The fascist violence in Charlottesville was in defence of prominent public statues to those who fought to uphold slavery. History should not be destroyed, and there is a place for such statues in appropriate explained context in museums. But public celebration of advocates of slavery ought to end. People always throw off the monuments of their oppressors, and so they should. The statues should be removed from their prestigious positions.
Hardly anybody remembers now that O’Connell Street in Dublin was Sackville Street. You will scour Ireland with little success for surviving statues of British Imperial rulers and commanders – there were once hundreds. I found that Burnes Road in Karachi is no more. Uzbekistan and Ukraine are no longer dotted with great statues of Lenin.
Yet I live here in a city which still has a Cumberland Street, named after a disgusting war criminal who perpetrated long term and systematic atrocities on this very people whose capital city is desecrated by his name. Cumberland was a worse racist and an infinitely greater war criminal than Robert E Lee. Yet I hear not a whisper to echo the brave roar of Charlottesville. The imposed regime which crushed Scotland, outlawed its major language and much of its culture and tried to expunge even the memory of its history and native culture, is celebrated in the heart of the nation. Hanover Street, George Street, Rose Street, Princes Street. These vicious, arrogant, Scot-hating people really did crush Scotland’s spirit, to the extent we still cringe before them now they are long dead.
It staggers me that, after we have decades of an element of home rule by alleged Scottish Nationalists and an alleged Labour Party, when even the pathetic colonial status of the devolution settlement gives the power to rename a few streets, Labour and the SNP, as the minimum gesture of self-awareness and a tiny, tiny glimmer of self-respect, have not renamed Cumberland Street after Keir Hardie.
Yes, we have always suffered from a parcel of rogues in a nation. Yet we remain a parcel of cowards as a nation. The brave left wing demonstrators of Charlottesville, supporting the removal of Robert E Lee against the violence of the fascists, put us to deep shame.
I have no idea, and little interest with regards to what (if anything) happenned in Charlottesville. However, I am completely convinced on (my own analysis – and many others), that some, but not all terrorist events, are staged, or partly staged. I have no problem whatsoever in believing (on the evidence available) that some terrorists events are partially staged (obviously fake), but then the terrorrists (and I am not mentioning who I think they are) do some real brutal killing of innocents as well. I don’t buy numerology, though as regards to that aspect, I may be wrong.
However, I really liked this comment by flaxgirl on OffGuardian – a website I have enormous respect for, though I have never posted there. As regards to archie1954 denigrating the “bad language” of the author of the piece, well archie should get out more and meet real people in their own culture and neighbourhoods. As strange as it may seem – that is how real people speak, so why shouldn’t they write the way they speak. They are not seeking your approval.
https://off-guardian.org/2017/08/15/the-battle-of-charlottesville/
Tony
“Viscous, arrogant Scot hating people really did crush Scotland’s spirit. “A work continued over the decades by our cruel ruler’s State Broadcaster, the BBC.
As Western nations rulling elites go Britain’s must rank as the cruelest.
It’s true the SNP should be leading, being reasonable and nice has brought only endless attacks by the BBC and ‘newspapers’. But everybody should be out and active.
The 5-6 thousand people who campaigned outside the BBC against the BBC, that was action, peaceful but full blooded.
I thought the 35 MPS we do have should be out and around the country putting forward a clear message, but they seem to be going for being good constituency MPs.
I get it that it has been gruelling with a GE and Council elections. But many are looking for leadership.
There is another side to this though. Seven years of Tories and the chaos of Brexit, the FM would reasonably have expected a surge of support for what she is doing, a strong handshake from the people with lets do the best we can response. Instead she got a flabby, wet limp hand from Scots. The response produced 13 Tory MPs.
Personally in her place I would be thinking, Piss off you wimps.
So overall it is certain sections within the population who need to carry most of the blame.
“the 35 MPS” represent a Scottish majority, and sufficient to end the ‘union’ charade precisely as it began. They should give notice to end it now.
I was brought up as a Catholic in a Roman Catholic school in Oldham, and I was taught and read English history books. I had no reason whatsoever to believe, that any of the content was inaccurate, as it was quite obvious that most of it was true.
About 15 years ago, my wife and I and our daughter left London Gatwick for a long weekend in Dubin. It was midummer in England – very hot – so we travelled with Rucksacks and Shorts and T-Shirts
We arrived in Dublin and it was like it was mid winter – torrential rain and cold.
We were then met with the Warmest welcome Ever of any place we had ever been too. Only Amsterdam came close.
The cultural change was completely phenomenal. I know loads of Irish people, but they never told me it was like that.
So we were there for 3 days and discovered Dublin, and we did the official tours and everything over 3 days
We all received a complete re-education of history, from the Irish point of view.
I know the Irish were telling The Truth.
Over 50 years earlier, I got a great welcome in Edinburgh..and my Relations were very proud of Their Scottish history, and trying their best to teach me.
They knew I was English.
Tony
Then there was Labour Leader John Smith who too conveniently died without a trace, making way of Bliar.
Trowbridge,
I remember John Smith, and I remember Princess Diana. I can understand why such people needed to be disposed with, but why kill David Kelly? He was a complete expert on all these weapons of mass destruction, that your former employers are obsessed with. He wasn’t likely to blurt andthing was he? Why not instead do a David Shayler on him? David Shayler has been rendered harmless, and so have you. What’s this obsession with assassination? Is it designed to keep people’s gob’s shut? It obviously didn’t work on you – nor Craig Murray for that matter.
Tony
Assassination is designed by the British elite people to get in No.10 and stay there. it’s alarming how many opposition leaders like Gaitskill, Tony Crosland, Willie, Smith, and Robin Cook conveniently died young. Can’t think of aTory who has.
Kelly like Gareth Williams were killed because they could spill the beans on how incompetent they are.
Don’t think Craig is in any danger,
Sounds to me that Robin Cook died of ricin poisoning, like I almost did.
Remember that dirty moment when Colin Powell made out that Saddam could kill thousands similarly at the UN which that team from Porton Down determined that followers of Osama did not do locallly.
Did Kelly threaten to tell what his colleagues at the biological center were capable of?
” Didn’t work on you”
What? Death?
One squeak from Dr David Kelly would have prevented Iraq, Libya, Syria from happening.
The Zionists cannot create their greater Israel stretching from Palestine to Kurdistan on fully functional occupied land. there is a vicious series of articles slandering the Kurdish by Sarah Abed over on Voltairenet.org. It portrays the Kurds as:
Lie 1/ stateless nomads, ungrateful to the dictators the British placed them under in 1918 when they carved up Kurdistan into Iraqi, Syrian, Turkish and Iranian rule. They had owned their land before British treachery dispossessed them.
Lie 2/ crypto-Zionists on account of the pig-herders barzani family belonging to Mossad and the legacy of the Biblical Captivity
Lie 3/ Amoral, tarring the Muslim Kurds with the same brush as the non-Muslims Kurdish political resistance groups in the countries of post 1918 British splitting up of Kurdistan
Lie 4/ criminal, describing the Peshmerga as the private army of the mafia Mossad, friend of Erdogan, Barzani
Lie 5/ mercenary, paylings of the US, when in reality since the Bush Blair Iraq War Iraqi Kurdistan is wholly controlled by the US.
Lie 6/ mad, because former, now unelected president Barzani acquired weapons through his family connections from Germany, which he sold to Daesh, who are constantly threatening Kurdish peace and tranquillity
Lie 7/ misogynist. Kurdistan like Baghdad, Syria, Jordan and Philistine has always allowed women to participate in the business and political affairs of the country as well as respecting their role in religion and family. Sarah Abed insinuates that the secular resistance groups’ use of women on the battlefield is a cheap propaganda PR tool.
Roll up! Roll up! Read all abaat it! : http://www.voltairenet.org/article197439.html
I have never read such cheap, politically toxic, manipulative drivel.
giyane,
That is what you may think, and I don’t know enough detail about the subject to argue with you, but the author appears to have done an enormous amount of research on the subject, and I do have massive respect for voltairenet’s objectivity and accuracy. It is entirely possible, she has got some things wrong, but I do not agree with your accusation that Sarah Abed is slandering the Kurdish.
What do you think of this?
I think its probably true. Have you any evidence to prove its not?
He quotes the same author Sarah Abed.
https://richardedmondson.net/2017/07/17/the-kurds-washingtons-weapon-of-mass-destabilization/
Tony
There’s more dog trash in a pound of Smash. The 2 articles are exactly the same, duplicate trash.
Dear Tony,
Thank you for noting that an enormous amount of research went into my three part analysis. Everything stated is backed by facts.
If Giyane would like to present information that refutes anything that I have stated in my three part analysis, then he is more than welcome to do so. So far all I have heard from him and others are ad hominems and false accusations.
Here is part III which includes a link to Parts I and II. http://www.mintpressnews.com/history-violence-myth-moderate-kurdish-rebel/230635/
Thank you,
Sarah Abed
They ARE stateless nomads Giyane..Kindly point out on a map where “Kurdistan” is…or even was and best of luck in that endeavor..2)The Barzani family’s Jewish connections are easily verifiable. As for the rest why don’t you attempt a refutation of some sort, especially if you’re going to brand someone as a liar. Kurdish history speaks for itself as does their actions throughout that history. Sorry if you find the truth offensive.
