The Al-Hilli Conundrum 6629

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My post on the shootings in France has brought tens of thousands of people to this site – but not to read my dull contribution. People are coming to read the comments from other readers.

Today’s development of the bomb squad descending on the al-Hilli house does not in itself worry me enormously. You may recall the massive terror scare that was ramped up when some Muslim students in Manchester were found to own a bag of sugar.

In fact we have the opposite phenomenon today, with the spook-fed “security correspondents” on TV lining up to tell us it is probably just everyday household stuff. This deviation from the standard Islamophobic “Muslims = bombs” narrative is so startling it makes me wonder why the “move along, nothing to see here” line is being taken so quickly.

My own security services sources insist that al-Hilli was not a person of current interest to the UK intelligence agencies and was not involved in anything clandestine. I have no reason to disbelieve them. On the other hand, the limited and confusing information in the media is almost entirely from official sources. I find it very strange indeed how little attention has been paid to the murdered French cyclist, and how easily it is presumed he was just a passerby. Surely it is as likely he was the intended victim and the al-Hillis the accidental witnesses?

Please do read the comments on my first entry on the subject to see the debate unfettered by the censorship in the mainstream media. This is perhaps my favourite comment:

From Janesmith101

All comments regarding Sylvain, Al-Hilli and a possible nuclear link are being removed from sites I’ve posted on in The Guardian, Independent and Huffpo UK.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/09/alps-killer-motive-baffles-police

Here was my comment, I added as a point of fact it was completely speculative and an unproven theory in a later comment, also removed.

Sylvain Mollier, the ‘passing’ cyclist, was in fact a nuclear metallurgist who worked for a french nuclear company called Cezus (a subsidiary of Areva). Cezus fabricates and processes zirconium into metal and nuclear grade zircoaloy for nuclear fuel assemblies – it also has other applications in aerospace such as components and ceramics for missiles and satellites. Mr Al-Hilli was also a skilled aerospace engineer, on what looks to be his first camping holiday.

What is the probability that two highly skilled engineers managed be at the same remote place, at the same time, yet still managed to end up dead as a result of what looks to be a military style assasination?

As someone else pointed out in The Independent comments, the deceased were found by a ‘retired’ RAF officer who, we assume, will recieve perpetual anonymity as a witness. If the police are looking for a motive, try an intercepted rendevous by a security service fixated on denying a hostile power illicit nuclear technology.

http://wrmea.org/component/content/article/162-1995-june/7823-israel-bombs-iraqs-osirak-nuclear-research-facility.html

The Huffington Post UK reports that this wasn’t the family’s first trip to the camp site. An earlier report had asked other camp site visitors whether they had seen the family before and they had replied they hadn’t. If this isn’t wasn’t the first visit by Al-Hilli, it might slightly increase the odds that he knew or had met Mollier before, this being the last in a series of rendevous of a transactional nature. Mollier lived and worked locally.

Again, I’m not sure of the truth of these reports, there is some very sloppy journalism, as there is always seems to be. I’ve read for example Mollier’s company Cevus descirbed as a steel firm something which it is patently not, but perhaps it may have been a detail lost in translation.

An interesting comment summing up some of the strange coincidences, at least, surrounding these murders. My other favourite comment calls me a “macchiavellian shill”.

I have only one thought of my own I want to add at the minute. Al-Hilli was a Shia muslim and had been on pilgrimage to Qoms in Iran. What if it is indeed true that he was in possession of no especial nuclear or defence secrets to pass on to the Iranians, but the Israelis thought that he was? The Israeli programme of assassination of scientists involved in Iran’s nuclear programme is a definite fact. It makes as much sense as anything else at the moment, as a possibility.

I am not saying that is what happened. But the directions in which the mainstream media is being so strenuously pointed by official sources, like the massacre of an entire family over an inheritance, are certainly no more inherently probable. Certainly as we are now told all the shots were from one gun, for the assassin to get each victim in the head with none of them being able to escape, indicates real proficiency with the weapon and a very high level of training.

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6,629 thoughts on “The Al-Hilli Conundrum”

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  • Stan

    Here are my thoughts on the information that has emerged so far.

    Al-Hilli and family are parked up in the layby, front ways in (not where car ended up)as shown by start point of arc skid marks. They may have been there a while. Girl may also have gotten out of car at this point too.

    Killer is perhaps hiding down banking at other side of road (I think there is a river down there) at a point virtually opposite where BMW ended up facing.

    The french cyclist who is to rendezvous with al-hilli appears on scene (gets off his bike) and is shot in back 5 times by killer who is behind him. Al-hilli realises what is happening and reverses back at speed. Car is shot as it reverses (glass was found in other areas of car park and not just where it ended). BMW hits banking in reverse. Killer is now facing car and fires through windscreen before quickly moving to driver side front window to shoot al-hilli, then shoots remaining adults. Older girl may have been shot whilst in car or may have got out before shooting or just before RAF man arrived.

    Any transfer of information could have been done by simply dropping a usb stick etc as he cycles past and does not require a lengthy meeting in the car. But he may well have got off his bike before shooting. Not sure where bike ended up though.

