Ray McGovern and the Sam Adams party have presented the Sam Adams award to Edward Snowden. I am delighted. This from Ray’s account of the event:
In brief remarks from his visitors, Snowden was reassured — first and foremost — that he need no longer be worried that nothing significant would happen as a result of his decision to risk his future by revealing documentary proof that the U.S. government was playing fast and loose with the Constitutional rights of Americans.
Even amid the government shutdown, Establishment Washington and the normally docile “mainstream media” have not been able to deflect attention from the intrusive eavesdropping that makes a mockery of the Fourth Amendment. Even Congress is showing signs of awaking from its torpor.
In the somnolent Senate, a few hardy souls have gone so far as to express displeasure at having been lied to by Director of National Intelligence James Clapper and NSA Director Keith Alexander — Clapper having formally apologized for telling the Senate Intelligence Committee eavesdropping-related things that were, in his words, “clearly erroneous” and Alexander having told now-discredited whoppers about the effectiveness of NSA’s intrusive and unconstitutional methods in combating terrorism.
Coleen Rowley, the first winner of the Sam Adams Award (2002), cited some little-known history to remind Snowden that he is in good company as a whistleblower — and not only because of previous Sam Adams honorees. She noted that in 1773, Benjamin Franklin leaked confidential information by releasing letters written by then-Lt. Governor of Massachusetts Thomas Hutchinson to Thomas Whatley, an assistant to the British Prime Minister.
The letters suggested that it was impossible for the colonists to enjoy the same rights as subjects living in England and that “an abridgement of what are called English liberties” might be necessary. The content of the letters was so damaging to the British government that Benjamin Franklin was dismissed as colonial Postmaster General and had to endure an hour-long censure from British Solicitor General Alexander Wedderburn.
There has been a determined attempt by government to justify the need to intercept everybody’s communications, all the time. We have, yet again, had MI5 claim there are many thousand violent Islamic terrorists running around the UK, (yet somehow not managing to kill anybody). The cry of “paedophiles” is raised, as always. I can imagine them suggesting the entire population be shot dead, and justifying it as making sure they get the paedophiles. The tabloids would go with that.
There still had not been a single credible claim by the mainstream media that any named individual has died, despite that contingency being trotted out all the time as the reason Snowden and Manning should not have revealed state crimes and abuse of power. I am hopeful that, with the internet still largely free to the dissemination of information, out next massive whistleblower is only weeks away.
Thanks for your bang on description Mark G., this goes to the heart of what is creating apathy and lethargy with what we have at present.
“We are made aware of our democracy. Yet freedom is restricted, justice is exhausting civil rights and biased towards the elite establishment (i.e. ‘established’ so advanced revision is unnecessary). Democracy is mute.
We are also aware the British ‘party system’ is padded, underhanded, treacherous and unprincipled. We have no choice. The ballot sheet should have a box, ‘none of the above’ – that would fix it. The system has become a handful of tight seats; the election decided on the marginals with strings pulled and controlled by Multi-nationals, Banks, Hedge-fund bosses, multi-billionaire financiers – billionaire! That is 1000 million, absurd and ludicrous (as is $17 trillion in debt – laughable).
Justice now costs a bomb and is unavailable for anyone without funds to spare.
But to abstain from voting is the wrong message, there are some amongst us who, although coming mostly from disillusioned socialist and more radical camps on the left and green left spectrum, are trying to create a new consciousness and opposition.
The problem is engrained party politics, power addicted brokers/salesmen and women who attach their principles to the establishment and are promoted by the latter as the answer to our questions which invariably never happens.
Far from getting into a party mode, we should get back to basics by being active locally, helping people and getting them together for to deal with their own local needs, away from the dependencies created, whether its local services, shut shops, post offices nobody seems to care about unless they are sold, politcs with a small p, all the while pointing to the systems failures as eing created by party politicians, its they who got us into this fine mess, to quote a wise pair, Laurel and Hardy.
They have no solutions to the foorthcoming struggles, for example, yesterdays energy price rises and subsequent febrile reactions from our venerable addicts/party leaders; it was derisabble wishy washy excuses, i.e the bigger boys whole sale markets have screwed us, we are helpless, sort of a whimper.
A week spent schmoozing China’s leaders, well, cameron and Osborne met opnly second ranking officials, they are the breakfast and without offering the Chinese 100% control and ownership of at least 3 nuclear power stations, their words would have disappeared in the wind.