He wasn’t likely to blurt andthing was he? (Kelly)
Unfortunately for him he was but whether he was a freelance moral crusader or if he was being egged on by mates in SiS is an interesting question (whether or not you asked it).
There is evidence that showed at the time of around the US/UK et al invasion of Iraq that Kelly and other WMD Inspectors were getting suspicious of intelligence that was being relayed to them to assist their assessments. The (we now know fabricated intelligence did not tally with Kelly’s and his expert colleague’s circle first hand evidence and experiences)
DIS (as was), the part of the UK intelligence that made assessments of raw intelligence, were being sidelined (they were a bit too professional and expert to be kidded by the CIA intelligence manipulators / fabricators). The honest background guys at SiS were perturbed that “intelligence” was not being assessed by the UK experts and they were expected to accept on trust the picture being put together by the political security people in the US.
Kelly doubts became more and more strong, he met with Gilligan (who had recently been to Iraq) to ascertain 1) what Gilligan’s perceptions were of the situation on the ground and 2) what the BBC would present as factual (whether it was or not).
In the week before the invasion Kelly wrote a personnel view of where he thought the Iraq aimed hegemony was going. The piece appeared in the Guardian after his death, the opening sentence made very clear that in the days before the invasion Saddam was co-operating with the destruction of disputed range missiles.
The CIA spawned a hoax story that Mobile Bio Weapon Labs had been found in Iraq, the POTUS went on the telly (Blair the following day) and reported to the nation that the smoking gun of WMD capability had at last been found. Kelly had been sent to inspect the equipment. The following day he spoke to his contact on the NYT and said the president was talking bollocks. What had been found was Hydrogen Generating Equipment for filling weather balloons. The following day the NYT ran the story, the following month Kelly was dead.
In his last days Kelly (permission granted by the FCO) kelly did an interview for Australian ABC where he contrasted the difference between Russian and US Bio Weapon Research Labs. Confirming that whatever the US says it was still developing BIO WMD capability. Those that say “yes but for defensive capabilities” were caught wrong footed by his final words in the interview. Kelly explained that there is little or no difference between Offensive and Defensive Bio WMD Research what determines its use is Intent and that is very difficult to determine. (so US (and UK) research in BIO WMD Good, Iraq Research Bad.
Kelly was swapping concerns with colleagues he was writing a book, friends were putting together ideas for a War Chest to assist Kelly in fighting a legal battle counteracting the cruel treatment that he had suffered at the hands of his employers.
Kelly had his mad up and was going to put up a fight and blab what he knew to anyone (useful to his and UK spooks cause) that would listen and expose the deceptions that took Britain to war.
In the week of his death the US withdrew Kelly’s Top Secret Security Clearance, pulling the rug from under him regarding his further involvement in his expert field.
Yes Kelly was a loaded loose cannon. He was looking forward to retirement in a few months time, he had come to terms with no longer working in the field that put him at the head of the world experts in his disciplines. He had fallen out with the CIA spooks on the Iraq Survey Group ( the CIA body that determined what intelligence went to the Inspectors and what assessments came out.
Any assertions I have made here that readers may doubt, I am happy to give sources but its after 2.00 am now so must to bed.
ps
Shutting Kelly up was only 50% the purpose of his death. As important was the message sent to anyone else that held US Secrets that if they blab they will be dealt with accordingly.
So if the “suicide” had been believable, if it had been accepted as convincing and properly investigated then the secondary purpose (possibly primary) of Kelly’s death would have failed in its goal, it had to be widely accepted that Suicide was unbelievable, that the law will be ignored when necessary.
People had to believe that Kelly was murdered and the law was a useless mechanism in attaining justice regarding this matter. That is why so many spoilers were played into the Cover Up for the sole purpose of advertising the fact that government doesn’t care if the law was abandoned and reinforce the fact that the government can do anything it wants and the public can do nothing to stop them.
This latter point seems consistent with the known facts* and offers a gentle but firm rebuttal to the argument that conspiracies don’t happen, to argue which position sincerely, requires a cultivated failure to imagine the purpose and the goals of power, let alone the means.
* Facts which should probably include the number of suspicious deaths of microbiologists globally in the years surrounding Kelly’s own death.
Peter Beswick, Your research is excellent. Were you personally involved / connected? I’m impressed.
Similarly, the assassination of JFK was meant to be suspicious to those in the know.. It would have been very easy to kill him with untraceable poisons, but that would not have intimidated anyone.
Yes, pretty accurate summary of Kelly’s predicament. Still not completely convinced he was murdered, by the circumstantial evidence certainly points in that direction.
*but
Yes Mark all circumstantial except the cover up which has hard irrefutable evidence and points to some very enlightening “facts”.
So whilst Craig goes on his holibobs I will take advantage if the mods allow.
The case was made extremely complicated for the reason of not allowing the truth to surface through; confusion, decoy and distraction . Explaining the salient details with explanations and sources will be very time consuming and create a very heavy read.
So if allowed I will detail some of the “hidden” facts, explain what they mean and if anyone challenges me for the evidence and sources I will happily supply ( except if I smell a rat / shill / troll / or deliberate stalling / distraction techniques).
As I say, if Craig permits, I will lay the story open before Craig returns rejuvenated and wanting his blog back.
1st installment.
The search for and finding of the body.
(The story does not begin here but for the sake of simplicity in explaining the story there will be some toing and froing in time.
One of Kelly’s daughters from mum and dad’s cottage phones the police to report dad is missing. 11.45pm 17th July 2003. Within 15 minutes 3 police officers arrive at the Kelly home from Abingdon police station, missing persons forms in hand. (AA route planner has journey at 6.3 miles – 15 minutes) Impressive!
Lots of things went on in the early hours of the 18th (I will come back to some of these later). The police decide that the local search and rescue team were a better option for searching for Kelly than themselves. The police didn’t even check the local pubs to see if Dr Kelly was there.
They did however do some hard thinking and came up with a list of 6 locations where Kelly might be found. The Police had at their disposal at least 24 search volunteers and a few trained search dogs. The police in their wisdom ask only two volunteer searchers to get out of their beds and bring one dog. The searchers are sent to the no. 2 most likely spot where Kelly might be and as luck would have it they found him.
Police and ambulance crews home in on the scene. A news black out was put in place, the ambulance crew were detained at the scene and were prevented from using their radio to contact their HQ with their report.
Before Kelly’s body was found Andrew Gilligan had an early morning phone call from his mate Mike Smith (Defence Correspondent of the Telegraph) Smith told Gilligan that the Police were not searching for a missing Kelly, they were looking for a body.
Gilligan is a bit shook up but things got worse when he got into work, his boss, the head of news at the BBC called Gilligan into his office, whilst Gilligan had been traveling into work a body had been found and it matched Kelly’s description. Oh dear!
It got worse, during the news blackout at the scene someone managed to contact the head of news at the BBC and told him it looked like suicide, a knife had been found at the scene and painkillers were involved. Well this was awful except the blister packs of the painkillers were not discovered by the forensic team in Kelly’s coat pocket until several hours later (after 2pm in the afternoon).
New Rule! (1) When say some really weird shit that a normal person would definitely not believe I will provide some supporting evidence.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10192271/The-betrayal-of-Dr-David-Kelly-10-years-on.html
Back at the Kelly home a Family Liaison Officer is introduced to the family to help them through the “Inquiry”. The body at this point has not been discovered. But when it is the Liaison Officer leaps into action and becomes Gatekeeper for access to the remaining Kelly’s. Mrs Kelly was allowed however to speak to two journalists on the phone ((Tom Mangold and Judith Miller), Mrs K told them both that Kelly had committed suicide (before the pathologist knew).
Any way that’s enough for tonight, if I don’t get moderated I will continue to reveal some very weird stuff that Hutton did not pick up on ( or more correctly he hid).
2nd Installment – Dr David Kelly – the hidden facts.
The day Dr Kelly went missing – 17th July 2003. (and a bit before)
Did Dr David Kelly actually go for a walk that day? Was he even at home? Was he still alive?
On the 9th July Kelly’s name was given to the rabid press at the insistence of Alastair Campbell as the person who leaked false claims to Andrew Gilligan that the justifications for Britain invading Iraq and forming part of an Force of Occupation were baseless lies. (the false claims actually turned out to be true).
Anyway Kelly and his wife were thrown to the wolves, the people who created this unpleasant drama for the Kellys even went to the trouble of frightening the pair by ‘phoning and telling them that hoards of media types were heading to the sleepy Oxfordshire village that was the Kelly’s home and were going to camp on his doorstep and trample on his privacy.
Kelly was told by his MoD minders that he should run away, pack his bags and get out of his home as soon as possible, escape to somewhere safe!
Mrs Kelly recounts the awful, stress fueled flight to the Hutton Inquiry. How they packed very quickly and made their way to a property in the West Country made available by one of Janice Kelly’s friends. She gave a anxious fulsome description of the journey including a stop at an hotel in Weston Super Mare and even included a description of how tense breakfast was before completing their journey to Cornwall.
