The mainstream media are making almost no effort today to fit Charlie Rowley’s account of his poisoning into the already ludicrous conspiracy theory being peddled by the government and intelligence agencies.
ITV News gamely inserted the phrase “poisoned by a Russian nerve agent” into their exclusive interview with Charlie Rowley, an interview in which they managed to ask no penetrating questions whatsoever, and of which they only broadcast heavily edited parts. Their own website contains this comment by their journalist Rupert Evelyn:
He said it was unopened, the box it was in was sealed, and that they had to use a knife in order to cut through it.
“That raises the question: if it wasn’t used, is this the only Novichok that exists in this city? And was it the same Novichok used to attack Sergei and Yulia Skripal?
But the information about opening the packet with a knife is not in the linked interview. What Rowley does say in the interview is that the box was still sealed in its cellophane. Presumably it was the cellophane he slit open with a knife.
So how can this fit in to the official government account? Presumably the claim is that Russian agents secretly visited the Skripal house, sprayed novichok on the door handle from this perfume bottle, and then, at an unknown location, disassembled the nozzle from the bottle (Mr Rowley said he had to insert it), then repackaged and re-cellophaned the bottle prior to simply leaving it to be discovered somewhere – presumably somewhere indoors as it still looked new – by Mr Rowley four months later. However it had not been found by anyone else in the interim four months of police, military and security service search.
Frankly, the case for this being the bottle allegedly used to coat the Skripals’ door handle looks wildly improbable. But then the entire government story already looked wildly improbable anyway – to the extent that I literally do not know a single person, even among my more right wing family and friends, who believes it. The reaction of the media, who had shamelessly been promoting the entirely evidence free “the Russians did it” narrative, to Mr Rowley’s extremely awkward piece of news has been to shove it as far as possible down the news agenda and make no real effort to reconcile it.
By his own account, Mr Rowley is not a reliable witness, his memory affected by the “Novichok”. It is not unreasonable to conjecture there may also be other reasons why he is vague about where and how he came into possession of this package of perfume.
The perfume bottle is now in the hands of the Police. Is it not rather strange that they have not published photos of it, to see if it jogs the memory of a member of the public who saw it somewhere in the last four months, or saw somebody with it? The “perpetrators” know what it looks like and already know the police have it, so that would not give away any dangerous information. You might believe the lockdown of the story and control of the narrative is more important to the authorities than solving the crime, which we should not forget is now murder.
The TRUTH has been murdered – that’s all
The most likely interpretation of this supposedly boxed and sealed perfume bottle is that it is different than the container supposedly used to contain whatever it was the Skripals were exposed to. That it is the same bottle is ludicrous. That it contains the identical material that contaminated the Skripals is also far-fetched.
If it really contained N, and Crowley opened it to insert the atomizer, he should now be dead along with his partner, who supposedly sprayed it on her wrists. If he was close to her when she did that, is another reason he should be dead. A candid interview with the Skirpals might clear some of this up. It seems that that is never gonna happen. I wonder why.
I’m going back to reading about Alice and the White Rabbit. Her story makes a lot more sense.
Nothing worse than a silent whore, I mean you pay them all that money, the least they could do is make an effort and pretend.
Journalists, on the other hand…..
Wasn’t it Isaac Babel who said that he was becoming “the master of a new literary genre, the genre of silence”. Journalists would be well advised to follow his example.
In the interview, Mr. Rowley understandably says he doesn’t want to go back to his home. Perhaps he can be provided a room at the very private, newly named, “Dawn Sturgess Memorial Home for Novichok Survivors,” where Yulia and Sergei Skripal apparently reside in quiet and peaceful solitude.
More seriously, the ridiculous stories put out by the UK government about these sad events deserve to be questioned. Although I’m not British, I applaud Mr. Murray’s public tenacity on this issue. Here in the US, I thought that at least the anti-Trump portion of the media would investigate this story as way to impugn Trump, since he mindlessly and immediately threw out Russian diplomats at May’s request. However, the US media has been very uninterested in the story, other than to parrot the UK government’s press releases.
“I applaud Mr. Murray’s public tenacity on this issue.”
Craig should perhaps liaise on the subject with George Galloway, who also has the bit between his teeth.
“However, the US media has been very uninterested in the story, other than to parrot the UK government’s press releases.”
US* government’s press releases you mean.
Obvious they are nit, they are in full red scare mode to block imagination & spread fear of annihilation. Else people might think about what recent wikileaks etc, releases actually show.
Eg, Thats it’s all internal messing really. And they are a totalitarian deeply corrupt establishment working against the population of the united states.
Obvious they are not*,
The US media is very selective on what they use to attack Trump.
For example, one of their main themes of their attack is that Trump colluded with a foriegn nation which helped him win the election in exchange of promises of a supportive policy once in office.
