My post on the shootings in France has brought tens of thousands of people to this site – but not to read my dull contribution. People are coming to read the comments from other readers.
Today’s development of the bomb squad descending on the al-Hilli house does not in itself worry me enormously. You may recall the massive terror scare that was ramped up when some Muslim students in Manchester were found to own a bag of sugar.
In fact we have the opposite phenomenon today, with the spook-fed “security correspondents” on TV lining up to tell us it is probably just everyday household stuff. This deviation from the standard Islamophobic “Muslims = bombs” narrative is so startling it makes me wonder why the “move along, nothing to see here” line is being taken so quickly.
My own security services sources insist that al-Hilli was not a person of current interest to the UK intelligence agencies and was not involved in anything clandestine. I have no reason to disbelieve them. On the other hand, the limited and confusing information in the media is almost entirely from official sources. I find it very strange indeed how little attention has been paid to the murdered French cyclist, and how easily it is presumed he was just a passerby. Surely it is as likely he was the intended victim and the al-Hillis the accidental witnesses?
Please do read the comments on my first entry on the subject to see the debate unfettered by the censorship in the mainstream media. This is perhaps my favourite comment:
From Janesmith101
All comments regarding Sylvain, Al-Hilli and a possible nuclear link are being removed from sites I’ve posted on in The Guardian, Independent and Huffpo UK.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/09/alps-killer-motive-baffles-police
Here was my comment, I added as a point of fact it was completely speculative and an unproven theory in a later comment, also removed.
Sylvain Mollier, the ‘passing’ cyclist, was in fact a nuclear metallurgist who worked for a french nuclear company called Cezus (a subsidiary of Areva). Cezus fabricates and processes zirconium into metal and nuclear grade zircoaloy for nuclear fuel assemblies – it also has other applications in aerospace such as components and ceramics for missiles and satellites. Mr Al-Hilli was also a skilled aerospace engineer, on what looks to be his first camping holiday.
What is the probability that two highly skilled engineers managed be at the same remote place, at the same time, yet still managed to end up dead as a result of what looks to be a military style assasination?
As someone else pointed out in The Independent comments, the deceased were found by a ‘retired’ RAF officer who, we assume, will recieve perpetual anonymity as a witness. If the police are looking for a motive, try an intercepted rendevous by a security service fixated on denying a hostile power illicit nuclear technology.
http://wrmea.org/component/content/article/162-1995-june/7823-israel-bombs-iraqs-osirak-nuclear-research-facility.html
The Huffington Post UK reports that this wasn’t the family’s first trip to the camp site. An earlier report had asked other camp site visitors whether they had seen the family before and they had replied they hadn’t. If this isn’t wasn’t the first visit by Al-Hilli, it might slightly increase the odds that he knew or had met Mollier before, this being the last in a series of rendevous of a transactional nature. Mollier lived and worked locally.
Again, I’m not sure of the truth of these reports, there is some very sloppy journalism, as there is always seems to be. I’ve read for example Mollier’s company Cevus descirbed as a steel firm something which it is patently not, but perhaps it may have been a detail lost in translation.
An interesting comment summing up some of the strange coincidences, at least, surrounding these murders. My other favourite comment calls me a “macchiavellian shill”.
I have only one thought of my own I want to add at the minute. Al-Hilli was a Shia muslim and had been on pilgrimage to Qoms in Iran. What if it is indeed true that he was in possession of no especial nuclear or defence secrets to pass on to the Iranians, but the Israelis thought that he was? The Israeli programme of assassination of scientists involved in Iran’s nuclear programme is a definite fact. It makes as much sense as anything else at the moment, as a possibility.
I am not saying that is what happened. But the directions in which the mainstream media is being so strenuously pointed by official sources, like the massacre of an entire family over an inheritance, are certainly no more inherently probable. Certainly as we are now told all the shots were from one gun, for the assassin to get each victim in the head with none of them being able to escape, indicates real proficiency with the weapon and a very high level of training.
