This is essentially a free speech forum. I enjoy much of the banter which goes on between commenters, particularly the dedicated band of people who post on a daily basis. There is an important distinction between my writing, and the comments section. The proportion of readers who leave comments is well under 1%. I cannot know what percentage of the readers read comments, but I suspect it is not terribly high.
In social media I find establishment hacks – particularly journalists and Labour Party functionaries – dismiss my thoughts by referring to the comments section. “Craig Murray – have you seen the tinfoil hats comments on his blog!” being a genuine and very typical example. Well, if people wish to damn me by association with the views of other people, that is sadly an example of the low intellectual standards of the British nomenklatura of our time. The only views on here which are mine are those which I write.
I cherish the diversity of the comment threads and am fond of our little community, most of whom I have never met. I do not value people by the standard of how close their views are to my own. I am sometimes saddened by the personal animosities which arise between people.
We state some rules from time to time. This is the current set, which I just made up:
No racism. Any comment which is racist will simple be deleted immediately. The biggest problem we face is anti-Jewish comment, which I will not tolerate. We are not in the business of stigmatising anti-Zionism as anti-Jewish, but there are quite frequently distinctly anti-Jewish comments. I deleted one just an hour ago.
Similarly, no holocaust denial. I do not believe it should be illegal (I am against thought crime) but I do not wish to have it on my blog as those associated with it often have very unpleasant sympathies. That is not to say the subject of the holocaust can never be mentioned – it will never be possible to ascertain the precise number who were killed, and it is important we remember not only the Jews but the Poles, gypsies, gays, freemasons and numerous others who suffered. But the basic facts are not in doubt. It is surprising how often people attempt to insinuate holocaust denial.
Sockpuppetry. It is in practice impossible to outlaw sockpuppetry without a formal registration system, which I do not want. But the adoption of multiple identities within the same thread is not to be allowed, nor the creation of identities of which the purpose is to ridicule, attack or insult another contributor.
Fair Play. Play the ball, not the man. Address arguments, not people. Do not impugn the motives of others, including me. No taunting.
Relevance
Attempts to keep people on topic are hopeless, but do try.
9/11
We don’t discuss 9/11. There are plenty of places on the web where you can do that. It tends to take over threads.
Contribute
Contributions which are primarily just a link to somewhere else will be deleted. You can post links, but give us the benefit of your thoughts upon them.
No explanation.
Enforcing these rules is necessarily arbitrary and needs judgement calls. Moderators are precluded from explaining decisions online. If you want to complain use the contact button.
Moderators
We have, and have had, excellent moderators over many years. But almost all have found it not only time consuming but also surprisingly emotionally draining. If you are interested in volunteering and are willing for me to know both your real and online identity, please get in tough using the contact button.
Anon, erm, you appear to be confusing me with professor Finkelstein.
There are a few commentators here whose main aim is to knock spots of others and generally disrupt or hijack the discussion. Now even though its fairly easy to scroll by them unfortunately you can not stop them misinterpreting and generally dissing your comments. It appears as if these people suffer from some form of intellectual inferiority complex and don’t have lives like the rest of us. Its a great pity since the phenomenon gets worse and worse all the time and the question is will this blog reach an intolerability tipping point at which point normal people with lives will no longer wish come here anymore, which would be a great pity.
Engaging the Havasack is to lose the discussion. He’s made it clear he is here not to provide context, rather discord. He is unabashed about this philosophy. Look up Hasbara and tactics. There is no air between Hasbara and Habab.
Habbabkuk
I am happy to disagree on this one, but any suggestions how to combat anti-Semitism on the blog are always welcome. I feel it is important for there to be somewhere that those pent-up feelings of hate can find their expression, if only to be slapped down shortly afterwards. See it as one of those boxing academies where angry and frustrated youths go to punch a bag all day long. It keeps them off the streets.
Anon, when can I expect an apology?
@Ishmael
17 Jun, 2015 – 9:31 pm
It wasn’t my title. It was the title of the videos I linked to.
It will be interesting to see how Mhairi shapes up over the next five years.
If you look carefully, Danny boy, you’ll see exactly who Craig has sussed out.
It is the people whose peculiar thoughts and posts impelled him to write as follows:
“The biggest problem we face is anti-Jewish comment, which I will not tolerate. We are not in the business of stigmatising anti-Zionism as anti-Jewish, but there are quite frequently distinctly anti-Jewish comments. I deleted one just an hour ago.”
and
“..no holocaust denial. I do not believe it should be illegal (I am against thought crime) but I do not wish to have it on my blog as those associated with it often have very unpleasant sympathies.”
and (in reply to you):
“The clear point is that objecting to somebody’s politics is fine, objecting to their ethnicity is not. It is a very simple distinction which both you and Monteverdi (assuming you are two people) seem to wish to obfuscate. If you are an anti-Jewish racist you are not welcome on this blog.”
and, again to you (begging the question of whether you are malevolent or just stupid):
“If your intention was to say that you oppose Zionists, including Jews who are Zionists, but you have nothing against jewish people who are not Zionists, then you were very far indeed from getting that across.”
