It is time for straight talking. Philip Hammond stated the plain truth when he said that Scotland could not have a different relationship with the EU than the rest of the UK. It is true as a simple technical truth, as I explained. If the UK leaves the EU, the only way for Scotland to remain a member is Independence. Frankly anybody who understands the first thing about the subject knows that and it is actually helpful for Hammond to explain it. I have no doubt that May gave Sturgeon the same message today. By proclaiming commitment to Unionism in the first sentence of her first speech in Number 10, and then immediately coming to Edinburgh, May could not have made her position clearer. Further there is no doubt that Hammond would have cleared his unequivocal statement with May before he made it.
If I can forsake honesty and straightforwardness, and try to channel Machiavelli, I can make out a case for Nicola Sturgeon to initiate a time-consuming – and expensive – process of entering extensive consultations to try to find a way that Scotland can effectively remain in both the EU and the UK, even though I have no doubt whatsoever that Sturgeon, who is not stupid, knows as well as I do that this is an impossibility. That Machiavellian argument goes like this – “We know it is impossible for Scotland to continue EU membership still within the UK if the UK leaves, but we must be seen to have explored all avenues so that unionists will be persuaded that independence is the only option left.”
But here are four arguments against that:
1) Pitching independence as a very bad option, only to be taken if no others are available, is not a good sales technique
2) Wasting European politicians’ time asking for an impossible “part of UK” arrangement will erode the initial surge of sympathetic support for Scotland’s democratic desire to remain in the EU, which sympathy has been strongly felt in Europe
3) Sturgeon has appointed an “expert panel” to advise her with a massive establishment and neo-liberal bias and a unionist majority, containing just a single radical thinker, Alan Mille.
4) We are witnessing the final implosion of the British Empire with the Westminster bubble detested and politics in a state of flux. There could be no more auspicious time to launch a new push for Independence. This is not the time for temporising.
The appointment of such an establishment “expert panel” really does worry me. You can guarantee that this panel is not going to recommend that Scotland leaves the UK in order to obtain a continuing or expedited membership of the EU. Three are former FCO colleagues of mine. They happen to all be people I like, but I don’t dislike people for their politics. You could not get a more solid establishment man than Lord John Kerr. He is on the steering committee of the Bilderberg Group, for Christ’s sake. David Frost as CEO of the Scotch Whisky Association actively campaigned against independence. Mariot Leslie is sound and pro-Indy but not radical.
Bluntly the composition of this panel worries me that Nicola Sturgeon is seeking not to push forward for independence and does not want an Indyref2. Why else would you appoint a representative of the steering committee of Bilderberg to your expert panel, together with fistfuls of other uber-establishment figures? For me, it says a lot about Sturgeon that she has chosen to advise her a group of people almost all of whom are used to six figure incomes and whose average income is well over £200,000 p.a.
Stuart Campbell hit the nail – as so often – on the head when he suggested that actually Hammond’s position should be a gift which Sturgeon accepts. It is extremely helpful that Westminster states Scotland can only be a member of the EU if it leaves the UK. It is true, and it is a choice the Scottish people must be offered to sort out the two incompatible referendum results. In a choice between the EU and Tory Westminster – a far clearer choice than Indyref1 – I am confident how the vote will go. For Heaven’s sake, Nicola, quit messing around with your entirely voluntary association with the Bilderberg Group and go for the referendum.
I think Nicola has woken up to the fact that it might be very bad for Scotland’s economy to have a “closed” border between it and it’s nearest and most important trading partner. Especially if the rUK economy implodes or the EU impose punitive tariffs on trade across that border. Probably better to ward of Brexit then go for Indiref Mk II.
There is zero risk of punitive trade sanctions between the rUK and EU
Craig, I would be interested to hear more on your views about the “final implosion of the British Empire” I must admit it’s not something that crossed my mind, I’ve always assumed that the US UK special agreement *was* the post war continuation of the empire, combined with the “West” seen very much as Rome, and the common wealth as colonial outposts.