Two news stories have strongly supported this claim. However, both have gotten shoved down the memory hole. The reason being is that the media wants to tell a story about Russia, but the stories that supported the collusion claim involved the “wrong” foreign countries. The stories I am referring to were one that said that Trump’s son, Kushner, colluded with Israel concerning Israel’s desire to have the Obama administration veto a UN resolution condemning Israel in Obama’s final month, and the other was one of secret meetings between representatives of the Trump camp with representatives of Israel and the MBS regime in Saudi Arabia where they promised support for Trumps campaign and where the following Trump administration has strongly supported the goals of these foreign countries to the detriment of America.
But, since those stories involve the wrong ‘bad guy’, they have been pushed into the background while the volume on the fake and evidence-free claims of a Trump-Russia collusion keeps getting cranked up in apparent attempt to prove Goebbels old theory that if you tell a lie that’s big enough and tell it loudly and often enough then the people will believe it.
Unsurprising, Craig, as the function of MSM investigative journalists is to find out the Official Narrative and parrot it.
On a brighter note and now that the Supreme Court has ruled that those in an unhappy marriage must jolly well stay in it, we can expect sales of NoviSpray to rocket.
Two aspects of the Amesbury story should be summarily dismissed: ‘Novichok’ and ‘Perfume’.
Product tampering usually results in a public health warning and immediate product recall. The police already know the brand involved since they are reported to have retrieved the bottle in question. No alarm = No novichok.
The bottle Charlie Rowley describes in his interview with ITN was NOT a perfume bottle (see earlier posts by The Brave Adventurer, here: https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/07/the-holes-in-the-official-skripal-story/#tc-comment-title)
CR maintains it was a glass bottle, yet made no reference to having broken it (an earlier explanation for his own contamination). Instead the contents ‘poured…all over his hands’ (listen carefully to his various responses).
Not a perfume bottle = not perfume.
There was reference to the smell of ammonia once upon a time. Where did that come from? Charlie points us to the answer:
“Dawn was talking about finishing dying her hair, because she’d been dying her hair down by the river the day before.”
I doubt Dawn was a natural blonde. Peroxide is used by ladies to bleach their hair. Whenever female members of my family have done so in the past I detected a smell akin to ammonia (hydrogen peroxide per se is odourless apparently, but my experience was that of others utilising a commercially synthesised product).
Bottom line: the so-called ‘contamination’ was in fact co-incidental normal product usage (apart from Charlie’s spillage that is).
She was dying her hair down by the river? Uh? That is almost as odd as she said she had to go to the bath to lie down.
I expect she was using ‘sun in’ or similar – there are a few which are similar
https://sun-in.com/
And not take her clothes off before getting in it. Or did she forget to add water?
Btw. I’ve just this minute concluded an interesting conversation with my wife, who denies having used peroxide per se but directed me to her small array of proprietary products. One by Clairol in particular (Nice ‘n’ Easy) features both peroxide and ammonia. Furthermore inside the box are two plastic bottles and a separate pump/tube dispenser.
Charlie’s ‘perfume bottle’ story is looking increasingly less fragrant.
Just to be clear. Many non-perfume products without atomisers are sold with separately packaged pumps. But is any perfume whatsoever sold with a separate pump or indeed a separate atomiser?
I suspect Charlie Rowley may know very well the difference between a pump and an atomiser.
As I’ve opined elsewhere, I seriously doubt that whatever afflicted Rowley and Sturgess came from any bottle they may have handled between them, perfumed or otherwise. It’s a convenient (and mutually helpful) scapegoat.
My ex worked for years selling perfume and make up in high street stores, I asked about the separate nozzle, the answer was no never seen one like that for a perfume.
With the exception of inoa, all hair dyes do smell actively of ammonia . They mostly come in two tubes and you have to mix the contents . You certainly would take your clothes off and just put something old on while waiting for 40 minutes and then wash with a lot of water and shampoo .
That she did this by the river is not credible . Sounds rather Made up . They had a house or the shelter .
No known brand of perfume comes with an atomiser you have to assemble . So it’s all rather crazy.
Self assembly perfume bottles , dying hair by the river and going to the bath for a lie down . All a bit Much . This would make a brilliant thriller ( no disrespect to the poor lady ego died so tragically ).
“Self assembly perfume bottles , dying hair by the river and going to the bath for a lie down . All a bit Much .”
I quite agree. I think there is a reason for Charlie being ‘cagey’ and it has nothing whatever to do with ‘Novichok’ or perfume, bottled or otherwise.
