I had fairly well concluded that the most likely cause was a fire disrupting the electrical and control systems, when CNN now say the sharp left turn was pre-programmed 12 minutes before sign off from Malaysian Air Traffic control, which was followed fairly quickly by that left turn.
CNN claim to have this from an US official, from data sent back before the reporting systems went off. It is hard to know what to make of it: obviously there are large economic interests that much prefer blame to lie with the pilots rather than the aircraft. But if it is true then the move was not a response to an emergency. (CNN went on to say the pilot could have programmed in the course change as a contingency in case of an emergency. That made no sense to me at all – does it to anyone else?)
I still find it extremely unlikely that the plane landed or crashed on land I cannot believe it could evade military detection as it flew over a highly militarized region. Somewhere there is debris on the ocean. There have been previous pilot suicides that took the plane with them; but the long detour first seems very strange and I do not believe is precedented. However if the CNN information on pre-programming is correct, and given it was the co-pilot who signed off to air traffic control, it is hard to look beyond the pilots as those responsible for whatever did happen. In fact, on consideration, the most improbable thing is that information CNN are reporting from the US official.
“Flight MH370: UN N-watchdog says no explosion or crash detected”
http://news24online.com/flight-mh370un-n-watchdog-says-no-explosion-or-crash-detected_LatestNews24_36118.aspx
Detailed timeline:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/world/2014-03/10/c_133173895.htm
For anyone considering the role of materials, there is a closed-loop recycling process for aluminum in the aerospace manufacturing industry, using nanotechnology:
http://www.recyclingtoday.com/rt0114-constellium-aerospace.aspx
@Bluebird: Related to your query:
http://www.computer.org/csdl/trans/tm/2009/09/ttm2009091221-abs.html
https://www.ee.washington.edu/research/nsl/papers/PIMRC-07.pdf
@Bluebird: I don’t know if this will help:
http://www.spaceops.org/images/spaceops/7-Securing%20Space%20Link.pdf
Obviously, jamming is a reality.
FWIW on the use of lasers to communicate with satellites:
http://www.militaryaerospace.com/articles/2012/07/satcom-feature.html
Katie
30 Mar, 2014 – 2:18 pm a point i made elsewhere but perhaps worth repeating here, they (Will and Kate) were also on holiday at the same time, and not many miles from, the Chevaline killings.
NR
30 Mar, 2014 – 6:24 pm yesterday’s bbc 2 o clock news carried interview with US naval officer. Sorry you are way out of date. He said it was “the whole Indian Ocean” and a hopeless task. Like Chevaline and every other cover up, the emphasis is always on the SIZE of the task. It provides excuse and enough delay for the story to die.
James
30 Mar, 2014 – 8:57 pm “Marlina.
I seek the truth.
I note, as I seek the truth, others divert. I don’t.
It upsets people. But “the truth” is important.”
– Oh the corny old “truth excuse” used since Neanderthals ventured out of the jungle for bombastic, arrogant, self-important, crude, aggressive, belligerent, personal, offensive, sarcastic, divisive remarks. Oh how original! Bit akin to “Patriotism being the last refuge of a scoundrel.”
Your comment at James
30 Mar, 2014 – 5:38 pm “Oh, I like to comment.
It shows how little you know about the subject matter.
I like getting rid of “you lot”.
I like exposing “lunacy” in all it’s manifestations.
It’s not exclusive to you. Your just “low hanging fruit”. It’s easy.”
Ah that says it all doesn’t it? Not here to contribute positively but to berate anyone you want to get rid of and then have the audacity to blame others for the declining interest. We’ve seen it all before on Chevaline “mucker”. At least do us a favour and come back as someone else. At least it would keep us guessing who you are for a few minutes.
Others think your technical knowledge is worth having, prepared to humour your boorishness. Unfortunately I am not one of those. My experience suggests the more you humour bullies, the worse they become. There is nothing I can remember of any value you have contributed to the Chevaline debate and nothing here either. The site would be much enhanced without you and I certainly wish that on the basis of your offensive language alone, you were blocked by the site owner.
As to your claim you are a pilot, it is either evidence of a psychotic personality or civil aircraft pilots have taken on a very unfortunate and un-typical personality type. Your demonstrated outbursts of intolerance and prejudice are more typical of a “squadie” than a pilot I would say, though I am sure no self respecting platoon would put up with you for more than a day unless you changed your manner.
Perhaps you have learned everything you know from “Flight” magazine and computer games? I don’t suppose you have strong views on TB have you?