The full drama fueled dash told to the Hutton inquiry in Mrs Kelly’s “own words” came across as remembered visceral fear, an event that no one would want to go through. Just terribly awful!
Except it didn’t happen, it was made up. David Kelly was down the pub that evening playing Crib with his mates. So where did the Kellys stay? Why the deception. A theory is that the Kelly’s actually stayed in a “Safe House” local to Oxford that evening.
The following day (10th) a window is discovered unsecured at Dr Kelly’s Dentist, no more was thought about the strange occurrence until a week later when the news reports Dr Kelly had been found dead other reports stating that he was suffering depression.
Dr Kelly’s dentist thought this to be a strange. Kelly and his dentist were friends, he had even sent her a post card from Iraq which she kept in his dental notes. Dr Kelly’s dentist was Dr Bozena Kanas with a dental practice in Abingdon she went to check Kelly’s dental notes for any mention of depression. The file containing the notes was missing. The practice staff searched high and low and searched again for the notes but there was no sign, they had definitely been removed.
Two days later whilst contractors were working in the dental surgery the dental notes (including x rays) reappeared precisely where they should have been. The police were alerted. Fingerprints were taken from the practice staff. Assistant Chief Constable Page of Thames Valley Police told the Hutton Inquiry that the matter was investigated but taken no further as the fingerprints on the x rays tallied with the practice staff’s fingerprints and there were no other extraneous prints.
That was a lie. Six unidentified prints were found on the x rays that did not match up with those of the practice staff.
So Kelly’s playing crib his Dentist’s surgery is being turned over but where Kelly slept that night we do not know.
We do know that each member of the Crib team who were present that evening (12 of the 16 regular members (not including Kelly and the landlord)) were interviewed by the police, twice!
Why? Well were the police interested in Kelly’s state of mind on the 9th July or did they want to know if he had told someone where he was staying that night? On the 15th of July Kelly faced a televised grilling by the Foreign Affairs Committee, of parliament on the 16th he was before the Intelligence and Security Committee. What precisely could the Crib team at the Hinds Head inform the police about Kelly’s death?
This wasn’t the only time the police went to extreme lengths to question people who on the face of it had little or nothing to offer as evidence especially when compared with the absence of action of the police who avoided questioning and investigating extremely important witnesses. Eg;
The police visit 167 premises that Kelly may have passed on his “last walk” but completely ignore 3 men in a boat moored overnight on the River Thames approx 500yrds from where Kelly’s body was discovered.
So back to the 17th, the walk.
A week before Kelly’s home was invaded by the press, his public profile was raised even further when he went on the telly for his grilling by Parliament. The papers were full of his photographs a personal details of his life
Why did he feel safe to go for a walk without being mobbed?
It wasn’t just the press that wanted to talk to Kelly, the Met Special Branch wanted him arrested for other Official Secret leaks, they had asked the MoD for a Damage Assessment for if Kelly was arrested, they would have had their eye on him.
The CIA wanted US secrets taken out of Kelly’s possession, the week of his holibobs in Cornwall had seen the US strip Kelly of his Security Clearance.
Kelly was on a hit list of Iraq militants, the government were aware of this. Norman Baker (MP at the time) says Kelly was murdered by a gang of Iraqis in his book about the affair
Kelly’s bosses wanted to talk to him regarding his responses to the Parliamentary Committees
And Kelly just walks out of his door for a walk and isn’t seen alive again?
Kelly apparently sends emails from his home on the morning of the 17th proving he was there, however one of the emails contains an error that Kelly could not have made. Who sent that email and why/
Kelly and his wife had been offered a “Safe House”, he had been absent from his home since the 9th why would he go home when he could still keep low? He could have anything he needed collected for him as he had during his week away. Even the cats were being fed by Dr Kelly’s daughter.
3rd Installment
The first police officer on the scene
The first police officer (DC Graham Coe) on the scene where Kelly’s body was discovered gave a short statement to the Hutton Inquiry in it, he managed to mislead the Inquiry on 4 very important points.
He told the Inquiry that he was accompanied by just one other officer, this was not true there was a third man who was never identified.
Coe said he had been ordered to do House to House Inquiries in Kelly’s village (Southmoor) Kelly was still missing, a volunteer search team of two + dog were out looking for him.
Coe decided to ignore his orders and decided to have a look at the river he took two colleagues with him. They were heading towards the river when they bumped into the search team, they said they had just found a body.
Coe stood guard on the body until ambulance and police teams turned up.
Coe told the Hutton Inquiry he left the scene when the ambulance crew arrived (c 10.00am) and had nothing more to do with the scene that day. This wasn’t true he stayed at the scene until nearly 12 noon.
In the time ( 2hours) Coe said he wasn’t at the scene (when actually he was) witnesses say many changes took place. The body was moved. The bottle of water that an ambulance technician had told to the police would not have remained standing where it was as Kelly was dying , was moved 6 inches and propped upright against a branch (*bottle remaining upright is important.- later installment)
Blood was added to the scene; a 3 foot pool of blood appeared where the ambulance paramedic had been standing / kneeling / crouching when she was checking for signs of life. She told the Hutton Inquiry there was very little blood at the scene, no “puddles” or anything like that.
Ten times more blood appeared on the right knee of Dr Kelly’s jeans than was present when the ambulance crew were present a similar sized blood stain on the left leg had been “diluted”.
The search team told Hutton that the body was slumped against a tree when they discovered it, all witnesses that saw the body later said the body was on its back, the ambulance technician said he stood in the gap between a tree and Kelly’s head when he was checking for signs of life. Coe said the body was on its back.
Coe told Hutton he took no part in the search of Kelly’s home the following day, in fact he took a very significant part in the search.
Some years later Coe confessed in a newspaper interview that he indeed was accompanied by 2 colleagues and not 1 but refused to identify the third man. Coe confessed that the body wasn’t on its back when he first saw it, (note the body was on its back when Coe left the scene. Coe told the newspaper he approached the body from a different direction from all other witnesses (they took the common approach path incl the volunteer searchers) Everyone approached the body with the legs of the body pointing towards them. Coe approached the body from the side – 90 deg difference), he told the newspaper it was sat against a tree when he first saw it.
Coe’s admissions to the newspaper prompted the Attorney General to ask the police to question Coe on his differing accounts, the police took him in for questioning but only questioned him about who was with him that day, they didn’t ask him who moved the body.
Coe was present when the body was moved and the scene reorganised, he misled the Hutton Inquiry but has never faced a Court to explain his words and actions.
That’s British Justice for you.
To be continued (Craig and Mods willing)
4th Instalment
The Water Bottle (and tips on how to research the Kelly Death Story)
(New Rule no.2)
When statements are made regarding mundane items pointing to a police cover up of murder, suicide or death by natural causes then I think evidence is required or someone might consider me a conspiracy theorist.
A 500ml bottle of Evian water was discovered at the scene where Dr Kelly was discovered, I say a bottle of Evian water because the bottle had an Evian label on it, the contents may well have been tap or river water, or ….., the mineral make up of the water was not determined.
But this was a murder style investigation surely the provenance of the water bottle was investigated!? No maybe not!
ACC Page at the Hutton Inquiry (Wednesday, 3rd September 2003 appearance)
“I would not say I launched a murder investigation but the investigation was of that standard.”
(Interesting point here is Page did not know at the time the investigation was launched what was the mode of Kelly’s death …… Or did he?)
Go to Hutton inquiry Web Site Archive Snapshots. Snapshots are captures of a website at a particular point in time.
http://www.webarchive.org.uk/ukwa/target/102325
Pick your snapshot, I am choosing 22 Nov 2004
https://www.webarchive.org.uk/wayback/archive/20041122120000/http://www.the-hutton-inquiry.org.uk/index.html
Go to “Hearings and Transcripts”
Enable your “Search / Find Text” feature if not already enabled, on my machine I type “CTRL F” and a little box comes up, normally top left of bottom left of screen. If it doesn’t appear take your curser to the top of the page and go to “Edit” menu, you should find it there.
Type “Page” (without inverted Commas) in the little box and toggle through the web page / document for all instances, in this case two; Wednesday, 3 September 2003 am and Tuesday, 23 September 2003 pm.
Click on Blue Text “Afternoon” next to Wed 3 Sept. Type “murder” into little box and you should be taken to para 26, line 21. (Only one case of “murder” on this page)
So that’s how to get around the Hutton archive. Another Useful Archive for Kelly researchers is the Attorney General’s (Grieve) website where he patently didn’t want answers to simple questions, many such answers are found at this resource. Just why they were missed is anybody’s guess.
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20110628102955/http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Pages/DrKelly.aspx (note: all docs are searcable using the Search / Find Text Feature)
So ACC Page is in charge of the investigation and he’s applying murder Investigation Standards.
Right here we are going to pretend to be detectives.
We are confronted by the scene of a dead body ( this is when the body had been moved to flat on its back a distance from a tree), items are lay out in a line from the shoulder of the body;
We’re going to use the Forensic Scientist’s (Roy Green) Report here (from the AG’s Archive);
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20110628102955/http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Pages/DrKelly.aspx
Page 9 of 20
“The right knee of the jeans bore a roughly circular contact bloodstain that was approximately 8 cm in diameter. This showed that at some time during the incident and after the deceased had sustained an injury to his wrist he had knelt in a pool of blood. One such area of bloodstaining was visible by the left hip of the deceased. This area of bloodstaining was sampled as AMH.29, STR profiling of the blood on this swab produced a full profile which matched that of Dr KELLY.
