I did not believe the official story of Hasna Ait Buolacehn the moment I saw it. The official line was that she was a suicide bomber who blew herself up when the police stormed the apartment in St Denis where the alleged terrorist ringleader was hiding out. But that story seemed to me completely incompatible with the recordings on which she could plainly be heard screaming “He is not my boyfriend! He is not my boyfriend” immediately before the explosion. She sounded like a terrified woman trying to disassociate herself from the alleged terrorist. It was a strange battle cry for someone who believed themselves on the verge of paradise.
Then yesterday the truth emerged from forensics that she was indeed not a suicide bomber. None of the mainstream media appeared to find this in any way troubling. And just in case anybody did, the BBC (and I assume all the French and major international media) then immediately did an interview with an anonymous member of the French Police attacking squad, who stated that Hasna was:
“trying to say she was not linked to the terrorists, that she had nothing to do with them and wanted to surrender”.
But he said that due to prior intelligence, “we knew that she was trying to manipulate us”.
Unfortunately this would have been a very great deal more convincing had it been stated 48 hours earlier, rather than only after the original reports that she was a suicide bomber had been corrected on forensic examination. As it is, it looks very much like a post facto justification, a new story to cover the new facts.
Besides, it is very difficult indeed to see what prior intelligence could explain if someone was genuinely trying to surrender or not. There appears to be no information available to the public that gives the slightest indication that Hasna was an extreme Islamist; what public information there is paints the opposite picture. The best the media have been able to dredge up are quotes from friends saying “if she was, then she must have been drugged or brainwashed”. Google it yourself.
But even were she an extreme Islamist, that does not mean she was not attempting to surrender. All of which is a bit nugatory if she were then killed by an explosion triggered by the terrorists themselves. But the changing story about Hasna makes me less than confident that is what actually happened.
I have no difficulty with the principle that the police should shoot people who are shooting at them. I outraged many friends on the left for example by not joining in the criticism of the police for killing Mr Duggan. People who choose to carry guns in my view run a legitimate risk of being shot by the police, it is as simple as that. Jean Charles De Menezes was a totally different case and his murder by police completely unjustifiable. In Paris it appears plain that the police were in a situation of confrontation with armed suspects.
There are severe intelligence disadvantages to killing people with profound knowledge of terrorist organisations. It also cheats the justice system. Nevertheless I can conceive of situations where simply taking out by an explosion a terrorist cell might be justified. But only if you are quite certain of the situation. The case of Hasna is to me troublingly reminiscent of the case of Jean Charles De Menezes, in that it became obvious in the days after his death that everything the police and establishment had leaked to the media about him (leaping over barriers, running through the tunnels, heavy jacket, wires protruding) was a complete, utter and quite deliberate lie.
The media could help if they were in any way rational and dispassionate, or ever questioned an official narrative. It is an urgent and irrepressible question as to why the BBC journalist did not ask the French policeman “and why did you not say this 48 hours ago when you were content to allow the story to run that she was a suicide bomber?”
Similar media manipulation is at use here by the Guardian in telling us the police stormed a “terrorist apartment”. What is a “terrorist apartment”? Are the walls made of semtex? The intent of course is to assure us everybody inside was a terrorist. It is not just the Guardian. The phrase is all over the media. Again, google it.
I am worried in case Hollande’s Rambo impersonation is steamrollering justice. It may well be that Hasna was a dreadful and bloodthirsty terrorist. I do not know. It may well be she was killed by the terrorists not the police. All we know at the moment is she was in an apartment with people who allegedly were terrorists, and died in the “battle”. But I do not trust the changing stories of the authorities.
@RobG
“Do you vermin really think that you can get away with this..?!
The ‘person of interest’ will be brought to trial.”
“For war crimes, amongst other things.”
Can I suggest you go and discuss this with your fellow tricoteuses at your local café.
Not that anyone will ever accuse RobG of being a person of interest.
I wonder if RobG might want to make his list public.
@Tony_0pmoc
Yes, the practice drill, held before the attacks, on the same day, is important. I should have mentioned that in my earlier post (6.13pm). A multi-site attack exercise, no less. Then “oh look – it’s actually happening for real”. Ditto in London on 7/7.
You say “It is entirely possible that another Team Came in – who Actually Did shoot and Kill People”.
Well one witness saw four guys with AK-47s come in, although the official story seems to have settled on three.
Who was the English bloke in the foyer? Was he hurt?
BTW the scumbag “truthers” are already up and active, of the kind who say no massacre happened, and who cause people to associate doubt of the official lies with belief in bullshit. I saw one video where some arsehole was saying nobody was hurt at the Bataclan and that the prolonged flying about of stuff in all directions after an explosion, as shown in security footage, was a giveaway, and wouldn’t really happen, because gravity pulls downwards only, etc. – what an idiot.
