I have a meeting today in London with the Ambassadors of Venezuela, Bolivia, Cuba, Nicaragua and Ecuador to brief them on Scotland’s continuing struggle for Independence. These nations have been at the forefront of the international movement against colonialism, and know all about the sharp end of neo-Imperialism and the evil-doing of the CIA and other western security agencies.
The test of the Independence of a state is nothing to do with domestic or regional government, or even with bilateral arrangements with the state from which it secedes. The test of Independence is, purely and simply, whether or not you are recognised by other states as independent. That is the very clear cut position in international law. For this reason, it is essential that Scotland reaches out, not just within the EU but to the entire international community. Ultimately we need these people to vote and lobby for us in the United Nations and other international institutions.
Frankly, the SNP is rubbish at this. I am doing this meeting because the hierarchy of the SNP spurned the approach from the Ambassadors, as previously detailed on this blog. This reluctance seems part of the hierarchy’s effort to be NATO friendly and thus CIA friendly. The Ambassadors would far rather be meeting with an official SNP representative than a nobody like me. Unfortunately the SNP won’t do it. That is a disgrace.
I can increasingly foresee, as Westminster governments move ever further to the right and encroach more and more on civil liberties, a situation arising where Scotland wishes to claim its independence without the consent of Westminster. In that situation, we will need all the international support we can get, just as the Palestinians have been making headway in UN institutions. Work needs to be put now into laying the foundations for that support. Personally I would characterise Scottish Independence as an anti-colonial struggle; use of Scots as British cannon fodder and integration of the Scots elite into the Metropolitan elite does not make Scotland any less a colony. Rome had san African Emperor, but still her African possessions were colonies.
But even for those who do not accept that analysis, there is no doubt that Scottish Independence would have a highly beneficial impact on the global balance of power. The weakening of the USA’s most powerful sidekick; the lessening of the UK’s ability to participate in illegal neo-imperial invasions and to host weapons of mass destruction; the re-opening of the question of the undemocratic Security Council structure at the UN.
Then there is also the positive role Scotland can play as a major contributor to UN Peacekeeping Forces, and a voice for sanity, reason, human rights and the pre-eminence of international law. An independent Scotland as a state party will be able to request the International Criminal Court to lay war crime charges against Blair and Straw for the illegal invasion of Iraq, which would be a powerful deterrent to future aggressive war.
I am but one man and a private individual. Everything I can do, I shall.
“Craig,I am still baffled why you are not supporting Brexit ?-in the case of Brexit you would get your new referendum which may free the Scots from servitude.”
Then how could he say that Scotland opposed Brexit? When in his mind he and his fellow obsessives are Scotland and the majority who voted against independence aren’t?
“Hmm – there speaks a democrat? Let’s not bother ourselves with the untidy “democracy” thing. Let’s just decide on behalf of the plebs, because we “right-thinkers” are MUCH better qualified to make these “difficult” decisions!”
__________________
Alex.
You probably think the Scottish referendum was fair and proper, the process yes, the staggering onesided propaganda scaremongering machine frightening the living daylights out of the likes of pensioners however wasn’t.
That’s your democracy in action, so you can climb down from your high horse on democracy.
_________________
“And of course, just months prior to UDI in these countries, they had held a referendum on the issue, which showed only 45% of the population had voted for independence?”
__________________
Alex.
If you could be so kind as to provide links to the claims that all the countries that have declared (UDI) had referendums that resulted in 45% for.
Thank you.
Or is that an attempt at sarcasm? Very poor.
___________________
“ROS displays a breathtaking arrogance in his casual disregard for democracy. Not in my name, my friend!”
_________________
Alex says “breathtaking arrogance, you mean like the Treasury which was meant to be neutral in the Scottish referendum taking the side of the Tory government.
Or the threats that Scotland would be attacked from outerspace if it left the union, one politco who claimed our mobile roaming charges would go through the roof price wise, on the same day the charges were reduced.
More “breathtaking arrogance” saw the claim pensions wouldn’t be paid even though people had paid into them for years, the threat to remove BBC programmes was thrown (oh how I wish they would)
More “breathtaking arrogance” saw David Cameron scurry around Europe pleading with ministers of EU nations to talk down Scottish independence.