It may be worth posting this US/Jewish viewpoint
“12/18/2013 – China, Russia, and Iran prepare for Daniel’s Prophetic War against America and NATO Europe – See more at: http://destination-yisrael.biblesearchers.com/destination-yisrael/2013/12/china-russia-and-iran-prepare-for-daniels-prophetic-war-against-america-and-nato-europe.html#sthash.UY4mJbJO.dpuf
Called the “East China Sea Air Defense Identification Zone”, China claimed that the disputed and uninhabited islands known as the Senkaku in Japan and the Diaoyu are within their realm of international control. It thereby gives them territorial dominion over these islands if they are now united under China’s military control. China also published the warning that any aircraft flying over this region could provoke “defensive emergency measures” against the aircraft that failed to identify itself. ”
We don’t need reminding that an aircraft with disabled transponder, not responding to air traffic control, would be regarded as potentially threatening. If it had continued on its original course in these circumstances it is possible it would be shot down. At the very least it would be intercepted by fighters.
So the two options of it being shot down where originally stated and apparently witnessed by some it is claimed, and then the new course invented to cover up to prevent an international incident. (There are precedents with TWA 800 and the Gulf war attack on USS Liberty – whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/ussliberty.html)
Or changing course somewhere to the west is the true story and there is an alternative explanation for what they originally thought and what the Vietnamese fishermen/oilworkers saw. (Disclaimer: I KNOW this is a over simplified version of options (James) you don’t need to tell me)
and we also have this from the US/Jewish source which applies the interpretation of ancient prophesy to current situations. It could be dismissed as “tin hat” as James so eloquently put it, but unfortunately these things are taken seriously in Jewish/Israeli circles. Why else would Israel claim a legal right to be there after a break of at least two thousand years? An ominous element of the discussion is “Rome” as an Iranian target. Also nine months is given prophetic significance (recent trial period) Is this a little insight into the intended plan, now probably de-railed by internet information dissemination? A Malaysian plane hi jacked by Iranians, modified and crashed into the Vatican????
Well after 9/11 it cannot be simply be rejected for outrageousness alone can it. Then we have documented evidence that Netanyahu wanted to bomb Iran in 2008 and was stopped by his generals and still does http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/a-wolf-in-sheeps-clothing-dont-be-fooled–iran-still-wants-nuclear-bomb-says-israeli-pm-benjamin-netanyahu-8852173.html http://972mag.com/netanyahu-lacks-the-votes-to-bomb-iran-seeks-high-level-backing/51788/)
He like Bush needs a convincing “Pearl Harbour” incident if he is to persuade public opinion and main players.
Has everyone seen this ?
“The last words from the cockpit of the missing Malaysia Airlines plane before it disappeared were actually ‘Good night, Malaysian three seven zero,’ not ‘All right, good night’ as Malaysian authorities had previously claimed.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2593483/Revealed-Last-words-doomed-MH370-Goodnight-Malaysian-three-seven-zero-NOT-Alright-goodnight.html#ixzz2xZch55GO
How utterly bizarre, ye another change !!!
“Yet, the State of Israel is not falling for this illusion that has no illumination. With all the international crises we have had in the past six months, any one of the co-signatures of the “Big-Six plus Iran” could create another one, like an internal crisis in the United States, such as the collapse of the New York Stock Exchange or in Europe. If so, Iran could be there with the flip of the nuclear button and a “nuke” will be headed to drop on her enemies. The recently accepted agreement by America and Europe, known by the Jewish sages as “Rome or Edom” have now allowed by international consent for Iran to power up its centrifuges, and the international community will then be powerless to stop “Nuclear Iran” from creating or using a nuclear bomb.
The first to invoke the promise of becoming a nuclear state will be the Saudi Arabia, whose princes have unabashedly stated that if the Nation of Iran does acquire or reach the capacity to develop a nuclear weapon, the Saudi kingdom will be right behind. To do so, all the capital of Riyadh needs to do is to invoke their agreement with the Islamabad agreement with Pakistan in 2004, when the Saudi funded Pakistan nuclear bomb program.
According to the agreement, Pakistan, when Saudi Arabia desired would release some of those nuclear warheads. All Saudi Arabia would have to do is to call for their delivery along with the appropriate missiles to carry a nuclear payload. Even this scenario carries also a prophecy from the quill pen of Zechariah the prophet titled, “The Flying Megillah Scroll.”
Ownership of Inmarsat.
CIA and Bush …….
Do we believe them?
