The Tony Blair House Journal (editor Alan Rusbridger) reports on Kanye West’s disgusting private performance for the Kazakh dictator and his family, and takes a sideswipe at David Cameron for visiting that country.
But peculiarly they fail to mention that Tony Blair receives US $4 million a year as a consultant to the worker murdering Kazakh dictator, and that Alistair Campbell and Jonathon Powell as well as Blair visit to give this support – which has included a behind the scenes campaign to help Nazarbaev win the Nobel Peace Prize, fortunately with no result to date.
@ Fedup,
Q: The fact is this is a free blog, and it costs the poor bastard whom was nearly killed because he stuck to his guns and did not want to collude or play the dirty game, and keep quiet in the face of torture, murder, and the apologists thereof. In fact it costs him money to run this blog probably.
R: I dunno if we’re on the same page, but those thoughts of yours reflect mine.
Here’s a web site that provides a free platform for anyone, regardless of creed, color or culture, to say whatever they want, yet some individuals ‘demand’ this, that or the other thing, as if the onus [of whatever] rests on the shoulders of the man/men providing an outlet where one can vent one’s contemporary idiosyncrasies.
“Despite the fact that innocents are dying all over the place, my yaddah, yaddah, yaddah, blah, blah, blah has to be published, online and accessible to millions of readers….” Got it?
“Fedup, agreed about the Medialens policy ”
Your lucky Villager isn’t here to insult you & make a never-ending big deal over you making a simple mistake, as he so often does to Mary.
Well, they can try 😉
Wonderful to see Washington, Paris et al. falling behind Putin’s efforts to diplomatically end the Syrian crisis.
His going after loony Kerry for issuing his ultimatum has totally changed the situation.
Let’s hear no more Russophobia, and see more of Putin taking positive action in troubling international disputes.
“There is no shame in kicking these disruptive elements out”
this site is confusing, perhaps, because it’s a wiki, but fascinating for all this kind of stuff, if we take this board seriously, regardless.
http://meatballwiki.org/wiki/SoftSecurity
Contains this:
“I’m reading the case (*) of a feminist forum that prided itself on inclusiveness that got trolled to nearly the ground by a anti-feminist troll; they did not want to ban the person on philosophical grounds due to their ideal of RadicalInclusiveness. This left them open to two months of vitriole until the forum hosts banned him”
Is this the case here? I actually think that the responses from some of the ‘regulars’ have been just as abusive. Although they can plead self-defence, self defence isn’t much cop if you’re not actually going more than reflecting the hostility – is it?
“Agree that the benefits of the questioning which Habbakuk originally seemed to open up have long since been replaced by embarrassing and tedious non sequiteurs,…”
_______________
Slightly unfair, that, Technicolour and perhaps based on a selective recall of my posts.
Non-sequiturs, I don’t think so. Tedious, well, no more so than the usual obsessional flows emanating from the Eminences. Embarrassing – perhaps to the people whose arguments I puncture, yes, or do you perhaps have in mind the streams of “fuckings”, etc, which appear to some to constitute appropriate replies to my comments?
So, possibly, one thirds guilty as charged.
@ Technicolour:
Something else for your consideration : would it be fanciful to suggest that as some commenters’ expectations (war in the Middle East, Bradley Manning to get 112 years, etc, etc…) are dashed so attention turns to the so-called “trolls”?
A compensatory reflex? Or, more broadly, a reaction against their impotence in the real world and their failure to bring the massses round to their way of thinking? Or simple cussedness?
“Hang on there, are you implying that the rest of us are not giving Jon our full support, and or appreciate his efforts?” Fedup.
No, of course not. It’s great, too that you’ve re-iterated that you do appreciate Jon’s much-valued input.
“Also you should have jumped in and kicked the fuck out of the racist bastards abusing you.” Fed up.
