The shocking death of Lee Rigby quite naturally appals us all. The intention of the crazed little group who conceived this killing was to make it as horrible as possible in order to scare people.
Horrible, sociopathic violence happens to people from time to time. They have done since Cain killed Abel, metaphorically or literally as you choose. Here is another headline today, just as horrific:
A British soldier has been jailed for stabbing a 10-year-old boy after getting drunk on vodka while serving in Afghanistan.
Both that obscene attack and Michael Adebolajo’s appalling actions are borne out of the same conflict. But it is reasonable to suppose that both these incidents involved people with, for whatever reason, a pre-disposition to murderous violence.
Such people have always been with us and will always be with us, but fortunately they are very, very few. In a nation of 60 million, involvement in violent crime is very low. If you are the victim of criminal violence, the odds over the last decade are about one in twenty thousand that the violence inflicted on you will have any linkage to political or terrorist causation. And the odds that you will suffer any kind of violent attack are thankfully pretty remote.
We should not panic from theatrical violence, just deplore and take sober stock. Sadly if a lunatic on the bus decides to strangle you tomorrow, there are no pre-emptive laws that can stop that. We should stop pretending that the state can always prevent.
Any CCTV footage yet?
Jesuit Atheist
27 May, 2013 – 6:42 pm
What only one dog? Seems to me there was a whole bloody flock of the things……………
……………….Colonel Kempe and Reginald Dissolute still wore expressions which showed the poor opinion which they had formed of my companion’s ability, but I saw by the inspector’s face that his attention had been keenly aroused.
“You consider that to be important?” he [ the Inspector ] asked.
“Exceedingly so.”
“Is there any point to which you would wish to draw my attention?”
“To the curious incident of the dogs in the night-time.”
“The dogs did nothing in the night-time.”
“That was the curious incident,” remarked he.
“The odd almost disinterested actions of passers-by has been attributed to the constant use of this area over many years, for filming of TV’s ‘The Bill’ cop soap.”
That’s a throw away explaination. There were no cameras or indication of crew and actually no statements from anyone that they thought it might be staged.
A real crowd viewing such a scene would be profoundly shocked by it (even given the occassional hope/expectation of something theatrical occurring)
People would react by flight and fight, reflexively edging backward and reflexive screams and shouts of “Murdering bastards!” “keep back” “dont talk to them” “the cops are coming” etc…
Oh. And thanks JA. (6 13 pm)
The great poet treads such a lonely road. But every so often there comes the warm light of recognition.
“If there was no collision, nobody run down then a pre-damaged car must’ve been brought to the location /…(snip a shortlist of things required)…/”
With that attitude towards public trickery, Illusionists like David Copperfeild must seem godlike.
Pamela Geller on the EDL this week: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/
“The EDL held a pro-freedom demo today against racism and bigotry, and as if on cue, the haters and the fascists turned out to harass, provoke and agitate. Every time British patriots rally for freedom….”
Pamela Geller on the EDL two years ago: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/06/edl-shake-up.html
“So it seemed to me at the time that the EDL was a genuine anti-jihad group, strongly pro-Israel as every legitimate anti-jihad group must be, since Israel is at the front lines of the global jihad..”
“However, it has become increasingly clear that the EDL has morphed and diverged from its original course…… Roberta Moore, the leader of the Jewish Division, has broken with the EDL….And they are now unrecognizable to me. I am sure regular Atlas readers have noticed that some time ago I stopped covering their events — I was waiting to see how things would shake out. I was waiting to see if the forces of good would recapture the heart and soul of the group. Alas, it was not to be.
Now that the person whom I most trusted in the EDL, Roberta Moore, has resigned…..I too am withdrawing my support from the EDL. I hope that genuine anti-jihadists in Britain will also leave the EDL and work with Roberta on starting a new group….”
So, if I read her farnetications (thank you, Webster Tarpley) correctly, it was the crazed actions in Woolwich of the two converts to Islam that have been “forces for good” in that she now feels that the heart and soul of the EDL is in accord with her zionism.
Nobody has yet compared the Woolwich events with the very similar killing of Theo van Gogh in Amsterdam Oost in the “Dutch 9/11”.