US financial desperation has led to these two characters going out to sell their and our souls, anything for more markets and a new relationship.
Two years ago China’s nuclear industry was knocking on our door asking to be able to quote for the work, only to be met with a cold shoulder, so this 180 degree u-turn by these two Bullington boys smacks of desperation. The US is going down the pan so lets go out and find another rock to limpid up to.
For politics to become normal we either need PR or disband from voting alltogether and choose demarchy/lottocracy as a system.
It will also take strong Independent minded candidates, in the case of PR, to bring back a mandate based and cooperative politics that puts constituents first.
Any lazy mind who believes that party politics, or Labour readjusting their policies, what a farce to watch them adopt every Cons. policy going, will bring relief to this grab and run minority show we are subjected to, should think again, these manipulators know every trick in the book and however much they are not a celebrity and can only command ‘shouting interest’ from a few selected viewers on Question time, this show will be promoted to run by the BBC, another dependent addict to the establishment and rules, whether politicians and politics is popular or not, i.e. we will feed you unpopular politics, whether you like it or not.
All those thinking of UKIP as a protest vote, watch what you vote for, plenty of skeepskin s available these days and some UKIPLERS are already thinking of moving over to the Tories, they are one kadre.
I will only call people anti West when they become blind to the human rights abuses committed outside the West and then support those politicians who offer encouragement to the regimes carrying on those abuses, while at the same time being every ready to emphasise even the smallest transgressions of western democracies.
“the logical thing to do would be to end all Western support”
And I am the naïve one – but I’m glad that you recognise that negotiation has to be the way forward. That said I do think that there has to be moves regarding who the West supports within Israel and how that support is qualified – but perhaps also there need to be some changes on the Palestinian side as well.
“when they become blind to the human rights abuses committed outside the West and then support those politicians who offer encouragement to the regimes carrying on those abuses”
What do you call those that deny, or seek to mitigate the human rights abuses either committed by, or encouraged by the West, and who offer support to the politicians who provide not just encouragement, but weapons, and just as lethal, political support, to the regimes carrying on those abuses ?
” I’m glad that you recognise that negotiation has to be the way forward”
What part of “it takes two sides, both in good faith to negotiate” don’t you understand ?
If one side repeatdly refuses either to compromise, or even to enter the negotiations in good faith, then pressure, boycotts, cultural isolations, expulsions from organisations etc, should be applied.
Maybe this helps to understand what has happened on this blog??
http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?364178-Confessions-of-a-Zionist-Paid-Internet-Troll
“Maybe this helps to understand what has happened on this blog??”
I read that years ago, seems very plausible & in fact quite likely to be true, especially given that the Isreali Government is quite open about recruiting such “Internet Warriors”, and it only further help confirm what I already suspected was occuring all over the internet.
Interesting that our ex-Mod didn’t think that hardly ever happened here, especially after a sudden influx of new Posters shortly after this Blog was voted the 2nd (or was it 3rd ?) most popular political blog; probably might explain why his moderating wasn’t such a great success imho.
“What part of “it takes two sides, both in good faith to negotiate” don’t you understand ?”
None at all – I was agreeing with you.
“What do you call those that deny, or seek to mitigate the human rights abuses either committed by, or encouraged by the West, and who offer support to the politicians who provide not just encouragement, but weapons, and just as lethal, political support, to the regimes carrying on those abuses ?”
I would call them hypocrites – and use my democratic freedoms to try and change matters. I would also recognise that I should use those freedoms on behalf of those who do not have them in regimes where the human rights abuses are even worse.
” use my democratic freedoms to try and change matters. I would also recognise that I should use those freedoms on behalf of those who do not have them in regimes where the human rights abuses are even worse”
So you will be in agreement to try to persuade our Government to put pressure on the Israelis iro their horrendous human rights abuses of the Palestinians, and also to urge them to compromise to reach a solution to end the conflict there.
Runner77,
Your “Confessions of a Zionist paid internet troll” is a hoax that was posted on sites such as this all over the internet in the hope that at least a few fools would believe it.
No surprises to see Macky falling for it:
“it only further help confirm what I already suspected was occuring all over the internet.”
Nothing like confirmation bias, eh?
Anon
That’s a pity – I was hoping I could claim some back pay.
“No surprises to see Macky falling for it”
Oh look yet another “Anon” !