Harbinger Group Inc. (NYSE:HRG), formerly Zapata Corporation, is a holding companybased in Rochester, New York, and originating from an oil company started by a group including the former United States presidentGeorge H. W. Bush. Various writers have alleged links between the company and the United States Central Intelligence Agency. In 2009, it was renamed the Harbinger Group Inc.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harbinger_Capital
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zapata_Corporation
Interesting connections of Bush/Zapata Group/CIA and Kennedy assassination.
And then we have the Inmarsat – Thales corporation and the Thales Satcom was in the Malaysian Boeing 777.
So then: Once again:
From all what we know now: Do we believe a f*cking sh*t of what Inmarsat is telling us ???? Do we???
Bb
NR
31 Mar, 2014 – 4:37 pm Am I reading it right? How do we reconcile following with the 2.40 being the last Malaysian military record as it went west?????
“A Boeing 777-200 aircraft left Kuala Lumpur International Airport at 0:41 a.m.(1641 GMT) March 8 and was expected to land in Beijing at 6:30 a.m.(2230 GMT) that day.
Contact with the flight was lost along with its radar signal at 2:40 a.m.(1730 GMT) March 8 when it was flying over the Ho Chi Minh air traffic control area in Vietnam.
New analysis of statellite data suggested that the missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 “ended” in the southern Indian Ocean, said Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak on Monday.”
BB.
Clearly we should believe nothing, see my post where they’ve even changed the wording of that last message.
Agreed katie.
We’ve heard more BS from MSM and officials by now than we had heard BS from Maillaud in chevaline in one complete year.
I am still puzzled about the first minutes in MSM.
US media were reporting the crash while Malaysian airlines still denied a crash and they said for several hours that MH370 did not crash. This was the first time in history of aviation that an airplane did not arrive but the airlines stated officially that their airplane “DID NOT CRASH”. Only after approx. 8 hours the airlines did confirm an accident. However, for 8 hours after the plane went missing the airlines said that they did not crash. What did they know and why did they change their story then and began deliberately searching in the wrong area? Political pressure from USA?
1) Was the plane ordered to turn back, if so who gave the order?
2) Was the plane turned back manually or by remote control?
3) If the latter, which country or countries have the technologies to execute such an operation?
4) Was MH 370 weaponised before its flight to Beijing?
5) If so, what are the likely methods for such a mission – Biological weapons, dirty bombs?
6) Was Beijing / China the target and if so why?
7) Qui Bono?
8) The time sequence of countries identifying the alleged MH 370 debris in the Indian ocean was first made by Australia followed by France, Thailand, Japan, and Britain via Immarsat. Why did US not offer any satellite intelligence till today?
9) Prior to the switch of focus to the Indian ocean, was the SAR mission in the South China seas, used as a cover for the deployment of undersea equipment to track and monitor naval capabilities of all the nations’ navies competing for ownership of disputed territorial waters? Reuters as quoted above seems to have suggested such an outcome.
10) Why was there been no focus, especially by foreign mass media, on the intelligence and surveillance capabilities of Diego Garcia, the strategic naval and air base of the US?
11) Why no questions were asked whether the flight path of MH 370 (if as alleged it crashed in the Indian Ocean), was within the geographical parameters of the Intelligence capabilities of Diego Garcia? Why were no planes deployed from Diego Garcia to intercept the “Unidentified” plane which obviously would pose a threat to the Diego Gracia military base?
12) The outdated capabilities of the Hexagon satellite system deployed by the US in the 1970s has a ground resolution of 0.6 meters; what’s more, the present and latest technologies boast the ability to identify objects much smaller in size. Why have such satellites not provided any images of the alleged debris in the Indian Ocean? Were they deliberately withheld?
13) On April 6th, 2012, the US launched a mission dubbed “NROL-25” (consisting of a spy satellite) from the Vandenberg Air Force Base in California. The NROL-25 satellite was likely rigged with “synthetic aperture radar” a system capable of observing targets around the globe in daylight and darkness, able to penetrate clouds and identify underground structures such as military bunkers. Though the true capabilities of the satellites are not publicly known due to their top-secret classification, some analysts have claimed that the technology allows the authorities to zoom in on items as small as a human fist from hundreds of miles away. How is it that no imagery of MH370 debris was forwarded to Malaysia, as this capability is not classified though other technologies might well remain classified? (Source: Slate.com)
14) Could it be that the above capabilities were not as touted?