Crab; I agree the casual behavior of onlookers is strange, but as I’ve said before, many persons have a different response while in ‘shock’. I get calm and contemplative when in shock. It’s a form of altered awareness and some folks just zone out.
Never mind that, where are the phone clips at? Have these been confiscated by the cops? Is youtube filtering these out?
There ought to exist torrents of the stuff judging by the number of spectators.
“That’s a throw away explaination. There were no cameras or indication of crew and actually no statements from anyone that they thought it might be staged.”
But bystanders might have been expecting cameras and crew to turn up any minute, especially as the two attackers were hanging around, rather than running away.
If they weren’t expecting something like filming of ‘The Bill’, then the behaviour of the observers must be considered very, very unusual. Not ‘brave’, but exceedingly odd.
“People would react by flight and fight, reflexively edging backward and reflexive screams and shouts …”
Yes, not strolling past one of the attackers as he’s talking to camera, and not even appearing to notice him. Or his knives or his hands.
Kibo Noh 27 May, 2013 – 9:07 pm
“But every so often there comes the warm light of recognition.”
….and sometimes the plaintive whistle of a barb passing unnoticed over the head of the oblivious victim.
Kibo Noh 26 May, 2013 – 8:50 pm
to Lobotokuk Splendidus
‘Ben’ made a valid point when he said, ‘ Too many frauds have been committed against the public trust for us to trust the purveyors blindly.’
I remember in 1983 while working with Capscan on the UK PAF file in Victoria London, my boss, originally from Israel told my father, one Christmas, I was very naive on post WWII affairs.
That ‘heads up’prompted a good look at history and the massive, treasonous collaboration between American industrialists and financiers and the Axis powers, before and during the last World War; the role of these same elements in the recycling of the profits reaped by the Nazis back into the hands of the people who had committed the Third Reich’s crimes including Franklin Roosevelt’s ill-fated attempt to prosecute, at Nuremberg, the American and British industrialists who had backed Hitler.
I became aware of the Zionists’ successful use of Nelson Rockefeller’s treasonous, wartime collaboration with the Third Reich to pressure him, under threat of disclosure, into throwing decisive support to the creation of the state of Israel.
Later while analysing the terrorist attack American soil, the collaboration of George Bush’s family with the Third Reich became clear, specifically the role of Richard Nixon, Allen Dulles, Ronald Reagan and William Casey in the Crusade For Freedom, an illegal domestic intelligence operation, in which Nazi collaborators and war criminals were imported into the United States for political purposes; it was Richard Nixon’s role in coalescing the Nazi collaborators brought into the U.S. under the Crusade For Freedom, into a formal wing of the Republican party.
I then understood the U.S.S. Liberty’s role in relaying electronic intelligence concerning Israeli military operations to Egypt during the 1967 Six Day War and Israel’s discovery of this which led to their attack on the U.S.S Liberty.
Moving on it was the petroleum industry’s deliberate creation of the “oil shortage” of 1979 in order to destabilize Jimmy Carter and pave the way for the massive military buildup that took place under Ronald Reagan.
I was slow to connect the dots even after the Reagan and Bush administration’s use of Monzer Al-Kassar as the central figure in the Iran-Contra operation. Al-Kassar is one of the world’s leading terrorists and arms dealers and is credited by the DEA with importing 20% of the heroin consumed in the United States. Afghanistan took the baton.
I found out British intelligence convinced George Bush Snr to create his own private intelligence network and the use of this “government within a government” to effect the Iran-Contra and Iraq-gate weapons transfers.
It was not until the petrol industry’s deliberate luring of Saddam Hussein into Kuwait to precipitate the Persian Gulf War and the subsequent Iraq sanctions that murdered millions of kids (worth it!?) I became cynical and distrustful of so called Western ‘democracy’ and made coordinated efforts to seek whatever truth I could find in the thick soup of deception and lies.
I have spent from then until now making connections to people, people like me who have little faith in those that hold office and represent us; it is they who have nothing to exemplify. That leaves us guys to enlighten, us to illuminate.