Next to this was a bloodstained wristwatch (AMH/4) and a metal penkife (AMH/5) which had its blade expose.
Page 10
Next to the deceased’s left shoulder was a Barbour cap (AMH.6). Beyond this, approximately 25cm from the left shoulder was an almost empty Evian water bottle (AMH.2) and 12cm further on was its top (AMH.3). Each of these items appeared to be smeared with blood, indicating that the deceased was already injured when these items were handled”
Ok we are police detectives what do we think? Well we will borrow some details from the future to assist.
1) 3 blister packs of painkillers were found in Kelly’s Barbour pocket later in the day, two completely empty one had a single pill left in it.
2) No fingerprints were found on the knife, one thumb print was found on the bottle neck (not Kelly’s)
3) 111ml of water was later decanted from the bottle (22.2% of its contents) (Roy Green used the forensic term – “nearly empty”), the male ambulance technician at Hutton;
“ Q. Did you see any items next to the body?
A. Yes, to the left side above just where the arm was, there was a wristwatch, a silver knife with a curved blade and a bottle of water.
Q. And the bottle of water, was that empty or full or —
A. I think it was empty.
Our First observations (as detectives)
What the fuck are all those items doing on the left of the body) (sorry we have potty mouth detectives in our presence) Everything is on the wrong side of the body!
He’s sawn through the tendons of his left hand for fucks sake! (sorry can’t see this improving)
He’s right handed (thanks to more hindsight delivered by the Kelly’s Liaison Officer, appointed before the body was found to assist the family through the Inquiry!!!)
And look the watch strap, it’s on top of the fucking knife,
He’s handled the bottle after blood had started to flow. No fingerprints made from blood or sweat.
How many times did he handle the bottle? Ok lets make a wild assumption that he entered the wood with 3 blister packs full of pills (30 pills) (fuck off pills at that – a half inch long!)
Kelly suffers from dysphagia, he cannot swallow pills but nevertheless he overcomes his gagging reflex.
He’s sat at the botton of a tree, or sat unsupported away from a tree with legs out in front of him. Even if you don’t suffer from a bad back, that position hurts. Kelly did suffer a bad back and his frequent walks were a therapy for the pain (his frequent walks when he was in the Middle East included other purposes).
He’s sat with 30 pills in blister packs he’s got a bottle of water. Right we assume he hasn’t started hacking yet, he holds the blister pack in one hand and uses his thumb to press out the pill, he pops it in his mouth and picks up bottle next to him and takes the first pill and then places the bottle on the ground next to him and repeats the process.
He’s killing himself for fucks sake why aren’t his hands sweating?
At some point he gets bored and puts the pills down and puts the top back on the bottle. (But no! This can’t be right – no blood stains on the blister packs, fuck it we’re detectives we’ll ignore this or we won’t solve this before Craig comes back and gets cross)
So forget no blood on any of the blister packs. He starts to hack again, Oh Fuck that hurts! Grabs the pills and starts munching them again then puts the blister pack down, takes top off bottle (top is bloodstained) and has another gulp and then continues taking the pills.
How many times did he pick up and put down the bottle? Still no prints.
Bizarrely with 111mm of water left in the bottle (or none or nearly empty – depending on who you believe) he leaves one last pill and then places the bottle in a position he couldn’t reach even if his tendons hadn’t been chopped.
He then places the knife on the wrong side again in a position he can’t reach without getting up or rolling and then places his watch on top of the knife.
Then lies down and dies. Well not quite, Kelly was still alive when the blood stopped flowing (the artery had withdrawn and shrivelled at the end, the bloods platelets started doing their job, the wound was clotting) according to the pathologist Kelly started picking at the wound to encourage blood to flow he deduced this from the state of the wound and the redness of the skin.
The pain killers wouldn’t kill him for a few days, he had not even lost enough to lose consciousness but he died anyway.
But lets not forget that when the ambulance crew were there, there just wasn’t much blood. That only appeared in the afternoon.
Vanessa Hunt Ambulance Paramedic Tues 2nd Sept 2003 Hutton Inquiry
Q. And is there anything else that you know of about the circumstances of Dr Kelly’s death that you can assist his Lordship with?
A. Only that the amount of blood that was around the scene seemed relatively minimal and there was a small patch on his right knee, but no obvious arterial bleeding. There was no spraying of blood or huge blood loss or any obvious loss on the clothing.
Q. On the clothing?
A. Yes.
Q. One of the police officers or someone this morning said there appeared to be some blood on the ground. Did you see that?
A. I could see some on — there were some stinging nettles to the left of the body. As to on the ground, I do not remember seeing a sort of huge puddle or anything like that. There was dried blood on the left wrist. His jacket was pulled to sort of mid forearm area and from that area down towards the hand there was dried blood, but no obvious sign of a wound or anything, it was just dried blood.
Q. You did not see the wound?
A. I did not see the wound, no.
Q. You were not looking at the wound, then?
A. The hand — from what I remember, his arm — left arm was outstretched to the left of the body.
Q. Yes.
A. Palm up or slightly on the side (indicates) and, as I say, there was dried blood from the edge of the jacket down towards the hand but no gaping wound or anything obvious that I could see from the position I was in.
Q. Were you examining the wrist for —
A. No, I was not. No.
Q. And were you examining the ground for blood or blood loss?
A. No.
MR DINGEMANS: Right. Thank you.
LORD HUTTON: Thank you very much Ms Hunt. Thank you.
MR KNOX: My Lord, the next witness is Mr Bartlett.
LORD HUTTON: Yes.
MR DAVID IAN BARTLETT (called)
I think this is enough for now, I haven’t finished with the bottle yet though.
(one possible solution to the wot no blood on the blister packs is – Kelly takes all the pills bar one and being a decent citizen didn’t want to litter the copse, he carefully placed the empty packs plus unwanted pill in his pocket and thought it must be time for the main event. Then at some time later decides he needs a drink and pours water on his left knee.
Fuck its not my fault that this is the best material we have to work with)
Note: the ambulance crew both variously describe the blood stain on Kelly’s right knee as the size of a 10p, the size of a 50p and about 25mm in diameter.
In the afternoon Roy Green measures it as 8cm diameter. (forget about a similar size stain on the left knee that had been “diluted”. 8cm is the entire width of the front of Kelly’s jeans.
Using Pi and radius squared you will discover the stain grew 10 times in area from morning to afternoon. Assuming homogenous penetration of blood through the denim material, this means that 10 times more volume of blood was present on Kelly’s right knee in the afternoon than was there in the morning.
Installment no. 5
This becomes a little more detail heavy so before I expose more of the Hidden Facts there is some reading material that will help understand the background.
Dominic Grieve was about to put the kibosh on allowing Kelly’s death from being investigated by a Coroner. Before that happened three witness statements had to be “Hung Out”, (put out partial truths to hide more sinister ones). Compare what was said by witnesses at the Hutton inquiry and what was reported reported 7 years later in the press.
~
Paramedics oral evidence at the Hutton Inquiry
para 70, line 15 to para 85 line 15
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20051212110041/http://www.the-hutton-inquiry.org.uk/content/transcripts/hearing-trans27.htm
“Dr David Kelly’s body ‘had obviously been moved’: Paramedic at death scene reveals concerns over Hutton Inquiry”
Updated: 01:41, 12 September 2010 Mail on Sunday
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1311255/Dr-David-Kellys-body-obviously-moved-Paramedic-death-scene-reveals-concerns-Hutton-Inquiry.html
~
Dc Coe’s oral evidence to the Hutton inquiry; (from top of page to para 5 line 10)
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20051212105546/http://www.the-hutton-inquiry.org.uk/content/transcripts/hearing-trans33.htm
Coe’s remembered account
“There wasn’t much blood about – if any”
Published in The Mail on Sunday on 8 August, 2010:
http://www.mattsandy.net/?p=1401
~
Pathologist’s evidence to Hutton inquiry; (from p 5 line 12 to para 29 line 11)
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20051212105546/http://www.the-hutton-inquiry.org.uk/content/transcripts/hearing-trans33.htm
Pathologist’s Mail Interview
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1305159/Dr-David-Kelly-pathologist-Nicholas-Hunt-demands-inquest-Ive-hide.html
Pathologist’s PM Report
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20110628102955/http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Pages/DrKelly.aspx
The next installment will discuss some of the contradictions in theses accounts.
6th & 7th Instalments
Time is running out now for me to complete the task I set myself so I will be jumping about a bit.
Please read Instalment 5 with links before reading this.
The paramedics do not think Kelly died of blood loss, they don’t believe what they witnessed is reconciled by what later witnesses saw. Both of them went on the telly and said he wanted to see photos of the scene.
3 sets of photos were taken;
1) The first police officer to take photos (arrived just before the ambulance crew) took photos of the scene in the morning when the ambulance crew were present and a couple after the ambulance crew left. Only these photos were sent to the Hutton Inquiry, they were not shown to any witnesses including those that had seen the body.