15) However, in December, 2013, the USAtlas V rocket was launched carrying the spy satellite NROL-39 for the National Reconnaissance Office, an intelligence agency which is often overshadowed by the notorious National Security Agency (NSA), only it scoops data via spy satellites in outer space. The “NROL-39 emblem” is represented by the Octopus a versatile, adaptive, and highly intelligent creature. Emblematically, enemies of the United States can be reached no matter where they choose to hide. The emblem boldly states “Nothing is beyond our reach”.This virtually means that the tentacles of America’s World Octopus are spreading across the globe to coil around everything within their grasp, which is, well, everything (Source: Voice of Moscow). Yet, the US with such capabilities remained silent. Why?
http://rt.com/op-edge/disappearance-malaysian-airlines-flight-373/
Not my usual source for links but very close to what I would like to see answered. Alas little chance of that happening.
Good post Straw. All questions which journalists should be asking .
For me,the overriding question would be,why were no military planes scrambled immediately the plane turned & the transponder was switched off.
The truly scary thing is that there were other planes airborne in the area around that time,,could they not see MH370, because the chances of a collision must surely have been there ?
@Katie 31 Mar, 2014 – 9:16 pm: Your DM link above also contains a fuzzy graphic explaining the Emergency Locator Beacons/Transmitters on the 777.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/03/31/article-2593483-1CB69F4700000578-876_634x498.jpg
@straw44berry 31 Mar, 2014 – 10:14 pm: It’s not only that sophisticated US satellites should have detected visual evidence of the crash/debris/explosion/impact, but they (and Russia, China and others) are monitoring the electromagnetic spectrum, from low frequencies to infrared. They must have records of the SATCOM pings.
@Tim V 31 Mar, 2014 – 9:56 pm: “NR 31 Mar, 2014 – 4:37 pm Am I reading it right? How do we reconcile following with the 2.40 being the last Malaysian military record as it went west?????”
CNN just has a report of changes in the tale of the initial turn and starting point to the route south to the Indian Ocean.
Didn’t hear the details. Oh, they’re also confused. Story is that after the world’s most expert experts analyzed the Malaysian military radar it shows the plane made a left turn and not a right turn. They didn’t say if that was from the viewpoint of the Malaysian military radar or from the plane. Why does it take expert experts to distinguish left from right?
Shouldn’t radar data be a compass heading — not left or right?
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/31/mh370-pilot-last-words-malaysia-airlines-plane
So now the pilot’s last words have changed, again. Original reports were that he said, “Roger that.”
Ignore my comment re CNN comment on Malaysian military radar and left/right turns. They dropped all references to experts analyzing Malaysian radar recordings and now say info came from relatives of passengers who put together their own Power Point presentation of questions they want answered by Malaysia, which show several turns.
CNN has no idea how the relatives determined that. Not surprising the investigation is so messed up. Everyone is busy making Power Point presentations to everyone else.
It could be as simple as a needed misdirection on emerging events having greater gravitas in the covert game of 3-D Chess. David Copperfield can disappear a pachyderm with hundreds in abeyance, but the witnesses all tell of a different perception than that which has transpired before their very eyes. It used to be the case that you believed nothing of what you hear and only one-half of what you see. Manipulation of every media source has become the new Magick.
As always the Grand Masters of Illusion have us by the short hairs, and have our full attention placed exactly where they want it; on another trick we can never reconcile.
@Katie: This is related to US spying abilities way back in the mid 1980s. It’s in the news today because of a proposed swap of an Israeli spy, held by the US, for Israel’s release of several Palestinians.
“The New Yorker Magazine | January 18, 1999, pp. 26-33 | SEYMOUR M. HERSH The Case Against Johnathon Pollard”
“They often deal with signals intelligence, or SIGINT, and their world is kept in order by an in-house manual known as the RASIN an acronym for radio-signal notations. The manual, which is classified “top-secret Umbra,” fills ten volumes, is constantly updated, and lists the physical parameters of every known signal. Pollard took it all. “It’s the Bible,” one former communications-intelligence officer told me. “It tells how we collect signals anywhere in the world.” The site, frequency, and significant features of Israeli communications — those that were known and targeted by the N.S.A. — were in the RASIN; so were all the known communications links used by the Soviet Union.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/fr/576453/posts
(Original is archived in a format that doesn’t work for me.)
Not credible that 30 years later the US and other powers know nothing about the disappearance of MH370.
Another CNN discussion dwelt on how certain nations — China, India and Thailand specifically — withheld info or blurred satellite images. Initially no mention of the US (or Australia) and when one expert finally raised the question another quickly dismissed it with, “Why would we be watching an empty ocean?”
X-posted from Squonk thanks to commentator Brianfujisan….