The idea that it’s actually collapsing is quite an appetising suggestion.
Craig, do you mean she, Nicola, is saying one thing and doing another? Business as usual for politicians. I haven’t a clue why you want to be one. Do you really think you could change a fig, as bright as you are?
Hope your mother is recovering well!
I don’t think Sturgeon and May will reach any kind of agreement today at Bute House. Many diehard unionists have been throwing the federalist idea about but to me that’s a non-starter.
No indy ref 2 must be the way forward, Sturgeon has all but exhausted all, the routes to keep Scotland in the EU. Or at least she must be seen doing so. Now it’s time to move to a second indy ref, I’m sure a Holyrood majority for one will be reached Tories aside.
Sturgeon has laid the foundations for an independent Scotland, in the EU by being canny enough to visit Brussels and make allies before the scaremongering commences.
As independent English speaking nation in the EU, Scotland could prosper, with many English and EU countries setting branches, just across the border from England. This second indy ref is a great opportunity for Scotland to fufil its long awaited hopes and dreams.
We mustn’t fail to gain independence this time around, though I feel we will succeed. We must be wary of media and political scaremongering again.
We had far worse scaremongering from politicians, media and big business in the EU referendum, but we still voted for our independence*. Either the Scots don’t have the balls to vote for their independence or they don’t want it.
(*it feels great by the way.)
I’m sure Obama must feel the same way as his 51state, breaks away from Europe, in or out Westminster, will always be America’s little bitch, Blair saw to that. “With you whatever.”
What was you said about feeling good again?
“What was you said about feeling good again?”
That Brexit means Brexit. While you try hook your boat to a sinking ship.
How’s the Scottish economy doing, btw?
‘How’s the Scottish economy doing, btw?’
With the price of oil so low it’s rather dependent on the aforementioned Scotch Whisky Association.
It will be kept afloat by oatcakes. And Trump.
Well I could say that oil is a bonus to Scotland, but the revenue from it goes straight into Westminster’s coffers and has done so for nearly 50 years, who do you think paid for the Thames barrier or the Euro tunnel, and countless other Westminster vanities such as the Falklands war.
Or I could point out that the clowns at Westminster have ran up a unpayable debt of £1.5 trillion quid, and that Moodies and Standard & Poors have now reclassified London as a basket case, but I won’t.
I’ll just say that Scotland will do fine as a small independent nation, Westminster of course had the foresight to set up an oilfund like Norway so the rest of the UK will be fine as well, oh wait a minute, that’s right consecutive British governments dont do foresight, Brexit being a prime example.
“No indy ref 2 must be the way forward, Sturgeon has all but exhausted all, the routes to keep Scotland in the EU. ”
Before the EU referendum you were campaigning on this blog for Brexit.
You wanted Britain out of the EU, you got what you wanted. Now you want back in again.
Not so Fred, I pointed out that the EU had its bad points, which could do with reforming.
Unlike you I don’t see the world through Union Jack goggles.
I seem to remember one of the bad points you pointed out was the prospect of Turkey joining and us being inundated by Turkish migrants.
Hardly campaigning for remain was it?
So of course you will be arguing now that if Scotland gains independence and re-joins the EU we will be inundated by Turkish migrants wont you? All those bad points of the EU you pointed out before the EU referendum you would be arguing against Scotland rejoining?
“No indy ref 2 must be the way forward,”
A full stop or comma after No might have been useful. I took you to mean the opposite of what you apparently mean.
“If the UK leaves the EU, the only way for Scotland to remain a member is Independence.”
Independence in the EU. Snigger
Nicola Sturgeon is on the list of people who have officially endorsed Hillary Clinton; that’s all that needs to be said.
Where does it say that? Source please?
Here you go, and it wasn’t exactly hard to find. Why couldn’t you be bothered to do a simple search yourself?
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/14373986.Sturgeon_endorses_Hillary_over__quot_abhorrent_quot__Trump_in_race_for_White_House/
Why would she ignore third party candidates like Jill Stein and Gary Johnson? Trump and Hillary are polling so badly that there is a real opportunity for third parties.
