There are gaping holes in the official story of the Boston bombings.
We are asked to believe that Tamerlan Tsarnaev was identified by the Russian government as an extremist Dagestani or Chechen Islamist terrorist, and they were so concerned about it that in late 2010 they asked the US government to take action. At that time, the US and Russia did not normally have a security cooperation relationship over the Caucasus, particularly following the Russian invasion of Georgia in 2008. For the Russians to ask the Americans for assistance, Tsarnaev must have been high on their list of worries.
In early 2011 the FBI interview Tsarnaev and trawl his papers and computers but apparently – remarkably for somebody allegedly radicalised by internet – the habitually paranoid FBI find nothing of concern.
So far, so weird. But now this gets utterly incredible. In 2012 Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who is of such concern to Russian security, is able to fly to Russia and pass through the airport security checks of the world’s most thoroughly and brutally efficient security services without being picked up. He is then able to proceed to Dagestan – right at the heart of the world’s heaviest military occupation and the world’s most far reaching secret police surveillance – again without being intercepted, and he is able there to go through some form of terror training or further Islamist indoctrination. He then flies out again without any intervention by the Russian security services.
That is the official story and I have no doubt it did not happen. I know Russia and I know the Russian security services. Whatever else they may be, they are extremely well-equipped, experienced and efficient and embedded into a social fabric accustomed to cooperation with their mastery. This scenario is simply impossible in the real world.
We have, by the official account, the involvement of the two Tsarnaev brothers, the FBI and the Russian security services. The FBI have a massive recent record of running agent provocateur operations to entrap gullible Muslims into terrorism. The Russian security services have form on false flag Chechen bombings. Where the truth lies may be difficult to dig out. But the above official version is not true.
Adrian Haburkuk (age 7yrs 5months and tree weecs),
go tell your dad to take his pills on time. He probably missed the previous one trying to teach you to his own insanity.
And who was the FBI agent who shouted out to him that he could set his conditions for coming out? Did a frightened 19 year old, preparing to die, for the first time since the nightmare began here a familiar voice?
But maybe he is guilty as hell. I don’t know but some things just seem very wrong.
“hear a familiar voice” I meant obviously.
“What will the younger brother say. Interesting he was terrified of the police but surrendered close to death to the FBI Hostage Rescue Team ”
I thought he’d tried to commit suicide by shooting himself through the throat and wasn’t going to be saying anything; or did I read that wrong?
Frazer at 13h06 says :
“Oh God..not another conspiracy theory..I thought we had enough with 9-11 !”.
I fully agree. I’m sure we haven’t heard all of the story yet (if only because Dzokar hasn’t been interrogated yet), but to immediately start up with speculations like “the legless man was an actor and faking it” is immediately right over the top (and I’m trying to put it kindly).
PS to Frazer : you’ve forgotten the Al-Hillil thread, I guess; that was a real field day for every soothsayer, amateur detective and conspiracy theorist in the blogosphere.
Kempe,
Nobody has said definitely that he shot himself in the neck. There is also the photo of him climbing out of the boat. Just before the FBI arrived the police had fired dozens of rounds at the boat followed by flash-bang grenades. The police helicopter overhead could see the suspect under the remains of the tarpaulin cover and told the ground where in the boat to aim the flash-bangs. One hit him right about the head and neck area. On the open channel being broadcast over the internet (they often forgot that in the heat of the moment) it was clear that they were just about to fire incendiary devices into the boat having established it had 20 gallons of fuel on-board according to the owners. Suspect was described as alternatively “motionless” and “flailing about” in boat after multiple flash-bang hits and a boat that looked like a sieve with bullet holes. So they decided setting fire to it would do what was needed.
Then a miracle occurred and after some strong words (instructions from the top) the FBI Hostage Rescue Team ordered all other agencies “back to the perimeter” and sniper teams off of roofs.
At one point it was even said “We have a problem. This down link is being broadcast live on the internet”. But too much had already been said.
@ Hab,
Many who want to discredit the asking of reasonable and logical questions about the official version of a story making national – and/or – international news have a tendency to use the phrase “conspiracy theory” to discredit either the questions being asked or the questioner.
