I can’t pretend not to have been disappointed by the Clackmannanshire result, especially as I am here with some wonderful people who have put months and years of their lives into campaigning heart and soul.
But the count was fascinating. Professional Conservative, Labour and Lib Dem politicians working and socialising together and dressing the same. Tory ladies in pillar box red clothes and Lib Dem councillors in Labour Party rosettes. All braying and congratulating each other in the same voices, and looking smug and very happy together.
We are not winning tonight’s battle at the moment, but the battle lines have now become clearly defined between the single establishment of the media and all the political parties, and almost half the people – so far who want an alternative political structure. This is a stage in a process, and in its clarity and scale a major advance.
Nick,
Yes,keep sending the cash to the same coked up bankers in the City -who then send it over to even more coked up bankers in Wall St,who send it to even more coked up NeoCons in WashingtonDC,who send it to even more coked up Dr.Strangeloves in the Pentagon.
Youre being shafted even more than the Scots yet you appear unable to suss that mate.
Duh.
Get over it…
“Craig the smoking gun we need to see.”
Not so much a smoking gun as a damp squid.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/scotland-independence-referendum-videos-claim-vote-definitely-fix-1466219
I was happy to believe the result was fair until I saw Les Wilson’s link at 10.53 am. Now it is in question.
I think what Just Saying said is more important than the odd incident of fraud.
‘Once again what proportion of the 90% turnout of the 793k postal votes are NO votes? To avoid allegations of postal vote fraud, of stuffing rigged postal NO votes into the count. Its unprecedented the postal vote registration and turnout – even influencing the combined turnout as the 793k postal vote registration out of 4.27m registered voters amounts to an unbelievable 18.5% of total voter registration – and in itself may be responsible for the unprecedented 93.7& overall voter registration. If the percentages are adjusted for the historical low uptake percentage levels in populous Glasgow, they must have rigged 100% postal voter registrations elsewhere to end up with the preposterous 93.7% overall voter registration!?’
and
‘Its simple, Salmond & Co have to take control of all the ballot papers, separate the unprecedented 90% turnout cast of the 793k postal votes “registered” into YES and N9 votes – the truth will be then be clear, numbers dont lie. Who knows they may even be evenly split, but the exercise MUST be carried to avoid any suspicion of duplicity bearing in mind the unprecedented 18.5% postal vote registration.’
You have let us down ye bonny Scots – “such a parcel of rogues in the nation”. You have the same choice now as Jock Hamilton did, so I am told, just a wee way down the street when he came home one night before tripping over the gutter. Stay there, as Mrs Hamilton suggested, or pick yourselves up and keep going with greater determination.
“I was happy to believe the result was fair until I saw Les Wilson’s link at 10.53 am. Now it is in question.”
So the result turns out pretty much how the opinion polls and the bookies predicted and you think it wasn’t fair? The result was almost exactly as a Yougov after polling poll predicted.
The polling station they claim was rigged was in Dundee, one of the very few with a large “Yes” majority. The local SNP observers have stated that at that point the votes hadn’t been sorted.
But the Nationalists were never going to accept democracy were they? Nationalists never were too hot on democracy.
Jives – thanks for illuminating me, I never realised I was being shafted by the bloke in the Pentagon. Time for your medicine now
@leswilson
Bonkers. These counts are all watched very closely by trained and experienced SNP activists. Fraud at this point is perhaps not impossible, but would require prestidigitation of a very high standard. You might want to ask yourself a rather obvious question: if the video is so incriminating, why wasn’t it given to the Returning Officer? Craig Murray’s blog can’t do much with it.
The sorry truth is that a majority of Scots are either foolish enough to support the Union or were intimidated into it. In 1707 they rioted in the streets at the proposition and the Treaty documents were ritually burned at the Midsteeple in Dumfries. Our level of political understanding seems to have declined over the centuries.
Under the USSR dissenters were branded as mentally ill
To the 55%
England will captain and steer the ship. Your frightened passified little soul has the freedom to crew under English protection. Sell them your flag as a teacloth to amuse them. They will pat your head for voting to be a servant. You cannot put Scottish as your nationality or fly your flag among the nations. A tyrants knave, a base slaves soul.
You will never know the elation, freedom and pride of being fully responsible for your own destiny or even what it might have been. You had no right to deny this to those real Scots who would gladly give their lives for it.
You spoke but as a North British Unionist visitor you had no right to make such a decision for your hosts. You are not now welcome.
Have the decency to go South and live among your kind and let the Scots experience the full flowering of nationhood. They are proud of trying to be fully free and can raise their heads. You should wear a badge “I voted no” or are you already ashamed uncle toms with your heads down? It is not over
John Goss: I was happy to believe the result was fair until I saw Les Wilson’s link at 10.53 am. Now it is in question.
So, the way they rigged this election was to have a guy sitting in the counting room with a big yellow flourescent jacket filling in the ballots there and then?