Well, as I tried to say, there’s a time and a place and also achieving certainty, or likelihood, and there’s also proportionality. If one is ‘wily’ (!) then perhaps one can achieve more, in terms of communication and so on, through (to utilise another trope) ‘silky Persian diplomacy’. To draw on that famous psalm, there’s a time for The Clash and then there’s a time for the Incredible String Band.
I always liked ‘silky Persian diplomats’, even though they’re nearly always the baddies in Hollywood movies! I quite like the idea of satin robes, Mediaeval velvet and things, though not the 1970s couture preferred by Denis Roussos. Eleanor of Aquitaine is more my goblet of mead.
In fact, I don’t know about you, but I tend to sympathise with the baddies in quite a few Hollywood movies, even those 1970s TV movies where the pock-marked baddy (usually neither silky, nor Persian) would try to escape in a small ‘plane only to be stymied by the goody driving a fast car into its path. I cannot stand characters like (to quote John Lennon) “all-American, Saxon mother’s, bullet-headed son”. Not that I’ve anything against ‘Saxon mothers’, Americans, or people with elongated heads.
An interesting insight into the FSA. He also says the AQ-linked chaps treated him more humanely.
Syria hostage Domenico Quirico ‘treated like animal’
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-24039309
“Villager: it’s quite clear that you are mainly attacking Mary, of course. May your god, whatever it is, go with you, because I swear, you’re not making an iota of difference to this reader.”
Technicolour,
A. You should know as well as anyone that Mary is quite combative herself. I don’t ‘attack’ her but i do level with her when she gets her *facts* wrong. As she did the other day when she labelled Bashar al-Assad an FRCS (perhaps in an attempt to glorify him?) and refused to come up with the evidence. We all make mistakes (except Habbabkuk of course 😉 ), but are also willing to stand corrected and back-off. Not Mary. She said she had it ‘by authority!; whatever that is supposed to mean. It was quite an interesting exchange — you should go back and read through it if you haven’t already. Dreoilin was an objective witness and in the process also kept Fedup on the straight and narrow who was inciting calls of racism where they were none.
B. Leave “your (my) god” out of this. It has nothing to do with this pitiable thread. I am surprised that you attempt to drag It down to this level.
Villager, what is the point of attacking Mary about a completely minor issue? In the middle of a discussion about Syria, what is the point? Apart from personal dislike? If you can contradict her evidence, simply post the counter evidence. This is how, in a sane world, it works. It was not an interesting exchange.
Habbakuk, the same to you. You may think that your catch phrases are interesting, but I assure you, after months of this, they are not. What is is interesting is if you have some new information, or a different perspective. It is true that you suggested that the US would not attack Syria and that this was sabre rattling, but your point got lost in your seeming inability to state it clearly, without muddying the waters with tedious and (I’m sure) paradoxically heartening references to ’eminences’ and so on. Shame. And, I think, embarrassing, because you seem to now be playing the same game you started off by challenging.
The anti-hero (to pick up from Suhayl) should beware, I think.
Bits of a paraphrased conversation between rightists. Sean Hannity, not an advocate of action against Syria on practical grounds, but wants Obama to take out Iran’s possible nukes before it’s too late, speaking to Congressman Peter King, major hawk re Syria. [my remarks in]
SH: German and Russian intelligence dispute claims Assad regime were responsible for gas attacks.
PK: No one any longer doubts US intel, especially those who’ve seen classified material.
SH: Why can’t we see the classified material? [A point made elsewhere by an ex CIA]
PK: Who are you going to believe, the Germans and Russians or Americans?
SH: [shamed] Americans, of course. Will the US protect Israel if we attack Syria?
PK: Israel says they can defend themselves. [So why doesn’t Israel (with Saudi help?) do a teeny pin-prick attack on Syria and leave us out of it?]
They then engage on what happens if Assad is overthrown. King’s best response is it would help the rebels (now numbering from 1200 to 1600 factions) if Assad was at least destabilized.