There is approximately a 0% chance of a third party getting the Presidency. Come on, I thought you understood something about American politics.
Do a bit of looking up what that Gary Johnson is all about, while you’re at it – he’s markedly worse than Clinton.
Well she could hardly endorse Trump could see, with his racist comments and his dislike of Mexicans and Muslims. Also Trump built a golf course in Scotland and in doing so Trump, then thought he could decide Scottish policy on renewable energy.
I have no great attachment to Clinton, a war hawk and facade for the industrial military complex machine, and friend of big pharma.
La Clinton is a huge world-wide promoter of “fracking” too.
But back in March, which is where the WoS article came from, she could easily have endorsed Sanders as the Democratic nominee, a democratic socialist, instead of going for the war-mongering corporate centre-right candidate.
Yes I suppose she could’ve she could’ve back the likes of Ted Cruz or Jed Bush, but she endorsed Clinton. Now in the cold light of day when Clinton lokks like becoming POTUS, it might be a good thing for a future independent Scotland that she did.
I’ve no doubt if Clinton had made the racist and derogatory remarks that Trump made, both Sturgeon and Salmond would’ve refused to back her.
As I’ve stated I’m no fan of the Clinton’s per se, Sanders has backed her bid.
Still I see your point about “toxic Clinton”
But the point is, RoS, that Clinton was – at the time of endorsement – still just one of the candidates. Not the Democratic nominee. Sanders had a very good chance of becoming the nominee. If it was a race between Trump and anyone else, of course she should endorse the Democrat, but it seems she jumped the gun. Any of the other Democratic candidates (including Martin O’Malley) were very much more progressive.
Yes Glenn I agree with your point, and although I don’t agree with her endorsement, in a political sense, it could be seen as tactful as Clinton is one of the favourite to become POTUS.
Or who knows maybe it even boils down to something as trivial as women trying to empower other women, if Clinton wins she’ll become the first female POTUS, something Sturgeon can relate to here in Scotland.
Yes, all fair points. It does still suggest, sadly, that Sturgeon is not quite the progressive that we might like her to be.
As opposed to Trump! Not much to choose from.
Yes there was. Take a look at the other candidates:
http://2016.democratic-candidates.org/
I don’t know why people are having difficulty in understanding that – at the time of endorsement – there was more than just Clinton or Trump to endorse.
Many Scottish people hate the Murdoch sponsored Tartan Tory SNP.
You would need to be really daft not to have noticed they are simply being used to take seats from Labour in UK elections. The worst thing they could do is go for indyref2 b/c that would expose that they have no plan for independence, just like the original referendum.
Most of those seats needed ‘taking’ too.
And every one of those seats can be won back. Just not by Blairites or thugs of the sort who are currently engaged in the coup against Labour Party members.
Proof positive the left, even the likeable real ones, are closet unionists, footsoldiers of empire, and just don’t and won’t get it, Scotland is out of this union, Labour is an English-Welsh political party only now.
Any country can leave the EU, by an established formal process. The union with England is the coercive abusive one.
‘The union with England is the coercive abusive one.’
Yes, the Union that Scotland started under the Scottish King James after the English/Welsh Elizabeth died.
Not bad going, considering he’d been dead nigh on 80 years come the act of union.
The Union that started with the King was a Union of the crowns, long before the union of the parliaments. Both different and for different reasons, you will find that the people at the time had no vote on the parliament decision and rioted after it was released. As for the joining of the crowns James was the next in line to both thrones, by blood you may say.
https://scottishhistorysociety.com/learning-resources/popular-opposition-to-the-ratification-of-the-treaty-of-anglo-scottish-union-in-1706-7/
Scotland has voted against becoming an independent country by 55% to 45%.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/events/scotland-decides/results
That was two year ago, recent polls have shown a move towards independence.