Dopey…
True.
Can you imagine this happening in “Skegress”.
Wall to wall TV crews. A “WhataDrama” special. CrimeWatch drooling.
A phone hacker fest going on in the next field.
…even a Gieger counter in the “Car Park”. (now that would be interesting indeed !)
@ James yes they’d be having orgasms over it all.
If we all go on a reccie to Chevaline I wonder if Brett will rent us his house..
@Anders
> All a bit like the London riots a ways back, gangs
> using Blackberry I think 64 bit encryption, off the
> top of my head (I use an iPhone and encrypt bugger all),
> but the MET were demanding access keys, and Blacberry
> quite rightly said a big FU.
Yes, but if you have access to the phone you can read the messages in plain text.
There are many trails that can be left from activity on a PC. On the one hand you are willing to accept an agent publishing his car reg., his name, email address to the world, but then on the other hand it would be impossible to get a shred of evidence from the workplace of a corporate intelligence gatherer, particularly when the latter expected to be coming home for dinner. For that matter there would probably be more chance for information at SM’s home than his work, particularly since he was on paternity leave (as far as I remember).
I still haven’t gotten a strong enough rationale for the car rental & car reg. / name publication etc for BM – so I still hold to him not being involved. I don’t buy the line that they did all that to make it look like they were normal Brits. Loads of people own holiday homes without renting them out. You can trot out the line that I’m being naive, but I think it would be unnecessary and create hassle to rent it out. I think following the BM spy route is flawed, despite the attractiveness of it!
On the other hand I do not think it is coincidence that Mollier worked at a leading nuclear R&D facility, nor was the trip of Al-Hilli to Qoms. That’s where the linkage comes in. If you accept that Mollier was selling info and Al-Hilli was delivering it, then it all makes sense. There are any no. of parties who would be keen to put an end to it.
@Big Bear
“Is this thread being used to do the donkey work for the investigators? It’s a great ploy if it is.”
If it is they are going to have to start feeding us some crumbs …… we’ve run out of evidence to work on and the thread is now subject to conjecture alone.
Is this thread being used to do the donkey work for the investigators? It’s a great ploy if it is.
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No, for the PROTAGONISTS ™
It is all a badly SPUN
FAIRYTALE ™
That is why BM was wheeled out – as Bilbo Baggins said, he said NOTHING!
(They are certainly getting their workaround tips from this thread)
(one example, BM over egging the pudding and at pains to point out he didn’t actually BREAK the right hand side driver’s window AT ALL, contrary to M’LLaud’s version, no, after reading this thread and MY persistent comments that a fart could have collapsed what was left of the window, BM is now simply saying he PUSHED the window in, and switched off the ignition. What a JOKE.
Small point?
NO! It unravels all his lies)
So BM=
BLAND
FAKE
WOODEN
WHAT DID HE SAY!
What did he confirm?
What questions WERE NOT ASKED?
Yes we are doing their job, helping the HCA BOYZ.
Lol @ Dopey
If we all rent the house in one big share they could get rid of us all in one go.
@ roger
And I think it’s even less of a coincidence that Saad worked for SSTL.
How come Sylvain got buried so quickly? I’ve just checked how long it took to bury Jo Yeates – 6 weeks. So on that basis its perhaps nothing unusual for the Al Hilli’s not to be buried yet the muslim thing aside) but very unusual for Sylvain to be buried within a week?
@Felix I’m not sure if this link will work for you but here’s an example:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Oz-wa3joezMJ:france.silverfernsussex.co.uk/gallery.html+&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk
Wrong Anders.
Bet On Martin did tell us something.
He told us Mollier was having a rest (with bullet holes in him).
AND he took his pulse !
A doctor I am not, but…and I am guessing here, if a cahp has holes in his head, the last thing I would do would be to take his pulse !