2/3 Parallel events…
Monday 23/7/18
Start of the IICSA’s 2-Week Anglican Hearing into extensive child sexual abuse by Peter Ball (former Bishop of Lewes then Bishop of Gloucester) and whom was – allegedly ‘…not well enough to attend court in person’ nor able ‘to answer any questions by video link…’
This week (23/7/18) includes ‘witness’ George Carey (former Arch Bishop of Canterbury) answering questions in the IICSA court about his ‘actions’ – with respect to multiple allegations against Peter Ball – in his own role as the most senior leader of the Church of England combined with the most senior ‘Lord Spiritual’ with a powerful seat in the House of Lords.
https://www.iicsa.org.uk/investigations/investigation-into-failings-by-the-anglican-church?tab=hearing
Tuesday 24/7/18
Interview with Charlie Rowley. Widely reported in the MSM who’ve emphasised – but not substantiated – alleged links between the death of Dawn Sturgess and the ‘attempted assassinations’ of Sergei Skripal and Yulia Skripal.
*Notes that many senior Church of England clerics and Church of England Dioceses/Comms Teams all have an active (often daily) presence on Twitter. Again, none appear to be commenting on the extensive child sexual abuse being cross-examined in the IICSA court’s Anglican Hearing. See @JustinWelby (current Arch Bishop of Canterbury) or @C_of_E (the main Church of England Twitter feed).
At least one senior cleric, however, has sought to comment on the ‘Skripals/Salisbury poisonings’. See Nicholas Holtam, Bishop of Salisbury in various printed MSM press articles.
And in another branch of the parallel universe, no comment from Theresa even though:
1. Her father used to work for Peter Ball, as well as many others covered by this inquiry.
2. She’s normally big on Novichok stories.
It’s far more likely that the daughter brought this stuff back from Russia, dumped one unused, then used the other bottle to poison herself and her father in a suicide attempt that would put blame on the Russian government. We know from the evidence of Mr Rowley that it took five or ten minutes for his partner to become completely incapable, and the same or a little longer for him to become ill, so we could conclude reasonably that Yulia administered the compound (which is clearly not Novichok) to herself and her father after leaving the restaurant, and had a few minutes to dispose of the administration method prior to them both collapsing on the bench.
DNA results on the perfume box/cellophane will, of course, be instructive…
Rowley was contaminated at the same time as his partner Dawn (or even before, as he claims to have been contaminated whilst inserting the spray mechanism into the perfume bottle), he was clear,during the ITN interview, about having only handled the bottle once. He didn’t become ill for hours afterwards, having gone to collect his ‘script from Boots and then to a Hog Roast before returning home.
He washed his hands thoroughly straight away, he says. The Skripals fell ill at exactly the same time, indicating that a significant dose was administered to both at exactly the same time, and that means it was post-restaurant. Given that the Skripals have failed to say ‘someone rushed up to us and squirted something in our faces’ it’s therefore logical that it was self-administered….
The Skripals have said nothing about the affair other than what their MI5/6(?) handlers have told them to say.
We’ve only heard from one half of the Skripals, Yulia, who gave a scripted no-questions performance. The other half, Sergei, hasn’t been heard from at all.
There is a video of the public meeting held in Salisbury City Hall last night (Tuesday July 24th) for anyone interested:
https://www.spirefm.co.uk/news/local-news/2641742/salisbury–amesbury-latest-from-the-authorities/
an ode to Charlie & Dawn in this laughable scenario ….
Perfume In the Breeze
Agnetha Fältskog
The beach is a lonely place
This time of year
The mongers and the tourists
And the children
Have all disappeared
I’m not sure what happened
But it happened so fast
People say love like this can never last
But, what a night
What a night
What a night
I’m still not alright
Oh, you vanished
Like a rainbow
From the horizon of my heart
Left me seaside like a homeless
I pushed my sorrows in the car
Oh, you vanished
Like a shadow
Into the darkness of the seas
Maybe next time, my sweet lover
I’ll catch your perfume in the breeze
Flicking through channels on the TV set
To quiet my mind
Reality shows and the news replaces
The piece I can’t find
I’m not sure what happened
But it happened so fast
People say love like this can never last
Fortune tellers
And tarot cards
Can’t find…
There is a reason why England has come to this, there is no Shakespeare writing the Merchant of Venice because murdoch pays the mortgage, and presstitution is legal. And a wellby has risen to Archibishop and an oscar wilde heads the ES. But it will be another twenty years before 300 year old institutions collapse and prove Prophet Enoch Powell right. No whistleblowers, no integrity, no sacrifice, no consciounce, no morality among the many in the know. Scotland needs to break free before its share of national debt and 20% ECB guarantee surpasses Greek levels.
The Telegraph/ITV story – Even a five year old could come up with something more credible – this is just like a story written by an algorithm joining sentences together.
And those naughty Russians – the best way to hide the evidence is a) just get rid of it permanently or b) put it into a box and repackage it, just so that it looks like a branded perfume bottle and hope to god no-one ever finds it.
“We’re highly trained assassins, we have the manual to work by … let’s go for option b.”
