended victim and the al-Hillis the accidental witnesses?
Please do read the comments on my first entry on the subject to see the debate unfettered by the censorship in the mainstream media. This is perhaps my favourite comment:
From Janesmith101
All comments regarding Sylvain, Al-Hilli and a possible nuclear link are being removed from sites I’ve posted on in The Guardian, Independent and Huffpo UK.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/09/alps-killer-motive-baffles-police
Here was my comment, I added as a point of fact it was completely speculative and an unproven theory in a later comment, also removed.
Sylvain Mollier, the ‘passing’ cyclist, was in fact a nuclear metallurgist who worked for a french nuclear company called Cezus (a subsidiary of Areva). Cezus fabricates and processes zirconium into metal and nuclear grade zircoaloy for nuclear fuel assemblies – it also has other applications in aerospace such as components and ceramics for missiles and satellites. Mr Al-Hilli was also a skilled aerospace engineer, on what looks to be his first camping holiday.
What is the probability that two highly skilled engineers managed be at the same remote place, at the same time, yet still managed to end up dead as a result of what looks to be a military style assasination?
As someone else pointed out in The Independent comments, the deceased were found by a ‘retired’ RAF officer who, we assume, will recieve perpetual anonymity as a witness. If the police are looking for a motive, try an intercepted rendevous by a security service fixated on denying a hostile power illicit nuclear technology.
http://wrmea.org/component/content/article/162-1995-june/7823-israel-bombs-iraqs-osirak-nuclear-research-facility.html
The Huffington Post UK reports that this wasn’t the family’s first trip to the camp site. An earlier report had asked other camp site visitors whether they had seen the family before and they had replied they hadn’t. If this isn’t wasn’t the first visit by Al-Hilli, it might slightly increase the odds that he knew or had met Mollier before, this being the last in a series of rendevous of a transactional nature. Mollier lived and worked locally.
Again, I’m not sure of the truth of these reports, there is some very sloppy journalism, as there is always seems to be. I’ve read for example Mollier’s company Cevus descirbed as a steel firm something which it is patently not, but perhaps it may have been a detail lost in translation.
An interesting comment summing up some of the strange coincidences, at least, surrounding these murders. My other favourite comment calls me a “macchiavellian shill”.
I have only one thought of my own I want to add at the minute. Al-Hilli was a Shia muslim and had been on pilgrimage to Qoms in Iran. What if it is indeed true that he was in possession of no especial nuclear or defence secrets to pass on to the Iranians, but the Israelis thought that he was? The Israeli programme of assassination of scientists involved in Iran’s nuclear programme is a definite fact. It makes as much sense as anything else at the moment, as a possibility.
I am not saying that is what happened. But the directions in which the mainstream media is being so strenuously pointed by official sources, like the massacre of an entire family over an inheritance, are certainly no more inherently probable. Certainly as we are now told all the shots were from one gun, for the assassin to get each victim in the head with none of them being able to escape, indicates real proficiency with the weapon and a very high level of training.
Not that I agree with hijaabs, niqaabs and so on, I don’t.
Evening Campers
Well must say not much news today is there ?
Seen a cpl of mentions of a Swiss Bank account containing £4m
But the 3 things notable by their absence in our rag tops who just love sensation, are any mention of espionage, Nuclear or the catchall terrorism.
Sometimes things become conspicuous by their absence…… D Notice perhaps ?
Felix, yes, thanks, I understand. The Goodies had a great cycle.
http://www.goodiesruleok.com/
This is interesting, but not the whole story:
Stakeknife
Stakeknife[1] is the code name of an alleged spy who infiltrated the Provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) at a high level, while working for the top secret Force Research Unit (FRU) of the British Army. Reports claim that Stakeknife worked for British intelligence for 25 years.[2]
Stakeknife had his own dedicated handlers and agents and it was suggested that he was important enough that MI5 set up an office dedicated solely to him. Rumours suggested that he was being paid at least £80,000 a year and had a bank account in Gibraltar.[3]
Serious allegations have emerged to the effect that the British government allowed up to forty people to be killed via the IRA’s Internal Security Unit or “Nutting Squad” to protect his cover.[4] In 1987 Sam McCrory, an Ulster Defence Association/”Ulster Freedom Fighters” member, killed the 66-year-old Francisco Notarantonio at his home in Ballymurphy in West Belfast.[5] The UDA/UFF had discovered that a senior IRA member was working for the FRU.[clarification needed] It has been alleged that FRU agent Brian Nelson gave Notarantonio’s name to the UDA/UFF to protect the identity of the real spy.
