Labour voters are switching straight to Tory as second preference and Tory straight to Labour in Scottish local government by-elections held under the STV system. These are not opinion polls, they are real elections.
I was shown results and transfer sheets yesterday in the margin of the SNP vetting assessment of potential candidates which I was attending. Unfortunately I did not have a chance to copy down the figures, but the pattern was clear.
For those unfamiliar with single transferable vote, you mark the ballot paper 1,2,3 in the order you prefer the candidates. What is now becoming clear is that Labour voters tend to put the Tories at 2, and Tories put Labour as 2. I have been arguing for years that there are no significant policy differences between Labour and Tory – it is a fake choice. I will never forget at the count in Clackmannan the Labour and Tory councillors and their wives all celebrating together, all looking well-heeled and arrogant and entitled, impossible to tell apart.
That the few remaining Labour voters put the Tories as second preference, instead of the Greens, SNP or Liberal Democrat, shows that the core Labour support base is largely Blairite. Which explains why the ultra-Blairite Jim Murphy, scion of the far right Henry Jackson Society, is set to become Labour Party leader in Scotland. It is also interesting that Tory voters are happy to give second preferences to Labour, recognising that Ed Balls, Yvette Cooper, Tess Jowell and Harriet Harman – every one a millionaire – are doughty protectors of the rich and the established order.
I haven’t been able to find a website that records local byelection results including the transfers – some results are listed on politicalbetting.com but only give the final result after all transfers. If anyone can find the data online I would be grateful. I should love to see an analysis from James Kelly on this one.
Upon reflection Kempe I wish I had said “funniest” rather than “most stupid”. As in “That’s the funniest combination of words”.
Iain
Why thank you for your words of support. Not sure how I feel about the company I keep in your words though. Have I become the Hab of the left sector? I feel I am actually forwarding arguments rahter than just sniping at others.
RE: working from the inside of rancid institutions. How’s that worked out this past century or so for the well meaning anti-war, anti-poverty, minority in the Labour and Liberal parties? Really, how is that approach doing? The answer is so obvious I am amazed I have to keep asking the question.
Anytway I need to take my banging hangover to work now.
Change “minority” to “people” in the above comment. There’s also the issue that people are corrupted within these institutions which my comment sort of brushes over. Anyway the outcome is the same whtever the motivations are.
A national scandal especially in view of the hypocrisy we were hearing last month.
It is shameful and a national disgrace: Hundreds of Welsh veterans sleeping rough on the streets
http://members5.boardhost.com/medialens/thread/1417989165.html
This associate of Pamela Geller has been allowed into the UK by May for a speaking tour organized by the Zionist Federation. Some venues have cancelled. Kedar is infamous for some outrageously racist statements about Arabic people.
http://www.islamophobiawatch.co.uk/zionist-federation-cancels-mordechai-kedar-lectures-but-only-at-schools/
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/blogs/politics/15674-zionist-federation-speaker-immigration-will-be-death-of-europe
UK December 2014
Hunger in the UK
4 million people at risk of going hungry
272 food banks across big cities and towns
500,000 children live in families that can’t afford to feed them
3.5 million adults cannot afford to eat properly
Source: All-Party Parliamentary Inquiry into Hunger in the UK, Poverty and Social Exclusion project
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-30346060
The BBC’s sympathies are clear at any rate. R4 news bulletins yesterday covered Salmond’s intention to stand for Gordon. A brief third-hand report on Salmond’s intentions was appended to Malcolm Bruce in person explaining why this was a Bad Thing, around midday. Subsequent reports similarly failed to give Salmond an airing, but were accompanied by the hopeless Liberal candidette, Christine Jardine, getting a free party-political in person.
The web report allows Salmond more room to explain his position, but not without the obligatory bile from the commentator and the other parties; the comments seem to have been written by Cameron. Here –
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-30364575
But this is not all. Same timeline – check the tendentious headline:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-30368620
And not reported by the BBC at all:
http://news.sky.com/story/1387365/alex-salmond-will-donate-pay-if-elected-as-mp
So, here we go again.
It’s Monday. Here’s a morale-booster for ya –
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30342948
Yeah, right.
Meanwhile….
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/dec/07/champagne-house-of-lords-reform-taxpayer
*snuffle, slurp*
left Habby, I like that very much, and so fitting, going for the lowest most safest denominator would also fit that description.