@ Daniel Rich 11 Sep, 2013 – 7:14 pm
“Did Hillary ‘Arm those Mofu, BadAss, Serious Freedom Friers and oh, I got my own Liberty Medal, ehehehehehe…’ Rottingham Clingon, bet on the wrong horse again?”
The far-right is furious and puzzled that Jeb Bush awarded her the medal. Explanation: Presidents Bill Clinton and George H.W. Bush received the Liberty Medal in 2006.
[Hillary] Clinton playfully joked that the two ex-presidents are “let’s face it, the classic odd couple of American politics.” She said the duo “just had one of their annual play dates up in Kennebunkport,” at the Bush family compound in Maine.
It’s all in the family.
Suhayl: “I hadn’t twigged to the alleged significance of the word, “wily”, actually (I’d rather be wily than thick), though I did think the adjuration to “civilise” myself might be subject to various interpretations.”
Suhayl i hand it to you for your unequivocal and gentlemanly balance and objectivity. That, despite attempts by the chief mischief makers, Macky, Fedup & Co, to drag us into their dirt.
To be clear, like you, even i had not twigged to the alleged significance of the word, “wily”, and thanks to my good education was even oblivious to its obtuse connotation. Perhaps because i don not have a Ph D in abuse like Dr Fedup. You will recall even Dreoilin was perplexed and kept asking where the word w** had crept in pointing out that it was our five-star F-twerp who had himself made it up, with the obvious motive to incite.
End of story.
Respect, sincerely!
Villager; Depends on which ‘wiley’
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lj5mvoabcT1qg636ko1_500.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/wile%2520e.%2520coyote%2520and%2520road%2520runner&h=324&w=432&sz=72&tbnid=PhmXIz8BNg2hNM:&tbnh=94&tbnw=125&prev=/search%3Fq%3DImage%2Bof%2Bwile%2Be%2Bcoyote%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=Image+of+wile+e+coyote&usg=__XNDr5QRIojLKOdSaPjjt8E7uJnI=&docid=AvpnOxkLNfhIMM&sa=X&ei=V-MwUsjpMIS-igLsw4HoDg&ved=0CDkQ9QEwBA&dur=35
Suhayl you are so full of shit sometimes (in a very good way) PMSL
OK, but seriously Suhayl you and I have had our fair share of fights, but never shall I tolerate someone abusing you in a racist fashion, never! That is the lowest of the low, and only can be found in the mindset of the master race fuckwits. I will not insist on how you should do the voodoo that you do the best. Although will stick up for you time and again, if anyone dares to be racist towards you, regardless.
====
You bet it should be. I appreciate that I may not come across as the model of probity, but in my experience the more I have let these fuckwits throw crap around the more they have become “emboldened” and upon unleashing the gates of abuse upon them, then they rush to “Mod” and complain and he duly goes around deleting the offending posts. This in turn validates their tactics which leads to further disruptive behaviour.
You ask about the “assertions”, I should only point you to read the unconscious drivel that is getting posted around here by these so called “contributors”. Further by now it should be a given, to understand that ziofcukwits are racists, it was declared in Durban conference and since then the situation has tended towards getting worst and not better.
I will never forget during the early days, there was this lunatic racist supremacist who had been giving it hell around here, until I arrived and started to fight fire with fire and I distinctly remember his plaintive comments to Clarke and Jon seeking their help to reign me in, and when he saw they were not forthcoming packed up and did one!
==
Thanks Daniel Rich. We are on the same page. I am ever so grateful to this Scottish host of mine (the little guy has my utmost respect, and I hope he knows it too), who has afforded me the space to find similar thinking people as myself and has facilitated communication of my thoughts and indignations of a bunch of virulent mercenaries whom have long ceased to have a soul and to be human. Their eyes blinded to the suffering of their victims, their ears deafened to the shrieks of the wailing mothers, and children, and their hearts hardened to the silent tears of the old men who are watching their hard worked farms of olive trees that have stood the test of time in centuries to be uprooted so that a tweet from Brooklyn or some other white trash ghetto to be settled and housed.