On 11 May 2003, several newspapers named Freddie Scappaticci as Stakeknife. Scappaticci denied the claims and launched an unsuccessful legal action to have the British government state he was not their agent.[6] He later left Northern Ireland and was rumoured to be living in Cassino, Italy. There were also reported sightings in Tenerife.[7]
A report in a February 2007 edition of the Belfast News Letter reported that a cassette recording allegedly of Scappaticci talking about the number of murders he was involved in via the “Nutting Squad”, as well as his work as an Army agent, had been lodged with the PSNI in 2004 and subsequently passed to the Stevens Inquiry in 2005.[8]
The former British Intelligence agent who worked in the FRU known as “Martin Ingram” has written a book titled Stakeknife since the original allegations came to light in which says Scappaticci was the agent in question.
Could someone please give me their explanation to this one as it has been puzzling me from the very start:
Within the first 24 hours of the incident the press release stated something along the lines of that Zeena was not discovered at first and it was only when someone reported that a child was missing at the campsite. So they police then looked inside the car and found Zeena beneath the fabric of the mother’ clothing.
Questions:
Who reported that a child was missing and just exactly did they mean by that? Was that person stating that a child was missing from the campsite? Or stating that a child was missing where?
The UK won’t be any whiter than other countries.
The UK at least used to have a much darker reputation in this regard than most other countries (except Bulgaria and, er, France). Quite apart from all those murders committed by “Loyalists” in Northern Ireland, there is an uncomfortable weight of evidence pointing towards assassination being a tool used far more frequently by the UK than by most other countries.
This is a good starting point (although to be taken with a pinch of salt): http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/EF13Ak03.html
as is this: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1307199/British-spies-carried-assassinations-Cold-War-claims-agent-Le-Carre.html
followed by: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_MacRae
Unless you have read this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Enemies-State-Memoirs-Private-Spy/dp/0671711946
that probably won’t make sense to you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilda_Murrell
The essence of the Gary Murray book is that much intelligence work is nowadays contracted out to private-sector suppliers. Contracting out assassinations to freelancers would be a further step down that road. It would also explain the weird, somewhat amateurish execution of that hit. However, in the case of the al-Hilli family and Mollier, I really cannot see the *WHY* in all of this.
Yes, that’s it, Anders777, of course wrt Northern Ireland, it was Brian Nelson, not Brian Crozier. Crozier was another alleged SIS-linked spy.
What’s the whole story?
Cheers Suhayl, thought you would be up to speed.
This is a good overview from Aangirfan:
GCHQ. Top US and UK spies have died in mysterious circumstances. Did they know too much about links between the security services and arms deals, drugs deals, child abuse…?
Stephen Drinkwater worked at the UK spy base called GCHQ.
In 1983, he was found dead at his home with a plastic bag over his head.
In 1997 GCHQ worker, Nicholas Husband, was found dead at home dressed in a bra and panties – with a plastic bag over his head.
In 1999, Kevin Allen, 31, a language expert at GCHQ, was found dead in his bed with a plastic bag over his head and a mask over his mouth.
(MI6 dirty secrets.. why do sex games appear to feature in so many spy deaths?)
Rusbridger had discovered that a group within MI6 appeared to have helped Hitler both before and during the war.
In 1994 an ex-MI6 man, James Rusbridger, was found hanged at his house in Cornwall.
He was wearing a green chemical protection suit, rubber gloves, gas mask, and black plastic mackintosh.
Boy from Charleroi in Belgium, near the home of Marc Dutroux, who allegedly worked for the security services. ( the wor)ld’s worst …)
In 1994, Stephen Milligan, who reportedly worked for MI6, was found dead. He had a black bin liner over his head and he was wearing stockings and suspenders.
Milligan also had a satsuma stuffed into his mouth. Gareth Williams worked for GCHQ and MI6. He was found dead in a locked bag, in a flat full of women’s clothing.
Milligan.
According to Crispin Black, a former UK Government intelligence adviser: “Disposing of an enemy and making it look like a perverted fantasy gone wrong is in the training manuals of every spy agency from MI6 to Mossad.”
(MI6 dirty secrets.. why do sex games appear to feature in so many spy deaths?)