The French state is not short of committing acts terrorism In New Zealand. Rainbow Warrior comes to mind. Blowing up and sinking the ship with the loss of life,and they still have not officially apologised for this terrorist act. New Zealand caught two of the French agents and they were sentenced to ten years but only did two France threatened an economic embargo of New Zealand’s exports to the EU if the pair were not released.
The UK has the chair of the UN Security Council at the present in the form of Justine Greening DFiD.
‘Greening was the first development minister to chair the UN Security Council on Tuesday, Nov. 17, 2015 at United Nations headquarters
Even if members of the Islamic state, also called Isis or Daesh, are razed from the region, long-term security in the form of a functioning civil society remains a distant, likely generational goal. Yet that heady task is being taken on by Britain, which is using its month-long presidency of the United Nations Security Council to highlight the tether between development and conflict prevention.
On Monday and Tuesday last week, Britain’s Justine Greening chaired two Security Council debates, one on Syria, one on the root causes of conflict. The sessions marked the first time a minister for development had led the UN’s august 15-member body, usually the preserve of the Foreign Office or the ambassadorial class.
Greening’s pitch was simple: “Investment in prosperity and stability overseas is critical if we don’t want global problems to end up on our own doorsteps.” In short, a lack of development provides fertile ground for extremism, terrorism, organised crime and war, as well as driving the increasingly international problem of migrants and refugees.’
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/11/20/justine-greening-un-security-council-_n_8607472.html
So who will pay to return this once beautiful country back from the present rubble in the event of peace breaking out. It will not be the UK or any other of the Western criminal states who have caused its destruction.
~~
Elsewhere you learn that Ms Greening fell for the charms of the sex pest/bully/blackmailer Mark Clarke one time rabble rouser for the partei and now excommunicated.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/politics/6753437/Tories-rocked-by-bullying-and-suicide-scandal.html
India Brummitt is an aide to Claire Perry, Rail Minister and before appointed by Cameron to prevent child sexualisation.
Resident Dissident, people in the West have had enough of the neo-con vermin, and their trolls in the media.
FEAR. FEAR. FEAR. WAR. WAR. WAR.
Do you think we’re fecking stupid..?
What’s been going on in Belgium today is yet again comic book stuff (and the total chaos that is the Belgian government should be brought down as a result of it).
In my little corner of France no one is buying into the official narrative.
If you believe that you can lead the masses into yet another corporate war you’ve got another think coming.
(and for all the psychos at GCHQ staring at flickering computer screens, we’re coming for you)
“In my little corner of France no one is buying into the official narrative.”
That will be the little corner you occupy which the French ignore then.
http://bgr.com/2015/11/20/husband-response-isis-antoine-leiris/
If the Belgian Federal Government collapses who will that affect? Not the Belgians – more elected politicians per head than any other country and even spare governments should you need one.
And I’m a bit pissed off with the time it’s taking you to get here. I’ll have changed sides by the time you make it. Fardoust knew my father…
Oh, for feck’s sake, Resident Dissident, is that the best you can do.
I repeat, you lot are all going to be put on trial, and as with most psychos you are unable to understand the dynamics.
You-lot-are-guilty-of-crimes-against-humanity.
That’s a fact, although I’m sure you’ll tell us about how butchering huge numbers of civilians is quite sane.
eh. suggest nickname for halcyon alcyone if he would not object….King Tut Tut. ( assuming amenhotep has no objection.)
The more one reads, the more surreal it all seems.
PM ‘Wants Syrian Airstrikes Within Two Weeks’
David Cameron’s new push for support from MPs comes as the Chancellor unveils plans to buy 138 stealth fighter jets for £12bn.
http://news.sky.com/story/1591964/pm-wants-syrian-airstrikes-within-two-weeks
We were led to believe that there was no money left in the jar on the mantelshelf.
Spot on Craig. Most of the newspapers ran with this ‘party girl bomber’ line without pausing to reflect on how nonsensical this was for a devout Wahhabi, or whatever brand of medievalist fervour she was meant to have been consumed by.
What’s worrying in France is the state of emergency. Three months can become three years and then three decades. Just ask an Egyptian what that feels like.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Vlad doubles his firepower in Syria. He knows fine well what the next play is meant to be.
Krishnamurti doesn’t have your back, fakir.
Your Radiation This Week No 31
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/11/21/your-radiation-this-week-no-31/
I know exactly why I am on the trolls’ shit list – my posts on Israel’s atrpcities and my support for the Palestinians as has just been demonstrated. Bit of a slip up there. Desist and return to your village, you nitwit.
Here is the latest entry from the PMG for you and your associates to digest. The list is longer than usual.