Remember that the Brits were suggesting a few days ago they were about to name Russian suspects and also publish CCTV of them. They haven’t done it, have they?
This entire ridiculous story Mk2, is just pure distraction in an attempt to gain the sub 100’s attention to hate Russia, and the over 100’s attention talking complete and utter nonsense to each other in an attempt to cover up grievous crimes and incompetencies of our Governments, and their controllers which are still going on.
Best ignored, and so are they.
Get on with your own life, and do something more interesting instead.
Tony
Agree totally. Even discussing this stuff seriously gives legitimacy to utter nonsense. If they insist on foisting
fiction upon us under the guise of fact they could at least make it more like John Le Carre than Enid Blyton.
It all serves as useful distraction – people doing so even ‘legitimize’ the claim that the Skripals were poisoned by Novichok as opposed to some other similar (eg BZ) nerve agent.
It’s all a bit like whack-a-mole. Hit one for six and the ones scripting all this will throw out another ‘explanation’.
while it is entirely fair to blame MSM for both accepting the official version(s) wholesale and allowing the saga to vanish between the skripals and Amesbury, i’m not sure they are quite so culpable over the perfume bottle. I mean, what are you supposed to say? where can you fit it into any news bulletin? I thought one recent version had Charlie Rowley saying someone had dropped the bottle and it had shattered – hence no ‘container’ ‘item’ or whatever for the police to produce.
btw still no response to my formal question to MI6 via FCO about whether either sturgess or Rowley or both were known to UK intelligence services – they’ve had two weeks to think up a reply. will chase again later this week.
the police have said they found a small perfume bottle in Charlie’s flat containing novichok agent. Interesting they did not say they had found it before he regained consciousness. I am guessing he told them about the “perfume” and they went and referenced it and tested it and then told him it contained Novichok agent.
I colour my hair at home. The way it works with many home hair dye kits, is you pour the contents of small bottle A into larger bottle B which contains a separate liquid, screw the applicator top onto bottle B and give it a good shake to mix the two. Then wearing plastic gloves you dispense it onto your hair using the nozzle supplied with the applicator top.
According to a statement of Charlie’s from his ITN interview it seems the police found the bottle without guidance from Charlie but sought confirmation from him afterwards:
“When the police came round…when I came round weeks after, and the police mentioned a bottle they’d found in the flat, they run tests on it and I can pretty much guarantee that the contents in the bottle was perfume and it was nothing to worry about and they run tests on it and I was in complete shock when they told me it was Novichok.”
Hmm..he does not say that he identifies it as the same bottle…
Does anyone get the feeling that they’re being cheated?
Yes, I paid twice for my iPhone. Once through the state sector, R&D etc, Who then hand off to their other hand, The corporate state, who I pay again.
And it’s not what I wanted anyway. A tool for monitoring & control by those who ripped me off in the first place.
@ Ishmael July 25, 2018 at 15:38
And that harms your health through non-ionising radiation.
https://forbiddenknowledgetv.net/first-5g-rollout-in-ca-causing-brain-damage-to-firefighters/
‘Firefighters in California counties from San Francisco to Sacramento to Los Angeles, have reported severe neurological damage, headaches, insomnia, memory problems and confusion after 5G towers were installed outside their stations. When tested, they were found to have brain abnormalities and measurable neurological deficits and firefighters have now filed to be exempt from the California law that would enforce the installment of 5G towers near their places of work.
When their fire stations were relocated away from 5G transmitters, firefighters claimed their symptoms stopped. More shocking (no pun intended) was that the radiation levels measured were just 1-2/1,000th the FCC’s allowable “safe” limits for non-ionizing radiation. In other words, the FCC considers radiation levels 1,000 times higher than those which debilitated strapping firemen to be safe!……’
It’s no joke – they’ll be rolled out here soon.
Thanks.
Though myself I don’t use it as a phone.
The things are also Toxic to human health via posture alternating also. & brain function. Use it loose it. .
or* loose it
“The Russians did it” No.
The British Government did it.
The perfume bottle and its contents were prepared at Porton Down and collected by the Skripals early in the morning of the day they were poisoned – the police have a record from 8.30am that day of the Skripal car on the East side of Salisbury (the opposite side of town to Sergei Skripal’s home) at a roundabout which leads back from the chemical weapons facility a few miles along the road.
It’s worth remembering that these perfumes can be tiny – for example, Chanel No5 starts at a 7.5ml bottle (for £85)… properly prepared, this would make them an ideal candidate to use for a young woman to carry a tiny amount of deadly nerve agent across international borders without raising suspicion.
The bottle was intended to be smuggled back to Moscow by Yulia Skripal when she returned there after the short visit to see her father. Sealing to the item in a cellophane wrapper – as if brand new – would further lessen the risk of airport security opening the package to inspect its contents. I imagine she would also have carried a fake shop receipt to show – if necessary.
