My world view changed forever when, after 20 years in the Foreign Office, I saw colleagues I knew and liked go along with Britain’s complicity in the most terrible tortures, as detailed stunningly in the recent Parliamentary Intelligence and Security Committee Report. They also went along with keeping the policy secret, deliberately disregarding all normal record taking procedures, to the extent that the Committee noted:
131. We note that we have not seen the minutes of these meetings either: this causes us great concern. Policy discussions on such an important issue should have been minuted. We support Mr Murray’s own conclusion that were it not for his actions these matters may never have come to light.
The people doing these things were not ordinarily bad people; they were just trying to keep their jobs, comforting themselves with the thought that they were only civil servants obeying orders. Many were also actuated by the nasty “patriotism” that grips in time of war, as we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. Almost nobody in the FCO stood up against the torture or against the illegal war – Elizabeth Wilmshurst, Carne Ross and I were the only ones to leave over it.
I then had the still more mortifying experience of the Foreign Office seeking to punish my dissent by bringing a series of accusations of gross misconduct – some of them criminal – against me. The people bringing the accusations knew full well they were false. The people investigating them knew they were false from about day 2. But I was put through a hellish six months of trial by media before being acquitted on all the original counts (found guilty of revealing the charges, whose existence was an official secret!). The people who did this to me were people I knew.
I had served as First Secretary in the British Embassy in Poland, and bumped up startlingly against the history of the Holocaust in that time, including through involvement with organising the commemoration of the 50th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz. What had struck me most forcibly was the sheer scale of the Holocaust operation, the tens of thousands of people who had been complicit in administering it. I could never understand how that could happen – until I saw ordinary, decent people in the FCO facilitate extraordinary rendition and torture. Then I understood, for the first time, the banality of evil or, perhaps more precisely, the ubiquity of evil. Of course, I am not comparing the scale of what happened to the Holocaust – but evil can operate on different scales.
I believe I see it again today. I do not believe that the majority of journalists in the BBC, who pump out a continual stream of “Corbyn is an anti-semite” propaganda, believe in their hearts that Corbyn is a racist at all. They are just doing their job, which is to help the BBC avert the prospect of a radical government in the UK threatening the massive wealth share of the global elite. They would argue that they are just reporting what others say; but it is of course the selection of what they report and how they report it which reflect their agenda.
The truth, of which I am certain, is this. If there genuinely was the claimed existential threat to Jews in Britain, of the type which engulfed Europe’s Jews in the 1930’s, Jeremy Corbyn, Billy Bragg, Roger Waters and I may humbly add myself would be among the few who would die alongside them on the barricades, resisting. Yet these are today loudly called “anti-semites” for supporting the right to oppose the oppression of the Palestinians. The journalists currently promoting those accusations, if it came to the crunch, would be polishing state propaganda and the civil servants writing railway dockets. That is how it works. I have seen it. Close up.
Boris Johnson’s press boy“A source close to Mr Johnson” told the Press Association: “It is ridiculous that these views are being attacked – we must not fall into the trap of shutting down the debate on difficult issues.”Since when was “You look like a letterbox” either a “view” or a contribution to a “debate”.
When I say Johnson looks like a mass of waste on a barber’s shop floor, I’m not trying to debate with the Old Etonian fucker.
It sounds to me as though Bannon etc. are behind this latest Trumpian move by Johnson. It may suit some that Johnson makes a bid for the prime ministership, and among their number, some may even believe that a bid could be successful. But there will come a day when the support will swing behind Bannon’s fellow “Catholic traditionalist” Jacob Rees-Mogg. That’s my prediction. Never underestimate a man who’s got a quarter of the cabinet in his organisation without himself even being in the cabinet, who set up a company that manages funds worth billions, who is worth nine figures himself, and whose dad was editor of the Times.
Boris Johnson is likely seeking to appeal to a wide audience, and his words have been chosen to be of interest to the masses. If you don’t like that then maybe you ask some questions as to the efficacy of British state education – you reap what you sow and all that.
Steve Bannon is indeed after the radical left – and guess what most people support him. You don’t like that then try explaining to people how unlimited immigration is going to work out when the population of Africa is going to increase by 1 billion people in the next 50 years. Do you really propose to bring in an extra billion people?
Yes things are getting ugly – and they are going to get a lot uglier. And the reason is that the people have been lied about substantially everything for a generation. Take a look at accelerating crime levels – people don;t like being stabbed, chopped up with machete’s, run down, and generally brutalized. Politicians obsess over “hate speech” and couldn’t care less who gets chopped. People do not like this set of priorities.
Let’s leave the EU – let’s not leave the EU, let;s pretend to leave the EU. If we leave the EU then you will all starve to death – just like you did before 1973 when millions of emaciated people tried to live on grass. It is all a farce and people are fed up. When they are as fed up as they are now then they are going to start to look for more radical solutions. The more the elite scream racist, and bigot and feign outrage then the more determined the people will become.
Donald Trump is a Nazi. US emission levels are falling. No, they must be rising. Oh they are falling it must be because Donald Trump has destroyed the economy. Black unemployment is at historic lows – must be because Trump is trying to reintroduce slavery.
Is it right? No. Who has caused most of this – the sneering liberal elites who no longer even bother to hide their contempt for the mass of the population, and who last saw the truth at the same time they last saw 6 headed space aliens.
use of a phrase like “liberal elite” really does make you a lunatic
Daimler are falling into line following Trump’s threats on trading with Iran.
Link
Daimler Shelves Iran Expansion Plan on U.S. Trade Sanctions
7 August 2018 12:13 BST
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-07/daimler-scraps-iran-expansion-plan-because-of-u-s-sanctions-jkjijlfl
Trump has his blowtorch alight and he is applying it to Iran.
@ Sharp Ears August 7, 2018 at 17:24
Daimlers. already? Iran needs Daimlers, when they have the perfectly serviceable Paykan? It’s called ‘cutting off your nose to spite your face’, a ‘Bubus Orangicus’ speciality (or M. O.).
@Paul Barbara, If you go to Iran, you will see very few remaining Paykans (Hillman Hunter), but plenty of Kias, Hyundais, Renaults, Peugeots, and of course various newer cars actually manufactured in Iran.
@ Andyoldlabour August 8, 2018 at 09:11
I was last in Iran in 1975. Seeing as Iran can still produce it’s own cars (unlike us) it seems strange they would import all these other foreign cars. That could change, if more countries kowtow to US sanctions threats.
Do you know that in Iran Insulting the Prophet, Apostasy, homosexuality, adultery and non violent drugs offences are all punishable by death. The Judiciary has limited discretion not to impose the death penalty on children who may have committed any of these offences.
So, is President Trump wrong? or would you recommend that the US formally endorses judicial execution for adultery, homosexuality and apostasy? Are you lobbying for these things to the introduced in the country in which you are resident? Or is this all just something that the foreign man should endure because….?
yes its wrong…stop trying to be “clever”
And its all down to Loony and Trump to sort out….
how about minding your own business, stop interfering in Irans affairs and letting Iranians sort it out themselves?
Israel ‘welcomes’ assassination of top Syrian weapons expert amid claims Mossad was behind the car bombing
Syrian rocket scientist Aziz Asbar was killed by a car bomb in Masyaf on Saturday
Israeli spy agency Mossad planted the device, according to anonymous reports
Israel has denied being behind the bomb, but ++ said it ‘welcomes’ Asbar’s death++ !!
Asbar was working to update Syria’s missiles to make them more accurate
7 August 2018
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6034531/Israel-minister-welcomes-Syria-scientist-killing.hmtl
If we are to run out of food by next August, according to the NFU, then I’m stockpiling Melton Mowbray pork pies, starting right now. But how long do they keep?