Seriously? Do you actually think that guy is rigging the ballots?
An odd incident of fraud is being used to divert attention from massive fraud. Look into what Just Saying said.
John Goss,
Like Craig, I attended a count last night – Perth. It was a first time going to a poll count for me. The processes and procedures involved in the count were thorough and observers from both camps watched all parts of the count from just a few feet away. I did see a few no votes go into the yes pile, but the counter quickly corrected the error.
If all the counts followed the same routines that I saw then nobody can have any doubts on the validity of the vote.
Love and kisses
David
“The polling station they claim was rigged was in Dundee, one of the very few with a large “Yes” majority. The local SNP observers have stated that at that point the votes hadn’t been sorted.”
There is more than one polling station. The International Business Times you linked to would have somebody saying they were just waiting to be counted on the NO table. Whether it is true or not all instances of potential fraud should be investigated especially the postal votes which are nearly always a source of fraud. Other potential ballot-box switches are helicopters. And why did they print more ballot papers? The woman counting votes and switching piles is clearly cheating it would appear. I am not convinced that everything was above board!
“All braying and congratulating each other in the same voices”
It’s called a Scottish accent but I can understand how they might all sound the same to your carpetbagging English ears.
words are stones
Gonna go smell some roses while I still can. D:
Les Wilson
Thanks for posting… that answers my own question. Yes, I was totally foolish to contemplate the possibility of a YES win. Vote rigging would be the only watertight means and would also explain why yesterdays optimism and expectation contradict with the result.
” I am not convinced that everything was above board!”
No, I never thought you would be.
84.5% turnout!
No matter which side you supported in the referendum, this is a huge positive to take away from all this. It is a level of mass political awareness and engagement that has never before been seen in Britain.
The clearly understood battle-lines Craig speaks of are not confined to Scotland. Hopefully it won’t be lost on activists across the UK that now is the perfect time for all parties opposed to neoliberalism and neoconservatism to bury their petty differences and form a single UK-wide electoral coalition. Seize the day, people! Give us somebody we can support in the 2015 general election without wasting our votes!
“No I never thought you would be.”
Yes but I thought you and the other interlopers on the blog would defend to your last breath Her Majesty’s government position however corrupt had been its means of seizing power. Don’t expect for a minute you would call for an investigation into what appears to be rigging.
SNP undercover agents have done their job for the establishment. Robin Cook gave set the alert flag and took the fall-out.
The can of worms survives and you peeps can connect back into the matrix. The weakness has been plugged…
Les Wilson, that video is stunning, what is that woman doing switching the bundles, and who is that guy sitting at one of the counts, filling in ballot papers himself.
They asked for Plan B, they’ll see it soon.
“the horrifying event of an EU referendum”
So, DomesticExtremist, only the right kind of referndums should be allowed to take place?
“Yes but I thought you and the other interlopers on the blog would defend to your last breath Her Majesty’s government position however corrupt had been its means of seizing power. Don’t expect for a minute you would call for an investigation into what appears to be rigging.”
There was no rigging. You were always going to claim there was. Most people accept that people have a right to have an opinion different to theirs, most people accept that democracy is the fairest way to choose.
Other people think they are the only people entitled to an opinion, it’s been predicted all along that those people would not accept democracy, your response was expected.
“the horrifying event of an EU referendum”
So, DomesticExtremist, only the right kind of referendums should be allowed to take place?
Fred, you’ve predictably gone into total denial when the evidence is right before your face.
“Les Wilson, that video is stunning, what is that woman doing switching the bundles, and who is that guy sitting at one of the counts, filling in ballot papers himself.”
So why not take your video to the electoral commission and ask them?
Have you seen the map of how each region voted? It’s red. So a little old lady and a man in a dayglo jacket fixed all that did they?
The majority of people in Scotland want to be British as well as Scottish, that isn’t so hard to believe is it?
@ all readers:
I am obliged to note the reappeaarance of “Sofia” on this thread – at 10h56 this morning…..
….and the disappearance of that indefatigable commenter “Republicofscotland”, from whom total silence.
🙂
“Fred, you’ve predictably gone into total denial when the evidence is right before your face.”
The video showed me a ballot paper with a cross in “Yes” on a table marked “No” and told me it was proof of ballot rigging.
The SNP observers who were there say the papers hadn’t even been sorted at that point.
What the other people in the video were doing I haven’t a clue and neither have you. You have no evidence, all you have is a disregard for democracy.
Mr Goss
“Fred, you’ve predictably gone into total denial when the evidence is right before your face.”
__________________
Yup, we’re all blind and only old John can see through the veil of conspiracy.
Like with the Rothschilds, the Biilderbergers, 9/11, the London bombings, the Boston marathon bombing, Gunner Lee Rigby, etc, etc, etc….
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Is it possible that this man is walking our streets? Scary !