The Sunday Times has a story claiming that Snowden’s revelations have caused danger to MI6 and disrupted their operations. Here are five reasons it is a lie.
1) The alleged Downing Street source is quoted directly in italics. Yet the schoolboy mistake is made of confusing officers and agents. MI6 is staffed by officers. Their informants are agents. In real life, James Bond would not be a secret agent. He would be an MI6 officer. Those whose knowledge comes from fiction frequently confuse the two. Nobody really working with the intelligence services would do so, as the Sunday Times source does. The story is a lie.
2) The argument that MI6 officers are at danger of being killed by the Russians or Chinese is a nonsense. No MI6 officer has been killed by the Russians or Chinese for 50 years. The worst that could happen is they would be sent home. Agents’ – generally local people, as opposed to MI6 officers – identities would not be revealed in the Snowden documents. Rule No.1 in both the CIA and MI6 is that agents’ identities are never, ever written down, neither their names nor a description that would allow them to be identified. I once got very, very severely carpeted for adding an agents’ name to my copy of an intelligence report in handwriting, suggesting he was a useless gossip and MI6 should not be wasting their money on bribing him. And that was in post communist Poland, not a high risk situation.
3) MI6 officers work under diplomatic cover 99% of the time. Their alias is as members of the British Embassy, or other diplomatic status mission. A portion are declared to the host country. The truth is that Embassies of different powers very quickly identify who are the spies in other missions. MI6 have huge dossiers on the members of the Russian security services – I have seen and handled them. The Russians have the same. In past mass expulsions, the British government has expelled 20 or 30 spies from the Russian Embassy in London. The Russians retaliated by expelling the same number of British diplomats from Moscow, all of whom were not spies! As a third of our “diplomats” in Russia are spies, this was not coincidence. This was deliberate to send the message that they knew precisely who the spies were, and they did not fear them.
4) This anti Snowden non-story – even the Sunday Times admits there is no evidence anybody has been harmed – is timed precisely to coincide with the government’s new Snooper’s Charter act, enabling the security services to access all our internet activity. Remember that GCHQ already has an archive of 800,000 perfectly innocent British people engaged in sex chats online.
5) The paper publishing the story is owned by Rupert Murdoch. It is sourced to the people who brought you the dossier on Iraqi Weapons of Mass Destruction, every single “fact” in which proved to be a fabrication. Why would you believe the liars now?
There you have five reasons the story is a lie.
Hi Brabantian. Have you considered the possibility that habbakluck is working for the CIA? or was it the ICA, international compliance organisation? or the IAC, the interactive corp.
Watch out Brabs, Habby is trying to make new friends and sign you up to his Morris Dancing group, the ‘big fat lying Molly’s’
NeverHadAMind
Well, why not? If Snowden’s really a CIA asset then why not Julian Assange? Why not you, for that matter?*
_______________________
* on second thoughts, delete that – you’re too stupid.
snowden = psyop
Iain, I would be pleased to meet up. My problem is I will be coming down by an organised coach, so not sure when it will arrive or when it will depart back yet. 🙂
Anyone want to borrow my vuvuzela?
Suhayl Saadi@5:53pm
Mike Lesser has done a brill job and put it all together in 2009. New articles appear every month.
All the old IT papers going back to the 1960`s are archived and can accessed.
That pub looks great but Nunhead is possibly a bit of a trek (but it would mean we could arrange a rendezvous underneath the Scottish martyrs monument which would seem appropriate. :))
The 20th may be a bit hectic but if others from out of town want to meet I will try to make it.
Bloody hell. Mr Goss. We meet at last. Nevermind, will you be persuaded to join us? Clark? Lysias? Habbakuk? Baal? Macky?
Come on, it will be hilarious. I’m buying the first round.
@Mary
15 Jun, 2015 – 4:27 pm
Thanks for the link to the Counterpunch article. It’s a good piece but makes the mistake of referring to Mari Yamaguchi’s Associated Press article this weekend, in which Yamaguchi asserts that the spent fuel pools at Fukushima units 1, 2, 3 and 4 are still intact. That’s not the case. SFPs 3 and 4 certainly went sky high in the early days of the disaster (and we’ve all been breathing it in for the last four years). One can only speculate about SFPs 1 and 2.
This is on-topic, because our glorious spooks undoubtedly know about all this; just like they know about child sex abuse within the British establishment, and they know about the fact that the banks have become, to all intents and purposes, criminal cabals, etc, etc.
In any sane/normal society at least half of the British government and half of the people in the security services would be doing time.