1) I didn’t state that it was indeed true, but possibly likely to be true, given that ;
2) many Reports like these seem to be true;
http://www.thejc.com/lifestyle/lifestyle-features/israels-cyber-warriors
http://electronicintifada.net/content/israel-investing-16-million-new-media-warriors/9245
3) I would be interested to see the evidence that it was indeed a hoax; so please provide.
BTW “For the return of Habba and Free Speech” seems rather ridiculous now as there is nothing to stop the Hubbu-Clown Troll Clown posting if it wants to.
Any reader of the Guardian in the 60s and 70s could never have imagined that this sort of bilge would be printed today.
‘The Duke of Cambridge has conducted his first investiture ceremony. With the steady hand of the Sandhurst-trained, Prince William wielded his great-grandfather George VI’s ceremonial sword to bestow two knighthoods without mishap and pinned a plethora of medals on proud chests with military precision.
Among the recipients gathered in the Buckingham Palace ballroom on Thursday was Wimbledon, Olympic and 2012 US Open champion Andy Murray, 26, who had to undergo a dope test before collecting his OBE. “In middle of a drug test hahaha I’m goin be late!!!” the world No 4 tweeted, though he made it on time, arriving with his girlfriend Kim Sears and his parents Willie and Judy in a chauffeur-driven people carrier.’
There is also a whole page devoted to a new book from Morrissey, a vanity project. Who is interested in that has been? No mention btw that he went to Israel again (he went in 2008 too) to perform thus breaking the boycott and in spite of pleas not to go.
http://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/oct/17/morrissey-autobiography-triumph-mired-moaning-review
http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/alexander-billet/morrisseys-big-mouth-silent-apartheid
The only decent thing in the rag was a double page spread of some of Don McCullin’s war photos. He has just won an award.
http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/gallery/2013/oct/18/aop-photographers-awards-winners-pictures
PS Macky totally agree with you at 10.48am. Craig didn’t get it either. He even put a message up for H…….. which almost welcomed his posts.
A photo of someone I know very well was posted on that hate ‘ism’ site. An incitement to murder. A death threat. The International Solidarity Movement workers have had a terrible time. Shot at, injured, their boat rammed, imprisoned and even killed like Rachel Corrie and Tom Hurndall.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Solidarity_Movement
“Any reader of the Guardian in the 60s and 70s could never have imagined that this sort of bilge would be printed today.”
Perhaps they do it because they find people read it on a regular basis – you certainly do as evidenced by your extracts. Please note for future reference that this troll (and I suspect others) really are not interested in gossip about the Royals, Andy Murray, Morrissey etc.
“Craig didn’t get it either. He even put a message up for H…….. which almost welcomed his posts.2
Yes, but at least this was very early on, before the Troll revealed beyond all doubt that he was a classic troll, and a particularly venal one at that. But yes, the harm done by well-meaning but clueless liberals is immense, & I’ll even include Villager & Technicolour in that, but I like to think that perhaps these two are young enough for immaturity to be a mitigating factor, well one hopes !
Thanks for that runner 77 and Macky, makes one appreciate the value of real person to person conversation, looking into each others face.
These cowboys sitting in dark rooms will only damage themselves, aiding and abetting an Apartheid Israel that has no qualms to do to Arabs and Africans what once had been done to them, what a sad cycle of self abuse. An anti human drive that breeds racism and fascists tendencies, calling all opposition to their agenda anti semitic to paint over the rift that is tearing israels society from left to right, once again.
Brainwashed since Golda Meir told them that there is no such thing as a Palestinian, they are all terrorists, these Zionists find no end to their harrassment, not even if it distrubs the actuyal harasser mentally and changes his life forever.
poor mites, when will they wake up and embrace all of humanity, cast off their ‘ueber alles’ copy cat activities and agenda’s.
We must publicise our MP’s status as FoI’s at the next election, tell voters of their split loyalties which have diverted our foreign policy via Batboy Hague.
Ref British Gas, in the news for their price rises.
I posted this comment here last January.
‘Gas boss forced out with a golden goodbye: As families face ever-rising bills, energy chief is walking away with up to £13m
Phil Bentley is boss of British Gas which has doubled its prices in 7 years
Windfall enough to pay typical family’s gas and electric bill for 9,500 years
Bentley will leave company later this year as part of management overhaul
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2258695/Phil-Bentley-As-families-face-rising-bills-energy-chief-walking-away-13m.html‘
I read in today’s Guardian that Bentley has got the top job at Cable and Wireless, salary details unknown. Good riddance. He’s off to Miami.