IOP headlines for 17 November 2015:
Israeli Army opens fire on Palestinian vehicle – kills occupant
Israeli air strikes hit Gaza City and Gaza refugee camp
Palestinian Resistance hits back at Israeli forces
Israeli Navy opens fire on Palestinian fishing boats
Israeli Army position opens fire on Gaza farms
1 wounded in Israeli Army attack on Central Gaza
Israeli soldiers terrorise 3 boys aged 6, 9 and 11
Israeli soldiers twice raid and demand obedience in Palestinian girls’ school
Night peace disruption and/or home invasions in 3 refugee camps and 20 towns and villages
3 air strikes
7 attacks (6 Israeli ceasefire violations + 1 Palestinian)
39 raids including home invasions
1 beaten – 1 dead – 9 injured
4 abducted (aged 16 to 17)
4 acts of agricultural/economic sabotage
24 taken prisoner – 24 detained – 112 restrictions of movement
Read more for the detail.
http://palestine.org.nz/phrc/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2971&Itemid=44
PS My dog loves bones. Big ones. Here she is. Her name is Tiddles.
https://sparrowchat.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Tiddles-300×225.jpg
And you are yourself being obtuse about why Craig runs this blog
@RobG – “In my little corner of France no one is buying into the official narrative.”
I’d be interested to hear more about what people are saying in France.
In the Arab world, many take the view that those who are fighting in various countries under the Daesh banner are basically gangster mercenaries who are paid to attack and undermine almost everyone apart from themselves, except Israel.
what’s missing in the following headlines?
BBC: Molenbeek: life in the “jihadi capital of Europe”
Guardian: Is Molenbeek Europe’s jihadi central?
New York Times: Molenbeek, Belgium’s ‘Jihad Central’
funny how the media has almost entirely ignored the irony:
Bad Neighbors: Jihadists, NATO and EU Headquarters All Coexist in Brussels
The overcrowded borough of Molenbeek in Brussels is a safe haven for radical Islamists: it is here where jihadists acquire weapons, find logistical support and networks to carry out terrorists attacks in Europe, the mayor of Molenbeek said, according to Reuters…
The absurdity of the situation is that Molenbeek is in a short driving distance from the headquarters of NATO and the European Commission. In other words, there is a breeding ground for Islamic extremism and the main offices of both NATO and the EU coexisting in Brussels, literally at the heart of Europe…
Muslim youth become radicalized and then go to Syria to fight, and when they come back to Europe they find support in Molenbeek…
http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151118/1030331697/brussels-molenbeek-terrorists-eu-nato.html
Village du jour; Why go searching for comments in places out of your element to seemingly smarm me? I can provide you with sufficient fodder for your brackish peat-bog fungi. All you need do is ask young’n. More than happy to pin your elfish ears back.
“Hasna” – personal friend, was she ? She was hanging around with genuine killers and at the very least was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
It’s ill-making to see Murray desperately trying to change the subject from the murders in Paris to some shoot to kill cobblers.
Resident Conformant: “We should not forget that you have recently expressed your support for Stalinist purges on the previous thread.”
Damned straight – and don’t you forget it. 😉
EdL; A bit harsh on the lass aren’t ye? Look at the discourse on this blog. Some even seem to be peacekeepers trying to cobble some positive outcome from the diatribes Legion. Hasna may have been a naive peacekeeper seeking to promulgate the even-handed notions displayed in the Quran. You seem to have an inside track on her motivations. You must be omniscient.
What happened to Peacekeeper? Squonk? John? Jon? Clark et al?
Wasn’t it Justine Green who was late for a vote, because she was entertaining a live troughing pig. At least in the Scottish Parliament they are late because they have been eating the pies.
Video: France arming jihadists in Syria since 2011
http://off-guardian.org/2015/11/21/video-france-arming-jihadists-in-syria-since-2011/
France arming Jihadists…
Is this global Rope-A-Dope triangulation or just business as usual?
Sounds a lot like T-Dog and D-dog……https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Marathon_bombing#Identification_of_suspects:_Dzhokhar_and_Tamerlan_Tsarnaev
“Russia is focused on destroying the terrorists’ economic base, having targeted 15 oil storage and refinery facilities as well as 525 oil trucks, according to Shoigu.
“We stopped supplies of 60,000 tons of oil per day to the black market and terrorists are losing $1.5 million daily,” Shoigu said.”
This seems smart and decisive of Vlad.
The skill is in avoiding violence when you really want to hit him..and you have told him before..a few weeks before…
So I went out for a smoke to calm down..and I come back and he is still stroking my wife as if she is his pussy cat…
I thought well what should I do..hit him really hard or treat him like a pussy cat and stroke his back…
I stroked his back – came over Really Gay..
And so all the Really Big blokes danced together at the front – and our friend turned up first time..and thought and She said..is This a Gay Pub?
We were all Dancing to the Band
If you are so lucky in life – it only comes from really hard work – and finding yourself in a real community – a village.
Like where we live.
All the politics all the religion counts for nothing – compared to the love and support of your family and friends.
And you can’t get that from moving around all the time in your life…
It takes 5,10,15,20 years plus to make good friends and live in a community – a village..as if you have always lived here…like part of the furniture.
Its called Home.
Tony
Looks like the financial community doesn’t like Corbyn. Editorial very hostile to him in this weekend’s Financial Times.