Tins of beans, meat, fish etc…dried yeast, flower, dried meats and salt fish have much longer shelf lives. Also I wouldn’t start now, say October, November. As to drink, good wines, especially red, have a longer shelf life and in fact improve with age. Avoid cheap champagne and prosecco for hoarding. Potatoes and onions if stored properly in the dark will also last a few weeks. Get an allotment, start planting now for winter crops of cabbage and leeks. You can also plant things like all season lettuce but again wait till later. If all else fails emigrate to Russia, Putin promises to give anyone a decent plot of land in Siberia if they move there as it is a vastly underpopulated country.
Don’t bother. If we have a ‘no deal’ brexit, by next August we will have an abundance of meat from Australasia and fruit and veg from the Americas. And all cheaper than we currently pay under the current EU protection racket.
Tony, we already have an abundance of farmed venison and lamb from Australasia, so Brexit is irrelevant here – and, given their current farming problems, they may be focusing on feeding themselves by next year. As for fruit and veg, we may just let our own crops rot in the field and will need to buy in…
What on earth are you trying to say? Venison??? We will be buying as much commonplace meats as we want from Australasia. And the same for fruit and veg from the Americas and elsewhere. Crops rotting in the fields? Yeah…..right. Keep buying into the scaremongering. The excuses come the middle of next year are going to be absolutely bloody hilarious. Even more hilarious than the excuses from Andy Haldane and his ilk as to why the economy didn’t crash immediately post-brexit referendum, a crash that they assured us was going to happen.
Or we can just gorge ourselves on all that newly-reclaimed N Sea fish.
We also have the ingredients for cakes: eggs, flour and sugar. Let them eat cakes, I say.
Perusing the commentariat here, it appears the bordello at Naked Capitalism has met its match.
Great news for many readers.
According to someone called Michael Harriot diversity of thought is white supremacy.
https://www.theroot.com/diversity-of-thought-is-just-a-euphemism-for-white-supr-1825191839
This means that anyone that disagrees with you on any matter must be practicing diversity of thought which means they are a white supremacist which means they are a Nazi which means you can kill them.
What an ingenious way of eliminating any possibility of arguments and disagreements of any type.
This kind of idea means that we can reincarnate the Khmer Rouge on a more massive scale – Imagine the fun involved in simply killing anyone that disagrees with you.
Good talk by George Galloway, Re Corbyn, Tom Watson, Antisem Ect.. Although he is wrong about the biggest Genocide in History being the Holocaust.. The Biggest Genocide in history took place in the America’s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cyrv4MytLmk&feature=share
Galloway rejects even the questioning of details with regards to the Holocaust. I believe no historical event should be beyond research. The recent banning of the crazy Alex Jones and indeed Tommy Robinson’s censorship issues are also troubling. I think Info Wars is cartoon like with a lead actor that is more like a pantomime dame. Robinson is a joke who for some reason appeals to a good many nationalist cranks. The attacks on their preferred method of publicity should have us all worried. As I suggested, I have no time for either but they could be the start of a censorship campaign that will take with it many reasonable voices, which has already been a problem amongst Syrian pro government supporters.
Thanks for the link Brian.
regarding Youtube “banning” Alex Jones well they are entitled to as a private entity
personally I say do NOT ban anything and leave ANYTHING up for people to critique…let these lunatics dig their own graves
‘The Biggest Genocide in history…’ Do the dead or survivors give a flying **** about the size?
I don’t Know about all the worlds Genocides..How peoples react in Aftermath.. But I know that Native americans Care,, Thats what Standing Rock water Protestors were all about.. and the war on First Nations Women is ongoing
True. It has never ended.
Brian
The Native American holocaust about a 100 Million. Heathcote Williams & Martin Wilkinson
Video: Claire Palmer
https://vimeo.com/142419357
Thank you Dave
And yes !00 million is the number
Have you heard of John Trudell –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAyWre4j8U4
AND –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrCOFUpRg8w
Most Native North Americans died of the same reason as many Central and South American natives: new diseases from Europe for which they couldn’t build up immunity fast enough or not at all (genes). The vast Atlantic and Pacific oceans had protected them for ages before.
I think you’re confusing attempted genocide with actual genocide (no survivors).
well some Jews like to claim a holocaust is THE Holocaust and that they are special, Gods chosen ones etc etc and use that to gain sympathy and excuse any crap they do
More to the point: Do the perpetrators care?
Yes, thank you for the link.
Being a person born in the Caribbean, it seems a wee bit difficult not to notice the ‘minor’ historical facts of genocide inflicted against native peoples in the Americas and the after effects of the ‘small’ involuntary migration to the Americas of over 10 million Africans, as indeed being not insignificant sets of occurrences in human history.
My reply to Brianfujisan re. George Galloway’s comment.
See: above.
Gideon and Poison Gove have been to Bayreuth together for a large dose of Wagner x 4.
Lads’ holiday for Michael Gove and George Osborne
August 6 2018
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lads-holiday-for-michael-gove-and-george-osborne-d9wrq275t Paywall
Could you make that up?
Hope they got the lesson from Gotterdamerung.
What’s wrong with liking Wagner?
“What’s wrong with liking Wagner?”
Nothing, if you like glorifying war and the survival of the fittest at the expense of normal human decency and compassion.
Wagner was a nasty piece of work. Even Nietzsche, after being initially impressed, became disillusioned with him.
He was also an anti-semite of the worst sort.
However we should really not weaponise art. Wagner’s has revolutionised what became known as music drama and fused the literary and musical aspects of opera in a very dramatic way. The music is powerful, but perhaps not so moving. One can like the music of Wagner but not his person.
For the last couple of weeks I’ve been in Chippenham, a town which used to be dominated by the Plymouth Brethren. Their womenfolk still wear head-scarves and are not allowed to talk to men outside their religious group. These are the ancestors of that jumped-up nation that aspires to be the world’s policeman. led by the man who said that he could get away with groping ladies’ sexual organs with impunity.
Is it not more rational to belong to a religion which recognises openly the latent attraction between the sexes and does something about it? Boris is well-known for his inability to control himself sexually. Now he complains that without being able to see his prey he would be unable to be allured to them, nor be able to use their facial expressions to guide his predatory charm.
Don’t worry, Boris Always Lies. He is hoping to attract the Dutch protestant Islamophobes, to some Brexit compromise. The DUP are already owned. Instead of governing, these pompous Tories are constantly trying out new gambles and the consequences of their gambling failures are not paid for by them. They are like a rudderless, sail-less, garbage barge drifting out of the Thames into the Channel. Thankfully carrying their objectionable stink with them .
“a town which used to be dominated by the Plymouth Brethren.”
Hardly
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/3354065
Although it did give Jeremy Corbyn.
Jeremy Corbyn has excellent provenance.
‘Though not a Devon native, Mr Corbyn has many connections to the county, with his mother’s side of the family living in Plymouth, his niece living in Exeter, and his aunt being a Tiverton stalwart.
He explained: “My aunt, Mary Corbyn, was matron of the hospital in Tiverton, and later on became the manager of Ilford Park camp for Polish refugees. She worked there for many years, supporting older people, mostly men, who had come from Poland in the Second World War and she stayed there until she retired. I remember being taken as a very small child to visit her in Tiverton Hospital and I thought she was ever so frightening with her matron uniform on.