“According to Reuters (28th March, 2014, quoted by Matthias Chang):
Ultimately, the only country with the technical resources to recover the plane – or at least its black box recorder, which could lie in water several miles deep – may be the United States. Its deep-sea vehicles ultimately hauled up the wreckage of Air France 447 after its 2009 crash into a remote region of the South Atlantic.
The US has a state of the art spy satellite system, with very precise capabilities of monitoring the earth’s surface, including moving objects. These technologies are part of the United States Space Surveillance Network. The Diego Garcia base “is one of only a handful of locations equipped with a Ground-based Electro-Optical Deep Space Surveillance system for tracking objects in deep space”. Given the levels of sophistication of these observation technologies, it is highly unlikely that the MH370 flight could have travelled unnoticed over a large span of the Indian Ocean.”
We keep coming back to this satellite discombobulation. There is just no way they don’t know what happened.
It is self-evident.
X=posted from Squonkblog thanks to commentator BrianFujisan/
http://www.globalresearch.ca/malaysian-airlines-flight-mh370-vs-the-2004-indian-ocean-tsunami-the-role-of-the-diego-garcia-military-and-intelligence-base/5376111
According to Reuters (28th March, 2014, quoted by Matthias Chang):
Ultimately, the only country with the technical resources to recover the plane – or at least its black box recorder, which could lie in water several miles deep – may be the United States. Its deep-sea vehicles ultimately hauled up the wreckage of Air France 447 after its 2009 crash into a remote region of the South Atlantic.
The US has a state of the art spy satellite system, with very precise capabilities of monitoring the earth’s surface, including moving objects. These technologies are part of the United States Space Surveillance Network. The Diego Garcia base “is one of only a handful of locations equipped with a Ground-based Electro-Optical Deep Space Surveillance system for tracking objects in deep space”. Given the levels of sophistication of these observation technologies, it is highly unlikely that the MH370 flight could have travelled unnoticed over a large span of the Indian Ocean.”
This satellite capability keeps coming up, doesn’t it?
They know. Believe me, they know.
What happened here? human error? Sorry.
Straw posted something very interesting on the 30 th. of March
Both black box pingers on US1549, the plane that successfully ditched in the Hudson river, did not activate even though they were submerged in salt water.
“I am unclear if the pingers failed in AF447, or were just not heard for some reason. The area where the boxes were located were well covered initially via acoustic search. I will have to re-read the Metron report. Considering the pinger failed in US1549, there has to be some real worry here.”
http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/535538-malaysian-airlines-mh370-contact-lost-447.html
Is this standard on all planes?: “The A320 has some unexpected amphibious capabilities, especially if you think the pilots had not pushed the Ditching button that closes all the “holes” of the airframe to enhance floating ability of the aircraft at sea…”
http://theaviationist.com/tag/us1549/
Two stories on ditchings:
http://www.airasia.com/travel3sixty/from-the-magazine/highlights/pilotsperspective/landing-on-water
http://www.askcaptainlim.com/ditching-flying-81/389-can-a-boeing-777-ditch-safely.html
Katie – Your 10:33
Considering there were lots of other flights in the air then MH 370, which would by then be supposedly over the strait of Malacca, would have been seen by other pilots as it was supposedly flying at a lower than normal altitude … yet there are no reports of bogies by other pilots. No reports from ferry/freighter captains of a low flying plane, no reports from Malaysian or Indonesian naval units at sea and …well… no reports from a single credible source in an area normally dotted by military activity.
Morning all.
NR,Ben,Donald. They can throw out as much false information & fuzzy pictures as they wish but it will be deliberately misleading to obscure the truth, this is not Chevaline it’s Benghazi,it’s the third Building on 9/11, it’s the plane into the Pentagon…… all over again.
They will never come clean & we will never know.
We need to try & find a credible motive for the murders.
My money is to foment trouble with China who has been working closely with Iran.
‘China has assisted in the development of Iran’s nuclear program via the transfer of technology and machinery.
China’s economic ties to Iran have shielded the Iranian regime from the effects of international sanctions.’
http://www.rand.org/pubs/occasional_papers/OP351.html
Whilst some helping with the rescue are being used as useful idiots, I cannot think of any other reasons for this global cooperation.What better way to start than stealing over a hundred Chinese citizens & goodness what else behind the scenes ?
Sorrensen, yes your theory is credible but improbable, it’s too simple in my view, no way would all this activity be done to purely protect the Yanks image, I’d say it’s more likely they’d want to look like heroes !
Yes they’d be hell to play if it was proved that over 200 people died to save the skin of two British royals, but they could still dress that up saying whilst trying to protect them MH370 got caught up in the mayhem & tragically crashed.