    So killer obviously was aware of meeting place and time. RAF man was also aware and was instructed to be first at scene to control events and perhaps remove anything not removed by killer. All he had to do was wait at the bottom of the road and time his arrival so the killer had left. (This may also be total rubbish and he may be innocent.)

    If Al-Hilli had got his information who knows what he may have done. He may have just driven off and not gone back to campsite or even UK. Therefore very important that the info does not leave the area. Imagine if a member of the public had picked up the usb stick etc after events…….An “ex RAF” man could be a useful person to have on scene.

    The position of the shell casings and also bullets would also backup my theories though am not sure where they all are.

    Anyhow thats my take on the evidence I have seen…but who knows.

  • Ricki Tarr

    My Suspicion is that Hicheur was set up as his Lawyer complained about, SS’s can forge an Email in his name or to his address, Im not saying he wasnt guilty though its just a good way to get him out of the picture to expose other players!

    Maybe Africa has something to do with this as Al Hilli worked with Nigeria on their latest Sat and the US’s interest in this region at the moment.

    http://www.phantomreport.com/americas-shadow-wars-in-africa

    see article that mentions al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, the same group that emailed Hicheur!

  • John

    @anders777
    “the Tavistock social engineers bombard us with all sorts of data all the time (print, audio, visual, psychic via HAARP, affects the brain patterns, mobile phone cell towers, ditto, and all the rest),”

    You are certifiable.Everything is a conspiracy: 9/11 ,7/7,Al Saddi,Dr Kelly,and on and on.How do you manage to survive knowing oall this info.Im amazed.

    So anyway as James asked,you got any proof for your wild theories on this story? Especially Cat D notice? As Ive spoken to friends in the media and they dont know of one.

  • Vermillion

    @Peter
    Regarding the Luger my point was that as they were issued for years in Switzerland there are bound to be lots about – they may be rare on the US gun scene but not in Switzerland or France near Switzerland. Also the German navy I believe was issued the 7.65mm Luger to not just Swiss issue. Given the barrel can be changed to convert a 7.65 to 9mm and vice-versa and it seems that some magazines at least can use either caliber the rarity of 7.65mm Lugers in fairly irrelevant

  • watcher

    @all (especially newbies)

    Please read the thread,I know it’s long and you have to use a BS filter in places but it’s worth it to A) get upto speed and B) prevents the same info being repeated over and over…

    For me a BIG breakthrough was made last night regarding the production of Hafnium as a by product of Zirconium Isotope production.

  • Felix

    @Katie

    It is not clear to me how ex-Air2000 man fills out his days. I don’t buy just cycling and pottering about the house doing DIY. His training business seems to leave no internet trail.

  • watcher

    @Felix, training pilots would prob pay so well it could be a work 1 week per month type of deal, and probably through personal recommendation.
    I mean we don’t want any old Ahmed learning the in’s and out’s of flying a 737 etc

  • bluebird

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hafnium_controversy

    For those who care. We are talking about hafnium isotope 178 hf m2.

    There is a lot of info in that link. Those who might have found a home made laser technology for creating that isotope from the hafnium metal with laser beam energy will immediately stay in the focus of all secret services world wide, whether or not they are muslims or perhaps alleged terrorists.

  • Fiona

    As for the Hafnium “bomb” I can see no real evidence of it being possible. The original scientist, Dr. Carl B. Collins, seems to be a fraud – discounting any experiment which did not give him the wanted result and no one has been able to reproduce it. I am no scientist but I know that sure ain’t science.

  • watcher

    @Fiona, I wonder how much evidence was floating around when Oppenheimer started his first few tests

  • Ferret

    @Watcher

    For me a BIG breakthrough was made last night regarding the production of Hafnium as a by product of Zirconium Isotope production.

    I nearly fell off me perch!

    😀

    For those who don’t know, or didn’t read last night’s exchange…

    Back in 2003 the New Scientist published an article saying that a particular form of Hafnium could make a mini-nuke, and the technology could be developed “within 5 years” ie by 2008.

    Given that it’s now almost *10* years since the article, it’s likely that this technology already exists and is top secret.

    The plant at Ugine where Sylvain Mollier not only produced reactor-grade Zirconium, but also Hafnium, as already mentioned on this thread. And it had a world-class R&D lab, where Mollier may have worked.

    Now, to turn ordinary Hafnium into “nuke” quality Hafnium you have to bombard it with high-energy sub-atomic particles.

    So… adding it all together… Adlène Hicheur worked at CERN (high energy particle bombardment), Sylvain Mollier worked at Cezus Ugine (Zirconium/Hafnium), and Saad Al Hilli worked at Rutherford (possibly on SILEX, the technique of separating isotopes by lasers).

    Between the three of them (or even just Mollier and Al Hilli) they have enough to make someone want what they had very, very badly.

    Gamma-ray weapons could trigger next arms race

    But in future there may be cheaper ways to create the [explosive] hafnium isomer – by bombarding ordinary hafnium with high-energy photons, for example. Hill Roberts, chief scientist at SRS, believes that technology to produce gram quantities will exist within five years.