“I’ve been in Devon many times on visits. I can’t pretend I was born in Devon, I was born in Wiltshire. I know politicians are very good at claiming several places, it’s not possible, you can only be born in one place!”’
https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/jeremy-corbyn-reveals-familys-devon-688993
PS Michael Foot was born in Plymouth. He died 8 years ago aged 96. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Foot
Why did they do this to his memorial? He was opposed to EU membership right back to the 70s and led the ‘No’ campaign.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/disgusting-beyond-belief-michael-foot-memorial-daubed-with-nazi-graffiti-in-attack-blamed-on-brexit-a3286976.html
Michael Foot – who’s wiki page has no reference to the ten dead Republican hunger strikers on his watch as leader of the opposition. Because he did nothing despite being asked to. Wiki however gives him praise for being “A staunch republican (though well liked by the Royal Family on a personal level)”
Supporting the IRA is not a necessary condition for being a staunch republican – as any sensible person should know.
Peculiar post – not sure why having links to Devon is somehow better or worse than Chippenham. His parents did send him to a public school however – so perhaps their provenance isn’t all you suggest.
“Boris is well-known for his inability to control himself sexually.”
That’s his excuse but it takes two to Tango; so, what on earth would any woman see in such a vile, obnoxious, odious and, in my opinion, physically repellent creature? Any woman that chooses to sleep with this narcissistic, egotistical maniac should seek out the services of a psychotherapist.
On Boris:
1 There is zero scriptural authority prescribing the burka.
2. Women are being forced and coerced by their male-dominated societies to wear this and discriminated in a thousand other different ways. Why has not one single woman in this blog spoken up about it?
3. Boris has a sense of humour and it’s based on Western values. We do not need any Islamic preachers here when Islam by definition does not recognise women as equals, it can’t be simpler surely.
“Women are being forced and coerced by their male-dominated societies to wear this”
Nope, it’s a personal choice. People in Muslim countries get as annoyed by them as we do.
@MJ,
There is no choice in many Muslim countries. The laws – sharia – are made and implemented by men. There are varying degrees of punishment depending on which country the women live in. In a Taliban controlled area of Pakistan or Afghanistan, a woman could face death for not wearing the burkha/niqab. In Iran it could be a few hours in a police cell to imprisonment.
@Observer
1) You mean “proscribing”.
2) Probably not because they were waiting for you.
3a) What’s a “western value”? Did it originate in Plymouth? And how can I boot it up its coccyx? Because whatever it is, it’s really pissing me off. Has it got something to do with having 20 different kinds of sugar-covered cornflakes in the breakfast cereal aisle?
3b) Some things are very simple. Indeed the entire social question is probably very simple, when it comes down to it. But the question of how to arrange objective and subjective conditions so that it can actually appear as simple, so that it can be posed in simple terms, by which time it could and would be given a simple answer and there’d no longer be much of a big problem socially, is very difficult and certainly cannot be arrived at by mere logic or discussion.
3c) Don’t call me “Shirley”.
3d) @Giyane is my favourite poster here and a tenth of one of her contributions contains a hundred times more sense than your latest effort.
Prescribing is correct. Think of “prescription”. Proscribing is prohibiting.
Yes, I am familiar with the words but made the mistake of getting @Observer’s meaning totally wrong, which is wholly my fault. I kind of associate the attempt to justify a right-wing politician’s latest bit of xenophobic rabble-rousing by referring to “western values” with stupidity, but in this case I went too far.
Thank you MJ. Got some rattled, LOL. For a moment I thought I might have to go to Plymouth to learn my English.
I have lived and worked in a couple of countries with majority/substantial Muslim populations and have seen them up close and personal. My broader point is that the religion itself discriminates against women, e.g. men are allowed 4 or 5 wives, whatever, though the other way round is proscribed. I grant you that burkas/full-face-covering is limited or even non-existent amongst the educated progressives. Corollary to the broad point is the serious conditioning that begins at a very early age.
Good to see the Canadians standing up to the Saudis and hope they keep it up.
Good god, where would we be without you do some exemplary mansplaining for us?
Actually when I come to think of it, perhaps you did mean “prescribing”. If so, my apologies. As far as I know there is no “scriptural authority” either prescribing the burqa or proscribing it.
Boris Johnson is just trying to be obnoxious, to whip up a feeling of “we gonna come right out and tell the truth cos weve had enuf of those Paki’s, politikally correcked leftie’s and librul’s”. There will be more.
The west / ContraPoints. https://youtu.be/hyaftqCORT4?t=6m1s
Giyane is my favourite poster her.
Well N_ thank you for that compliment, but I am male, 63 years old and currently sitting in my underpants because it’s hot in my bedroom.
After I came into Islam I did find it extremely difficult to gain any kind of access to a potential bride. There was a Bosnian girl begging in a hijab in all weathers I tried to chat up, but she was married and Christian although her husband she said was Muslim. Eventually I found marriage through a very good friend from Kurdistan.
I think other posters may be as confused as I was about the Muslim female. I had assumed that they always wore the clothes they wear outside the home in the home. It’s not considered nice to wear what I’m wearing now for men or women. But in the home Muslim ladies wear normal Western clothes without their hijabs or burqas if they are with their immediate family. Different men have different psychologies and paranoias. I myself had been put through the mill.
I have never asked my wife to cover her face unless I have actually heard men using disgusting language for example in the Sunday market in Birmingham. The burqa is simply a tool to deal with unashamed male lust, and it’s a very effective tool. Normally it’s the proponents of unashamed male lust who get rattled by this Islamic tool to frustrate their diseased minds.
I don’t know Boris Johnson so I don’t know if he is an example. Public School is not good for the soul, and deliberately designed to corrupt it by removing children from the love of their families. I would have thought Boris would have been financially and socially free from the restrictions of Eton. He’s playing some game , or as the Tory chairman said whistling a dog whistle to the right.
Muslims are mostly from societies which do not have social welfare and I would say they are natural capitalists as a consequence. It does seem odd Boris insulting his natural constituency. But maybe he himself isn’t a Tory, just as a common or garden narcissist with a penchant for being annoying. On a more sinister note, the disgusting excesses of Obama and Cameron’s Islamic State and Al Qaida are starting to be downplayed. Boris might be just trivialising the issue of Islamism because he has been supporting Islamist violence against the Muslim populations of Syria Libya and Iraq for so long.
Anyway they lost, and Boris has good reason to trivialise his vicious part in British foreign policy, to save his own bacon, and to stick two fingers up to Russia which has trashed the neo-cons disgusting plans.
“Different men have different psychologies and paranoias”
Presumably women are at the mercy of these different psychologies and paranoias.
“I have never asked my wife to cover her face unless I have actually heard men using disgusting language for example in the Sunday market in Birmingham”
So you have asked her to cover her face if other men have made comments!
“The burqa is simply a tool to deal with unashamed male lust, and it’s a very effective tool.”
So women must cover up to protect them from male lust!
Why not force the men to wear straight jackets?
“Normally it’s the proponents of unashamed male lust who get rattled by this Islamic tool to frustrate their diseased minds.”
I am disgusted by your post!
smoothsmoother
I see it as a tool in my toolbox.
You seem to be in a chimpanzee phase of evolution in which the only tool is the baring of the teeth.
a woman’s right to choose obviously – and their struggle not men’s is the route to liberation. men of course should feel compelled to ridicule and mock the husbands and fathers.
what if it was chosen for them by other family members?
Re 2, as a woman myself I’m not in agreement with your assertion that women should automatically adopt the position you take. Why? It’s because I don’t know for certain that your own claims are accurate. I’ve worked with, been friends with Muslim women. Some wore different items of Islamic dress, some didn’t. There was choice involved. What right did I have to tell them they were being forced to conform, etc etc? Furthermore, what right do you have to dictate how other women on this forum should think?
Re 3, are you serious? You’re excusing Boris his appalling comments by saying it’s just his sense of humour and “western values”?