So, Daniel – who’s been sussed out?
Nothing I have written above has broken the rules as stipulated by Craig. See if you can work out why.
“any suggestions how to combat anti-Semitism on the blog are always welcome”
I think your addressing the wrong person for those ideas. Israel’s state actions being the main impetus behind the ‘modern’ perverted reaction against ‘the Jewish’ that some will undoubtedly subscribe to ‘it’.
Rob, I meant no personal implication, it was just a random thought on the tittle of the vid.
“It will be interesting to see how Mhairi shapes up over the next five years”
Each to their own I guess. I don’t consider it significant, maybe interesting that Scots don’t feel like chomping her head off with a Claymore or something.
And sucking younger people into the system. legitimizing it. Not really no.
Suggestion: the said so-called Semites could stop making Israel an apartheid and influencing Western politicians to incite war in Muslim countries.
Quote from Torah in the Qur’an ” In ‘udtum ‘udna ” if you come back, ( to good ) We will come back. So far no sign of that.
Tell you what, I does upset me to see the The Holocaust Industry played out, thriving, on this blog.
“Conservative Friends of Greece, er, is there one?”
I’m not sure there’s even a Conservative Friends of Britain.
Nice idea, eh.
I’ll be sure to highlight the event should I come across one.
I believe it was Baldrick’s famous ww1 poem
Boom, boom , boom , ….boomm….. boom. boom. boom,,, boommmmmmmm
“Aside from the point you are obviously trying to make about Jews being deceitful and willing to sink to any depths to further their own interests (classic anti-Semitism), paradoxically you also appear to believe that 6 million was not enough.”
Well Anon, what do you call the unbridled expansionism over how ever many acres of land, olive trees,bodies and gas wells? this will take, an unbridled ‘Vorwarts’ by the right wing settlers who dance on Bibi’s nose. into lands that are not their. He has only got a small majority and by god he will works to change that equation, by any means.
I do not accept a state of Israel anymore, it is a rogue border less state, a figment of the UN’s drunken mind, in constant expansion creating chaos, aan Apartheid state operated by Zionists who puit people into closed camps such as Ghaza, holding 1.6 milion people in abject poverty.
A country that wants to be a beacon by imprisoning children, all of it with impunity, excuses.
It raises hell on the high seas, just as Blackbeard did, killing pirates who ignore any rules, to provide a comparison from history.
Because it acts like a global terror organisation at every level of societies deemed important to its own aims and objectives.
Has Isis a friendly accord with Israel?
Not that Gordon Corera would want to comment…
Lastly, it does not do what it once pronounced on the tin of ‘best Balfour fish’
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surstr%C3%B6mming
I would support any Jewish uprising that reinstates Judaism at its heart, that calls Zionism for what it is, a nasty aberration of history which is copying some of histories worst examples. Why should Palestinians not want to live in peace?, how dare they are called terrorist, children grandparents working families, anyone. They want to live in cooperation with others who live in Palestine.
Anon1 you are an apologist for an unjust situation, a rogue states dastard behaviour, and whatever label you may want to put on me for saying so, feel free.
You once again have introduced numbers into the debate in order to goad others, but you reject the figures of children killed indiscriminately, in schools when they were changing between kids, everywhere, hundreds of them. They are targeted with ultra modern weapons a slow genocide whilst the world watches.
be off with you Anon
@Craig, in principle the guidelines are fine, but I fear in practise this means the recurring double standard treatment of racism, in that racism directed towards Muslims will be overlooked, but even the mere allegation of anti-antisemitism in a comment can result in deletions of whole threads (!), I’m thinking of the time you deleted two whole Threads, with a combine total of over a thousand comments, and without even the courtesy of checking the validity of the allegation !! As you must be aware most times such accusations of anti-semitism are deliberately twisted misrepresentations, as smearing is a favourite Hasbara tactic. So two negatives counts just here, one for double standards & second no respect for the commentators whose posts you needlessly wiped.