We all owe this guy (Craig) a huge thanks and our best wishes and gratitudes.
====
Coyote…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2rjDBQ1UDY
By the way, I think one can conclude that this was not ‘sabre rattling’. This conclusion is based on a) the fact that the vote in the UK parliament was a very narrow one b) the cries of fury from those in the UK parliament who wanted to see bombing c) the subsequent reaction from people like Ashdown who were arguing, apres Albright, that this is what our military is for d) from Kerry’s (flawed) presentation in favour of war, and from numerous other sources, not least the example of Libya. I do think that the stubborn resistance to the idea from people everywhere; the courageous stance of many of our MPs and the historic vote we ended up with have (one hopes) stopped this barbarity in its tracks. Of course the default is to say ‘we never meant it in the first place’. But we will see.
Craig has asked that we address issues and not other commentators. The mod could (imo unapologetically) delete all comments he judges to fail this criteria. That would sort out most problems here.
I suggest there is another division on this blog that largely remains unmentioned. And that is class.
Feeding the trolls? OK. I admit I’m guilty as hell.
Believe me I’ve tried ignoring them, but I really don’t believe they’d just go away even if we were all to manage that.
The constant “hasbara” occupation of these threads is inevitable given the popularity of Craig Murray’s blog and the growing respect for the stand he takes. It is an issue endemic to the blogosphere so why should we shy away from shining a light on it?
One thing I love about visiting here is the huge diversity of the content and the certainty that I’ll usually leave with a pearl or two of information and the strong conviction that these conversations are leaking into the mainstream. Also I like hanging out here with (mostly) a great crowd of people. Thanks for the company and the banter.
Given that this occupation will likely last until the issue of justice for Palestine is resolved, we may as well be realistic and prepare for the long haul.
While it is true that the topic is often derailed I feel that leaving the offensive posts up gives everyone a chance to see the dynamics of “public diplomacy” and draw their own conclusions. Also, in the process of trying to divert and suppress the discussion they tend to flag issues in need of society’s attention more effectively than could be achieved if we were mostly simply nodding in agreement.
I know if I was a bit wiser I’d just scroll on down through the, seemingly endless, drivel, but I’d say I’m probably not alone in having become a bit of a habakukoholic. I get the strong sense that, if this is the best that can be done to attack the conversation here, then the barrel has been truly scraped. They don’t even attempt to explain because there are no explanations that can justify what is being done daily by the people who have stolen the lands and blighted the lives of the Palestinians.
I also feel that Jewish people don’t deserve to be treated as though their identity is irrevocably tied to the brutal and expansionist state of Israel. So, mistaken or not, I’m for not banning them. Let’s allow them their flair for discrediting themselves and let’s not feel reluctant to engage and draw them out. Finally let’s allow ourselves a bit of fun in the process.
Vive la Diversité.
TC don’t be ridiculous, i don’t ‘know’ Mary personally so i can not personally ‘like’ or dislike her. Was Mary trying to glorify Assad? I did actually post the counter evidence addressed to both her and Suhayl. Are you sure you’ve read the thread. As for interest, anyway, one man’s meat is another man’s poison. Suffice it to say, *many* others joined the dialogue, presumably because they were interested, or are you accusing them of behaving irrationally?
You’re completely wrong about Habby too, but i’ll leave it to him to respond. All i can say is that it is a *big f***ing deal* for him to have called this whole Syrian “War” thing right AND to have been the only person to have done so, amongst all your conspiracy-theory junkie friends here. Obama’s “I was elected to stop wars, not to start them” is a major pronouncement and a turning point coming as it does precisely 12 years after 9/11. Don’t dismiss it all out of hand.
Go with greater awareness and less judgment as the overtones of your messages this evening.
There are certain powers that want this war to take place, Technicolour. Will they get their way? Are those big fleets in the Eastern Med about to go back home? How are the UN going to inventory everything type of CW Syria has in storage? Is Angie coming back to Eastenders?