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/oct/17/british-gas-phil-bentley-cable-wireless-tony-rice
Hi Grownups.
Mary.
Thanks for reminding us of Mordechai Vanunu.
Hats off to all whistle-blowers.
Humanity owes these them such a huge debt.
http://www.deliberation.info/vanunu-responds-to-gunter-grass-and-my-question-to-security/...
Macky.
Watching you and Dad this morning reminds me of a terrier (best dog in the world) shaking a rat in its jaws.
Shudafucop took me hunting the other day. We caught a fat kupi stag pretty quickly so we spent the rest of the morning swinging on whee-vines just for the pleasure of it. We knew we shouldn’t, but there’s no better way to get the ratmonkeys howling, and that show’s worth the disapproving looks of the grownups. Yes, even the Wathafek have grownups!
Possibly likely to be true, likely to be true, seems very plausible, help confirm what I already suspected, provkde evidence it isn’t true…
Whatever, Macky.
Even the crank site it was posted on said it was a hoax after the author admitted it.
But anyway, let’s enjoy some of the best parts of this “seemingly very plausible” story…
———————–
The next day, I arrived at the address – the third floor in a crumbling building. The appearance of the place did not inspire confidence. After walking down a long, filthy linoleum-covered corridor lit by dimly-flickering halogen, I came to the entrance of the office itself: a crudely battered metal door with a sign that said “United Amalgamated Industries, Inc.” I later learned that this “company” changed its name almost monthly, always using bland names like that which gave no strong impression of what the company actually does. Not too hopeful, I went inside.
[…]
The manager, a balding man in his late forties, rose from the only stand-alone desk in the room and came forward with an easy smile. “You must be Chris. Yvette [my ex-co-worker] told me you’d be coming.” [Not our real names]. “Welcome. Let me tell you a little about what we do.” No interview, nothing. I later learned they took people based solely on referral, and that the people making the referrals, like my ex-colleague Yvette, were trained to pick out candidates based on several factors including ability to keep one’s mouth shut, basic writing skills, and desperation for work.
[…]
My task? “To support Israel and counter anti-Israeli, anti-Semitic posters.” Fine with me. I had no opinions one way or another about Israel, and who likes anti-Semites and Nazis? Not me, anyway. But I didn’t know too much about the topic. “That’s OK,” she said. “You’ll pick it up as you go along. For the most part, at first, you will be doing what we call “meme-patrol.” This is pretty easy. Later if you show promise, we’ll train you for more complex arguments, where more in-depth knowledge is necessary.
[…]
After discussing pay (which was much better than I’d hoped) and a few other details, he then went over the need for absolute privacy and secrecy. “You can’t tell anyone what we do here. Not your wife, not your dog.” (I have neither, as it happens.) “We’ll give you a cover story and even a phone number and a fake website you can use. You will have to tell people you are a consultant. Since your background is in tech support, that will be your cover job. Is this going to be a problem for you?” I assured him it would not. “Well, OK. Shall we get started?”
[…]
The second binder was smaller, and it contained information specific to the web sites I would be assigned to. The sites I would work were: Godlike Productions, Lunatic Outpost, CNN news, Yahoo News, and a handful of smaller sites that rotated depending on need. As stated, I was NOT assigned to work ATS (although others in my group were), which is part of the reason I am posting this here, rather than elsewhere. I wanted to post this on Godlike Productions at first, but they have banned me from even viewing that site for some reason (perhaps they are onto me?). But if somebody connected with this site can get the message to them, I think they should know about it, because that was the site I spent a good 70% of my time working on.
[Still believing this, Macky?!]
“If you can convert one of the hostile posters from the enemy side to our side, you get a nice bonus.”
[Continued]
Ah Sofia ! My favorite Blog juvenile ! A free, open-minded wild spirit, the very essence of Youth. Hard to believe that you are the child of a troll, so you must of taken everything from your mother’s side; enjoy hearing your travel reports, and that you care enough to keep an eye out for what’s occurring here.
Nevermind, just for the record, do you believe Habbabkuk is a paid agent of the Israeli government?
haPpycLAppy whistleblocker closes blog
Craig Murray RIP
Craig has never understood that all freedoms are likely eventually to be perverted by fascist wastes of space
“[Still believing this, Macky?!]”
Still awaiting evidence, or reasonable grounds for claiming it’s a hoax.
So I take it that you are not claiming that other reports that the Isrealis are using “cyber warriors” are fake ?