I’v no idea what obs points meant. But yea, seems some look at islam like it’s not full of variation of practice and behaviour. Subject to alteration due to conditions. etc. & never seems to look at marriage & all the hurt & oppression that can entail.
In those cases one assumes Christianity isn’t bought into it, it’s then about the individual. Troubled upbringing etc.
Yes, his letterbox remark is funny because it has a ring of truth about it. But, one man’s meat is another man’s poison and so it is with women. But as Boris said it is their right to wear it if they want to and I totally agree with him. Don’t get so excitable in terms of getting personal about your rights or mine. Relax and speak freely–i asked a simple question, not impinging on your rights for Gods sake; don’t even know who you are!
Pray, what is Islamic dress and the different components, please educate me, along with your source.
Btw, did any of your muslim friends have dogs? Just curious. (The curious incident of the dog in the nighttime. Hilarious book, superbly funny–good example of British humour. It’s a cultural thing.)
Boris’ dog whistle worked a treat with you, then.
Only in your narrow, limited, pedestrian imagination.
I don’t have to imagine anything, since you have demonstrated it with your inane posts.
I would like to see the media reaction if someone in public life, e.g. a member of the Parliamentary Labour Party, was to take the piss out of the dress code of orthodox Hasidics.
Why should be people have a right not to be offended? I may hold different religious and cultural views from you. I am entitled to hold them, and we can both express our views, unless they are illegal. You can be offended by my views, which do not correspond to yours but that does not mean I cannot express them. I am offended by polygamy including as it is practised in Islam. You may wish to practice it, but it will be unofficial as it is of course not legal in this country. I do not wish to see it become legal. And I am entitled to say so. But lately it seems that no one is allowed to express any views that might offend a Muslim somewhere in the UK, however extreme their views. Why is this?
@ Mary
Wow! Considering all we’ve been hearing for weeks now is the rights those of the J***sh have to dictate how we should speak and what we mustn’t say, the final sentence in your post, addressed to Muslims, is absolutely extraordinary.
Constructive dialogue and critique is one thing, but a senior UK politician likening women to robbers and post boxes is the sort of humor practiced by juvenile morons. Surely you know the difference. By the way were you forced to wear this silly hat?
Sometimes women who are not oppressed need to stand up and speak out for the rights of sisters who are. An oppressed woman cannot speak out for herself.
– “Islam by definition does not recognise women as equals”
Us supposedly enlightened “Westerners” hold no moral high ground here. The right to vote was only extended to women in in the UK 1928, less than a century ago. France didn’t permit women to vote until 1944, and Switzerland 1971. Male homosexuality was illegal in the UK until 1967; within my lifetime. The context is that Christianity and Islam are both more than one and a half millennia old.
For heavens sake just let be, because trying to force matters is counter-productive. Reform will come in its own time.
If us enlightened ones think we need to apply pressure, where did the pressure come from that changed our societies? And had we been pressured by some society that obviously thought itself superior, would we not have resisted?
Of course there’s nothing wrong with setting a good example, but bombing the shit out of one majority-Muslim country after another and giving their resources to our side’s corporations while blabbing about freedom, democracy and equal rights does not count.
but some practices and customs both in the West and ME are nowhere near as old as we might think.
Women got the vote in the end because they proved themselves equal to men in factories during WWI. Decades of campaigning before that, but that was the tipping point. Men could no longer call them inferior.
No pressure from outside, merely from within.
It was reforming. In iraq for instance. Until we bombed the shit out of it & supported the religious fundamentalists again.
Much of the middle east has been set right back. Just where the “civilised west” want it.
And in the mean time we are going back to the 18th century. Via our enlightened leaders.
“The context is that Christianity and Islam are both more than one and a half millennia old.”
Given that Islam is say 600 years younger than Christianity, that muslim women have to wait 500 years for Islam to update itself? And who will do/lead such updation?
Bear in mind that Saudi Arabia has only just permitted women to drive a car! Crazy!!
You think in linear terms for change whereas there are other models based on experience, the change may be exponential and take say 5 or 50 rather than 500 years.
and you conveniently miss the point he compared them to bank robbers
He said they concealed their faces in a similar way to bank robbers. Probably an ill chosen comparison but not untrue. And said that he would only talk to someone if he could see their face. In our cultural cultural tradition women do not cover their faces. If someone wearing a veil wishes to consult or seek assistance from an “authority ” figure in our society, then I think it correct that they should be asked to remove their veil.
You defend someone who knew exactly what he was saying. It was quite deliberate and inexcusable of Johnson to behave in such a manner. He is stirring it up and sending a clear message to the racists and xenophobes out there that it’s ok to ridicule Muslims!
We have already seen examples in the UK of female Muslims being verbally abused in public, we’ve had situations where thugs have tried to tear veils from the heads of Muslim women!
Johnson knows these things. His decision to publish this dangerous bile was clearly a tactic to give his blessing to such attacks.
Here’s the biggest test. Would Johnson make similar comments about anyone of the J***sh faith? You can bet your life he wouldn’t!
I don’t think anyone has a “right” to be offended when people criticise aspects of their religion or culture and it is rather depressing that whenever anyone raises concerns about aspects of Islam which are at odds with the secular society the UK now is, rather than ignoring or addressing these concerns, strident claims of islamophobia are immediately aired by people who seem to earn a living by being aggrieved Moslems.
I realise any criticism of their faith is a difficult issue for many Moslems, many of whom have strong ties back to Islamic societies where religious belief, culture and the legal system are much more integrated, in the form of Sharia law, than in European countries. But we are where we are and in northern Europe that means we have separated church and state. Indeed in countries like France wearing the burka in public is banned as a result. It has to be said that recent events in the UK have thrown up some pretty unpleasant examples of the ways in which cultural attitudes to women, brought with them from Pakistan, have been at odds with what is viewed as civilised behaviour in the UK.
The debate about anti-Semitism is a difficult one for Labour but for different reasons. In principle we are asked to distinguish between Jews, as an ethnic group who historically share a common religion, and live in many parts of the world, and those Israeli Jews who live in the State of Israel where the government is seen to oppress
the Palestinians.
Many people including some posting here, fail to grasp this distinction and view all Jews as though they were Israeli citizens supporting the more divisive policies of the Israeli state. This results in the persecution of Jews who do not live in Israel, may not be particularly rekigious and may not support its policies towards the Palestinian people.
Criticizing the Israeli state should be distinguished from criticising all Jews world wide but often it is not and particularly in the British Labour party.
“Why has not one single woman in this blog spoken up about it?
Well, I certainly do.
If a “woman” wears a burka, you do not see
– if “she” is in fact a woman
– if “she” is grown up or a child
– if “she” is a friend
– if “she” has been punched in her face
– how she feels
– whether “she” cries or smiles
– if “she” needs help.
Men who force their family members to wear such pieces of cloth should be forced to carry their groceries themselves.
@Anne,
Well said Anne, I am married to a Muslim woman, and living in the UK she is free to dress whatever way she pleases, and that is the most important point – how she pleases.
If and when we go back to visit her family in Iran, everyone dresses in a Western fashion whilst in the house, but once they step out side the door, the women HAVE to wear a “rooserie” a headscarf, have the legs and arms covered, even when it is 40C in the shade – very uncomfortable.
The full covering – burkha/niqab, as worn in Afghanistan, parts of Pakistan, Saudi Arabia etc is part of strict sharia law dictated by men – the women have no say or choice in the matter.
Encouraging remarks by Anne and Andy above, thank you.
Many on here are hypocritical about human rights when they cannot see the basics of how Islam treats their own women.