Recent polls have shown we live under a Tory-Libdem coalition, thus were not given a Referendum on the EU, which Remain would have won anyway.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/26/scottish-independence-has-nearly-60-per-cent-support-poll-finds/
And after Cruellas coronation, and appointment of Bozo, rising no doubt.
It’s over, were going. England will continue on its rightward drift.
A bitter, xenophobic ex power, ruled by carpet bagging toffs who are too busy picking the bones clean to care where it will all end.
Lol. Newsflash like, innit.
And many more re-elected her and her party to govern Scotland. See, I can do that too!
I think she has played it well so far, but can’t go for #sexit yes until she has been seen to explore every available option – that will be the way to get the maximum number of supporters onside. Even then she will have to wait until WM decides what sort of exit they want – if they do go for a Norway type option, very unlikely I know, it would pull the rug from under the feet of Independence for many potential supporters.
I think Craig is looking at this based on the power play which is visible. The UK can’t do better economically in Brexit mode or out of the EU. So as economy sinks, the regions will look to bail out. Do the Scots want to be liable for the next City crisis which could happen at any time? The UK elite have got their Brexit. They see the UKs future as more reliant on the City and as Craig previously pointed out, Cameron wanted a veto on City regs. Cameron was never going to get the veto and they won’t in Brexit negotiations.
The UK was screwed in or out. In, we become assimilated which would be good for ordinary Brits, and out we keep our very corrupt elite, but we sink economically.
Keep in mind that the EU was set up in such a way so that UK would thrive, we didn’t, and globally we did poorly. We are not a well liked country so I don’t see any evidence to suggest the UK would thrive outside the EU.
I am hoping the negotiations go badly and we end up with another vote. But I have a funny feeling that many in the EU will say ‘sorry, but no thanks, we don’t want you back’ and the reason for this is that the Euroskeptics and moronic UK press won’t go away, they’ll never shut up.
Simultaneous with our entry into the EU and a vast tariff-free market for our once very large and mostly high-quality high-value manufacturing sector, was the astonishing wilful destruction of that very same manufacturing sector, the wanton scrapping of vast fixed capital assets and a greed-inspired flight of once mandatorily domestically invested capital into foreign market speculations. A post-industrial and human wasteland was created, unseen on earth except in the aftermath of natural disaster or war. Everything possible was done by right-wing UK governments to make sure the UK floundered uselessly in the EEC and EU whilst competitor European industry really got their act together and excelled, not without some ruthlessness, in some areas.
.
‘We are not a well liked country so I don’t see any evidence to suggest the UK would thrive outside the EU.’
Oh yes, and what about the Commonwealth? How come people like you always conveniently ‘forget’ the Commonwealth?
Why would Commonwealth nations want Britain back after Britain sold them out to to the EEC?
No stick with China and Saudi Arabia who already own half of London.
‘Bluntly the composition of this panel worries me that Nicola Sturgeon is seeking not to push forward for independence and does not want an Indyref2.’
Sturgeon’s apparent coolness in pushing forward an independence agenda (as Craig’s analysis of composition of the ‘expert panel’ suggests) is very probably matched by May’s unwillingness to move at anything beyond a snail’s pace towards Brexit. May will use her requirement of obtaining a ‘common UK approach to Brexit’ (ie a complete non starter) to suit her ends, and Sturgeon will use the deliberations (and probably the findings) of her ‘expert panel’ similarly to slow the momentum towards indyref2.
Normally staunch James Kelly getting worried in the same way.
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/a-worrying-change-in-emphasis.html
43,202 more people voted remain than voted yes, or put another way, 340,735 people short of matching the number of that voted no. Add the 173,000 EU citizens living in Scotland, assuming all EU citizens would vote yes, I believe that would be (if the turnout was the same as the last independence referendum) almost exactly 50%
Touch and go imo.
Re the 173,000 EU citizens living in Scotland, only those from Ireland Cyprus and Malta (the latter 2 countries because of their overlapping membership of the Commonwealth) actually had the right to vote in the referendum- which rather kiboshes your argument that, without them, the Scots vote would have been close to 50/50
In the independence referendum, all EU citizens residing in Scotland were allowed to vote. The same would apply in a second independence referendum if it took place prior to leaving the EU.