David Cameron even roped a surprised Barack Obama into saying Scotland must stay. Yet he praised Ireland as a flourishing independent country a few weeks earlier.
In my opinion the Crone Report and the stolen 6000 miles of seas around Scotland’s coast, and the refusal to stop polluting Scottish lochs, (the MoD’s actions supercedes SEPA’s) with nuclear subs is enough in itself to declare UDI.
Breathtaking arrogance, indeed.
Back to you Alex.
“You probably think the Scottish referendum was fair and proper,”
It was.
The notion of Scotland as a victim if English colonialism is simply silly.
The Scotch joined England when their own efforts at colonialism ended in ignominious failure. As a result they profited mightily from trade with the British colonies, particularly in tobacco, slaves and sugar, while imposing on the English their God-awful Steward monarchs.
This one’s for Alex, who’s mighty concerned about democracy.
Better Together Campaign Chief: We Would Have Struggled To Win Without ‘Scaremongering.
He said the campaign’s research showed negative tactics worked, despite newspaper columnists consistently calling for a change in strategy.
As yes great British democracy in action, a victory built on scaremongering and lies.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/sirajdatoo/better-together-campaign-chief-we-would-have-struggled-to-wi#.ldA2P891O
Harry Law why bring back dead cats and slap them on the table? there is Independence and EU membership without a UK.
I would expect many companies to relocate to Scotland for better and faster access to EU markets, once Engeland has left and is busy protecting its borders.
“As yes great British democracy in action, a victory built on scaremongering and lies.”
Like when they said the price of oil might drop through the floor, scaremongering while the SNP told the truth that it would bring in £7.5 billion a year in revenue.
The only Stuart monarch who reigned after the Union of 1706-7 was Queen Anne, for the last 7 years of her reign. After that, it was the Hanoverians who reigned, and one of the prime reasons England wanted to unite with Scotland was that England wanted Scotland, which had expressed doubt on the matter, to accept the Hanoverian succession.
” After that, it was the Hanoverians who reigned, and one of the prime reasons England wanted to unite with Scotland was that England wanted Scotland, which had expressed doubt on the matter, to accept the Hanoverian succession.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/empire_seapower/acts_of_union_01.shtml
The only Stuart monarch who reigned after the Union of 1706-7
Right, but all of them from James VI of Scotland reigned over the United Kingdom following the Union of England and Scotland Act 1603.
I say this as a rabid supporter of Scottish Independence, but a unilateral declaration without Westminster consent would be utter madness.
The best and probably only means remains convincing our countrymen in a plebiscite. Which may come again sooner than people think if Scotland is dragged from the EU without her consent or vice versa and England is forced remain despite voting to leave.
In defence of the SNP, it’s hard to argue that the softly softly approach hasn’t reaped dividends so far, even if it failed in the ultimate goal.
Then CE I presume you and your like minds will be voting for Brexit.
Independence in Europe.
Lol.
CE “but a unilateral declaration without Westminster consent would be utter madness”. Worse madness would be UDI without the consent of the people of Scotland. In my opinion such a fundamental constitutional change should only be undertaken/contemplated with the express wish of the people of Scotland through a referendum.
Anti-colonial struggle.
Sorry to say, Craig, but sometimes you are so full of shit.
“I have a meeting today in London with the Ambassadors of Venezuela, Bolivia, Cuba, Nicaragua and Ecuador to brief them on Scotland’s continuing struggle for Independence. These nations have been at the forefront of the international movement against colonialism,”
_________________
Not sure what this is supposed to mean given that they are fully in control of screwing up their own countries, but certainly they are at the forefront of clamping down on opposition groups and press freedom. One can see the attraction for the Scotch nats.
“Like when they said the price of oil might drop through the floor, scaremongering while the SNP told the truth that it would bring in £7.5 billion a year in revenue.”
________________
I’m glad you mentiined that Fred, the collapse in the price of oil is manufactured. One reason for the low price is to damage Russia’s economy, the second is due to shale oil production from the US, coming into a market where Saudi Arabia is determined to keep production at a maximum.