Moyle
In 1990, the editor of Defence Helicopter World, Jonathan Moyle, was found hanged in the wardrobe of his hotel in Chile with a pillow case over his head. He was in fact almost certainly murdered.
On whose side are MI5 and MI6?
In the 1930s, some members of MI5 and MI6 were fans of fascism and Hitler. (Domville, Knight, Mosley, Blunt … Haw-Haw and MI5Prince George, MI6 and the Nazis)
Much of the following is taken from ‘The Intelligence Game’ by James Rusbridger. (James Rusbridger)
In the 1930s and 1940s, MI6 failed to exploit the opposition to Hitler that existed within Germany.
In 1939, MI6 received the Oslo Report which contained details of Germany’s secret weapons development. MI6 ignored the report.
In 1940, MI6 had an advance warning of the German plan to invade Holland and Belgium. But MI6 chose to ignore the warning.
Rusbridger
In mid 1940 the Japanese discovered one of Britain’s most important secrets: that Britain was not in a position to defend the Far East, including Singapore.
The Japanese had a copy of British War Cabinet minutes.
The minutes had been sent to Singapore as sea mail in a freighter that was seized by a German ship.
The Japanese saw the secret documents and proceeded to attack Pearl Harbour and Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia.
Churchill created the Special Operations Executive.
On at least one occasion MI6 ‘infiltrated a double agent of its own into SOE who betrayed some 400 British and French agents to the Germans.’
(A retired Deputy Director of MI6 has stated that British intelligence knew about Argentina’s intention to invade the Falklands. Argentina was invaded in 1982.)
More from Rusbridger:
Ex-SAS man planted bomb that killed 80 men, women and children.
Britain protected the terrorists found guilty of the Bologna Massacre
1988 Mossad plot to bomb Britain
The late Roland Carnaby at the CIA compound in Langley, VA. (Website for this image)
Roland Vincent Carnaby, reportedly an agent of the CIA, was murdered in the USA.
Wayne Madsen “learned that Carnaby possessed knowledge of something the Bush administration or Israel did not want made public and that the ‘hit’ on Carnaby involved Israeli Mossad agents operating in Houston.” (CIA Agent in Houston Murdered.Mossad gets the Blame.)
Gary Underhill
Gary Underhill, a CIA agent who claimed the CIA was involved in the JFK assassination, died of a gun shot to the head in May 1964. His death was ruled a suicide. (Who Killed JFK?)
William Casey was Director of the CIA from 1981-87. Hours before he was due to testify before Congress about Iran-Contra, he was rushed off to hospital and soon died. (aangirfan: Opus Dei, Tony Blair, Fascists and Zionists)
Joseph E. Persico, points out (The Lives and Secrets of William J. Casey): “one school of rumors ran, the CIA or the NSC or the White House had arranged to have a piece of the brain removed from the man who knew the secrets”. How William Casey was Silenced – The Education Forum
William Colby (1920 – 1996) was the boss of the CIA from 1973 until 1976.
He was no friend of Israel.
He knew a lot about CIA dirty tricks and he died in ‘mysterious circumstances’.
On 28th April 1996 William Colby went on a canoe trip at Rock Point in Maryland. His body was found several days later.
Colby may have known too much about 1. The CIA and heroin 2. Israeli attempts to infiltrate and control the CIA 3. child sex abuse scandals and the CIA.
John DeCamp, who had once worked for Colby, investigated the Franklin child sex abuse case.
Shortly before Colby died, Colby warned DeCamp to give up the case.
However, ‘with the blessing of Colby’, DeCamp wrote a book about the case: The Franklin Cover Up.” (George Bush, The CIA, Mind Control & Child Abuse)
Reportedly: Many of the children described satanic rituals that they were forced to attend, some of which involved sacrificing infants and young children.
(aangirfan: William Colby, heroin, Israel and child sex abuse) (Classic State Terrorism) (aangirfan: OMAHA IS FAMOUS)
NSA Headquarters, Fort Meade, Maryland, where murdered spy Gareth Williams had worked. Williams reportedly helped oversee Echelon.
James Rusbridger, who worked for MI6, was found dead at his home near Bodmin in the UK. His body was suspended from two ropes, attached with shackles fastened to a piece of wood across the open loft hatch, and was surrounded by pictures of men and mainly black women in bondage.” (Animal Rites: Beast of Bodmin)
James Mossman was a BBC reporter, interviewer and former MI6 agent. He committed ‘suicide’ in his cottage in Norfolk. It was reported that he was gay.