Once back in Moscow Yulia would have quietly handed the item on to the next person along in an organised chain and disappear back into her ordinary life. The end of that chain – which began in Porton Down – would have seen the chemical agent used in an attempted assassination of a target at the very highest level of Russian Government. The agent was purposefully manufactured to replicate those of the Novichok type so that a subsequent search for the perpetrators of the murder would not extend to anyone, or any party, beyond Russia’s own boundaries (the ‘evidence’ would have incontrovertibly made it an ‘inside job’).
As we now know, the perfume bottle and its wrappers were compromised from the outset – poisoning the Skripals who tossed the tiny package into the undergrowth (in an urgent and desperate measure they saw as vital to their own survival at the time). It was found several months later by Charlie Rowley who, quite understandably, gave it as a present to his girlfriend.
Any investigation into possible perpetrators of an illegal event would not be thorough unless it included ALL parties with a known connection to the location, to the people involved and to the objects which were a part of it. Given that, one party which must come high up on the list of suspects is the British Government.
Sorry but there are too many holes in this theory to count. The biggest of all being they decided to go to the pub and then a restaurant after they saw the package as compromised. Surely they would have urgently returned to their handler or Porton Down.
Identifying the package as possibly being compromised is, I expect, the last thing the Skripal’s did whilst retaining any semblance of consciousness. Up until that point they probably reacted to their creeping unwellness in the same way most of us do… at first writing it off as, say, a touch of car sickness… then guessing if the upset was due to something they’d eaten that day (and wondering where it might end)… before worrying if they were coming down with a severe bout of the flu (etc). It’s likely that it was only with the onset of LSD-like hallucinations that they deduced the package they carried as being the source of their ever-worsening woes. By which stage, of course, they were too incoherent to do anything much more than fling it away in the hope that their condition might improve without it.
Furthermore, if the highest chemical agent experts in the land provided me with reassurances that the toxin they’d prepared was tested safe, secure and fit to carry, I tend to believe them… until near-fatal experience proved otherwise.
Charlie said it was an unopened box and he and gave it to Dawn as a present. He said he found it a few days earlier. After 4 months in the long grass – a cardboard box lying on the ground for 4 months – during snow melting and rain. What would it have looked like? Hardly the stuff of presents. This is the English Spring we are talking about. In any case I imagine it would have killed a curious fox long ago.
As a matter of interest, who would we be assassinating at the top of the Russian government and why?
This late spring and summer have been noted for the lack of rain and its clement temperatures… which have no doubt contributed in keeping the item in a fairly good condition. Undergrowth would not only have made the item difficult to find, but provided a leafy canopy as yet more protection to the item becoming degraded. I imagine the box would only have been slightly faded and with a light coating of mottled dust to the cellophane wrapper when Charlie found it. Thinking it unopened and brand new, I would’ve done exactly the same as he did if I’d come across it (as, I expect, most men would).
As for its intended target – President Putin… the hated scourge of all globalist politicians and, at that time, preventing the West’s narrative on Syria with the success of Russia’s heavy militarily backing for the equally despised Assad regime.
I don’t know where you are getting your weather information from but there were heavy snowfalls in Salisbury during March. More than sufficient to render any cardboard box soggy and unattractive
https://www.spirefm.co.uk/news/local-news/2530434/mini-beast-from-the-east-brings-more-snow-to-salisbury/
Reply to MaryPaul (below)
“I don’t know where you are getting your weather information from but there were heavy snowfalls in Salisbury during March. More than sufficient to render any cardboard box soggy and unattractive”
My theory doesn’t rest on whether the perfume box was in pristine condition or a “soggy and unattractive” mess, Mary. I would expect that the Skripals – although in dire straights by then – still had enough of their wits about them to realise how dangerous the package they were carrying was and make as much of an effort as they were still able to hide it. Easily done if there are many hedgerow and bushes around to kick it beneath and cover with whatever organic matter lay there. Such a sheltered position would in itself have protected the package from the worst of the snowy whether that was to come later in March… along with the cellophane wrapper providing a further degree of moisture-proofing (as it is designed to do).
When found, I expect is was in a condition whereby Charlie could easily see that, though its packaging was somewhat degraded, the item was still identifiably ‘new’ – as in unopened and unused – with the glass bottle therein likely to be unchanged from a factory-fresh one. It would have seemed an especially attractive find if the item was an identifiable, expensive brand (of the sort women typically acquire as a treat when travelling through airports).
‘…As for its intended target – President Putin….’ I’ve read a lot of stuff denigrating Putin but, thus far, he hasn’t been accused of using women’s perfume.
@ Robyn.