2) The police forensic photographer who took photos in the afternoon and at the evening postmortem examination at the hospital.
3) Roy Green’s team (forensic scientists).
Witness statements strongly suggest that the scene was significantly altered between the morning and afternoon photographs. No independent persons or body have compared these photos, they were ordered to be locked away for 70 years by Hutton.
If the eye witnesses are to be believed the body was moved, items around the body were moved and more blood appeared at the scene. Why not allow independent investigators examine all sets of photographs?
Why withhold the photos if the “Conspiracy Theorists” can be proven wrong?
…………..
7th and last instalment (but not the end of the story)
The intention (here on Craig’s blog) was to show that the police covered up the facts of Dr David Kelly’s death.
They made statements that were not true, they pushed the “suicide verdict” before the body had been examined by a pathologist and before the body had been identified by the family, they failed to investigate basic issues.
The family assisted the cover up, probably for what they thought were very good and acceptable reasons however they were treated with the same contempt as the law and the public.
The body could have been identified on the day it was found instead very early on the 17th the decision was taken that the family’s identification of the body should not take place until after the full post mortem examination. After the face and neck tissues had been dissected to bone, after the fluid had been drained from the eyes, after the brain had been removed.
Why might this have been decided? To cast doubt on whether the body was that of Dr Kelly?
But putting the feelings of the family aside, the law was raped that day and the vicious assault on on the thing that separates us from barbarians continues to this day.
The Coroner was bumped off the case immediately the body was discovered. Coronial Law was spat on and Hutton wiped his feet on it. The Law requires a Coroner pronounce the Cause of Death, complete a final Death Certificate when his / her investigation is finalised and that the Inquest is formally closed.
All of those Legal requirements were ignored. The only Death Certificate in existence is a preliminary / interim one that served the purpose of disposing of the body before the investigation of the Cause of Death had heard any evidence. The Inquest was not formally closed it was abandoned and a Coroner has yet to rule on the Cause of Death. Hutton had no legal power, qualification or experience to rule on the cause of death.
Today Kelly’s death could be covered up with less trouble The Law has now been amended so that now (specifically) for if a suspected suicide is investigated by a Public inquiry in the place of an Inquest then the Coroner MUST record Suicide if that was the finding of the Public inquiry. Even if the Coroner has new evidence that proves murder.
(Why write a law like that? When is a Public Inquiry ever going Try another Suicide?)
And one should remember that Suicide must also, in Law, be proven Beyond Reasonable Doubt, the Highest Standard of proof in English Law. Hutton did not apply any Standard of Proof to his findings. No Evidence under Oath, no Cross examination, no Second Opinions. Zero Standard of Proof.
The Proof of Intent goes hand in hand with Suicide, it must be proved Beyond Reasonable Doubt, it wasn’t. What Hutton took as proof of intent was that Kelly had removed his glasses and wrist watch and picked a nice location. Hutton did not explore the possibility of someone else removing Kelly’s glasses and watch and placing them with the body at Harrowdown Hill
The pathologist re-remembered something very important in 2010 that he had forgot or had not occurred to him in 2003, in his Post Mortem Report he said;
para 11 Conclusions
“It is noted that he has a significant degree of coronary disease and this may have played some small part in in the rapidity of death but not the major cause in the cause of death”
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20110628102955/http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Pages/DrKelly.aspx
Compare and contrast with 2010’s murmurings
“Dr Hunt says that unknown to Dr Kelly, he was suffering from a severe form of heart disease – atherosclerosis – which had left his arteries as little as a fifth as wide as normal. This left him at constant risk of heart attack and more likely to die from a slashed wrist, as his heart had reduced ability to survive sudden blood loss. If he had dropped dead in the canteen and you had seen his coronary arteries, you would have had a very good reason to believe that was the only reason he died. If you have narrow arteries, your ability to withstand blood loss falls dramatically.’”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1305159/Dr-David-Kelly-pathologist-Nicholas-Hunt-demands-inquest-Ive-hide.html
Many medical experts have suggested a major cause of Kelly’s death was due to Heart Attack / Arrest, the pathologist appears to have caught up with these experts however there is also very clear pathological evidence that Kelly died an extremely sudden death (not the very slow death concluded by Hutton).
……
Sorry no answers to how Kelly died only proof that it was covered up. For those that might like to speculate;
Why the is Heart Attack / Arrest theory important?
It has been suggested that some people in the cover up believed (because they were told) that Kelly died during an interrogation in a “safe house” and that, for “national security” reasons could not be revealed. Especially if those performing the interrogation were not British agents.
A further suggestion is that the Kelly family may have been informed that Kelly had been detained by the “security services” and interrogated about what he had blabbed, to whom and what else did he intend to leak?
The meaning of truth becomes very warped when “security services” come into the equation, they do not deal in the truth.
Whatever the truth of what actually occurred there are very few people party to that information, including I suspect Hutton, I suspect he buys into the Heart Attack version, there is evidence for this but it is circumstantial.
So the family believe that Kelly has been detained and he is confronted with some terrible evidence against him (remember if this did happen the family were certainly being told lies).
Kelly is confronted with horrible truths that will end his career, see his pension disappear, his reputation in tatters and possibly looking at jail time. This is told to the Kelly family.
They are told once confronted Kelly is left alone in a room to consider his position, he took a knife from his coat pocket (it resided there not in his desk drawer – Mai Pederon), when the spooks returned Kelly was dead.
Don’t believe this? Check out the security vetted psychologist that was employed by the police but kept secret from the Hutton Inquiry (not Hutton).
Gisli Gudjonsson, world expert in forensic psychology / false confessions who apparently spoke to many involved including the family, made a fascinating disclosure to author Robert Lewis, recounted in his book “Dark Actors: The Life and Death of David Kelly”;
“But that itself is only half the story, unless we’re supposed to believe our lovestruck inspector ended his life like an angst-ridden adolescent. None of it made sense until I spoke to Gisli Gudjonsson, Professor of Forensic Psychology at King’s College London, the man whose expert testimony helped overturn the convictions of the Birmingham Six and the Guildford Four. Gudjonsson acted as a security-vetted psychologist for Thames Valley Police when it investigated Kelly’s death, although his involvement only became known when the new Attomey General released a swathe of documents in an attempt to head off the legal campaign for an inquest.
`I suppose I can talk a bit about it now,’ Gudjonsson said to me. `Did he commit suicide? Yes, I believe so. His family were very cooperative with me. They were extremely helpful and open.’ ‘Well, why then?’ I asked. `Why did he do it?’ `I’m not sure I can really go into details, but he lost his security clearance. It was, definitively, the end of his career. And there were repercussions beyond that.’
At the time, the full extent of those repercussions did not occur to me. The most obvious effects were bad enough. Kelly was a year off early retirement. He had a top-security clearance that wouldn’t expire until three years later, long enough for him to bag a spot of lucrative freelance work in Britain or America, should he wish. In an instant, all that disappeared. He would never work in intelligence again. Even if the Ministry of Defence or the Foreign Office suddenly decided to put him back on the books, he would be out to pasture before his developed vetting could finish. And once he was pensioned off, there was no way he was getting back in. The door was slammed shut. The career he had carved out for himself since leaving Porton had collapsed.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ShRM5yFGoyUC&pg=PT280&dq=robert+lewis+dark+actors+google+gudjonsson&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjYrYDG5OXVAhWSHsAKHYBXApUQ6AEIJjAA#v=onepage&q=robert%20lewis%20dark%20actors%20google%20gudjonsson&f=false
Just why was this evidence kept away from the Hutton Inquiry?
Ok just one last explanation, to answer the ex Attorney General’s (Dominic Grieve) question in his contemptible statement to Parliament;
“If the body had been moved, then why, by whom and for what purpose?”
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201011/cmhansrd/cm110609/debtext/110609-0002.htm#11060943000003
When someone dies and left in the position they died in, within a short time (normally) blood pigment falls with gravity and stains (bluey / purply) the lowest part of the skin eg in contact with a floor.
Hypostasis / Liver Mortis / Postmortem Lividity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livor_mortis
If Kelly was on his back at the time of his death (or placed) and left there for a period of time, then one would expect Livor Mortis staining to show up along the lowest parts of the body.
If he had died sat against a tree then the Livor Mortis pattern would appear differently (bottom of the buttocks and along the bottom of the legs)
If Kelly was on his back after death and found sat against a tree, at the postmortem examination the Livor Mortis staining could betray that the body had been moved.
As it turned out the Livor Mortis had remained mobile (sometimes a natural phenomena, sometimes due to chemicals put into the body)
So if Kelly was moved from sitting against a tree to lying on his back a distance from the tree because of the fear of Livor Mortis giving the game away, they needn’t have bothered! Funny that!
Maybe someone’ is waiting for a particular narrative to ‘show up’.
Not sure what this means
Well said, Fordy, my man.
John smith was no saviour of labour – he was just as new labour as blair – he went down to the city of london in the “prawn cocktail offensive” which asked the city what they wanted labour to do (the answer was support the EU/erm). He was also an enthusiastic member of bilderberg (as opposed to the myth which says he refused to go). This is according to robin ramsay’s ‘rise of new labour’
https://www.lobster-magazine.co.uk/free/lobster63/lob63-new-labour.pdf
What is the origin of the phrase ‘Scot free’? I happened to hear it on TV tonight as in ‘She got away with it, Scot free’.