If this “Confessions of a Zionist paid internet troll” is really a fake, somebody went to a lot of trouble to produce it; reminds me of the fact, as has even happened here, that Zionist supporters often impersonate rabid anti-semites as a double bluff & convenient prop stick; whose motto is “By way of deception thou shalt do war” ?
Hello everybody! I am delighted to be here among friends and enjoying the debate already. Just to let you know who I am, my grandparents fled persecution in Europe and set up an international investmant bank in NYC. Clue: my name’s Goldman.
Yes, that story by a pretend Hasbara worker is a fake. We don’t do it like that at all. You can find all sorts of useful resources for explaining why Israel deserves everybody’s help and support here –
http://www.hasbara.com/v2pages/resources.html
We certainly don’t need no hole and corner operations in US cities to get the word out. Or full time advocates on the web. Not when $2000 buys 5 months hard work by a broke student –
http://www.aish.com/ai/bn/ji/Hasbara_Fellowships_700_students_Israel_summer.html
Naturally, Israel’s such a wonderful place, all of this would be a waste of time and money in a perfect world. But you’re all antisemites.
Macky 18 Oct, 2013 – 11:35 am
Habbabkuk was posting last night as Aguirre (der Zoern Gottes), eg:
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2013/10/edward-snowden-gets-sam-adams-award/comment-page-4/#comment-433840
You’re quite right, there is nothing to stop him posting. Even if we still had a mod, he could (and did) keep changing his handle.
In my opinion, he isn’t the problem. Let him post as much nit-picking nonsense as he wishes. If people ignore the nonsense, he’ll soon realise that the only way he can get attention is by making substantive posts, which then makes him an asset to the blog.
The problem is when people play into his hands and engage in squabbling matches with him, filling the blog with useless shite. I’m saying this to you because you are one of the worst offenders in this regard. Now we’re modless, it would be a great help if people like yourself didn’t do the trolls work for them.
When you’re not bickering, you’re one of the posters I most like to read. Shame I have to scroll past you so often.
Re. Anon’s reluctance to believe the authenticity of that Zionist internet troll: there’s nothing on Snopes about it being a fake, nor anywhere else on the web as far as I can see. Perhaps Anon would care to publish the evidence for his/her/its scepticism??
Macky, you just need to admit that you fell for a hoax, and an obvious one at that. The admin of the “Above Top Secret” conspiracy site it was posted on stated it was a hoax after the author told them so.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread826545/pg1
“So I take it that you are not claiming that other reports that the Isrealis are using “cyber warriors” are fake ?”
Now you switch. Look, Israel as a small country with an often justifiably bad international image sees it as necessary to improve its image by asking its citizens and supporters worldwide to help promote it online. There is nothing particularly sinister about that.
“When you’re not bickering, you’re one of the posters I most like to read. Shame I have to scroll past you so often”
Thanks for the back-handed compliment !
Not that I’m returning the favour, but yes I do like most of what you post here, however your approach to the troll problem is the ostrich solution, keeping your head down & hoping the problem will go away; well it case you haven’t notice all these long months, no it doesn’t go away, instead it get ever worse, as people who do not know or consider others to be trolls, will always engage with them, or even as we have seen here, often will team-up & side with them in order to attack another Poster that they don’t like, hell, we have even had on-line grooming & total brain-washing iro of a once sane Villager ! They will even be happy just talking to each other & turing the comments section of this Blog into a Zionist supporting playground just like Harry’s Place. No, I prefer the whack-a-troll mole approach, just having the satisfaction of shredding their bogus attempts at debating, and watching them having to change course & tactics, is good enough for me, rather than let nonsense go unchallenged, because at least I know that they know that I know they are full of crap.
Runner77,
Why don’t you read the “Confessions of a Zionist paid troll” again, from start to finish, and ask yourself whether you really believe it? I know it’s hard when something would appear to confirm one’s prejudices, but will you give it a go?
The second binder was smaller, and it contained information specific to the web sites I would be assigned to. The sites I would work were: Godlike Productions, Lunatic Outpost, CNN news, Yahoo News, and a handful of smaller sites that rotated depending on need. As stated, I was NOT assigned to work ATS (although others in my group were), which is part of the reason I am posting this here, rather than elsewhere. I wanted to post this on Godlike Productions at first, but they have banned me from even viewing that site for some reason (perhaps they are onto me?). But if somebody connected with this site can get the message to them, I think they should know about it, because that was the site I spent a good 70% of my time working on.
Really?