Both reason are not the fault of the Scottish government whose forecasts would’ve seemed reasonable, if the USA and Saudi Arabia hadn’t flooded the market.
But Westminster’s US buddy, is determined to weaken the Russian economy and compete with Saudi’s in the oil market, at home.
So you see Fred, the oil price collapse wasn’t a fluke or chance it was man made.
Tell me Fred why hasn’t the Britnats at Westminster, (who constantly proclaimed from the finials of St Stephens tower) that pooling and sharing and the broadshoulder of the UK will save us, stepped in and saved the loss of 65,000 oil jobs and counting?
Finally as you well know Fred, oil would’ve/will been a bonus to Scotland however small the revenue from it. As it stands the revenue goes into the Treasury coffers not Holyroods.
“Sorry to say, Craig, but sometimes you are so full of shit.”
says who? many here know when they see a bumbling fascist, you have merely defecated on yourself here.
@Geoffrey
I don’t wish to get bogged down in any brexit discussion as Craig has made his thoughts clear on that matter, all I’ll say is that like Craig I’m confident Scotland will be a member of the EU for the foreseeable future, come what may. And I will be voting to Remain, of course.
@Harry
Apologies, I thought that was implicit in my comment. I was of course referring to a UDI without a plebiscite to back it up. Likewise a UDI would be entirely justified in the face of Westminster refusing to recognise the will of the Scottish people expressed at the ballot box.
“Not sure what this is supposed to mean given that they are fully in control of screwing up their own countries, but certainly they are at the forefront of clamping down on opposition groups and press freedom. One can see the attraction for the Scotch nats.”
_________________
Anon1.
Really, I’d imagine those countries, were as you say “screwed up” a long time ago by the US, and are trying to find their feet again.
Mind you I don’t think their is a Central or South American country that hasn’t been damaged in someway or another by the number one warmongering nation on the planet the USA.
Britain has a long of history “screwing up” other nations, Mark Curtis in his excellent book, Secret Affairs, shows how Britain screwed up India, by desperately trying to cut the “Jewel in the Crown” into two, by partition, when India had, had enough of British colonialism. The result two nuclear powers face off daily.
Craig
Looks like all the City bankers are coming out in support of your stance on the EU now. They need a leader. Now is the time to step up.
@Craig, I hope for your sake nobody bought up the issue of the recognition for the independence of Crimea ! 😀
When we were children we thought of countries as cast in stone, but we grow up to realise that things change, some land is stone and some muddy bogs, some countries change more than others, some quickly and some slowly.
The story of the small island of Lundy in the Bristol Channel is a lovely example of what we might understand by sovereignty and how fluid it is.
At the outbreak of or shortly prior to WW1 the island was on the market and questions were asked in the House as to whether Russia establish a naval base in the Bristol Channel if it purchased Lundy. The situation was unclear.
When a serious crime was carried out on the island (a murder possibly) the accused (possibly a sailor / non-dom) was taken to the mainland for trial where jurisdiction was declined. The owners of the island expelled visitors who filed UK tax returns for compromising the status of the island.
In the latter part of the twentieth century those rights which tend to indicate something like independence were whittled away one by one until in the 1970’s a licensing application was sought for the bar and it was game over.
I agree with Craig that you are that which others recognise you as and of course although some may make pseudo recognitions for political expediency the consensus surely expect you to act first as if you were independent (whilst some ‘client states’ will of course simply fall in line their masters).
So its horse and cart. Act as if your independent and maybe you are independent, or maybe you might be if you can get get approval from at least one of the big bullies (and his cronies) in the playground.
This ties in with the EU question (sorry if this should go on the EU thread). I was shocked by Allison Pearson’s quote in the ToryGrope yesterday; did JC Junckers really say on the introduction of the euro
“we decide on something, leave it lying around and wait and see what happens. If no one kicks up a fuss, because most people don’t understand what has been decided, we continue step by step until there is no turning back.”
This is the way to lose and the way to gain independence. Step by step until there is no turning back.