This is not really about human rights is it? Have you got any evidence whatsoever that these women are wearing Burkas because they are coerced to do so? Have you carried out a survey? Also is it really a muslim thing? How do you know? Could it be a local custom. Probably more than 90% of muslim women do not wear the Burka even in countries where sharia is applied. A sizeable number in majority muslim countries wear western style clothes, so really it is not a major issue just one of those dog whistle type characterisation used for political purposes. In my view there are more grown up topics to discuss and Boris’ pronouncements are a disgrace.
@SA,
I know that many Muslim women are forced to wear a kind of hijab, be it a burkha, niqab or just a scarf. How do I know this? Because when my female relatives visit the UK or go to the US, they do not wear the hijab any more
If they had a choice, then there would be no need for repressive governemnts to punish them for failing to wear the hijab.
Do you honestly think that a woman wishes to wear a burkha or niqab in the full heat of Summer?
@SA,
Let me educate you about life for women in a Muslim majority country, one which operates sharia law. You obviously have never been to one of these countries – I have as recently as May.
In Saudi Arabia it is only recently that women have been allowed to drive. There are religious police in Muslim majority countries, whose only duty is to look for infringements of sharia – dress code, holding hands/kissing in public, drinking alcohol.
Men and women sit apart on public transport. It is not uncommon for women to be barred from watching sporting events where men are taking part.
A few years ago, Saudi Arabia wanted to put in a bid for the Olympic game – on the condition that an Olympics for women was held in another country.
In Afghanistan and Pakistan, women’s literacy rates are amongst the lowest in the World.
@Observer, thanks I just think that folks have to be aware, open and honest about the situation in other countries. There are hundreds of millions of perfectly decent Muslims, but at the same time a sizeable minority are not very nice at all, and it is these ones who conspire to push more extreme versions of the religion.
Unfortunately in Iraq and Syria, the extremists were often aided wittingly or not by our armed forces in the West, who saught regime change in a number of countries.
Anyway that is yet another subject for discussion at some time.
Andyoldlabour
You really ought to be careful about making assumptions about other people, just because you happen, as an Englishman or whatever (I am assuming here), to have visited Saudi Arabia. You know nothing whatsoever about me so please apologise.
Then you want to answer your own question. Boris’s outburst and Observers remarks are not really about oppressed women in the ME because Boris and the conservatives are doing lucrative business there. We were not talking about that we are talking about women wearing Burkas in the west. The major problems of women’s rights and human rights in Saudi Arabia and other countries are major and cannot be tackled by flippant remarks and observations made by
Observer and supported by your anecdotal comments. Of course middle eastern women would revert to wearing a veil when they visit thier relatives back home and this may be a combination of many factors, including coercive prohibition, or just wanting not to stand out. There are codes of dress within societies and some people like to adhere to them.
“There are codes of dress within societies and some people like to adhere to them.”
Exactly! There are codes of dress in the UK too and it would be good if people *choosing* to come to this country would imbibe that culture. If we want more women in politics and in corporations, even in directorships on corporate Boards, well they would need to meet some requirements. Would you like your newsreaders or even your future MP or future Foreign Secretary to show up in a full-face veil?
Wouldn’t matter to me what they wore, it would be what they said which interests me.
A snip @ £half a billion. Usmanov sells his Arsenal shares to Kroenke.
Arsenal: Shareholder Alisher Usmanov says he accepts rival Stan Kroenke’s bid for club
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45102550
Enter ‘usmanov’ in the search box on this website for details of Craig’s experiences >
Kroenke – ‘On a ski trip to Aspen, Colorado, Kroenke met his future wife, Ann Walton, a Walmart heiress. They married in 1974.[5] Already wealthy from real estate, he accrued significant additional wealth when he and Ann inherited a stake in Wal-Mart Stores Inc. upon the 1995 death of her father, James Walton. As of September 2015, that stake is worth $4.8 billion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stan_Kroenke
Handy that.
Walmart own Asda in the UK and now Asda are merging with Sainsbury. More and more money goes into fewer and fewer hands and so does the control over the consumers. the British public.
There is also a US conglomerate named Walgreens. No connection to Walmart. Walgreens acquired Alliance Boots in 2012/2014. Roll over old Jesse Boot, son of John, the Victorian founder.
Could Usmanov be waiting for a knock on the door like Abramovich? Stan has not been for Arsenal nor his clubs in the US and Usmanov was at least some sort of encouragement to do better. Hard to understand why he want a club that isn’t successful and waits till the team are out of Europe before coughing. Still don’t understand why his barber makes his hair look very wiglike? Good and noisy demonstration today outside the BBC concerning the extreme bias the beeb is showing over the anti Corbyn antisemite issuel Led by Jews for Labour.
Usmanov knows he will never get a Board seat at Arsenal so sells up for a profit. Kroenke is a robber baron, making Arsenal supporters pay his mortgage. He has raised bridging loan to acquire shares, he will then pay himself £30m dividend to pay the mortgage. As I said, robber baron capitalism.
People really must see Americans as they are: they have a closed cartel at home, then demand free trade abroad or else.
People really need to deal with them as business nazis, because they have no morals, no principles, nothing but avarice.
Sharp Ears
Just to say thanks for your comment Re Alesha
And for being interested enough to Dig up the Herald Article
I examined the Report that Hopkins tried to use.. The report refers to 87.000 People of Argyll and Bute.. Isle of Bute has only 8,000 inhabitants .. What a Vile wee Woman Hopkins is
Ha! Our friend Katie was on Sky News this morning sounding off against women who have their eggs frozen until the time is right to start a family. She has an opinion on EVERYTHING. Looking strange too with white and grey hair which matched her grey severely tailored jacket and white blouse.
She likes Boris btw and his views on burkas.
https://twitter.com/KTHopkins
Thanks to the Arsenal Supporters Trust. “Stan Kroenke taking the club private will see the end of supporters owning shares in Arsenal and their role upholding custodianship values,” said an AST statement.
AST added that by becoming the 100% owner, Kroenke would be able to take “detrimental actions” such as paying “management fees and dividends without any check or balance”.
It added: “The AST is also extremely concerned to note that this purchase is being funded by a loan.
Corbyn’s a gooner.
More like Corbyn’s a goner! ?
Nah FranzB, there are intelligent ppl around so in your dreams
– “Walmart own Asda in the UK and now Asda are merging with Sainsbury. More and more money goes into fewer and fewer hands and so does the control over the consumers. the British public”
Unregulated “free market” capitalism shares a similar end-point to communism – centralised control of all production. Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. We need to reinstate a mixed economy before it’s too late.
And that is exactly what Corbyn is offering. That’s why his popularity continues to rise; the people aren’t stupid, and they’re not fixated by the crazy neoliberal ideology like most politicians and media are.
Got to reply to this cos you’re so heartsick Clark but still trying to make things better.
Don’t expect sense from the UK/US friend, they’re oligarchies: https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746 full study can be read here: https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B/S1537592714001595a.pdf/testing_theories_of_american_politics_elites_interest_groups_and_average_citizens.pdf
Don’t give up hope bro, good ppl are fighting for change, love, hugs and all that’s good =)
CM – “Yet these are today loudly called “anti-semites” for supporting the right to oppose the oppression of the Palestinians.”
Baroness Varsi was on BBC R4 at 9.00 a.m. today(7th Aug). She brought up Islamophobia within the Tory party, referencing Zac Goldsmith’s dog whistle campaign against Sadiq Khan in 2016. Due to time constraints no doubt, she was unable to mention David Cameron’s (then Prime Minister) own contribution to this dog whistle campaign. Cameron accused Khan of associating with a muslim cleric who Cameron alleged supported the Islamic State. Cameron had later to apologise for this lie. It shows though that Islamophobia goes to the top of the Tory party.