I pointed that out last week and James said we mustn’t claim the non-voters, but I guess when he was learning to fly his helicopter, they omitted to teach him basic arithmetic, or he would get it.
Looks like it will all be over by Christmas
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/15/theresa-may-flies-to-edinburgh-to-tell-scots-that-she-believes-w/
where they mention, but it also has its own page linked, “New Brexit Minister David Davis declares Article 50 should be triggered by end of year”
Youknowmyname.
Thank you for the link, however I can’t quite see how Scotland can remain in the EU and the union?
The EU nations expressed a view that only a independent Scotland can join the EU, not a Scotland as a part of the UK which voted to leave the EU.
Some of May’s cabinet Phil Hammond for example have make paradoxical claims that a independent UK, can also be a part of the EU? Hammond makes it sound as though we’re out but we’re also in as well, I’m sure the other EU nations will have something to say about that.
The only sure way to guarantee EU membership for Scotland is to win a independence referendum.
Returning to the link, the handshake between May and Sturgeon, in my opinion shows a lack trust.
‘Returning to the link, the handshake between May and Sturgeon, in my opinion shows a lack trust.’
Maybe they both expect the SNP to become HM’s Loyal Opposition soon, the way Labour is misbehaving?
I’m rather hoping it was the type of handshake that says goodbye, I really don’t want see you again.
I’m rather hoping it was the type of handshake that says goodbye, I really don’t want see you again.
Must admit this does make me think!
“In a choice between the EU and Tory Westminster – a far clearer choice than Indyref1 – I am confident how the vote will go”
It’s probably rather important that Sturgeon sets out the terms of any EU membership prior to a referendum. Tell the Scottish people how much it is going to cost them and what currency they will have to adopt. They won’t want to buy a pig in a poke!
I think Sturgeon is wise to maintain her public silence. I’m not convinced by May’s publicly-stated intentions over Brexit, never mind that it will be possible to achieve a successful exit deal. Better for Sturgeon to keep her powder dry than risk looking unstatesmanlike and achieving nothing by making demands when May has only been in the job a few days.
All the calculations being made about the EU and the UK are premissed on the assumptions that the economy, like an experienced team of horses, will plod away as usual while its passengers argue about constitutions, borders and liquidation sales.
The reality is that the assumptions that the SNP makes about the economy are thoroughly out of date. The era of the Celtic, much like that of the sabre toothed, tiger has passed.
The same is true of the remainder of the UK, the economy has been wrecked, the bathwater poured away in order to dispose of the working class babies who bathed in it. Outside of London, the world’s biggest casino and adjoining brothel, the English economy is no longer capable of delivering anything to the people.
Not unless they are ready to take control over it and shape it for their own purposes.
There are no easy routes out of neo-liberalism. Nationalism will serve but only if it involves the empowerment of the populace. And we know that that is not what the control freaks running the SNP favour.
Replacing one silly woman acting as a sock puppet for high finance in London with another, doing the same thing, 300 odd miles to the north, won’t change anything. It might produce a bit of a spurt in the tourist industry but not much more.
I have every sympathy with Scots longing to free themselves from the dead hand of an England dominated by its post imperial bourgeoisie, but, as every passing day makes clear, the differences between the SNP, the Tories and New Labour are, on issues that matter, insignificant.
The EU that Sturgeon wants so much to remain a part of is crumbling like ice in the Arctic. It was already doing so before the referendum. Now the pace is accelerated.
And does Scotland really want to take its place, besides Greece, Portugal, Ireland and other peripheral EU countries, balancing its budgets under the supervision of the ECB, requesting permission from Brussels to nationalise its railways or subsidise its industries, arguing with representatives of the IMF that it has the right to control its own utilities, preserve its Health Service etc.?
Independence is a great thing but it cannot co-exist with membership of NATO, the EU or any other of the web of imperial institutions, whose centre is in Washington. And whose directors, within the Beltway Bubble, are grimly determined that they will either rule the world or ruin it to ensure that nobody else can.