Two Habbies walk into a Kneipe, Bartender says ‘hallo, there’s the door’
Re: Ba’al post on the marked difference of coverage by the BBC when it comes to the SNP and Alex Salmond in particular, that is going to get worse as they will find and use every speck of past dirt and rumour in order to ‘galvanise us against such lot, they will use their publicly funded primaeval mouth organ to slag them off something rotten and then turn around saying ‘ what’s the problem?, we covered the SNP/Greens/Independents’
That is what the MI lovey’s do best, lick backsides and keep on the right side of the establishment, cover up past crimes against children and bamboozle us with trivia when the news gets too close to exposing establishment paedfo’s, the only way into our pockets and minds.
Their misuse of ‘save the childrens’ funds for investment purposes is just one example, what of the millions they are making with phone in programs and sordid mass dancing events, its ridiculous, if they had to pay for the phone calls the phone lines would have been shut down after 100 calls.
The BBC has forgotten how to do it different, it has got to this point because they are dependent on a franchise from party political puppets, not a public vote of confidence.
And who would ever give the BBC a feedback or complain? those who care, are maligned, not the Archers fanatics and humditweedledum Antiques Road show watchers, the vast majority just takes them as a given, something they have no say in and in anyway ‘what would my one voice achieve?….
So we all carry on carrying on.
Lovely weather, I think I shall go for a walk today, blow away a weeks worth of snotty cold.
Yup.
You’ve got to accentuate the negative
eliminate the positive
Latch on to the perjorative
But don’t mess with mister inbetween.
(Sam Cooke, for Bing Crosby, edited by the BBC’s Deputy Supreme Undermanager (Class IV) for Political Product Placement)
Old Mark
“I’ve certainly enjoyed observing Crawford’s sleight of hand when it comes to Russian economic history….or in other words that the growth occurred entirely under the alleged numbskull, Putin.”
_______________________
I don’t think you’ve read his piece carefully enough, OldMark and there is no sleight of hand involved.
The piece (it is actually the words of Radoslaw Sikorski, Marshall of the Sejm) does NOT distinguish between the Yeltsin and the Putin years – in fact, at one point he says “in the decade from 2002-2012, Russia’s economy grew on average by 5% per year”.
The point of the piece – based on the Serbian example – is to prognosticate the economic “opportunity loss” likely to occur as result of Russia’s foreign policy adventurism and the Western reaction thereto.
As far as the Serbian example is concerned : Charles talks about Milosevic and Milosevicism”; it is no argument, therefore, to say that the man himself “was President for just 3 of the 17 years in question”.
Iain Orr
Thank you for your words, which were unexpected and accordingly all the more welcome.
““David Cameron had to use the profits from prostitution to get our GDP up to the level of a leading economic nation.”
No he had to do it to comply with EU accounting rules.”
___________________
Kempe is of course right.
National GDP is a measure used by the EU for a number of purposes – eg, it is one of the elements used to calculate Member States’ annual contributions to the EU budget, it is one of the elements (broken down to a lower level) used to calculate EU payments out of the Structural Funds, etc…
Now, GDP represents the total value of good and services produced and it has been deemed logical, therefore, that all Memeber States include in their calculations the (estimated) value of ALL goods and services, including those arising out of the so-called “black” or “unofficial” economy (and this therefore includes vectors such as drugs and prostitution). One may deplore the existence of those vectors, but the point is that they exist and that they generate money in the form of goods (eg counterfeits, drugs) and services (cash-in-hand economic activity, prostitution).
Hope that helps you, Phil.
@Phil
Alec Salmond said during the referendum that the subject of the Scottish HoS was ‘a matter for after we get Independence’. Do not confuse short term electoral calculus and not wishing to scare more horses than absolutely necessary with some deeply held principle. The SNP is the least monarchist major party in these islands, after Sinn Fein. They just don’t wear their hearts on their sleeves on this issues because the matter is not a devolved issue.
As for the SNP being a nationalist party, well knock me down with a feather. Labour, Tory and FibDems are British Nationalist parties. There were nationalists galore on both sides in the referendum, the argument was over which nation state should hold sway here. Just because the three British Nationalist parties do not have the N-word in their titles doesn’t stop them being Nationalist in outlook and action. Your analysis is that of a simpleton.
As patronising as ever.
~~~
Iain Orr That’s you tainted. 😉
Iain Orr; “I’d like to defend Phil and Habbabkuk against all-comers”
A very back-handed insult to Phil !
Iain Orr; “both ask pointed questions”
For two very different reasons.
Iain Orr; “which deserve responses”
Like everybody, they reap what they sow.