Sharp Ears, this is not a pub quiz, so I cheated…I think the answer is probably correct.
http://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2015/04/scot-free-origin/
So far as I recall “scot” refers to a kind of tax , duty or fee, hence “scotfree” means without any punishment, imposition or harm to oneself. It has noting directly to do with Scotland.
It looks like the Scandinavian “Skat” is the favorite source.
http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/scot-free.html
Is it a bit Irish to note that someone who Welshed on a bet gets off Scot free?
The analogy is not apt. The monuments to the Confederacy in the southern US were put up by the losers of the Civil War as a means of assuaging their humiliation, not by their oppressors as was the case in Scotland and other English colonies.
Scotland’s colonial elites are today still inflicting monuments on Scotland celebrating war criminals, such as the restoration of the “tower raised in memory of Field Marshal Earl Kitchener of Khartoum” at Marwick Head in Orkney.
Kittiwakes, puffins and gannets or wind turbines? That seems to be the question. ‘Businesses’ are appealing to the RSPB to drop the fight.
Suppliers unite in support of £2bn Scottish wind far
http://www.scotsman.com/news/suppliers-unite-in-support-of-2bn-scottish-wind-farm-1-4533196
RSPB loses legal fight against £2bn offshore windfarm in Scotland
Neart na Gaoithe project on east coast likely to go ahead after long-running court battle despite claim it threatens seabirds
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jul/19/rspb-loses-legal-fight-2bn-offshore-windfarm-scotland-neart-na-gaoithe
Mainstream Renewable Power was awarded exclusive rights to develop the wind farm in February 2009. They proposed using 125 3.6MW turbines or 75 6MW turbines to generate between 420 and 450 megawatts of electricity.
The scheme was given a Gaelic name – ‘Strength of the Wind’
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neart_Na_Gaoithe
Mainstream Renewable Power = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_O%27Connor_(businessman)
LED warning lights on the fan blades? Noise emitters? It needn’t have to be either or with sufficient will to solve the problem.
First goes the history then the culture then the language hey presto you have them where you want them,these tactics were tried world wide but were resisted none more so than in Eire they couldn,t defeat them but here in Scotland they found the most supine of races.The indoctrination/brainwashing of the UK is very subtle and invasive,the naming of streets erecting of statues etc are in your psyche every day from birth whether you like it or not.Nary a word about the horrors perpetrated on others by the Royals and their cohorts,we are a bunch of nancys who are prepared to fight and sacrifice for others yet won,t for their own.
Good for Mainstream Renewable Power.
Let’s pull down Martin Luther King’s statue as he was opposed to gay marriage.
Just sounding like looney Trump again.. Even Robert R. Lee opposed statues for victims of the defeated rebellion , indicating like King that it was rime to move on,
What Rebellion?
Certain States seceded from the Union – as they were perfectly entitled to do – there was no “Rebellion”.
That’s not what the Supreme Court ruled in Texas v. White in !869.
Get over denying what you don’t like.
I hope you won’t deny that some pretty abysmal law led to that decision:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._White
The dissenting justices rejected the majority opinion for different reasons. Grier, a “doughface” from Pennsylvania, was opposed to Radical Reconstruction and was primarily concerned with the bondholders. He felt that the Treasury lost any control over the bonds immediately after they were issued. Miller and Swayne were more sympathetic than Chase to the radical position. In a separate dissent they agreed with the majority that the bonds had been sold illegally by the secessionist government, but agreed with Grier that the current state of Texas was not a state within the meaning of the Constitution.[21]
(Wikipedia)
…and hence had no authority to prosecute the case.
On balance I think that the rulings on the Constittutional Amendments, especially the 14th one, offset the rough justice which had been decided on the battlefield
The fascist violence in Charlottesville was also aided and abetted by those who worked to get Trump elected during the presidential campaign, very deliberately and openly, and then downplayed the significance of his extreme right back-history and allies after his election and when he assumed power.
Like WikiLeaks.
Or as that a bit of history some people would rather be forgetten, when convenient?
Heathcote Williams, sadly no longer with us, composed this.
Donald J. Trump: president of the US plutocratic pornocracy
BY HEATHCOTE WILLIAMS
I don’t like to analyze myself because I might not like what I see – Donald Trump
On buying a beauty spot in Scotland for a golf-course
And for luxury condominiums,
Trump notices some old houses on the horizon
And he orders them bulldozed to oblivion.
On seeing a woman that he desires, he oafishly
Recommends “grabbing her pussy”.
He boasts that, ‘My fame lets me take liberties;
‘My fame allows me to abuse her.’
and so on. Too long to copy here.
https://www.prruk.org/donald-j-trump-president-of-the-us-plutocratic-pornocracy/
I went to a promenade theatre performance in Glasgow’s Merchant City recently. Lots of streets there are named after men from the tobacco and sugar trades. The show was about the women who had lived in the area, some well-known, some less so, and at one point we were given placards with their names on, to replace the street names as we walked through them. Only temporary, and onlookers will not have understood what we were doing, but perhaps a start.
Kevin McKenna, on indyref 2, get off your backsides, and become dissenters and agitators if you really want independence, we won’t win by being nice.
http://www.thenational.scot/politics/15475103.Kevin_McKenna__The_indywars_aren_t_a_bad_thing_____bring_on_the_disagreements/?ref=mrb&lp=9
“The only way to get anywhere with government, local and national, is to become belligerent”. As told to me by a government employee.
The latest and most expensive monument just sailed into Portsmouth Harbour.
I wonder how many poor souls around the world will be killed by that floating killer.
We build great ships in Scotland, pity they are used for destruction rather than joy.
Not much chance of that as due to the usual monumental incompetence by the UK Government we have an Aircraft Carrier without any Aircraft!
“pity they are used for destruction rather than joy”
Are you telling me that Scottish shipbuilders are so stupid they do not realize that they are building a warship? What possible purpose can a warship have other than inflicting death and destruction? It is not a pity it is inevitable that if you construct warships then they will be used to kill.
Loony,
Well I didn’t think of that, when I applied for a job at Hawker Siddely in Oldham in 1972. My brother-in-law didn’t think of it, when he applied for a job in London designing weapons of mass destruction 10 years earlier (he ended up in the same building as the Beatles (EMI)). He resigned – my sister couldn’t understand it – and divorced him. Meanwhile my nephew much more recently after his PhD in Maths at Cambridge, ended up designing Weapons of Mass Destruction in The Depths of Dorset. He too resigned and became a Catholic Priest.
You simply don’t think about these things..you just do it to get a job.
Fortunately, they didn’t offer me the job, however, I still ended up working on computer stuff destined for the MOD. I had no qualms about it..Some of my colleagues did, and I think my management were completely brilliant at allowing them to work on other projects, that had no connection whatsoever to do with war.
Maybe that is partially the reason I am so anti-war now.
Tony
Scottish shipbuilders are anything but stupid.
There are many types of ships that could be built in Scotland, such as Superyachts that cost almost as much as Warships, they bring joy.
Further more, there is a waiting list to have luxury boats built all over the world.
No shortage of money for them.
However, people need to earn a living, so we build them. Good bad or ugly.
The SNP might take a lead and start facing down Roothie/Duglugs/Meedja,we need some firebrands and stop hiding behind the “our hands are tied”,challenge them on everything at every turn,they have taken back steps too often far too often,show us what yer made of ffs.
Regarding Rape Clause Ruth-less Davidson, ex-convict Jeffrey Archer, who needed a plethora of editors and proof readers, with regards to his books. Has came forward and said that Davidson would make a excellent PM, Archer sees Thatcher in Davidson.
This dying unionist rag carries the tale.
http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/ruth-davidson-is-next-margaret-thatcher-says-jeffrey-archer-1-4530565
I’d imagine many Scots see Colonel Davidson as a modern day wannabe Thatcher.
That big gun between her legs made me laugh.
Jeffrey Archer, who needed a plethora of editors and proof readers, with regards to his books…
Needed,sure, but did he get them? The books are utter shite and even charity shops only use them for doorstops and propping up displays.
True, but alas there is no accounting for taste.
Archer has “written” 154 books and sold over 250 million copies. One wonders who the hell is buying them?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1278584/Jeffrey-Archer-Im-giving-away-100m-fortune–kids-look-themselves.html
Curiously, the Statue of Lenin in Seattle is still standing. The man was responsible for the deaths of millions.
No, keep it as a trophy for victory over the Soviets, like what my mother did with the Nazi flags my father brought back after defeating them, and made into curtains in the guest bedroom.
I’d seriously wonder about my hosts, if the room had swastika-styled curtains.
glenn, well I would as well. but I did meet Lemmy at the back of the Marquee in Soho, and he was the nicest bloke anyone could ever meet. He collected all this NAZI stuff, but he didn’t invite me to his houseboat on The Thames where he was living, so I never saw them. However he was Welsh, so that might explain it.
Hawkwind are still going. We may go and see them in Minehead next year. it would be nice in Dave Brock invited Nick Turner, cos Lemmy can’t make it.