And does Scotland really want to take its place, besides Greece, Portugal, Ireland and other peripheral EU countries, balancing its budgets under the supervision of the ECB, requesting permission from Brussels to nationalise its railways or subsidise its industries, arguing with representatives of the IMF that it has the right to control its own utilities, preserve its Health Service etc.?
Hang on just a minute; those railways are the legal property of Network Rail. Scotland has no legal claim on those railways. How can Scotland nationalise what belongs to Network Rail? Apart from that, as it was pointed out to Jeremy Corbyn, EU rules do not allow nationalisation of railways.
“How can Scotland nationalise what belongs to Network Rail?”
Easy. That’s what nationalisation is. Corbyn is correct however: EU rules don’t allow nationalisation of railways (or any other utility for that matter). No wonder he was lukewarm in the referendum campaign.
And if you fail to remove your US masters WMD’s in the event of independence we’ll nationalise them and dismantle them I’m sure they’d be worth a bob or two in scrap value.
Craig
When your political opponents are busy tearing themselves apart, why bother picking a fight?
The panel isn’t anywhere near as bad as you imply. Pissed off not being invited ?
You know fine well you’re toxic. The MSM would have a field day going back through your posts.
Too radical, and honest, for public consumption.
Face it, your better off and more use here. On the outside looking in.
Please be careful which tent your pissing into though.
Let’s go through the motions eh. May hasn’t any wriggle room, Article 50 will be triggered, and the Indyref 2 will follow in due course.
Talk me through the decent people on the panel, then.
Aye we’re all champing at the bit Craig but success this time, as last time, lies in the perceptions of the risk of Independence held by the electorate at large. Ever since 2014 the Scottish Government have been positioning themselves as a staid boring sensible reliable hand on the tiller. Way too timid on many issues for me but I’ll hang on for a bit if the ‘big prize’ is hoving into view again, and it is. It would therefore be nothing but self indulgent to act precipitously at this point. The Scottish government has to be seen to be mulling over all options available and treating ALL choices with due attention before reaching what I’m pretty sure we both would imagine is the inevitable conclusion. It’s not about how this looks to you or I, it’s about the 1% or 2% of NO voters who will be swung on board by their belief that Independence in Europe is the less dangerous outcome promoted by a ‘conservative’ Scottish Government than the alternatives being proffered by a currently fractured and befuddled Westminster.
“I am confident how the vote will go. ”
You were confident how the vote would go last time as well.
So confident that he bet 100 quid with me but still hasn’t paid up.
Sturgeon’s committee appointments are Syriza through and through. Beware you don’t vote Snat and then find that England votes Corbyn….
While I wouldn’t call it Machiavellian I do agree that is the long way round. Yes she is trying to convince many unionists and sceptics of the case for independence but you don’t do that by filling your committee with yes supporters. If there really is no way we can be in Europe and in the UK then it’s better our own people tell us that than Westminster.
I don’t think we have enough solid support yet for another referendum but when Lord Kerr et al say it isn’t possible for pro European unionists to have their cake and eat it…we may start to see the dam burst.
I would like her to do something about the less well off unionist vote too as per recent Common Weal statements.
For the Lord did looketh upon the Murrayites and sayeth unto them, “Why did you not honour your debt to Anon1 of the Faragites, who did bet 100 coins with your king that the Jockanites would stayeth in the united Kingdom of the Lord?” And the Murrayites shook their heads with great shame and did sayeth to the Lord that their leader was without honour. And the Lord became angry and cursed the Jockanites so that their nation would not become independent for a thousand years.
Hahaha Anon, be careful what you wish for! 😉
So, they don’t like Trump, even though his grandfather was a native Scottish Gaelic speaking Hebridean fisherman, even though he has pumped millions of dollars into Scotland and is prepared to pump in even more, even though he has a reasonable chance of becoming president of the U.S.A.
They no longer like the Labour party – new or old.