@Dopey I don’t think he’s really buried in the normal sense. I think they’ve had a funeral service and put him in a box somewhere in case they needed to re-visit. The family wanted him cremated and the authorities would not allow it.
“What do you make of his assertion that Mossad Kidon use .50 caliber Desert Eagles on wet work?
What do you make of his assertion that Kidon teams do not as a rule move in self-contained CELLS of four?”
No idea. All I know about them is that they are supposedly an elite assassination squad within Mossad. I know nothing about guns either. His opinion on the details of these subjects is not what I found odd – he could be completely right about them and yet way off with the overall story. Obviously details are important but off-the-shelf details can be used to build any story.
@ strawberry
Good point. Anders, Ferret and James can have the house.
I take it that Bet On Me Martin was a “keen” cyclist.
Well, have you ever tried to run in “cycling” shoes ???
You may as well run on ice skates.
Just a thought
@ james
A doctor I am not, but…and I am guessing here, if a cahp has holes in his head, the last thing I would do would be to take his pulse !
……………
I’d be too busy cycling back down the road to even think about anyone else’s pulse.
I’d be pedalling so fast I’d probably overtake the killers
Sylvain’s wife said he was trying a new route. From his house?
Or from where he parked his car.
Is the route thru the forest towards Jarsy is suitable for a road bike?
Even if it is I still dont see a circular route back to Ugine which is 12 miles away from the crime scene.
How far would he usually cycle on route?
Dopey, Strawberry.
I want the en suite !
…and is there a pub nearby. Anders can’t write otherwise !
So no reconstruction. Says to me there is either a “media blackout” but they leak…or the French want this “away”.
Roger
About this renting out business creating hassle from my readings the ‘better’ the agency the further the lengths they will go to and the more resources they will throw at creating absolutely lock tight background stories and covering identities. Otherwise they make the operatives very very vulnerable. Having a house for rent, which as somebody pointed out you can just say is let, fits into that level of cover surely ?
I don’t know what raf man did or did not do but i remain very sceptical that he is as was initially reported merely a passing bicyclist with nerves of steel. To be fair that cover didnt last long.
The pulse – it is possible to be shot in the head and survive so it wouldn’t seem outrageous to my mind to check on that possibility. Not i’m afraid that i would have waited around myself !
@Anaders but then straight after the riots we had the 4 days when Blackberrys world wide went down, I bet they all have access now!
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Bingo.
The clever folks on this thread are seeing right through all the soft, comfy, polite, impeccably grammatical and well written
LIES ™
🙂
😉
Wrong Anders.
Bet On Martin did tell us something.
He told us Mollier was having a rest (with bullet holes in him).
AND he took his pulse !
A doctor I am not, but…and I am guessing here, if a cahp has holes in his head, the last thing I would do would be to take his pulse !
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No offence C
But you are now on IGNORE ™
To idle Pip, what!?!?! 🙂
Carry on.
Dopey.
Thats what I mean.
You’ve already put the girl in “recovery”. Stuck you head in the window and shut down the car…
You then lean down….and check the pulse of a bloke with half a head.
Very wierd.
I’d pass Didierjean…and let him find it !
Bolt the door..and ring the Po Lice from the bathroom…with a duvet over my head.
@ Bilbo Mortdecai
It’s nice to hear that I am being missed (by some) 😉
1. Regarding your question on how I would reconcile “no ordinary tourists” with being randomly targeted by a deranged gunman, my – admittedly feeble – answer is that this “no ordinary tourists” comment could either be based on HARD FACTS known to the police, which they have not seen fit to share with anybody, or be pure guesswork on their part.