We must do a grand job of it. That is why we are here.
Hi Ben – Im not relating to how you or i or someone else would have acted – im relating to the range of reactions present given more than a handful of people. That individual reactions vary isnt an explaination for odd group behaviour because the group is a number people, and odds of probability ‘mediate’ its composition.
Mark;
Don’t forget Prescott Bush, Henry Ford and Joseph Kennedy. Nazi sympathizers, feeling the errant ‘Zeitgeist’.
“odds of probability ‘mediate’ its composition.”
You certainly have a point, crab. I’m reminded of the videos of D-Dawg (Dzokhar). He didn’t even flinch when the first bomb detonated, indicating an expectation.
Spot on Mark.
I would only suggest that this claim doesn’t go far enough …
Israel intended to sink the U.S.S. Liberty and kill all the crew (witnesses) then blame it on Egypt, kindling maasive anti-Arab sentiment in the U.S.A. and drawing America into the 6 day war.
http://whatreallyhappened.wikia.com/wiki/U.S.S._Liberty
BBC have pulled out that fat fucking tub of lard Anthony Glees this fascist wanker is always sucking up to the SIS (probably he is one of the fuckwits, earning a damn good living out of indulging in his hobby of snooping, and facilitating repression). As ever this tosser pouring hatred and bile on “Islamism” and all things thereof, pontificates forever more money for the MI5 (they haven’t yet managed to reach the ratio of one to one, ie a snoop for every citizen in UK) as well as more legislation to hep them to snoop.
This fat bald wanker then concluded, with ominous warnings that if his recommendations are not carried out then; the current tensions could give way to unrest! this statement coming from this mouth piece of the SIS is clearly indicative of the aspirations of the men in shadows to be treated on equal footing with the banksters; huge amounts of money and more power, or they will destabilise the very government they are supposed to be serving.
@ Suhayl (14h38)and “April Showers”/”Mary” (16h05) :
“I’d like to know why Muslim countries are reluctant to provide sanctuary to their Muslim brothers…” Habbabkuk.”
———
May I just point out that this sentence comes from Jemand’s post and that I was quoting para 2 of that post as an introduction to mine.
@ “April Showers”/”Mary” – having misattributed that sentence to me, you go on to slyly suggest that it is indicative of racism. However, I forgive you, because you are this blog’s expert on making sly, indirect comments about races – in your case, about Jews – and you probably think that others go in for the same kind of dirty tricks as you do. Sharpen up a little!
@ Villager :
“Next subject please Craig. This story has far exceeded its sell-by date.”
———–
I couldn’t agree more. Apart from anything else, the amateurs detectives and would-be “mystery” solvers are going wild.
But I notice that Craig has started a new thread – but the fact is that people aren’t interested (around 55 comments as opposed to 550 for this thread); people want threads on which they can hang their favorite obsessions. This one is ideal (as Resident Dissident had observed, “April Showers”/”Mary” even managed to get another Jewish bloodline into it somehow).
The Obsessive Vipertongue sniffs, at 20h25 :
“Before the HoC goes off again the SIS are reporting to the Intelligence and Security Committee this week on what they knew. I don’t suppose the proceedings will be reported.”
————
No, I don’t suppose they will. Just as none of the proceedings of that Committee are reported and have not been since its creation. The discussions of the Committee and the testimony before it are confidential – and rightly so, by the way.
Learn!
“The Bill”? Talk about scraping the bottom of the barrel.
Do you realise what you are saying? You are saying that a pre-planned terror attack was not staged, pre-planed or rehearsed but the reason so many people are ignoring what’s going on is because, er…, how can I put this, because they think they are seeing a film set? Sorry, how does that work?
@ April Showers (15h56), who writes
Their game –
Release three who were arrested
Arrest another”
————
Firstly, I find the use of the word “game” in this connection rather offensive.
But leaving that aside, may we assume that the Old Biddy approves of the fact that the police, having satisfied themselves that the three arrested men have nothing to do with the crime, have released them? Or would she have preferred the police to hang onto them?