Your fellow mates on their way to Scotland may understand.
I’m going the other way, but I wish Craig Murray well.
Tony
Ian Fraser Kilmister, otherwise known to us as ‘Lemmy’ was born in Stoke on Trent, agreed, at a time in the distant past that area would have been recognised as being Cymru but on Christmas Eve 1945, it was most definitely in England.
The Welsh can lay claim to all sort of things but Lemmy and his fascination with the Third Reich do not feature amongst them.
Another of the rock, pop, blues fraternity with a fascination with WW2 was/is John Henry Deighton, better known as Chris Farlow, his shop in Islington: ‘Call to Arms’ was a popular haunt for military re enactors and collectors. Always a good source of Nazi regalia in the 1970s.
You did not defeat them the soviet army defeated the German army.
I was only 16 then, and not in anyone’s army..
My father’s division certaily helped by cutting off the supply lines to the Panzer forces leading the Battle of the Bulge.
Correct Seydlitz. The Russian’s contribution to the vanquishing of Germany has almost been airbrushed from history. How many Russians died? Millions.
Well, the Russians had nothing to do with winning the Battle of the Bulge.
On the way, my father’s artillery blew up a statue of Kaiser Whilhelm along the Rhine at Koblenz on the orders of General Patten..
Have never airbrushed the Soviet contributions to the Allied victory over yhe Nazis.
Embarassingly Germany is ignoring the Soviet contribution to the victory over Nazi Germany although they had the biggest death toll by far. The Russians weren’t even invited for celebrations and no German delegation travelled to Moscow.
As a German I am really ashamed.
Btw.: statues of Emperor Wilhelm? There are many left. Sadly. One of his grandfather is standing close to where I live.
I’ll tell you what that particular statue has a interesting recent history, due to a Mr Carpenter.
The statute of Lenin has even been dressed up in drag, and made to look like John Lennon, as of 2015, the statute was/is for sale for a cool quarter of a million dollars.
It all began with the Velvet Revolution.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statue_of_Lenin,_Seattle
I think you’ll find your darlings Cameron and Hague have the blood of a few million on their hands. Boris and May have started a racist project called brexit which will shed lots more. These Tory draculas are frustrated at not being able to carve up the world in the manner they did before EU membership. They absolutely hate the EU restrictions on unfair trade and unjust laws. You always seem to be sucking on the dried up dugs of a much-hated former Tory prime minister, red in tooth and claw.
Trouble is, it’s not going to happen. At the conference season May and Boris will be quietly disposed of in the blue chemical of portable toilet. A fitting end to the failed project of Thatcherism. We are now entering the age of corporate manslaughter and banking accountablility. Nobody trusts the Tories any more.
Should the French tear down the statue of Lord Brougham for founding Cannes, and being a bitter opponent of the Napoleans?
We should erect a statue to Napoleon for helping to stock the British Museum’s Egyptian collection.
How about a statue for all those British soldiers killed during the cowardly Walcheran Mission against Napolean.
Good idea…there’s a few examples of command incompetence leading to mass mortality of our soldiers which could well be memorialised, and that’s one. Though I’d take issue with ‘cowardly’ There was no subterfuge involved: the intention was to take Antwerp, and it was a bold enough idea, if completely misconceived.
The soldiers just sat around in the hope of getting the French to attack the enclave which some discredited French Marshal was ultimately obliged to do, resulting in the mission’s withfrawal
Brougham said it was just another example of defeating the Emperor by having pin-picks around the world.
We are perhaps not talking about the same Walcheren? I am assuming you meant the expedition of 1809, whose objectives and scale seem to differ from your Walcheren Mission’s. Please clarify, in the light of this summary:
https://www.napoleon.org/en/history-of-the-two-empires/articles/walcheren-the-debacle/
Let’s tear down William Shakespeare’s statue because only 17% of parts in his plays are female.
Is that the William Shakespeare we think wrote the plays, or the William Shakespeare who almost certainly didn’t?
The jury’s still out but I’m standing with Mark Twain on the subject.
It would be a terrible injustice to discredit a man for something he never knew he’d done.
It is beyond doubt that some of Gandhi’s views on black Africans mark him as an out and out racist. Unsurprisingly therefore the good citizens of Ghana are pulling down statues of Gandhi.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/06/ghana-academics-petition-removal-mahatma-gandhi-statue-african-heroes
Almost contemporaneously with the anti racist stance of Ghana the British are busy erecting statues of Gandhi
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/14/new-gandhi-statue-unveiled-in-londons-parliament-square
What does all of this mean? Can it be that the British are reveling in naked racism by erecting statues to racists whilst non racists are busy pulling down statues of the same person.
Is it not fortunate indeed that cultural Marxists eschew reason – otherwise they would have a lot of explaining to do.
Let’s not forget that Albert Einstein had a problematic attitude towards women.
Clearly his nobel prize must be removed post mortem.
*sigh*
There are no perfect heroes.
Trump is so cornered that he has thrown in the sponge about hitting North Korea with fire and fury after it just delayed its plan rot hit Guam, and China said it would support Kim Jong-un if Washington attacked. What a clueless windbag!
I think this is an extremely good argument for Scottish Independence
“European Union citizens will be free to cross into UK from Ireland after Brexit, British Government admits”
Why not open up The Scottish borders too?
In order to come to England, you should first go to Ireland or Scotland…
Don’t the Welsh want to join in as well – or do they want to get out of The EU as quickly as possible too?
England Independent. Scotland,Ireland & Wales in The EU – Everyone Happy?
I just said to my wife, its getting like Oldham round here. Let’s move to India.
Tony
Despite receiving £6 billion in Region 1 funding, Wales, unlike Scotland remains a financial basket case, due, I suspect in no small part to politicians of staggering mediocrity.
£20 million was lost in a mismanaged sale of public land to a Welsh property developer based in Jersey. Well mismanaged was the expression used anyway, I couldn’t possibly comment.
Their vote in favour of leave, had I suspect more to do with the frustration they feel with appalling governance both in the Senedd and Westminster and their inability to change it.
Word rot should be to.
Winston Churchill’s statue opposite the entrance to Parliament has a column of fire inside it which makes the eyeballs glow red in the dark. However I doubt this supernatural phenomenon can be seen by ordinary mortals gawping at the motherfucker of all parliaments.
Are you having a laugh?
There cannot possibly be a statue of Winston Churchill anywhere in the UK. In 1899 Churchill wrote about “the dreadful curse of Mohammedanism” It is hard to imagine a clearer case of Islamophobia. I am confident that the British would never stoop so low as to erect statues to Islamophobes.
That was as nothing compared to what Churchill had to say about Indians and a good deal nearer to home, Welsh miners.
This statue of Churchill is at Woodford, Essex, his constituency.
https://www.londonremembers.com/memorials/churchill-statue-woodford-green
I suspect Winston Churchill’s views on the “lesser races” would make Robert Lee blush – should the Antifa thugs be allowed to tear down his statue as well?
giyane, Winston Churchill’s first job in the British Parliament was MP for Oldham. So you can blame us. I’ve never been that keen on NAZI’s and invasion either. However, its getting increasingly obvious that England, like Mecca is The Promised Land..it just gets a bot crowded at times.
My wife and I both love India.
Tony
In 1866 English Courts defined marriage as a “voluntary union between a man and a woman to the exclusion of all others”
This regressive and homophobic judgement served as to prevent same sex marriages. Victoria was the monarch, the Earl of Derby was Prime Minister and Disraeli was the Chancellor. None of these actors did anything at all to challenge or contest the homophobic court ruling.
The remedy is obvious – scour the land for statues to any of these individuals and tear them down. It is the only way to atone for historic establishment homophobia.
Loony,
I have never been homophobic, and no one I know is either, but some people take th p1ss – literally – whilst (my first experience of this was at work in about 1974) it is fairly rare – I found it somewhat embarrassing whilst having a wee at the urinals – and he was leering at me. He wasn’t even that good looking. The second time was in Turkey – whilst my wife was in bed. I went out for a smoke on the balcony (it was a cheap hotel – but bloody hell) I wasn’t expecting some bloke to try and pull me.
Why aren’t girls like this to me?
Tony
Normally the smoke alarms have been painted over. You should have stayed inside in the safety of your room
How about a petition to the Scottish Parliament to re-name certain streets and places? And of course a little sign which explains why a street was re-named: “This street was re-named because it was formerly named after a British warlord … who killed … Scots in the battle of … which took place to defend Scotland’s interests … . This British warlord is generally considered to be a warlord and war criminal.”
I am sure the Queen and the British aristocrazy and Whitehall are going to love this idea 😉
Btw. I am from Germany and apparently some military garrisons are still named after German war criminals (high-ranking officers and generals) of WWI and WWII. Current Minister of De_fence Mrs. Urs_ula von der Le_yen had promised to re-evaluate the names of all garrisons but it turned out she will have reviewed only 12 garrisons. She is a lot of hot air, really, but dangerous because she is re-building the German armed forces with dangerous intentions: German armed forces were built to merely defend German grounds – defensive only. Now they are being rebuilt to become more offensive – especially abroad. So far the German Parliament can veto any kind of mission of German Forces abroad but that veto might be disposed soon.