2. One thing that I wanted to share with you was this nugget of information from the current issue of Paris Match
– for the naughty amongst you: http://divers-ebooks.blogspot.de/2012/09/paris-match-n3305-20-au-26-septembre.html –
where it says that a family friend, the dentist Dr. Zaid Alabdi of Twickenham, planned to give an interview to the BBC but was advised by UK police to keep his mouth shut. According to the same source, Gary Aked is the only family friend who has elected to speak to the media. (And, yes, before you say it, I agree that this makes the AH family look even less like “ordinary tourists”)
3. A random thought that just occurred to me. If I were a police officer investigating this matter, my biggest fear right now would be any suggestion being publicly aired that the al-Hillis were targeted simply because they were muslims. With the current anti-western backlash in islamic countries caused by this unspeakable “The Innocence of Muslims” film and the “Charlie Hebdo” caricatures, can you imagine what would happen if the mere suspicion of this being some deranged mind’s idea of “revenge” for Mohammed Mera’s murders or something along those lines gained currency in islamic countries? The consequences would be too horrible to contemplate.
@Felix You can get it through Google Cache
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Or wayback. Prob too early though, but essential for the 404 sanitising.
did you know that Brett Martin is a make of drainpipe ?
Thanks for the cached link
In the 3rd photo of the exterior.
Whose vehicle an Audi reg GV11 HVM
GV is Brighton this is probably Brett Martin’s car
Bibo
“The pulse – it is possible to be shot in the head and survive so it wouldn’t seem outrageous to my mind to check on that possibility. Not i’m afraid that i would have waited around myself !”
Okay…check the pulse ??? Is he alive ? Is he “nearly” dead.
Roger, yes. The Wikileaks insurance file was protected by AES-256, for which “known attacks are computationally infeasible” (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Encryption_Standard). In the end the US cables were released not through cracking the encryption, but human error – in this case primarily the carelessness of a journalist who knew the passphrase.
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Thank you JON! 🙂 😉
Guy_Fawkes2010
20 Sep, 2012 – 6:23 pm
@ Blue Bear 😉
“Is this thread being used to do the donkey work for the investigators? It’s a great ploy if it is.”
If it is they are going to have to start feeding us some crumbs …… we’ve run out of evidence to work on and the thread is now subject to conjecture alone.
It does seem to have followed a classic pattern of massive lack of info followed by people being forced to join the dots with the few crumbs they get. The only way “they” can wield any kind of non-military power is to keep us guessing so we think they’re in control. Clearly they’re well out of control. The domestic French and British Police look like bumbling fools. When was the last time we heard a politician talk about this whole thing? It’s been days.
O/T…what was the name of the resolution/policy/bill(?) recently passed in the US to tie the Israelis into their constitution? HN2421…something or other..? It stated that should Israel come under attack the US would legally have to defend them. It also promised to train and fund the Israeli military.
@Bilbo Mortdecai
You may well be right. However you can explain anything that seems out of place by saying that was the spooks trying to throw you off the scent. Every so often you have to make the judgement as to which is more likely. In my opinion, if BM was an agent, the approach with lower risk would be to (a) not go on BBC (b) not rent out the house (or advertise it with the intention of not renting it) (c) not to publish your car reg. (d)not to publish your name. These things are unnecessary (with the possible exception of the BBC interview) particularly given that most were done without knowing that the outcome would be so public.
@dodger
I still haven’t gotten a strong enough rationale for the car rental & car reg. / name publication etc for BM – so I still hold to him not being involved. I don’t buy the line that they did all that to make it look like they were normal Brits. Loads of people own holiday homes without renting them out. You can trot out the line that I’m being naive, but I think it would be unnecessary and create hassle to rent it out. I think following the BM spy route is flawed, despite the attractiveness of it!
On the other hand I do not think it is coincidence that Mollier worked at a leading nuclear R&D facility, nor was the trip of Al-Hilli to Qoms. That’s where the linkage comes in. If you accept that Mollier was selling info and Al-Hilli was delivering it, then it all makes sense. There are any no. of parties who would be keen to put an end to it.
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Neuro-linguistic placebo-waffle to try and entrain the gullible that you are SMART ™
You didn’t say a thing. 🙂
EPIC FAIL ™