While some persons make outlandish and unsubstantiated claims:-
“…like “the legless man was an actor and faking it” is immediately right over the top (and I’m trying to put it kindly).”
through leaps of logic – this want of logical thought – surely cuts both ways.
PS. Life is good – and it remains good to question and understand the world around us – surely – Hab?
You believe in Russians blowing up buildings as part of a conspiracy theory but you reject 911? Craig, please let me slap you.
@CheebaCow
Yes indeed. So far so good! Thanks again.
I find it strange that so many “terror drills” seem to simultaneously occur at terrorist incidents in the last few years.
A lot of unanswered questions we won’t be privy to. The Elder was supposedly shot, but then we learn (?) he was run over my his brother while on the ground in handcuffs. What was the COD? Was the younger bro a ‘Stockholm’ type. The elder was a control-freak who beat his gf, always angry. He may have been an ideal candidate for radicalization, due to his combatant nature. It seems a good deal of restraint was shown by cops who were under fire from the boat. Someone wanted him alive, because the
knee-jerk of law enforcement is to saturate the landscape with ordnance (See Christopher Dorner) Why? Ostensibly due to the same wish we all share, to hear some answers as to why the FBI let yet another surveilled person of interest slip out of their grasp.
Ben, Unleaded
“The elder was a control-freak who beat his gf, always angry”.
– You mean his wife who is a convert from Christianity? As far as I understand she says her husband had no “rogue” changes in her behavior, and she is refusing to give interviews.
Ben,
No it was very, very clear that the police and other assets wanted him dead – in fact they had only stopped firing things into the boat when they thought they had killed him (with flash-bang hits to head knocking him unconscious for a time but not dead?) I was listening live to the police incident channel as were hundreds of thousand of others. The arrival of the FBI HRT (arriving/departing via Coast Guard helicopter?) was all that saved him suffering the familiar fate. Five minutes later and he would have been dead,
Ben,
In fact, recall that Fox News and others initially reported live that suspect 2 had been killed in a police shoot out at the boat according to their sources. It was only when he started moving again after some time they realised he was still alive and they had to retract that. He is very lucky to be alive. I didn’t think Superman could have got him out of that alive – but the FBI HRT did.
“The surviving suspect in the Boston Marathon bombings has been charged in his hospital bed, US media report.
“The complaint against Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was sealed, so details of the charges are not known, local channel WCVB said.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22257451
Well that’s helpful …
Dreoilin & Jives:
You are very welcome.
Other sources saying he’s been charged with “conspiring to use a weapon of mass destruction against persons and property in US resulting in death”.
and this charge carries the death penalty.
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/cfc1ce9e-ab71-11e2-8c63-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2RDZbaGEc
I’m not revealing my own view yet but I’m posting this for the habitual babbler family.
http://www.cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?p=2383138&sid=51cf1c313dcf9001da7e744a34208e98
Sorry Anon. I seem to be suffering from overload picking up bits of bread trying to find my way home on this. I really am exhausted from the lack of reliable information. They will tell us when they decide it’s in their interests. Ha
Just out of interest, were the accused to have been white, far-right extremists, would there have been the same effort put into finding a conspiracy here?
I think not.
Same Circus, different clowns Giles. Boston happened on Patriot’s Day, which is a fav of the Supremacists. There were quite a few incidents, Stateside, which led me to think them responsible. It’s true that the rightwing tends to tamp down the threat from domestic white terror, but the marionettes dance to a dog-whistle tune and the composer comes from the same music school.
“Norwegian Killer Linked to Tea Party and EDL”
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/
This petition is important. It is from an organisation based in Massachusetts who are concerned that the Boston marathon event is not used to remove civil liberties, increase surveillance and further remove individual freedom.
http://act.demandprogress.org/sign/boston_response/?akid=2130.2257080.eMI0Es&rd=1&t=2
“But legs blown off in warfare do not bleed as profusely as you would expect; evidently the arteries somehow close off. Otherwise the very many survivors such as Nelson or Henry Paget, would very quickly bleed to death. To believe the bombings themselves were fake you would have to believe hundreds of eyewitnesses and medical staff were complicit. I do not countenance that.”