Perhaps firstly you should try engaging in a rational debate with those that you would seek to defend, as direct empirical awareness may cause you to reconsider your rashness.
Macky
“Iain Orr; “which deserve responses”
Like everybody, they reap what they sow.”
____________________
As a statement relevant to life in general there is something in what you say, Macky.
The only problem is that the “harvest” – in terms of reasoned responses to my points – is meagre. This may be because my points are, on the whole, unanswerable and it is therefore more convenient either not to attempt a reply at all or simply to chant “troll! troll! troll!”.
But that’s OK as well. 🙂
From Mary
“Iain Orr That’s you tainted”
________________
I sense that Mary is preparing to cast Iain Orr into the Outer Darkness for the crimes of lèse-majesté and insufficient respect for the Message.
The example of Dreoilin refers.
‘The point of the piece – based on the Serbian example – is to prognosticate the economic “opportunity loss” likely to occur as result of Russia’s foreign policy adventurism and the Western reaction thereto.’
I’d agree with that Habby- it’s prognostication filtered via a prism of neocon wishful thinking.
The comparison with Serbia’s shattered economy has no relevance unless NATO bombs large parts of Russian infrastructure to kingdom come- Crawford, Sikorski and you seemed to have overlooked that. Or, are all of you suggesting a NATO bombing campaign against Russia in imitation of Blair and Clinton’s glorious Balkan intervention back in 1999 ?
@ Nevermind-
The BBC has forgotten how to do it different, it has got to this point because they are dependent on a franchise from party political puppets, not a public vote of confidence.
Monbiot’s on the case….
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/dec/08/taming-corporate-power-key-political-issue-alternative
All this week.
Still trying your hardest to cause trouble and play people off against each other, habby.
BTW. you forgot to tranfer the wink after you latest mauling of Mary, her comment that was meant as a friendly gesture and your editing makes it look like your malingering again.
As a right ol dame/damsel in distress, have you tried panto?
Corporate power has shut down our imagination, persuading us that there is no alternative to market fundamentalism, and that “market” is a reasonable description of a state-endorsed corporate oligarchy.
As above, with references, and plenty more food for thought-
http://www.monbiot.com/2014/12/08/there-is-an-alternative/
Thanks for that, Ba’al, he’s on track of the ones who pull the strings alright, maybe he will get to the BBC puppets by the end of the week.
Iain Orr,
Do you really admire Phil and Habbabkuk because they ‘both argue aggressively and employ ad hominem arguments’?
Shurely shome mishtake?
“Habbabkuk:
I sense that Mary is preparing to cast Iain Orr into the Outer Darkness for the crimes of lèse-majesté and insufficient respect for the Message.”
Craig talking about Inclosures in Scotland and Cameron talking about prostitution’s contribution to our GDP remind me of William Blake ‘s witness at the start of the UK Industrial Revolution.
As I understand it, in Blake’s artistic vision, in Ancient of Days, the reward for doing this, cold, calculated colonialism:
http://projectionsystems.wordpress.com/2009/09/24/ancient-of-days/
( First, Blake is not depicting God. This is Urizen, a character Blake invented as part of his complex mythology. Urizen is a mythical being of reason and logic, enemy of spirits of love and denier of passion. Not exactly God, but the embodiment of a “scientific” paradigm, dispassionate and precise.)
was this:
http://b01.deliver.odai.yale.edu/70/64/70644481-833f-4f5c-aaa7-dd4364d74f0f/ba-obj-2352-0001-pub-large.jpg
In questioning UK FCO complicity and use of torture Craig engaged his heart and disengaged his clinical, logical, colonial brain.
The blog is infested with shills and trolls for the Urizen, FCO, neo-colonial vision. Welcome to outer darkness all of them.
George Monbiot and Russell Brand on TTIP.
Who does Cameron work for?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh0InepmCwQ
Tell Cameron about Urizen and straightaway he’s going to reply:
” That’s what I keep telling everyone about the Eurozone.”
For those of us with a keen eye on both Scottish Politics and Scottish Football, the parallels between Labour/Tory and Celtic/Rangers are uncanny.
A large swathe of their “support” spend time bad-mouthing the opposition, but in reality they exist in an unhealthy symbiotic relationship.
It in no way surprises me that the Unionist wagons are being circled, and that the SNP as the Injuns will face Labour cowboys only too happy to use Tory guns.
Down in a deep, dark ditch, sat an old cow chewing a bean-stalk.
Out of the deep dark ditch – answer came there none.
2 hours of silence from Habby while consults the Tel-Aviv Troll hotline.