James Rusbridger’s book is an important source for the following:
(Sean Copland Dot Com – Spies – MI5 Murder British Author.)
The Hilda Murrel Story, detailing MI5’s alleged role in the murder of an old lady.
The CIA Middle East car bomb, where the CIA detonated a car bomb in a packed Middle Eastern street killing 80, and maiming a further 200.
The failed Mossad plan to bomb London, where they hoped to leave enough forensic evidence to blame the Arabs, thereby ruining British-Syrian relations.
And also, the Madeline Haigh story, detailing how a housewife found herself on MI5’s subversive list after writing a letter.
Stephen Milligan, was a Tory MP and Parliamentary Private Secretary to Jonathan Aitken. On February 7, 1994, Milligan was allegedly discovered bound to a chair with a plastic bag over his head and a satsuma [mandarin orange] stuffed in his mouth.(British Pol Ties to Auto-Erotic Deaths )
Aitken “was chairman of a secretive right-wing think tank known as Le Cercle, established after World War II and which was funded by the CIA, the Ford Foundation, and the Rothschilds” (echkelon)
Dead MI6 spy Gareth Williams. Did he discover that there was a group of ‘insiders’, within the security services, who are linked to fascism, the mafia, the drugs trade, the arms trade and child abuse?
Jonathan Moyle was in MI6 (Investigation into death of British spy.)
On March 31st 1990, Jonathan Moyle, the editor of the magazine Defence Helicopter World, Moyle was in Chile looking into a story about a Chilean firm, Industrias Cardoen which intended to convert US civilian helicopters into gunships for sale to Iraq.
“It has long been believed that Mark Thatcher, the son of the British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, was mixed up in surreptitious weapons agreements with Chile.
“Originally, Moyle’s family was informed that he had passed away as he was masturbating while hanging inside a closet in a hotel room in Chile. He was discovered suspended by his shirt with a pillow case over his head.
“As per a report in The Guardian on February 28th 1998, Moyle seemed to have been sedated. A needle mark on his leg may have indicated this.” (British Pol Ties to Auto-Erotic Deaths )
“In 2005, the commander of British forces in Gibraltar, Royal Navy Commander David White, was found dead and fully clothed in his swimming pool in The Rock section of Gibraltar. White had been ordered to return to Britain and go on mandatory leave by Britain’s Ministry of Defense.
“After his death, police said White had been under investigation for possession of child pornography. White, whose job put him in command of a GCHQ SIGINT installation in the British colony, was determined to have committed suicide and that there was no sign of foul play.” – (echkelon)
Aangirgan
Flanders
Are you saying that the Brish Secret Service had an agent working with in the PIRA in N.I. ?
Ya kidding me right !
Just read about the Titanic. I can’t believe it. On it’s maiden voyage to. Unbelievable.
Do you know, if you put water in the freezer, it turns to ice.
May give it a try later.
Get back to writing you “Magnet and Steele” nove Flanders.
“Just a couple of cops…outside the law” !!!
Well you can’t trust wiki, it is a fair overview, but you need to go on some controversial forums to get all the tidbits. Bottom line is a rogue state element was murdering with impunity for many many years. On UK soil
Do try and keep up Jimmeh! 🙂
Thanks, Anders7777, that’s an excellent summary, some of which I knew about, other parts of which I did not (or cannot recall).
What I really meant was this: What would be the repercussions if a senior, credible person – a Govt Minister or well-known Chief Constable, say – came out in public and stated that the UK state assassinates individuals, that this had been going on for years and years – always – and that it continues today, that there is a permanent government-within-the-state which acts in its own interests, and so on?
After the initial Red Top efflorescence they would not be given airtime, would be reported as having gone insane and might even end up in a dark wood, not with us good Seven Dwarves, but with the Evil Queen, her mirror and a slice of apple in their mouths.
Sorry, I don’t mean to diver the thread. Just something that’s often bugged me 🙂
You see, people – not just loons like us, the general public – in the Republic of Ireland (I think) and the other ex-colonies have always known this, but here in Britain, it simply cannot be said officially, or by anyone in the MSM, ever, ever, ever.
“What I really meant was this: What would be the repercussions if a senior, credible person – a Govt Minister or well-known Chief Constable, say – came out in public and stated that the UK state assassinates individuals, that this had been going on for years and years”
You mean like John Stalker (ex Asst Chief Contable) ?