Haha. It’s worth considering that the molecular facsimile of a Russian Novichok agent manufactured at Porton Down wasn’t ONLY intended to assassinate the country’s president. By tying the agent, at a forensic level, to Russia’s own chemical weaponry it was intended the aftermath to be one of total political chaos within the county’s government agencies and institutions… with accusations and counter-accusations, retributions, arrests and a political civil war in the scramble of various power-bases to gain the upper hand in producing Putin’s successor.
In short, Russia would be in exactly the position Globalist western governments want it to be in (and Trump would have lost the counterpart he was making overtures of detente towards).
I suppose there are no long grass in March, no dense foliage on bushes. It is misteriously surived in bare park.
I grew up in the UK countryside. It’s rare to see the actual earth in wild and uncultivated areas – there’s usually layers of mulching leaves (from the previous autumn), perennial ivies, hardy weeds, brambles, dead twigs, etc. It’s common these days to see areas of parkland left to pass though the seasons in their own natural way – rather than being overly manicured as they once were.
Where’s Anon1 –and his dog– when you need him.
This is one the best theories I’ve read, but it does not explain how Sergei and Yulia got poisoned. Was there a second package they (or someone else) opened?
Only one package – discarded in the undergrowth by the Skripals when it dawned on them that it was slowing killing them and later found by Rowley. Unopened (in its cellophane wrapper), but an infinitesimal amount of the bottle’s lethal contents had someone seeped through resulting in serious skin contamination for anyone handling it.
“…SOMEHOW seeped through…”
“The agent was purposefully manufactured to replicate those of the Novichok type so that a subsequent search for the perpetrators of the murder would not extend to anyone, or any party, beyond Russia’s own boundaries”
Russian intelligence and security know that many countries can manufacture substances “of a Novichok type”.
Yes, but only world-renowned Porton Down may have the collective expertise, the facilities and the gathered intelligence to manufacture a facsimile copy – molecularly identical to a known Russian Novichok. Crude copies of the agent would have had the opposite effect to the one intended… by convincing the Russians the assassination was an ‘outside job’ (at least outside of its own government agencies and institutions).
Mi6 have a technical department located at sF@C building just outside Milton Keynes.
Known in the James Bond movies as Q department.
Also as Craig will be aware there is always the diplomatic bag to overseas embassies which is often used for smuggling items which need to avoid customs examination. The bags can be defined to be as large as a shipping container.
The risks in transporting this lethal material must have been fully evaluated out the outset of the operation. This would have included an assessment of all possible outcomes in the unlikely event of a package failure whilst in transit (as, of course, it went on to do). And those calculated outcomes – both geopolitically and (possibly) militarily – would have been largely determined by who was in possession of the material at its point of failure. The situation may be bad now, but it would have been immeasurably worse if this failure had happened whilst the material was in the possession of a member of HM Government’s diplomatic service… it could, for example, have been interpreted as a State’s act of war by the target the material was obviously intended for.
It makes perfect sense for the British Government to limit this operation to a chain of anonymous Russian nationals – beyond its initial preparation and supply of the chemical agent.
Mi6 have a technical department located at sF@C building just outside Milton Keynes.
Known in the James Bond movies as Q department.
Also as Craig will be aware there is always the diplomatic bag to overseas embassies which is often used for smuggling items which need to avoid customs examination. The bags can be defined to be as large as a shipping container.
My secret source explains all https://patrickarmstrong.ca/2018/07/25/the-novichok-tales-part-%e2%88%9a-1-section-deux-bis/
brilliant
I am tempted to take this latest information and try to work it into some sort of theory. But, then I have to stop and remind myself that at this time we only have the information that has been released to us by the police-media-complex. And, since the entire story they are telling seems patently absurd, I have no trust at all in the information that has been officially released. Thus, any theory that might be build upon such carefully released evidence is like building a sky-scraper on quicksand. If there is great reason to doubt the information one has, then any theories build on that information are even more doubtful.
Note for instance that this person has been set up in an interview with one and only one interviewer. The resulting interview has been highly edited before being released. Presumably, the authorities picked the ‘best’ interviewer they could. Not the best in asking penetrating questions and getting to the truth like Perry Mason cross-examining a witness. But, ‘best’ in the authorities mind would have meant the one most trusted to put together the story that the authorities wanted to be told. This is very different from having an open press conference where journalists could openly ask questions of this man. That would have in the old days been the preferred method of having someone tell their story when many, many journalists wanted to cover the story.