Macky
“I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt when they are being vindictivly targetted by HMG”
Jesus, your boyfriend held at an airport for a few hours? You would kind of think the US government could do a little more than that if Greenwald really is the person he claims to be. That was nothing. There is no hounding.
Exactly the opposite. Greenwald is employed, presumably very handsomely, by a billionaire who funds US imperialism. He writes bestsellers. He gets movie deals. He trots around the globe lecturing his shite to great applause. He gets awards. He is making a fortune.
The idea he is being vindictively targeted is pure nonsense. That’s the PR talking.
Macky
“Have I previously seen you mock “911 Truthers” ?”
Well, I regret that.
Sorry, my list of names is too limited. Come on down everyone. Technicolour, where are you in the country? Mary, how you feeling? Anyone else down South I’ve forgotten?
@Phil, so if Greenwald is a CIA phony, would that mean that Wikileakes/Assange are very stupid dupes, or are they CIA fronts too ?! How about our man Craig, a very keen supporter of Assange, dupe or on the CIA pay roll ? What about all the loyal supporters & friends of Craig here, all clueless dupes ?
If Greenwald is working for the CIA, he might as well be working for the Russians or Chinese, for all the embarrassment & problems he causes for TPTB & their media propogandists !
Oh, yes, Assange & Wikileaks clearly in the pay of the people they expose.
Current:
https://wikileaks.org/index.en.html
Previously:
US embassy cable recommends drawing up list of countries for ‘retaliation’ over opposition to genetic modification:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/jan/03/wikileaks-us-eu-gm-crops
More:
U.S. PRESSURED GERMANY NOT TO PROSECUTE CIA OFFICERS FOR TORTURE AND RENDITION
and all the others
http://www.salon.com/2010/12/24/wikileaks_23/
Phil, sorry, out of the country (sorry on 2 counts, as wanted v much to march)
@Republicofscotland 4:25pm
“At the time Samantha Cameron worked in a designer bag shop,to cut a long story short Gareth Williams was found in a designer bag that was originally from the shop she worked in.”
http://internationaltimes.it/the-one-rule-is-never-to-fall-in-love/
“Come on, it will be hilarious. I’m buying the first round.”
What have you done now Phil?, you’ll have to hire an empty pub to boot. Thing is, I’d have to come by bus and leave by train, late…
Can we not meet somewhere central with flair, what was that pub we once met in Phil, thats in easy reach and central, and easy to find. What say?
How far is the nunhead pub by tube? I suppose we all can go there together if we manage to meet up before the demo. As long as I get my last train to Norwich, I’ll be fine.
@ Mary, sorry, but the offer of a round will mean that you’ll have to rough it with Habby and those, too many, from over the Atlantic…;)
and Phil will have to work overtime to pay for it.
RE: the anti-austerity demo next Saturday, it looks like it’s going to be a big one, and it’ll be fascinating to see how the authorities react to it.
For anyone interested, here’s Chris Hedges speaking about demos, 3 years ago, before the Occupy movement was completely crushed by the authorities…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SoXWuQPrrI
It may have been mentioned elsewhere, but I suspect the UK’s ‘youngest suicide bomber’ story is also designed to act as PR for the Snooper’s Charter. NB the lad’s link with Dewsbury, a handy wee reminder of 7/7 there — just in case we’ve forgotten why we need to spy on everyone all the time.
Pay three quid and vote for Jeremy Corbin:
http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-05-18/pay-3-to-register-and-get-labour-leadership-vote/
The Miami Showband killings.
The band was travelling home to Dublin late at night after a performance. Their minibus was stopped at what appeared to be a military checkpoint, where gunmen in British Army uniforms ordered them to line up by the roadside.
At least four of the gunmen were serving soldiers from the British Army’s Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR) but, unbeknownst to the band, all were members of the UVF (Ulster Volunteer Force).
While two of the gunmen (both British soldiers) were hiding a time bomb on the minibus, it exploded prematurely and killed them. It has been suggested that the plan had been for it to explode en-route and kill the band who would then be branded IRA bomb smugglers.
The other gunmen then opened fire on the dazed band members, killing three and wounding two.
Two serving British soldiers and one former British soldier were found guilty of the murders and received life sentences; they were released in 1998.
Allegations of collusion between British military intelligence and the loyalist militants persist.
According to former Secret Intelligence Service (SIS) agent Captain Fred Holroyd, the killings were organised by British Army Captain Robert Nairac (a member of 14th Intelligence Company), in collaboration with the UVF’s Mid-Ulster Brigade and its commander Robin ‘the Jackal’ Jackson.