May is just a racist – she was only too happy to support the imprisonment of British citizens from the Caribbean, and then to deport them. The Windrush immigrants are black, as are their children. All they did was work hard for low pay. They were treated as criminals, but its May and her ilk who are the criminals. Why Rudd took the hit for May is beyond me.
Baroness Varsi resigned from the Tory government in 2014 because of the Israel attack on Gaza. She’s reported to have said:-
“It appals me that the British government continues to allow the sale of weapons to a country, Israel, that has killed almost 2,000 people, including hundreds of kids, in the past four weeks alone. The arms exports to Israel must stop.”
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/aug/05/lady-warsi-resigns-government-gaza-stance
I suppose today she’d be accused of anti-semitism because she criticised Israel
Goodness me you are angry. Does not seem that the UK is a very comfortable place for you to live. Does that mean that it should all be changed so that you feel accepted? There are lots of groups in our country who would like better acceptance, why should the Muslims be singled out for special treatment especially special treatment for views which make the majority of the population feel comfortable, and are not part of our cultural tradition? Burkas are one example, multiple wives another, enforced marriages are another. Indeed sharia law in general.
*uncomfortable
Donald Trump will probably send a “tweet” saying how “great” Boris Johnson is for his anti-burqa spitting in the Torygraph.
Johnson is sounding very US. He is even talking about “free speech” now.
Johnson is a moron, he paid steve bannon a vast amount of consultancy fee for how to appeal to the public. Enact the base that doesn’t usually vote was the reply, racist rhetoric will win you votes with non voters. Jesus Christ it’s hardly rocket science is it?
There’s a reason that ‘liberal’ democracies don’t engage the racists at the loonie fringes and that’s because they’re unpredictable and usually bring the country to crisis, and turn on you
It won’t work, we’re not Americans. We dont protect our land spoils with guns. After all the British working class are the dispossessed, run off our land by the chartering of Georgian Parliament. How much of Scotland belongs to the game hunters eh? Trump voters are the descendants of those rooting tooting looting injun killers.
We’re the dozy fuckers who rolled over
it would be something like “Great great news from Great England, PM Johnson fighting fake news and the enemy of the state….Britishers build a wall”
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/fighter-jet-accidentally-fires-missile-in-estonia/ar-BBLDcB3
“The missile carried explosives of up to 10 kilograms (22 pounds) and was last located around 24 miles (40km) north of Estonia’s second city of Tartu.”
No-one in our media seems to have noticed that the border with Russia is less than 40km east of Tartu.
This sabre-rattling of NATO against Russia a few miles from its border is very provocative.
“Accidental” – who is kidding who?
I was in Sweden for a holiday recently and met a couple of Estonians. They say Nato has built a huge airbase and supply depot in central Estonia, housing some 2000 troops and dozens of aircraft, all unreported in the local press. There are Nato jets flying day and night provoking the Russians by flying along their border. The missile incident was no accident; several Russian aircraft were in the air along the border at the time and it seems the Nato jet approached the border turned quickly and fired its missile deliberately back into Estonia as a sort of warning. These missiles usually self-destruct in the air, but this one may not have, hence the local outcry.
Stirring up trouble here….http://theduran.com/nato-to-set-up-its-first-air-base-in-western-balkans/
Potential scenario creation: NATO warplane shoots down Russian plane ‘by accident’, Russia responds and is accused of aggression against NATO.
There is always a potential for conflict when forces are massed on the borders of another country. It was the amassing of such forces by Russia and France (orchestrated by the British) that led directly to WW1.
When the harridans of the PLP continue to push an externally-funded regime-change agenda in the UK, and newspapers of record lie, obviously, about anything Corbyn
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/08/07/labour-undermining-fight-against-anti-semitism-corbyn-suggests/ (Paywall)
Then it’s time to deploy “there’s an App for that” and go active.
The App in this case is the five year old “buycott” app for iOS and Android, from Buycott inc. Free, but you have to sign-up, unless you press the ‘skip’ button hidden on the top of the ‘give us all your data’ splash page.
Buycott allows one to scan ALL potential purchases, for , e.g. NRA supporting products, or some Hillary/Steele/Skripal related anti-trump campaign?
In light of our current attacks on our UK society, I simply searched for the soda stream device and was presented to join 3-campaigns.
a) boycott any is r eal product
b) boycott any product from an occupied territory
c) ignore the above choices and positively support is r eal products
( it’s nice that there are a few choices)
Shopping this week will be a lot more fun, scanning avocados and everything else!
B l o w b a c k
Nice one!
The Buycott app is at https://www.buycott.com/
If I used a phone I might use it.
I like buying Israeli stuff. It’s so helpful of the BDS arseholes to provide a shopping list.
Knock yourself out, you shopper.
Nice take on Syria (bit like Libya):
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1875153245875816&set=p.1875153245875816&type=3&theater
More than enough to put Assad in the crosshairs, and then there was the pipeline…
Head to HS2 if you want a nice little number. The white elephant’s estimated cost is £100billion, initially quoted at £50billion! Meanwhile the country’s local ransport systemw are crumbling. Clogged roads. Potholes. Unaffordable bus and train fares. Shortages of buses and rolling stock.
‘Britain’s new high-speed railway employs a quarter of its staff on six-figure pay packets, The Times can reveal.
HS2 paid 318 officials at least £100,000 in salary and perks last year, up from 155 in 2015-16. It also spent more than £600 million on consultants, well over double the figure of a year earlier.
The scale of pay has triggered alarm bells at the top of government. Liz Truss, chief secretary to the Treasury, wrote to Chris Grayling, the transport secretary, in the spring warning him that salaries were worryingly high.
HS2 Ltd, the taxpayer-owned company behind the project, has 1,346 staff, meaning that 24 per cent of employees now enjoy a six-figure remuneration package including salary, bonus and any pension contributions from the company.… paywall.’
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/quarter-of-hs2-workers-on-pay-deals-over-100k-h7cfxm09x
1825 – cutting edge technology ha ha ha. Take out commuting and work on what’s left. in my small remote village on the wild portugal/spanish border I enquired about ‘the internet’. just two days later two men turned up with a telegraph pole and installed a fibre optic cable (wicked amazon delivers the world to door).
Much in the MSM today about the Battle of Amiens, leading to the end of WW1. Treeza (she likes jazzing round the planet wasting fossil fuel) and P William will be attending a service in Amiens Cathedral.
But absolutely nothing about the annihilation of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, August 6th and 9th 1945 – apart from some reminiscences from survivors of the bombing crews, etc
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_bombings_of_Hiroshima_and_Nagasaki
Q. Have we learnt anything from our wars?
We ?
https://twitter.com/AlsoRandom/status/1026264789385916416
I suspect that war nostalgia, WW1 and WW11, are used to assist transition to ‘professional’ armies. Early successes like korea, kenya, suez rather less heroic led by whitehall donkeys
No we have not, sharp ears. We are buying some 90 billions worth,all in, F35b yesterdays model fighter, some 100 of them, when the alarming reports of scientists make it obvious that we can’t àfford any more high intense energy events.
Wars destroy infrastructure in a high energy high pollution scenario, followed by vast energy expenditure to re build.
Glaciers globally have lost 7m in height, just in one year. Sea level rises, storms and chaotic weather patterns will inundate our lowlying east coast, GUARANTEED. Any precautionary measures to safeguard the Fenlands that supply nearly a quarter of our fresh veg nationally?
Nothing zilch de nada.
We seem to elect vested interest representatives who arent bothered about their kids, the general wealth creating public, or peace.
Sharpen the pitchforks and buy beans…..
My comments on the F35 arrivals Nevermind.
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/07/the-ubiquity-of-evil/comment-page-11/#comment-767223
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/07/the-ubiquity-of-evil/comment-page-11/#comment-767254
PS Hope Craig’s OK. Any news of him? Nothing on his Twitter since July 30th.