OK guys, are we discussing Al-Hilli or are you going to continue to beat about the normal practices of the SS.
Everybody knows they bump people off so get over it.
Can we get back on thread topic please?
Anders:
The BIGGEST noise is this thread. 😉
It is DEAFENING. 🙂
4000 posts, getting on for…
Someone wants this thread invaded with false trails, disinformation, red herrings.
The robot automaton posters are out in force.
I hafnium a clue why!!!??!!! 😉 🙂
///////////////
Yes! Disinfo is the clue…
and it starded with the very first news in the media.
¡Rememeber my post of different spots of the picture taken to the supposed car!
In fact, it was not even the same car, but it had english plates and french gendarmes.
And… the scenery of the first car was set to illustrate the news. Who can assure us that the location and ciscunstamces of the scene given by the media are the real ones?
My nose points to a picture painted after all happened in a totally different spot.
The picture of the car and the scene is, quoting the ex-raf and kreepy photographer “like a holywood movie” . If you wish to seek clues you´ll never find it in that nowhere parking.
You mean like John Stalker (ex Asst Chief Contable
=====
Jimmy boy just cannot help himself! Like taking hafnium from a baby! You’ll be emptying the bins next at Legoland! 🙂
You mean like John Stalker (ex Asst Chief Contable) ?
=====
Funny how he’s not called SIR John Stalker, isn’t it… 😉
Yes lets Roland, what have you got to offer ? 😉
Yes, the silence is indeed deafening – back at the beginning, we couldn’t stop accountants, postmen, neighbours talking, saying how normal the Hillis were; Cameron, Hague, Ambassadors too. Must get to the bottom of it etc etc…
Re Hollywood movie, this kind of mood-creating phrase was used three times in this investigation. The first interview of Eric Maillaud on TV, he said:
and we unfortunately (sic) see more scenes like this in films than in real life…[translated]
http://news.sky.com/story/981353/four-shot-dead-in-uk-car-attack-in-france
The same news report (mistakenly) said the BMW was a 4×4. Unless…
Felix, what is it, a week since we had any snippet of news ?
That safe the police were drilling must be a jerry built bunker!!!
I dont understand why some posters believe that mollier must have been a scientist? Why?
They did need the hafnium metal to produce the hafnium isotop and the isomer. but then, where do you get hafnium metal? You cant buy it online like golf equipment or computers. As soon as you would try to buy hafnium as an individual, you would be on the radar of secret services and police.
Therefore you can only purchase hafnium metal (non radioactive, secure metal) ion the black market like you would purchase drugs like cocain or heroin. There is the mafia who offers their duties and contacts, or else you know somebody who knows somebody else who works in the production of hafnium and who would like to make some extra money by stealing some hafnium from his company.
My conspiracy is that sylvain earnt some extra money by selling hafnium from his company to the mafia and to anybody who would pay for it. Black market, no questions, nobody knows. Perhaps he had some friends in the company supporting him and sharing the income.
Sylvain in my conspiracy theory was a simple metallurgy worker who did support the illegal black market with hafnium metals.
wouldnt Sylvain being away from the factory for 3 years on parternity leave stop his access to any metals for the black market?
@straw
Not if he was ‘seller’ of the material and other workers supplied him with the product.
Folks, you could spend some downtime researching Tavistock, their role and history, read up on some other monument psyops, like Apollo, the Cold War, 911,77.
Without a thorough background knowledge, you will not understand how you are being “played” now.
The TAVISTOCK/SIS PRODUCTIONS Ltd. ™ FAIRYTALE ™
Continues! 😉
Great post btw Roland! 😉
Straw44berry18 Sep, 2012 – 8:27 pmwouldnt Sylvain being away from the factory for 3 years on parternity leave stop his access to any metals for the black market?
###
True! However, he might have either already a depot or perhaps friends in the company who would still provide him with the metal.
Anders Steaknife. you know who Ian Hurst is?
I keep mulling over the fact that Sylvain’s partner had said that he told her he was taking a new route that day. A bit too coincidental that the one day he decides to go a different way than he usually does he gets shot? Ordinarily I’d think “so what” but with everything else that’s on the iffy side with this case I wonder about this.
How many times do we go for a walk/bike ride and announce what route we’re taking? I never have. I’d maybe mention to anyone interested which way I’d gone once I was back, but not before I set out.
Dopey,
Unless it wasnt his choice of a new route but that of his training partner.