As a great mind once said in this very forum: Many a slip ‘twixt cup and lip!
@ Trowbridge H. Ford,
Q: His going after loony Kerry for issuing his ultimatum has totally changed the situation.
R: I have this nagging feeling the collective western governments don’t give real rat’s ass about bringing peace to the bleeding Syrian masses.
Their M.O. has been regime change from the git-go and unless that goal is achieved, I believe everything will be done to torpedo any process other than the installment of a ‘western-friendly’ stooge in Syria.
Fedup: “or some other white trash ….”
And this is not racism? LOL!
Let me clarify before I get accused of antisemitism.
“I also feel that Jewish people don’t deserve to be treated as though their identity is irrevocably tied to the brutal and expansionist state of Israel. So, mistaken or not, I’m for not banning them…”
I mean “them” as in trolls, not Jews.
My problem with “public diplomacy is that it assumes all Jewish people support the actions of the state of Israel.
They don’t. http://www.jfjfp.com
“i don’t ‘know’ Mary personally so i can not personally ‘like’ or dislike her.”
“amongst all your conspiracy-theory junkie friends here.”
– sounds like a whole lot of objectivity, Villager.
“Obama’s “I was elected to stop wars, not to start them”
Have you watched/read the transcript of his latest speech?
“But when with modest effort and risk we can stop children from being gassed to death and thereby make our own children safer over the long run, I believe we should act. That’s what makes America different. That’s what makes us exceptional.”
(link in post above)
And can you address the points I made about why I conclude this was not sabre rattling, but a real attempt to repeat Libya in Syria? That would be most interesting, thanks.
“Craig has asked that we address issues and not other commentators. The mod could (imo unapologetically) delete all comments he judges to fail this criteria.”
I would agree to that with the caveat that friendly exchanges would be exempt. We’d probably hear caterwauling about unfairness and discrimination in leaving such posted, but it couldn’t be any worse than the flaming du jour.
Yes, Daniel R: There is a big dog standing guard over Syria right now, and the neocon rats have scurried away. But they’ll be back. In the meantime, what other mischief can they get up to? Gaza, Chechnya, Taiwan, the Kuril Islands…what will do as a snack now that the main course is off the menu?
Is that a garbled metaphor? Damned if I care…
There’s always Venezuela – that’s definitely unfinished business.
“Obama’s “I was elected to stop wars, not to start them”
Have you watched/read the transcript of his latest speech?
Yes, i have, i quoted from it….something i believe that was similar to a statement even in divisive St Petersburg.
As for the rest, it is obvious that our take on US realpolitik is so different, it would take a lot of analysis to reconcile. I prefer to work on insights not analysis but perhaps another time. It may well be that the UK’s historic vote, defeated by a sliver was a fortuitous critical inflection point.
These are the contributions of this villagecunt!
The fucking idiot cannot understand that whites are in the fucking majority, the laws tend to favour them, the lay of the land tends favour them, and yes seeing as the minority Muslims/Blacks/Asians/”Pakis” are always the “groomers”, “extremists” suicide bombers after a shag with seventy two virgins in the heaven”, the “drug dealers”, etc. evidently “white trash” ie the scum fuckwits who make the journey to gain more importance in zionistan and beat upon poor Palestinians, and steal their lands for free housing, free money/bogus jobs, is now a racist term.
Needless to point out, now the wanker will be running to “Mod”, oh henny penny these abusive posts….. bollocks ….blah, or do the usual; google “ziofuckwit” and post the long fucking url.
While we wait for anything of substance to come back on the issue of whether this was ‘sabre rattling’ or not (Mike, of course, is right, there are always vested interests in going to attack ‘or what is our military for?’ – never mind Haliburton and the rest of whoever, or do people think that wars are started by people who have no interest in starting them?) – Ben, I think the problem here is that I would rather attacks on me, for example, stand, so that people can see what is up, generally. I would, however, argue that some posts should be deleted because they are plain boring. How do we work that into a policy?