May we also assume that the O.B. would approve of the police arresting new suspects as and when they might come along? Or would she perhaps prefer the police not to arrest new suspects?
In conclusion, her post was pointless and silly.
The King must be tired from his day in the sun. But now the poor dear has to sort this rabble out.
So, to lift his spirits let me offer a sneak preview of my entry for the William McGonnagle Memorail Competition for Stunningly Outstanding Poetry Competition.
I am confident that his refined sensibilities will recognise this for the epoch changing masterpiece it most surely is.
Remember silly bloggers, you were here on this special night.
………………………….
Ode to the King
Hablecork of Blog Murrey
There is none can you excel.
You have boldly rejected the Facts Presented
And defended your cause right well.
The first time I heard the King speak,
’Twas in the Craig Murray Hall,
Droning on about spelling or grammar
Or the faults of a blogger
Or something somewhat trivial and irritating like That As loud as he could Bawl. Some didn’t much like what what he was talking About
At all.
Now bloggers can wander safe arm in arm,
For Trollmen are there to protect them from harm,
And to watch there all day,
So that no Critical Thinking or Drawing Wrong Conclusions
Can Befall
On the Blog of Craig Murray.
Not hard to spot the obsessive and offensive ones here. Jemand extrapolates a “clash of civilizations” between Muslims and non-Muslims in the UK, HBK perpetually insults and attacks April Showers for commenting on Zionist Jewish involvement in world conflict and UK politics.
“Next subject please Craig. This story has far exceeded its sell-by date.”
Villager and Habbabkuk are so pissed off with this thread that they keep coming back, reading messages and leaving messages. Sorry, how does that work?
““The Bill”? Talk about scraping the bottom of the barrel … Sorry, how does that work?”
Maybe you should direct your question to Cryptonym who wrote at 27 May, 2013 – 1:37 pm
“The odd almost disinterested actions of passers-by has been attributed to the constant use of this area over many years, for filming of TV’s ‘The Bill’ cop soap.”
What’s your explanation for the extraordinarily calm, collected attitude of the bystanders? Why did they not run away?
JA; Please don’t equate Villager with Hab. It’s a false equivalence.
Thanks for the clarification, Habbabkuk. I really ought to have read it more carefully and of course, to have realised the entire first paragraph was in quotes. Then I’d have directed my comments (2:38pm and 2:56pm) at Jemand instead of at you – sorry. I agree with the points which you actually made in your post.
For all those who think the official narrative of Woolwich is starting to smell like a haddock left in the greenhouse, I commend this blog:
http://www.chrisspivey.co.uk/?p=12025
11.14
Kibo Noh?
We do.
Magnificent.
Vile Scumbag Mcain Sneaks into Syria To Meet/ Help His Thugs
McCain has previously pressured the Obama administration to increase its support for Syrian rebels, calling for “game-changing” action to end the civil war.
“We need to have a game-changing action: No American boots on the ground, establish a safe zone, and protect it and supply weapons to the right people in Syria who are fighting for obviously the things we believe in,” McCain said on “Fox News Sunday” earlier this month.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/27/john-mccain-syria_n_3342897.html
Mark @ 9 ;37 pm
I remembered reading Bin Laden’s speech on 9/11, in which he talks of the Government, within the Government that you mentioned in you’re post, i drummed a bit up for you, but the entire speech i would say, is worth a read
Now they will spend the money for their expansion and for increasing their importance. I will give you an example. Drug smugglers from all over the world are in contact with the US secret agencies. These agencies do not want to eradicate narcotics cultivation and trafficking because their importance will be diminished. The people in the US Drug Enforcement Department are encouraging drug trade so that they could show performance and get millions of dollars worth of budget. General Noriega was made a drug baron by the CIA and, in need, he was made a scapegoat. In the same way, whether it is President Bush or any other US president, they cannot bring Israel to justice for its human rights abuses or to hold it accountable for such crimes. What is this? Is it not that there exists a government within the government in the United Sates? That secret government must be asked as to who made the attacks.
Bin Laden 29th September 2001
http://www.globalresearch.ca/interview-with-osama-bin-laden-denies-his-involvement-in-9-11/24697