So, after May heads to Edinburgh for a Brexit showdown with Quisling, all we get is Bonkers and letterboxes. Priorities, obviously.
No mention of Scotchit 2.0, either.
‘Truth is treason in empire of lies’: Ron Paul on ongoing Big Tech censorship
https://www.rt.com/usa/435372-ron-paul-twitter-censorship/
I get much of the left argument on this, in a way (not referencing Ron there, he’s just too out on his own) e.g., That these platforms the public use should not be regulated, Because they do use them for all kinds of communication etc.
But thats not what these platform are, they are private companies. Corporate tyrannies. Who gives a monkeys what people think in this arena? What do people expect. It’s like trying to make rules in a shopping mall, No, you have zero control in that space.
Are they utterly stupid?
And the alt right are just hilarious. rotflmao . Their reaction just kills me. What a bunch of morons & snowflakes, Banned from the mall & acting like it’s some historical act.
Makes my day.
And this is what the “alt-right”/right wing WANT. (& Ron for that matter) Complete corporate tyranny. This is what they fight for every day.
Ishmael
Sorry, could you try making your argument again? I have no idea what you try to say.
https://twitter.com/Channel4/status/1026769924113412096?s=20
David Tennant instructing us that we should be worried and fearful about Trump, claiming to speak for the people of Scotland in saying we don’t like Trump, and suggesting that we are heading for some sort of dystopian fascist future with a neutered press etc. Basically Trump is evil, that’s the message.
Well, for a start, David Tennant is very rich. He’s rich because he works for companies like Virgin — as in Virgin the company that wants to privatise the NHS — and that paragon of truth and honesty the BBC. Yes, to be clear, that’s the same BBC that has played a pivotal part in dragging us into so many wars over the years, has done everything it can to keep the Tories in power, and basically declared war on the Scottish independence movement in 2014.
Now, as for David’s reasons to be fearful and his dystopian future, in my imagined dystopia we have people like Hillary Clinton starting World War 3 and the BBC telling us to get behind the vaporisation of humanity. Those that survive the initial thermonuclear blasts and radiation shouldn’t expect the “nanny state” NHS to rub any lotion on their burns, though, not unless they have a Virgin Health Policy.
Everything fails for people like David when you look at the facts:
– The same people that hate Trump, in the media and upper echelons, are the same people that took us into a bunch of wars, resulting in millions dead. They’re the same people that wanted Hillary to win with her pledge to attack Russia.
– The same people that talk about freedom of the press and free speech in the media and upper echelons, are the same people that are conspiring right now to shut down infowars, wingsoverscotland, and others. This is a developing story, btw, and it wouldn’t surprise me to see this website closed too.
– The same rich people in the media and upper echelons have conspired for decades now to undermine the left and destroy the aspirations and chances of poor people. This goes beyond mere disregard for the poor; they have supported the most cruel and hurtful policies towards them in terms of cutting benefits and bringing back what are effectively soup kitchens (food banks in newspeak).
– The same sort of people are doing everything they can in th UK right now to keep Corbyn out, using the most underhand lies imaginable (anti-semitism? Give me a break) to ensure their snouts stay firmly in the trough at the expense of everyone else.
When was the last time you heard David Tennant with his heart-wrenching love and fear speeches mention the plight of the poor, Iraq, Palestine, freedom of speech, media bias, or any of that stuff?
It is part of the strategy of the warmongers in Washington to stir up ‘useful idiots’ among liberals and the Left against Trump, with protests against him advertised by the media and trolls on social media trying to mobilise opposition. They pulled the reverse con trick with Bomber Obama, where those on the left were mobilised to support his gormless platitudes as the military establishment did their worst behind the scenes.
I don’t particularly care for Trump but his actions on the whole have been considerably more peaceable than those of either George W Bush or Obama.
Bang on, Tom. I’m no lover of Trump either, if we are going to talk objectively, but the reality is he was probably the better of two evils… that’s the choice most of the world faces in elections. Hillary made it an easy choice when she threatened Russia — and nobody after Libya could have any reason to assume she was bluffing.
“Whether Mossad is responsible for Azbar’s executions or not, it’s unquestionable the Israeli state is responsible for killing more people than the agents of any other state since World War II.
As Israeli journalist Ronen Bergman has documented, the number of deaths attributable to Tel Aviv will never be known for certain, but undoubtedly run to thousands — after all, Israeli operatives have carried out around 800 assassinations in the past decade alone. …”https://sputniknews.com/world/201808071067020730-mossad-history-syria-assassinations/
Should be emailed to every uk mp.
I have been reading about Ahed Tamimi’s village. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nabi_Salih
A tiny place whose spring has been taken over by the settlers in Halamish. You can imagine how aggrieved the Palestinians feel.
Ein al-Qaws Spring
Near the village there is a natural spring named Ein al-Qaws (“the Bow Spring”) which is owned by an individual of the village, Bashir Tamimi. In 2009 settlers from the nearby illegal Israeli settlement of Halamish took control over the spring and its surroundings and prevented Palestinian access to their land. Subsequently, people of Nabi Salih and the nearby village of Dir Nizam began regular Friday protests for the spring, and against the Israeli occupation in general.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halamish
The grim facts of the Occupation.
While the Johnson race card (for what else is it?) plays to the aim of establishing him as an anti-establishment Tory (a what?) capable of winning the working class and lower middle-class votes that went from UKIP to Labour last year, and flops, we don’t hear anything about burqas from his fellow Old Etonian Rees-Mogg.
But wait, yes, Rees-Mogg is in the media right now… His Somerset home has been attacked and according to the Daily Mail the words “Posh Scum” were written on windows. That’s hardly a staged assassination attempt, à la Mitterrand (the Observatory affair, 1959), but it’ll do.
Given the following links, Labour should be going on the ATTACK:
‘Is Labour Friends of I^rael an I^raeli embassy front?’ Electronic Intifada (replace ‘^’ with ‘s’ );
‘IT’S A TRICK, WE ALWAYS USE IT says former I^RAELI MINISTER’: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LZNXNVL1G8 ;
‘Common Enemy: Why I^rael Is Embracing Fascism in Europe’: (replace ‘^’ with ‘s’).
Together they give a pretty compelling idea of what is going on; the MSM won’t willingly expose it, so Momentum and decent forces in the Labour Party (and outside of it) need to get this info as widely spread about as possible.
IF you want laugh. Here’s PJW railing agains private companies, & yes they are just private companies. You sold yourself to them, now you bitch about it.
I’m not celebrating, but this shit is fucking hilarious. ……….I don’t fight for free speech in a shopping mall.
lol lol lol.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm4Pks_1_hI
PJW & those like him will continue sucking on them, no doubt.
Ishmael,
I am astonished you are laughing at overt censorship, on a massive co-ordinated scale, presumably because you strongly disagree with the views that are being censored. Don’t you realise that this is the thin end of an enormous wedge, that could potentially result in all views (including your own and Craig Murray’s) being censored if they do not agree with the American Corporate State? This is currently controlled by The CIA, and the totally corrupt US political elite. Where Paul Joseph Watson is wrong, is labelling them “Left”
They are not “just private companies” They are all very much aligned, with not just The US Government, but also the Military Industrial Complex, which is increasingly resembling the very worst aspects of the worst societies in human history, except it is not just for example Soviet Russia, or N@zi Germany, but a Global Monopoly, seeking Global Control. They have nearly achieved it, and you appear to be supporting them.