They do not like the English, even though it was the idea of Scotland to join in Union with England, some three hundred years ago.
They are not sure if they want to keep the pound but they do not want the Euro.
they are not sure if they want to keep the queen.
They do want to be in the European Empire but at the same time want to be an independent country.
How many people are currently native Scottish Gaelic speakers?
How the fuck can you be an independent country if you do not use your own language, your own currency or make your own laws?
DELUSIONISTS
“They do not like the English, even though it was the idea of Scotland to join in Union with England, some three hundred years ago.”
Yes! Lets rub that in:
They do not like the English, even though it was the idea of Scotland to join in Union with England, some three hundred years ago.
Their union forced upon us English by a Scottish King who then turned Ireland into a plantation.
Good article Craig. Have to say that I am now becoming increasingly worried by the SNP’s cosying up with right-wing neo-liberal folks in Scotland. This is very dangerous as it will start to be increasingly noticed and won’t bode well for the future (risks return of the Tartan Tory label from years ago).
Robin McAlpine recently did a good article on the right-wing wheedling its way into the Scottish government and the movement for independence, made for good reading:
https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/8778/robin-mcalpine-failure-after-failure-why-we-must-question-rightwing-case-indy
Theresa May said today that she will only trigger Article 50 when she has obtained a UK-wide agreement on Brexit. That can be seen as (1) a delaying tactic, and (2) as scapegoating Scotland for any delays. She has obviously taken the initiative on this and I don’t think this leaves Nicola much option but to call her on this. And the way to do that is respond by making it clear that as the people of Scotland voted overwhelmingly to remain in the EU then it is only they who can amend that decision. And the only way that can come about is if thyey are now offered a Referendum in which they are given the choice of either going along with the rest of the UK in a collectively-agreed Brexit or to confirm their wish to remain in the EU as an independent nation. The time for ‘exploring all other options’ is now over. Theresa May has called Check and Nicola must reply with Checkmate.
If i were May I would call Gnasher’s bluff. You’ll get one more referendum, but only one. Call it, the nats lose again and the issue is killed dead for 50 years.
‘the issue is killed dead for 50 years.’
Shh! They just can’t see that coming. I can’t wait until it bites them in the backside.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m a strong supporter of Scottish independence. Perhaps they should give the vote to the English? Imagine that – Scotland the Brave, unable to vote for its own independence, finally divorced from the hated English, by the English. It would be lolz forever.
Not making capital out of the Nice atrocity then Anon1 ? The ROP being your specialist subject and all !
I hope you do call another referendum, do it quickly please and put the rest of us at peace.
“Their wish to remain in the EU as an independent nation.”
Stop it, I’m going to have a hernia.
They also believe in Father Christmas, and all his little elves, who have recently relocated to the to of Ben Nevis, because they too believe Surgeon’s lies.
I kinda get the feeling she’s placating the pensioners ” well i tried every option but it seems we have no choice, for the sake of your children and grandchildren we now have to leave this union” Remember, pensioners vote and they vote in large numbers.
Me, I say go for it, I’m already campaigning in every house I go into during my working day and the results are pretty positive so far ( unless I’m being lied to)
If Scotland does vote soon
to leave the United Kingdom,
who will pay the pensioners pensions?
Will you still have free prescriptions?
Will you still have free universities?
Will you still have free bus passes?
Will you still have a free health service?
oh and you can keep TRIDENT
I first assumed that it was spelt MacHievelly and he was Scottish – sorry, I’ll get my coat;)
Best post today.
I did not know Scotland was the centre of the Galaxy. If it’s a Black Hole then Craig is the Singularity.
Sounds like the Brexit vote was just beyond the event horizon. The poor dears are in a state of enormous agitation.
She has lost one and survived, but she might now consider Cameron’s lesson of what can happen when you lose.
She might though just win if enough remainers move north and are given the vote, or if she offered the vote to ex pat Scots.
In any event Craig are you still 100% certain that the UK will not leave the EU?
28 pages out today.