For the negative count hat-trick, how does the wanton mass deletion of comments square with your acclaim belief in Free Speech ? Moreover, how can you claim you believe in Free Speech, say you are against thought crime, yet hypocritically refuse to allow it on your own blog ? Upto now your loyal friends were citing legal considerations for this hypocrisy, but you have now just confirmed that this is not the reason, but rather, it’s because of your “intellectual contempt” deriving from what you learnt in Poland, & your “experience of holocaust revisionists and their motives”. Well it’s a very strange way of intellectually proving your convictions, not by logical argument & rational reasoning, but by banning outright all other povs !
You have pointedly not responded to questions as to why you give primacy to just one specific genocide, nor why you adopt the Zionist tactic of conflating criticism of the support that Israel receives from the majority of those who call themselves Jews, with racism ? If an overwhelming majority of people who call themselves Jews DO support the appalling conduct of Israel, why is pointing this out considered anti-Semitic ? Yes, it is of a course a generalisation, but according to polls, a fairly accurate one; contrast this to how ALL Muslims ARE generalised in West, as being likely supporters of the tiny minuscule minority of Muslim extremists, even in the MSM, yet this is not jumped on as racism, especially not here on your Blog !
Like I said Habb it would be preposterous of Craig to make you a moderator,you’d cull more posters,than Bloody Mary did Protestants.
RoS; for once I agree with you. Habba’s contributions on this thread show him in his true colours- a frustrated commissar cross dressing as a concerned liberal.
If I were you, Craig, I would close the comments and concentrate on your own writing.
Macky,
It’s my view that devoting pages and pages to the subject of holocaust revisionism/denialism is about as useful, productively enlightening and intellectually stimulating as banging on endlessly about 9-11 conspiracy theories. I sense that Craig feels the same.
Given the reality of the Nazi, Armenian, Iraqi, Cambodian holocausts and others, Craig probably feels (rightly in my view) that those who question their validity can only be motivated by ideology and/or racism/antisemitism. In all my 52 years, I have not yet met a holocaust revisionist/denialist who has not been a antisemite or racist.
In my view, these reasons alone justify any rationale Craig might have for censoring such posts. Remember, any editorial decisions to censor what Craig regards as inappropriate posts here is not the same thing as his condoning censorship more widely elsewhere. It’s simply the case that it’s his blog and therefore he is entitled to make the rules as he sees fit – that surely, is his prerogative.
Where I agree with you is in respect to his lack of clarity in terms of his apparent selectivity which on the surface does seem odd to me. I’m only surmising here, but perhaps he regards the Nazi Holocaust as being particularly pernicious because of its particularly systematic and industrialized nature and extent compared to other holocausts.
This kind of thing can be very personal for people for a variety of reasons and I don’t feel its appropriate to pin him down on this anymore than is necessary. He clearly has his reasons and I for one respect him for that.
@OldMark
18 Jun, 2015 – 12:18 am
The likes of Habba work for Military-Whatever (‘military intelligence’ being an oxymoron).
These people are total vermin, as I’m sure many regular readers will be aware when the likes of Habba give occasional glimpses into their true character.
This is the British state in the 21st century, and it’s truly terrifying.
I can only say that we’re watching Habba & Co, and they’re all going to be put on trial.
“If I were you, Craig, I would close the comments and concentrate on your own writing.”
Very, very good suggestion.
The best submitted, so far.
Mr Murray, like thousands of bloggers over the internet doesn’t really want ‘real’ comments for that introduces the prospect of chaos and dissent.
Mr Murray wants order, in the form of a nice collection of cooing, adoring sycophants that agree with his every word…..and that’s terribly, ever-so-nicey-nicey…..
But there’s a problem….such sites wither and die.
I have seen this many times over…websites, following the introduction of ‘political correctness’ that have transitioned, like a highland burn, from healthy pools fed by fresh tumbling waters, to un-nourished foetid, rank, stagnant ponds, where no sane man would wish to tarry for any length of time.
Craig actually welcomes opposing views to his.
Quite frankly Craig has become the gatekeeper in the same vein as Tony Blair and David Cameron. Refusal to allow pertinent facts to be mentioned in relation to the now “banned topics” is simply abhorrent. Has Craig been warned to stop these comments thereby dirsupting the dissemination of truth?
The simple facts are, truth does not require legislation!
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize”
Well done Craig, whether you sold out or pussied out is irrelevant, the end result is the same….
I for one will no longer be commenting or infact even reading your blog any further and I guess I will have to find 9 copies of a different book to buy for family and friends this coming Christmas.
Truth hurts
I don’t agree with all Craig’s PoV’s
But he had the Balls to go ahead with the Elite.