Also, remember that this man is being kept secluded in a ‘safe location’. The UK authorities openly say they do not believe he was the intended target of an attack. Its not like he’s a super-secret UK spy rescued from Russia who needs witness-protection style protection. They say he was not the target, and that there would be no reason for targeting him. Thus, it should be perfectly safe to release him back into the general population since no one is targeting him. But instead he is kept secluded in a safe location. The only reason for this would appear to be to limit people’s access to him and to keep him from telling people what actually happened. Instead, we get this show-trial staged interview with one trusted member of the police-media-complex which is then heavily edited before the public is allowed to see it. And even then, the best they could come up with was this story that does not fit the previously released versions of the supposed truth put out by the UK government. The conclusion is that they can not get this man to tell the story they want told. He tells a different story, which then has to be edited down to something vaguely like what the authorities want told, which doesn’t even really make much sense but which was the best they could do with the available video of the interview.
Yes.
You’ve touched upon the absurdity of even a small thread in this elephant of a farce.
But since this farce is official, it MUST be deconstructed.
That effort in itself is NOT farcical, as some believe,
To the contrary.
It is essential to the mental sanity of anyone hearing about this and being so grotesquely misled.
open message to Mark Zioberg:
Underneath everybody’s clothes we are all NaKeD – deal with it!
Hamish de Bretton-Gordon, a former top British Army/NATO CBRN officer, who in a February 2016 interview with Australian ABC News has claimed to run 32 hospitals in ISIS-held territory and is suspected of running the White Helmets propaganda operation, also holds the position of Managing Director CBRN at Avon Protection, the “global leader in respiratory protection system technology”. He receives direct financial benefit from any kind of chemical scare — be it in Syria or in England — due to increased sales of chemical protection equipment. Avon Protection is owned by Avon Rubber plc, which is a public company. Here are the latest sales announcements and investor holdings disclosures for Avon Rubber (full list of news archived at https://web.archive.org/web/20180725131234/https://www.marketbeat.com/stocks/LON/AVON/news/):
December 6: Avon Rubber Secures USD14 Million Order From US Defense Department
January 24: Kempen Capital Management Builds 4.0% Avon Rubber Stake
January 29: Avon Rubber Wins Further USD13 Million Mask Order From US Military
February 9: JPMorgan Asset Management Increases Stake In Avon Rubber
February 15: Avon Rubber Signs GBP19.0 Million Contract With UK Ministry Of Defence
June 8: Capital Group Companies Ups Stake In Avon Rubber To 5%
July 17: Avon Rubber Wins Further USD25 Million Mask Order From US Military
Notice how Kempen Capital Management buys a 4% stake just 5 days before Avon Rubber wins a large order from the Pentagon. Similarly, JPMorgan Asset Management buys a 4.77% stake just 6 days before Avon Rubber wins a large order from the UK MoD. At least The Capital Group Companies has the decency to buy its 5% stake a good 40 days before the public announcement of the new order, upholding the illusion that asset management companies and retail investors are somehow on an equal footing. Insider trading laws are for the poor.
Interesting stuff.
Well done.
A costumed thug working for a billionaire oligarch and openly carrying a submachine gun has been caught on film punching a woman from behind at one of the oligarch’s properties in Berkshire..
Reports of this crime can be filed with the police by dialling 141 and then 0800 555 111 or using the Crimestoppers website.
The tragicomical aspect of this is how many grown-up people with various functions and in various (high) positions are involved in this make-it-up-as-you-go-along attempt at stitching together an event, a story. But the only story is their failed attempts, one death, and three (or four) surviving victims whose lives have been permanently altered, presumably against their will.
– the whole thing is very offensive to the average intelligence
– it is more proof of how the government(s) hold us, the citizens, in the lowest esteem (which we, sadly, also deserve)
– money and resources that could and should be dedicated to improving our lives and our humanity are being wasted on theatre of the absurd on a grand scale
– it is a colossal waste of everybody’s time which could be spent on making this world a decent place for everyone in it; on so many fascinating, purposeful projects already afoot and those yet to be imagined
– it is evidence of government “creation of facts’ for destructive purposes; of pushing the very idea of truth, trust and accountability out of reach
– it is psychological warfare against own citizens and all citizens everywhere.
Enough is enough, don’t you think?
Surprised they’re not going down the route of pointing the finger at Rowley, and perhaps his partner, as accomplices and possibly the ones who dosed the door handle for whichever agency was behind the initial poisoning.
The timing of their poisoning short on the heals of large sums of money going to other victims might be noteworthy. As might the not wanting to return.
I wouldn’t take him at his word as to not remembering where he got the poison.
Journalists, unfortunately, require access to survive. When it is access to officials or access to nothing, they rationalise.
I simply no longer visit Guardian, DT, Spectator websites any more. I read no ‘news’ at the Mail, Express, Sun, Star or Mirror. Nor the BBC.
I am almost ready to boycott BBC sport and DM sport website as they are now celebrity-driven channels for Us takeover.
I may click thru the odd web link from duckduckgo.com, but I never type in their website URLs to make a decision to visit their websites.
The circulation of German newspapers dropped about 50 percent in the 12 months after January 30, 1933. They were no longer worth reading.