Tony
It’s always good to see ourselves as others see us. There is a very good article on Counterpunch by a US academic at Duke university about Corbyn and ‘anti-semitism’
https://www.counterpunch.org/2018/08/07/the-uks-labour-party-and-its-anti-semitism-crisis/
“Corbyn’s apology was unnecessary. Not just because it was not merited by the real circumstances underlying this manufactured “crisis”, but also because every step he takes now is dismissed as “meaningless” and “too little, too late” by his opportunistic opponents.”
It was, totally. And counter productive.
But I don’t just blame him, but the weakness of supports on the left, who ALL sang exactly the same song.
And if you don’t sing form their song they block you. See, Novara media (thought tbf only one blocked me) Owen jones (blocked more than once, Richard Seymour (blocked half a dozen times). etc.
These “supporters” ALL basically accepted the premise. They helped hold the rope on this issue. “The left” is …. incompetent. And we’ve no reason to be. It’s more a middle management issue imo. Plenty of grass roots had/have the right attitude imo.
Check this if you haven’t seen it, Top. https://twitter.com/BTLF1/status/1026588016196902912
What is this “left” actually doing? Material facts. Making a name for themselves. Individuals who have taken it upon themselves to be the vanguard. Build a big platform, then tell followers what’s what. And if they don’t agree?
They cut the grass roots, they what to shape it, be big players. e.g., This is how you should think, & I’m more “educated” than you so I’m right. They HATE the public. Never want to go any way near the grass roots. And for good reason, peoples collective interests are a threat to their platform.
“The distinguished Oxford jurist Stephen Sedley (himself a Jew) has saidthat “there is no legal bar on criticising Israel. Yet several of the “examples” that have been tacked on to the IHRA definition (by whom is not known) seek to stifle criticism of Israel irrespective of intent. ”
Anyone know ‘by whom’?
@Clive P,
An excellent article which is indicative of how I feel about this whole charade. I believe that the US backing of Israel over the past sixty years, using (misusing actually) the power of veto at the UN to block resolutions and sanctions, has created a monster, which is the Israeli state. They been emboldened to the point where they do not consider themselves accountable to anyone for their actions, use undue influence on the politics of other countries, and continue their violent oppression of the Palestinian people.
When I seek the latest information about the Amesbury/Salibury alleged fatal poisoning incidents. The BBC still provides it latest new around about July 2018, this factless news is that two Russians have been identified as arriving in the Nation and departing back to Russia the day after the Amesbury fatal incident, and that Russia has failed is to comply with extradition to be charged in the UK?
How can the BBC be allowed to publish this evidential-less news item ?
“Allowed”? Don’t you mean “instructed”? Much more plausible explanation.
With the BBC as with much of our MSM, the guilt for this sort of relentless spun claptrap lies with the editorial staff.
No one believes any of the rubbish stories about the Novichok in Salisbury which are being released by the authorities and published in the MSM.
To summarise, the official line was, at first, that the Skripals (and Sgt Bailey) were poisoned by a military grade Novichok nerve agent, which could only have been made in Russia, smeared, as a gel,on the front door handle of Mr Skripal’s house in Salisbury. The Skripals had collapsed in Salisbury town centre and were said to have been treated in the local hospital where some sharp eyed doctor realised it was a nerve agent which was confirmed by Porton Down. The Skripals and Sgt Bailey have not been seen since although there was a brief video released of Yulia saying she did not want Russian diplomats to help her. A “D notice” appears to have been issued to suppress all news about the incident. (And the murder in London a week later of former Aeroflot executive Vladimir Glushkov).
Fast forward to FOUR months later, Salisbury drug addicts Charlie Rowley and Dawn Sturgess were poisoned and the cause was identified by the local hospital as the same Novichok agent, now disguised as a perfume. Charlie Rowley told the authorities he had found a perfume bottle somewhere between Salisbury and nearby Amesbury (where he lived) but now forgot where he found it. He took it home as a present for Dawn who recognised it as a familiar brand. He assembled it for her, attaching the atomiser to the bottle, and in doing so spilled some on his hands, so washed them at once. He said it smelt of ammonia. Even so Dawn sprayed it on her wrists and collapsed almost at once. Charlie collapsed later the same day. Dawn never recovered consciousness. At the hospital they identified the cause of their collapse as a Novichok and Porton Down said it was the same agent as the one used on the Skripals. Dawn was said to have received a dose of the same Novichok agent only 10x greater than the Skripals. Charlie was said to have recovered because he washed his hands after touching it.
So now the official line, which I have read in the MSM, is that two Russian agents came to the UK with a false bottle of perfume, containing a Novichok agent, which they smeared or sprayed onto the Skripals’ front door handle, then threw it away and fled back to Russia. FOUR months later Charlie found it, apparently looking new and intact – after being outside through a severe English winter – and took it home to Dawn who recognised it as a familiar brand and used it, with fatal results.
I don’t think we are seriously expected to believe any of this. I think the story about the perpetrators being identified is merely intended to signal to the Russians that the British have now got some idea how it was done. The official story is just a ridiculous smoke trail.
Mary Paul,
“I think the story about the perpetrators being identified is merely intended to signal to the Russians that the British have now got some idea how it was done.”
I am almost certain that neither “The British” nor “The Russians” are stupid, and I find it extremely hard to take seriously your view.
This is my analysis, that I wrote here the next day after the event, before Craig had written a word about it.
“So what has escaped from Porton Down, which is very near Salisbury?
The fentanyl story as it stands, makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Fentanyl may well be a dangerous opiod drug if misused, but it has been available for medical use on prescription since the 1960’s
Of course it could just be a “training exercise”, but why not tell the truth? Some people legitimately using fentanyl for a medical condition, may well be terrorised, by what is probably a load of old bollocks.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/salisbury-hospital-closes-ae-deals-12130467
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porton_Down
Tony
T Leaker,
More bollocks. i don’t believe a word, and that cock & bull story has already been done, and you updated wiki too fast, got too many decent photographers there, and no doubt all this complete load of crap will be headline news for the next few days.
I don’t believe it, and no one else could give a sh1t, so what was the point? Can’t you guys do something useful instead? You are like drama queens stil in the sixth form. Even Coronation Street is more interesting.”
Tony
Well, the American State Department has announced only today that it is imposing sanctions on Russia for poisoning the Skripals . Of course there is no connection with the British announcement only a few days ago that they had identified the Russian “agents” responsible. 😉
More news emanating from Plymouth that may explain why Boris (and indeed the rest of us) sees what he sees:
https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2018-08/uop-ain080718.php
Speak for yourself.
It was a degrading notion that reduces human to objects, what I might expect from a 12 year old brought up in this bullying society. & I can imagine the young & old emulating the attitude across society. It WILL be a factor in more harm coming to muslims & more devision in society.
It’s normalising the inexcusable. Why is this racist/islamophobe still at the centre of public life?
It’s not a new field at all btw. Well known subject in the visual arts.
I think it’s slightly different why borris “saw” was he did, e.g. because he’s a dehumanising racist. One of the lead racists in the UK.
As I really should have guessed it would my flippant comment was misunderstood. Our individual perceptions may be subjective, but we are not all given the huge public platform Boris enjoys. I personally prefer to rely on observations that can be verified by scientific evidence. His comment, whatever he might have intended, was neither humorous nor original. The postbox thing is an old right wing trope of the kind used by Bernard Manning, pandering to his xenophobic followers while being a dog whistle to his critics. Nothing really explains Johnson’s remark other than as another expression of his naked ambition and indifference to criticism. How could he be so blind to the effect of his words? His education appears to have been a huge waste of time.
If I say I don’t like Israel, that’s “anti-Semitic” and so presumably if I say I do like Israel, that’s “pro-Semitic”! But what if I say I like and dislike different aspects of Israel, does that make me “pro and anti-Semitic”?
semitic, schemetic, emetic