Well not quite!
You should read this:
http://www.medicalsci.eu/files/tccc_dorlac_isolated_civilian_penetrating_extremity_j_trauma_2005.pdf
“Results: Fourteen patients meeting inclusion criteria were identified from over 75,000 trauma emergency center (EC) visits. Average age was 31 years and 93% were males. Gunshot wounds accounted for 50% of the injuries. The exsanguinating wound was in the lower extremity in 10/14 (71%) patients and proximal to the elbow or knee in 12/14 (86%). Ten (71%) had both a major artery and vein injured; one had only a venous injury. Prehospital hemorrhage control was primarily by gauze dressings. Twelve (86%) had “signs of life” in the field, but none had a discernable blood pressure or pulse upon arrival at the EC.
Prehospital intravenous access was not obtained in 10 patients (71%). Nine patients
underwent ECT, and nine were initially resuscitated (eight with ECT and one with CPR). Those undergoing operative repair received an average of 26 14 units of packed red blood cells. All patients died, 93% succumbing within 12 hours.”
Article in The Guardian – published eight hours after this one – echoing a lot of what I say with more information from the Russian end.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/22/tamerlan-tsarnaev-dagestan-boston-bombing
Interesting that the Russian authorities are denying Tamerlan was of interest to them, and denying that he was in Dagestan in 2012
Sorry, correct link:
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2011/07/norwegian-killer-linked-to-tea-party-and-edl/
Serious lack of questioning of the “official narrative” in there, chaps. Seems like a willingness to “swallow official line”! Fits with the preferred version, doesn’t it, Sheeple?!
Let’s just say:
Muslims responsible = fake/conspiracy.
Far-right responsible = spot on, Govt, thanks so much!
Yet, Habakkuk, we still do not know who killed the Al Hilli family, or why. Is that thread still going, btw? I drop in occasionally, to say hello to the good people there.
.
MAAT, if you read the Methods of that study to which you linked, you will see that the study’s authors deliberately selected those patients who arrived at A and E in cardiac arrest and subsequently died. They did not analyse the ones who arrived at A ad E not in cardiac arrest, nor did they slecet the ones who survived. What they found was that all the patients who arrived at A and E in cardiac arrest from exsanguination due to proximal (thigh,upper arm) penetrating wounds, subsequently died. This is hardly surprising. Cardiac arrest due to hypovolaemic shock in a trauma situation is extremely serious and the prognosis is very poor. They also suggested the possibility that some of the patients might have survived had tourniquets been applied at the correct limb sites in the field.
Also, the study’s authors state that the the majority of civilian deaths from penetrating wounds of the limbs occur in those who have sustained those wounds to the proximal parts of the limbs (thoughs and upper arms). This is not the same as saying that most peiople who suffer such wounds, die.
So, in other words, this study does not suggest, or attempt to suggest, that all those civilians injured in the limbs to the extent of becoming amputees, normally die.
.
Re. the whole case of these two brothers, though, yes, it grows curiouser and curiouser with each passing hour.
Come on, Sheeple! Had the suspect been named Tray D. Ranged from Oddball, Alabama, would you all be looking for a conspiracy?
If “Tray D. Ranged” and all the aunts and uncles seemed to regularly talk to the FBI or FSB, yes I would think that suspicious.
Ben,
In case you missed it up-thread what do you make of this tweet by the younger brother?
https://twitter.com/J_tsar/status/290227971292282881
His tweets tended to be stream of consciousness type stuff. He also tweeted about the bombing itself at https://twitter.com/J_tsar/status/323950071777472514 – ending with “stay safe people”. The “ain’t no love” bit is a “Jay Z” lyric. He added the “stay safe people.”
Last year the only thing he seemed to be concerned about was whether the Boston Marathon was a safe place to smoke Marijuana. His opinion seemed to be that would get you busted.