I’m wondering if we should have an Orwellian Dystopia Clock, like the Doomsday Clock. I’m not quite reading the time as 2 minutes to thirteen, but it’s getting late, we’re at the bar and should really go home while we can, but I suspect we won’t.
Totally agree, I did the same 2 years ago, the radio and tv are intact because I do not express my anger on/at them!
thatcher’s legacy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHBRjERga38
Hatuey, your repeated attempts to get everyone here to stop discussing this matter remind me of the Aesop fable about the fox that lost his tail and then tried to convince all the other foxes to get rid of their tails.
Thanks for the remind.
And yet he keeps producing large slabs of text — fortunately most of them unreadable even from a first impressionistic glance because of the lack of whitespace and paragraphing.
Hey guys, sorry in advance for my english. I dont see anyone mentioning the mysterious BZ agent that was supposedly found in the samples sent from porton down to the swiss opcw lab. This was a big story in russian media, but unsurprisingly ignored here in the uk. Even Mr Lavrov, russian FM, has raised this issue in one of his interviews.
Apparently, russian intelligence services got access to the report the swiss lab made on the samples sent from porton down for independent confirmation of novichok. The report stated that samples contained undegraded novichok of high purity and degraded BZ agent. The report was used by porton down as official confirmation by opcw of novichok presense, with no mention of the BZ agent at all, untill the russian intelligence got a hold of the report and questioned it.
Apparently the response from porton down was that BZ agent was added as a ‘control’ substance, which is apparently ‘common practice’ to verify credibilty of a independent lab findings. Now, knowing the samples taken from skripals were a few weeks old by the time they were sent to the swiss lab, shoudnt it have been the other way around: degraded novichok and high purity undegraded BZ agent, if it was ‘added’ as a control substance?
Now if we imagine that the original samples contained BZ and novichok was the added substance it explains quite a few anomalities in this case.
BZ is a non lethal, incapacitating agent, with delayed symptoms after several hours, and symptoms similiar to those described by the whitnesses, who saw the skripals in the park. Which explains why the skripals survived, why the symptoms appeared several hours after poisoning (if they were poisoned at home), the need to dispose of their pets (if they were poisoned at home), their full recovery. Then novichok was added to the door handle the same way it was added to the opcw lab samples.
So the intention wasnt to kill but only to poison and dress the posinong as attempted murder by the russian state using novichok. Then the reappearnce of eau de novichok in amesbury a few months later to support the original version when the original version started to be questioned increasingly due to lack of proper evidence after 4 months and russian media and officials continuously picking holes in it.
Important points. One needs to follow the official statements (and pardon for my English too, not a native speaker and writing in a hurry). To reply to your points: It was the reply of the OPCW that BZ was used as a control substance. They said nothing about the Novichok, which according to Lavrov was of the very lethal A-234 variant. The problem here is: Which samples contained what? It is also not a hundred percent clear to me whether the OPCW experts personally took the blood and tissue samples. A close reading of Lavrov’s statement does not help. In any case, A-234 could not have been a control substance as this would have given away that not only Russia can produce it.
Some more thoughts (and sources) here:
https://off-guardian.org/2018/07/10/second-salisbury-alleged-poisoning-still-more-questions-than-answers/#comment-125785
This theory is not new on here. It is the favorite of myself and many on this board.
Anyone know what this is about? I have not heard of her.
http://news.sky.com/story/labour-mp-fiona-onasanya-charged-with-perverting-course-of-justice-11448580
i believe she is being charged with conspiring with a relative to avoid penalty points for speeding
Gosh, that’s important.
MaryPaul,
That was quick do you work for the Sun? It’s just been updated.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6864027/labour-mp-fiona-onasanya-to-stand-trial-after-being-charged-with-perverting-the-course-of-justice/
no
Here is another inerview with Victoria Skripal, for those who can read russian (or use Google translate)
https://echo.msk.ru/programs/razbor_poleta/2185506-echo/
Some new information from it
– Yulia visited her father often, something like every 3 months.
It makes me think, that Sergei’s surveillance didn’t like these visits. Perhaps they were afraid that some important information could leak to Russia through Yulia.
In case you missed another phone conversation
https://youtu.be/HpK5syBZjgY
Yulia blames Victoria for making the story public. She says it is the obstacle for her, preventing Yulia from returning to Russia.
It corresponds to the first information on Skripals, it was reported about Sergei and unknown woman. Victoria says, it was her who phoned to Britain and said “it is his daughter Yulia”. Pets were found after Victoria’s question about them, too.
Highly likely that Victoria spoiled the initial plot.
Interviewer for ITN: “Is it a case of…it’s unlikely anyone will end up in court?”
Charlie Rowley: “I’d like to think so. But I don’t know.”
Wrong answer there, Charlie.