And i watched, And Filmed Craig Getting Tore into the Establishment, and the Royals, About 8 months ago
Are they getting to him you wonder, i think not
Truth Hurts,
The notion that Craig is a gate keeper for the powerful is absurd as any cursory glance at his blog will attest. You simply object to his rules.
Excellent assumption Daniel but entirely incorrect. The gatekeeper reference was in relation to what topics may or may not be discussed……
Back to the drawing board mate.
It’s his blog. He makes the rules. If you don’t like them, set up a blog of your own.
I do have a blog of my own Daniel, I’m just not crass enough to advertise it here. Nice of you to pick up your ball and go home though.
Brian – Getting tore into the establishment and royals but never mentioning the J word is the greatest omission anyone can make in that arena. By doing so intentionally and now banning certain topics concerning said J’s utterly destroys any credibility Craig once had.
I know a lot of people who read here are going to assign him to the dustbin of history now as a coward and complicit fool.
I wish you all well in your new utopian tomorrowland (although I don’t see it working out as you all had hoped).
N.B I will not be responding to further comments or visiting this blog again, permanently.
““If I were you, Craig, I would close the comments and concentrate on your own writing.”
Very, very good suggestion.
The best submitted, so far.”
_____________________
It is an excellent suggestion.
I made it quite a while before Technicolour, in the following terms:
“..close off this thread for comments forthwith (you have given people ample time to react)”
(part of my post at 20h48 on 17 June)
“Truth hurts” (or whatever your real online name is):
“Refusal to allow pertinent facts to be mentioned in relation to the now “banned topics” is simply abhorrent. Has Craig been warned to stop these comments thereby dirsupting the dissemination of truth?”
____________________
Which must mean that for you, anti-Jew talk and Holocaust denial are “the dissemination of truth” – and therefore, “truth”?
I suggest you keep your cuntish little opinions (for want of a better word) to your own blog.
@Daniel,
So double standards, hypocrisy & intelluctual cowardice doesn’t bother you ?
You are wrong to write “devoting pages and pages to the subject of holocaust revisionism/denialism”, as in the two deleted threads in question, it was only in ONE thread that the issue of the accuracy of the official figures in light of current historical research become a a side issue of a side issue of a side issue, raised by only one regular commentator, but seized on by the usual trolls to try and disrupt the thread. The fact is in both these threads a lot of posters have spent considerable time & effort developing arguments, providing important & interesting information & links, which had nothing to do with the Holocaust; in fact the uncomfortable fact is that in both these threads, not only were the trolls being trounced, but so was Craig’s anti-Russian stance, which I suspect was the real reason why the threads were pulled, the holocaust reason was used as just a pretext, this is yet another aspect of Craig’s “intellectual contempt”! Similarly, have you never noticed that when a thread is not going his way, he suddenly puts up a hastily put together new Post ?
Yes although the Nazi Holocaust was industrialized, in ratio terms that doesn’t make it the most lethally efficient, as in percentage terms more Armenians living in Turkey were killed than Jews living in Europe.
I see, from reading back, that some of what I post bothers one or two here.
Time for one of these.
Daily atrocities committed by the Zionists against the unter untermenschen, the imprisoned and occupied Palestinians.
Zionism in practice
Israel’s Daily Toll on Palestinian Life, Limb, Liberty and Property
Compiled by Leslie Bravery, Palestine Human Rights Campaign, Auckland, New Zealand. If you have trouble reading this newsletter, it can also be viewed at: http://www.palestine.org.nz
13 June 2015 [Main source of statistics: Palestinian Monitoring Group (PMG). http://www.nad-plo.org/dailyreports.php%5D NB: We shall always do our utmost to verify the accuracy of all items in these IOP newsletters/reports wherever possible – but please forgive us for any errors or omissions (not of our own making) that may occur! L & M.
Villager shot dead and another injured as Israeli Army storms West Bank village
Israeli Navy opens fire on Palestinian fishing boats off 2 Gaza locations
Israeli Army opens fire on farmland in 2 Gaza refugee camps in Khan Yunis district
Israeli Army shoots and wounds person trying to flee Gaza blockade
Occupation settlers stone villager’s home – Israeli Army complicity
Israeli Army bulldozes West Bank village crops and blocks access to farm
Night peace disruption and/or home invasions in refugee camp and 7 towns and villages
7 attacks (6 Israeli ceasefire violations)
12 raids including home invasions – 1 dead – 3 injured
7 acts of agricultural/economic sabotage
7 taken prisoner – 11 detained – *101 restrictions of movement
and on, and on, and on.
~~
I am sure that before the day is out, I will find a pithy piece on NHS privatisation and dismantling.
Palestine is the crux of humanity. The NHS, as it exists, is too valuable for ALL of us to lose.