Absolutely, Doug (8:35pm today). If any has any doubt about what the security forces/spooks are capable of on the domestic front, the key is to look at what happened in northern Ireland. Wrt Northern Ireland, even today, only the tip of the iceberg has come out.
Dave, at 7:17pm, today – thanks, I’ll look them up. That’s amazing!
I’m imidway cooking curry and dal for eighteen people so this will be rushed.
I didn’t mean to, I don’t think I did, say Greenwald is CIA. That’s not how it works.
The billionaire financier of US imperialism, along with Hollywood, the mass media etc are rewarding Greenwald. Greenwald is a right wing libertarian. Take a look at his politics before he became the Salon/Guardian ‘leftie’. Take a look at what he writes ever. He has little substantiual political analysis. It’s all no context hand wringing. Which of course involves being seen to being antagonistic towards power. However, he only goes so far. Not even that far once you remove the ‘revelations’. Most of which were well known if not in the detail. This is classic corporate stae gatekeeping.
I mean, you have noticed the snowden affair is having zero effect on curbing the surveillance state. He only bangs on about the NSA. The dozens of other agencies and hundreds of police forces are getting more surveillance gear without mention. Theirs is a narrow focus on one agnecy. Even the NSA carries on unabated. Except the corporations will now get to store the data for them but that means little effectively. Except it’s paid for by internet users rather than tax payers.
Of course I think Assange is a different kettle of fish. He’s pretty much what he says I imagine. Why he flirts with Greenwald I can only imagine. But it’s not too diffifcult to imagine. For a start he is fighting for his life and can only fight so much. His life depends on the Wikileaks brand which is raised by association with Snowden.. He is pragmatic politically. He can only fight so many fronts. Even by your argument Assange is having to bite a bullet anyways, what with Omidyar blocking wikileaks payments. He’s already playing a complex game whichever way you look at it. But even not knowing why is no argument against all the weight of other eveidence against Greenwald. Hey perhaps Assange is just wrong. I try not to delegate my judgement to others anyway. There could be many reasons why. Also this relationship is at best arms length. It could change tomorrow.
Now. Assange and Manning are two perfect examples of how the US comes down on this stuff. They have really damaged the US and pay the price. In stark contrast to Greenwald (and Snowden who is living comfortably with his girlfriend). Hell even Sowdens rehabiliation has started with serious US pliticians applauding him.
And of course, you may have noticed the surveillance grows unabated.
Nevermind
Nunhead is an overground train, it’s too far for the 20th. We’ll sort something out more central. Iain’s suggestion of St Thomas’ is fine. Unless we actually name a pub so people aren’t hangging around at a hospital
I thought British involvement with both sides of the troubles was beyond much doubt. Yes they enabled the Unionists but they also infiltrated the IRA. Playing both sides. Which is how empire works isn’t it?
Phil, would have liked to have seen you, as this has been going through my mind since your last posts:
“I’m a better anarchist than you”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSnZtYDZ-B8
The George Inn, an old coaching inn just a short distance down Borough high street from London Bridge station, used to be a brilliant pub, and it’s not far from the start of the demo north of the river in the City. The George Inn is quite cramped, but it sits in a large square where there used to be tables and chairs.
If I sound like an ex-pat Londoner, that’s because I am.
I won’t dare ask how much a pint of beer now costs in London. The last pint I had in London was more than 12 years ago now, in the Clockhouse on Peckham Rye, an establishment that I’m sure Iain Orr will be familiar with.
“The George Inn, an old coaching inn just a short distance down Borough high street from London Bridge station, used to be a brilliant pub”
Been owned by the National Trust for many years so hardly the place for pocket revolutionaries to plot the downfall of the capitalist system!
“Pay three quid and vote for Jeremy Corbin:”
One slight problem for nearly everyone here you have to support the Labour Party. Though of course Mr Goss can advise you all about infiltration from his old weasel days.
@Phil
15 Jun, 2015 – 9:02 pm
Just across the road from the Houses of Parliament, and by the old Westminster tube station, used to be the St Stevens Tavern. When I was a young man I worked behind the bar there for a while. Back in the day I used to pull pints for some of the big names in British politics and the media.
Forgive the nostalgia. I believe the St Stevens Tavern was demolished when they revamped the tube station and built the extension to the Houses of Parliament.
Is the Red Lion on Whitehall still there? It was a block too far for the pissheads in Parliament, but you could still bump into interesting people there.
Ah Resident Dissident, you’re in London then are you – why not join us.