    The price is likely to be high – similar to enriched uranium, which costs thousands of dollars per kilogram – but unlike uranium it can be used in any quantity, as it does not require a critical mass to maintain the nuclear reaction.

    The hafnium explosive could be extremely powerful. One gram of fully charged hafnium isomer could store more energy than 50 kilograms of TNT. Miniature missiles could be made with warheads that are far more powerful than existing conventional weapons, giving massively enhanced firepower to the armed forces using them.

    The effect of a nuclear-isomer explosion would be to release high-energy gamma rays capable of killing any living thing in the immediate area. It would cause little fallout compared to a fission explosion, but any undetonated isomer would be dispersed as small radioactive particles, making it a somewhat “dirty” bomb. This material could cause long-term health problems for anybody who breathed it in.

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn4049-gammaray-weapons-could-trigger-next-arms-race.html

  • bluebird

    http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2003-02/ns-uaf021903.php
    Interesting link from 2003!!! regarding hafnium weapons on drones.

    Fiona, there is a lot of research on 178 hf m2 going on during the past 10 years and of course any success would have been kept secret. There are according to scientists no publications due to military secrets.

    However, within 10 years of military funded research i bet that they were coming forward and likely they already have such weapons.

  • Ferret

    @Felix

    It is not clear to me how ex-Air2000 man fills out his days. I don’t buy just cycling and pottering about the house doing DIY. His training business seems to leave no internet trail.

    I will be posting more on this subject later, HARD DATA™ style!

    Anders, royalty cheques will be “in the post”! 🙂

  • Fiona

    @Watcher

    Actually quite a few scientists knew from doing the calculations and from experiments that an atomic bomb was perfectly possible. It was the exceptions like Heisenberg who though it impossible or very impracticable but he made the wrong calculations about fissionable mass (some say that was deliberate to prevent the Nazis getting the bomb). The atomic bomb did not contradict the know laws of physics at the time unlike the hafnium bomb.

  • Katie

    Same here Felix, the guy looks fit & my first reaction was SAS, my gut is known to be very reliable. 🙂

  • Ricki Tarr

    “The case centered on about 35 emails between Hicheur and an alleged contact with Al-Qaida in the Islamic Maghreb named Mustapha Debchi, who tried to convince him to carry out a suicide bombing. Hicheur declined, but in one response suggested striking at the barracks of a battalion of elite Alpine troops in the eastern town Cran-Gevrier”

    Gran-Gervrier is 2.7 KM or 8 mins away from annecy!

  • Peter

    @ Vermillion

    I stand corrected. I wouldn’t have thought that possible, as the 7.65 x 21 Luger cartrige is thinner and longer than 9 x 19 millimetre Para, but it turns out that you are right. Certain aftermarket magazines can handle both types of ammunition
    http://www.ammoclip.com/L/luger_main.htm

    Thus, it would have been no big deal for the shooter to get hold of two suitable spare magazines.

  • watcher

    @Fiona, but why would YOU or any of us see ‘evidence’ of this Hafnium Bomb being possible … if it is possible it would be kept very quiet indeed.

    This is the best motive theory that has appeared here, especially in light of the skill sets of other witnesses, links to the French Zirc Company, SAH previously working on particle accelerators and other enrichment technologies

  • watcher

    I see the timescale for leaving comments on here as increased from 18th Sep to 21st!
    Thanks Craig/ Clark / Jon

  • Guy_Fawkes2010

    Morning Campers

    @Watcher @Fiona ….and the only theory not being rehashed and reported in the press at the moment.

  • Fiona

    @Watcher

    Of course it is possible. But if your argument it that it must be so because we see no evidence of it, then that is not the best argument I have heard. Scientists tend to blab quite a lot about at least the theoretical aspects of their work so there should be a least some scientists who say that it is theoretically possible but there are very, very few that I can find. It tends to be sensational news/magazine writers and gullible US politicians that say it is possible.

    However given that it is only necessary for someone to believe the Hafnium bomb is possible for them to act the reality may be irreverent. This would make the US a possible suspect as only they (and the long dead Nazis) would fall for this pseudoscience and they have no problems about killing on a half-baked suspicion.

  • Ferret

    @Fiona

    Respect for your opinion, but I’ve got to agree with Watcher and Guy, this is a really strong possibility.

    You say it would break the laws of physics, can I ask, which one(s)?

    Mind you, people said that about Cold Fusion which got rubbished in the press, but that didn’t stop the results being reproduced over and over again, with I think over 80 peer reviewed papers supporting it.

    See http://www.lenr-canr.org/StudentsGuide.htm

    Worth bearing in mind that the laws of physics change as new experimental data comes in, so they don’t stay the same over time. The fact that something may break the known laws of physics doesn’t mean it can’t happen, it just means the current laws of physics cannot explain it.

  • watcher

    Given that the mail has stated the company Cezus provided Enriched Uranium to Iran in 2007 and the consistent slaughter of Iranian scientists in the nuclear field … this angle seems to get stronger to me…

    @Fiona , I appreciate your more evidenced based / scientific reasoning and applying this sort of logic makes this whole thread more credible. As opposed to some of the Loch Ness Monster did it with a candlestick in the woods type posts

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