German Girl, I actually was very impressed with one of your female politicians, in much the same way that I was very impressed with Mhairi Black.
She is a German MP, of a minority party, and she stood up, and just told the truth in a very convincing style, about how the USA was attacking Germany – with its sanctions on Russia – and stated quite bluntly the implications in a similar kind of style that Nigel Farage did in the EU.
She demanded that The German Government Resist This American Attack on Germany
What’s her name? I bet you know.
Tony
Sarah Wagenlnecht ,Der Link. The Minority Left MP.
I am not overly familiar with the scope and range of statues in Germany. However perhaps it would be a wise precaution to simply tear down all statues in Germany.
I note that one Stepan Bandera has a fairly significant grave in Munich and that some wise Germans saw fit to desecrate the grave. Sadly I fear the Germans are not really keeping up with events. It is true that German Nazi’s are bad – always have been and always will be. However we are now very fond of Ukrainian Nazi’s – we send them money, we prop up their government and we pretend not to notice when they walk around in SS Uniforms. Modern Ukrainians are seeking to become more self sufficient – and have recently entered into a lucrative deal to supply North Korea with high end engines with which to power their burgeoning fleet of ICBM’s. We are very pleased with our current crop of Nazi’s.
Here is a brief clip of the German Green Party MP Dr. Von Berg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMDWAaxFnCA
Despite being German she seems to despise Germans. In the event that this is a popular view in Germany perhaps the British could sell you some statues of “Bomber” Harris – the man responsible for the destruction of Dresden. On second thoughts the British are almost certainly too lazy to pack and transport the statues – so it would probably be best if you could come and pick them up yourselves.
After removing all the statues that offend the politically correct, they will erect new statues that mock the past.
Melbourne’s upside down statue of Charles Joseph La Trobe:
http://www.onlymelbourne.com.au/statue-c-harles-la-trobe#.WZSI-FFLeic
(La Trobe was the first Lieutenant-Governor of Victoria who held office from 1839 to 1854 and helped establish the Royal Botanic Gardens, State Library, Museum of Victoria, National Gallery of Victoria and University of Melbourne.)
I gave up repairing old books – the decaying crusts of medieval theological bollocks newly imprinted on the propaganda tool of their time , paper.
All wrong. Waste of intellectual space. Their only value, like the Buddhas, is artistic or cultural, i.e the art or craft of printing and book binding or primitive stone-masonry as practised in history. Apart from that , the sooner they are removed, the better.
During the Soviet Union, the only case of using ricin in an assassination was that of Georgi Markov in London, said to be the work of Bulgarian intelligence for Moscow.
With the collapse of the USSR, Dr, David Kelly investigated the possible connection with it to Russia when he started to investigate Rissian violations of the 1972 Treaty againstr the use of Chemical and Biological Weapons, starting in 1988. It found none.
Though no sooner does Kelly return to the UK than Labour Leader and the apparent next Prime Minister, John Smith, only 57, suddenly drops dead. like I almost did in Sweden with a suspected heart attack though no evidence was found to support the theory.
They Kelly starts putting together a book about the use of these WMD, and is focused on Saddam’s possible possession and use of them.
Then he drops suddenly dead too after he is kidnapped along The Thames, smothered by his assailants ib the woods nearby, and his body is moved to prevent their possible identification.
Hr knew that Porton Down was involved.
A lesson can be learned from Paisley and Ahern who shook hands and planted a tree at the Boyne as a symbol of Irelands shared history rather than one of division.
Here are some progressive people tearing down a statue in Durham NC. They are doing so in order to demonstrate their virtue to the watching world who marvel at their selfless determination to spread love, joy, happiness, peace and tolerance throughout the world.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPYGmFpaPt4
Here is a BBC report regarding the destruction of the Bimiyan Buddhist statues by the Taliban.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-31813681
In sharp contrast to the necessary actions of tearing down statues in the US the actions of the Taliban “shocked the world” and paved the way for more recent “vandalism of Iraqi heritage sites by Islamic State fighters
The purpose of a public statue is to increase the size and awe of the individual, like that desolate Imperial charnel house St Pauls. Stick it on top of a giant memorial to the City of London with its infernal algorithms for nano-ising interest like a modern tower of Babel. And you can stick Big Ben into orbit for all I care. Why does no-one have a vision for the future of England cleansed from our colonial history and criminal forbears?
Because it is part of our history and destroying all the statues in the world won’t alter that. It can’t be cleansed from the record and these memorials should remain as a reminder.
Looking at the news footage of statues being pulled down in the US the crowds seem to be predominately if not wholly white. Presumably the black Americans aren’t too upset and are probably more concerned with the continuing prejudice they face in the 21st century rather than the events of 150 years ago. I get the impression this is more to do with removing “triggers” that might upset the Snowflake Generation and not any serious attempt to tackle present day racism.
Most people, perhaps almost all people, are against slavery.
The consensus of expert opinion is that the Egyptian Pyramids were constructed at least in part using slave labor. Given the content of your post I assume that you will be agitating for the demolition of the pyramids.
No doubt should the consensus of expert opinion change in the future you will be standing in line to reconstruct the same pyramids that your logic demands that you destroy.
All in the best possible taste as Kenny Everrett would say, flashing his drawers. The US stole most of Palmyra. What is it about empires and their stolen souvenirs?
In the interests of multiculturalism, probably…as long as it isn’t the local culture.
There are many statues in Glasgow, i confess to never having paid any attention to any of them.
There is one of Donald Dewer that used to sport a traffic cone at a jaunty angle. It always made me laugh to see him as the clown I believed him to be.
Americans, Irish, Uzbeks, Ukrainians, Pakistanis – They All Have More Balls Than We Scots
And it would appear Sarah Champion too has bigger balls than Jeremy Corbyn:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/16/sarah-champion-quits-jeremy-corbyns-shadow-cabinet-warning-pakistani/
“Trevor Philips, the former chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission, told The Telegraph: “I am absolutely gobsmacked, this is not the Labour party I know, even in the darkest days I don’t remember people being asked to stand down for trying to represent their constituents, which is what I think Sarah Champion was trying to do.”
Jeremy’s fans, be careful what you wish for.
Brought down by the same political correctness that hampered the police investigating these perverts.
Absolutely right. Has the political “correctness” become perverse in itself? Shameful.
Very sad, because I’m sure Ms Champion is not a racist and is a good, decent woman herself; standing up for the vulnerable young (inevitably white) girls.
Don’t let them shut you up Sarah; speak ever louder from the back-benches.
It is utterly pointless to complain about the colonial injustices of the British, whereby the oppressor class could pick any female or male they liked for their sexual gratification, and no doubt quite a lot of vice-versa when they were doing their Imperial duties, when our modern politicians are constructing a racist, xenophobic UK infrastructure under our very eyes.
Craig always links the 2 issues, historical oppression and modern xenophobia. Those who refuse to empathise with the victims of our UK oppression, do so because they want to construct a similar oppressive system themselves, with of course themselves on the upper hand.
Does Mrs May care about Muslim women still living in refugee camps in Pakistan 16 years after US carpet-bombing of Afghanistan? No, she wants a similar outcome for the conflict in Syria, whereby the country disintegrates into perpetual war. Otherwise why does she keep a Foreign Secretary who supports Al Qaida at the HoC despatch box?
Let’s deal with the utter hypocrisy of this Tory government first. After that we can engage social workers to give therapy to traumatised victims of K oppression and bronze-workers to melt statues of fat oppressors into ploughshares.
And we all trust the Telegraph to report the salient facts and create the context impartially. If you’ve ever read any story anywhere about events you witnessed, or compared witness accounts of any event you’ve witnessed, you know how hard it is to see anything objectively. The article you refer to is identical in tone and style to the years of bullshit I’ve seen on Corbyn, it clearly has an agenda to push and I wonder why it should be treated as an accurate appraisal of this situation, whatever that situation is.
Essentially, the story as reported in the Telegraph is Murdoch’s word against Champion. Should the context include the Murdoch empires war on democracy? His championing of every war? His hatred of the working classes he claims to speak for? His links with the Conservative and Neo-liberal establishment? His links with big oil? The two year Sun campaign against Corbyn? And then there’s the organised paedophilia in the BBC, Whitehall, American politics, the Catholic church, Belgium and well, globally. How does that fit with the story as described by Sun and Telegraph? It doesn’t quite, except in the single common factor here. Men.
I recall recently a campaign by the UK media backed by the establishment to ridicule and smear young well educated African activists who had the audacity to campaign for the removal of a Cecil Rhode statues located at Oxbridge(?). They were told to grow up, move on, stop worrying about the past.
Contrast that with today’s holier than thou judgmental guff directed toward the US and you can appreciate why the UK is currently held in such low regard on the global stage. A contemptible laughing stock to be honest.
Its great to be able to switch your conscience on and off like a light bulb. Maybe the UK media/establishment would be better served getting their own house in order, before twitching at the curtains gazing across the pond, no?
The US confronts and challenges its past on a daily basis, contrast with the UK unjustifiably glorifying its horrific past with never ending (white) pride.
“unjustifiably glorifying its horrific past” aptly describes every empire.