How doe these three things relate together:
1) looking like you are independent and doing the things which suggest you are independent
2) getting the majority to recognise that you are independent
3) getting a big bully to call you independent.
Which if the three is the most important?
BTW on looking like your independent: do you dress like a foreigner in your national kit (kilts at UN) or copy of the attire of the bullies (Meiji Japan in Europe)?
Craig Murray’s meeting with the Commies from Venezuela, Bolivia, Cuba, Nicaragua and Ecuador, confirms his basic position and explains his hatred of Putin’s Russia: CM is a Commie, with a Commie’s contempt for free speech and a natural love of the anti-democratic EU empire within which he is determined that the Scots will remain: hence the deletion of the comments I made on his previous post, and presumably, the deletion of this comment in due course — although I suppose this may be allowed to stand to prove me wrong. A little conundrum there for moderator. LOL
“I’m glad you mentiined that Fred, the collapse in the price of oil is manufactured. ”
Nothing alters the facts. What the SNP said was going to happen in their white paper isn’t what happened. That’s all we need to know.
I hate the fact that the referendum process wasn’t fair and proper. I hate the fact that pensioners were terrified by Labour activists who phoned them in the period before the referendum. I hate the fact that the three amigos trampled all over the purdah rules. I hate the arrogance and perfidy of the Treasury and the whole Westminster apparatus and the propaganda campaign that was conducted against us. I hate the breathtaking arrogance of anyone who shows disdain for the democratic process – on both sides. The answer isn’t to ditch democratic means of obtaining change – the answer is to learn from experience, and arm ourselves against the propaganda campaign. Let’s NOT join them – let’s BEAT them!
“Any politician or political party that pins it’s program on saying where going to raise wages is either, stupid, deluding themselves, or lying.”
The crisis is systemic. Your not taking about solutions, really, just a forum to distinguish within identity politics. I don’t know why I lend energy to anything other than disruption, frankly, but as I don’t regard that an end I don’t know why at all…
Prof. Guy Standing – Why The Future Needs A Basic Guaranteed Income
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3cGKSxhFdI
A good enough last post…
One would expect the SNP to adopt the precautionary principle and prepare for a Brexit by campaigning for a new Independence referendum, a sort of dry run, this time with strict election monitoring and sealed ballot boxes.
If it happens the SNP would be right there in full flow, prepared to lead into an Indy campaign asap, if the referendum is lost, the experience from it would hone the SNP for what is to follow one day.
The Tory Clowns today have dropped the currency by 1.7%, enormous,rare, it will make any small vacation so much dearer. How much longer are the people around Osborne and Cameron allowed to cause uncertainty in this highly strung chimera, the City of London?
Is BoJo waiting in the wings? his Haka type photo today looks as if he’s just about to cast a spell on the Tory Party, or sh.t himself.
C’mon Boris, tell us what you want to replace the EU market, access, and a lot of support for farmers and science with?
Its up to the out campaign to have negotiations with others and let us know how they cover the national need and GDP requirements. Its not up to the remain campaign to come up with solutions…
BUT, it would be a good idea to develop a new reform agenda that is progressive, looks at democratising vital, currently unelected positions within the top echelon, rotational job allocations, and, very important, for a more legal audited state of this supranational giant.
How can an unaudited EU be prepared for any legal vagaries thrown at them by ace TTIP lawyers in charge of suing governments?
Their rogue status would be an open wound to stab at.
So lets not kid ourself, the EU needs emergency surgery, right now and by any means possible.
I suspect a fair few nats will be voting Leave in order to hasten the mythical coming of the second referendum. Double bubble.
“The Tory Clowns today have dropped the currency by 1.7%, enormous,rare, it will make any small vacation so much dearer. How much longer are the people around Osborne and Cameron allowed to cause uncertainty in this highly strung chimera, the City of London?”
I believe there was a similar drop after a Times poll showed the Scotch would leave the UK. Nothing happened. Nothing will happen if we leave Mutti’s fourth reich. Europe will continue to sell to its biggest market and we will continue to sell to them without the political union.
Of more interest here is Nevermind’s obvious hatred of England, evident in every one of his posts. One wonders why he lives here.