My world view changed forever when, after 20 years in the Foreign Office, I saw colleagues I knew and liked go along with Britain’s complicity in the most terrible tortures, as detailed stunningly in the recent Parliamentary Intelligence and Security Committee Report. They also went along with keeping the policy secret, deliberately disregarding all normal record taking procedures, to the extent that the Committee noted:
131. We note that we have not seen the minutes of these meetings either: this causes us great concern. Policy discussions on such an important issue should have been minuted. We support Mr Murray’s own conclusion that were it not for his actions these matters may never have come to light.
The people doing these things were not ordinarily bad people; they were just trying to keep their jobs, comforting themselves with the thought that they were only civil servants obeying orders. Many were also actuated by the nasty “patriotism” that grips in time of war, as we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. Almost nobody in the FCO stood up against the torture or against the illegal war – Elizabeth Wilmshurst, Carne Ross and I were the only ones to leave over it.
I then had the still more mortifying experience of the Foreign Office seeking to punish my dissent by bringing a series of accusations of gross misconduct – some of them criminal – against me. The people bringing the accusations knew full well they were false. The people investigating them knew they were false from about day 2. But I was put through a hellish six months of trial by media before being acquitted on all the original counts (found guilty of revealing the charges, whose existence was an official secret!). The people who did this to me were people I knew.
I had served as First Secretary in the British Embassy in Poland, and bumped up startlingly against the history of the Holocaust in that time, including through involvement with organising the commemoration of the 50th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz. What had struck me most forcibly was the sheer scale of the Holocaust operation, the tens of thousands of people who had been complicit in administering it. I could never understand how that could happen – until I saw ordinary, decent people in the FCO facilitate extraordinary rendition and torture. Then I understood, for the first time, the banality of evil or, perhaps more precisely, the ubiquity of evil. Of course, I am not comparing the scale of what happened to the Holocaust – but evil can operate on different scales.
I believe I see it again today. I do not believe that the majority of journalists in the BBC, who pump out a continual stream of “Corbyn is an anti-semite” propaganda, believe in their hearts that Corbyn is a racist at all. They are just doing their job, which is to help the BBC avert the prospect of a radical government in the UK threatening the massive wealth share of the global elite. They would argue that they are just reporting what others say; but it is of course the selection of what they report and how they report it which reflect their agenda.
The truth, of which I am certain, is this. If there genuinely was the claimed existential threat to Jews in Britain, of the type which engulfed Europe’s Jews in the 1930’s, Jeremy Corbyn, Billy Bragg, Roger Waters and I may humbly add myself would be among the few who would die alongside them on the barricades, resisting. Yet these are today loudly called “anti-semites” for supporting the right to oppose the oppression of the Palestinians. The journalists currently promoting those accusations, if it came to the crunch, would be polishing state propaganda and the civil servants writing railway dockets. That is how it works. I have seen it. Close up.
It all steps up a gear as any tenuous links to Corbyn are exposed and exploited. It’s not a good time to be linked to him. Boris is off the hook and Corbyn is on it.
“A trusted ally of Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn who is accused of lying to police over a speeding ticket will stand trial in November, the Old Bailey heard today. ”
“Fiona Onasanya MP allegedly misled Cambridgeshire Police over who was behind the wheel of a speeding vehicle in July last year. ”
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/fiona-onasanya-corbyn-ally-accused-of-lying-over-speeding-tickets-to-stand-trial-in-november-a3910496.html
?
This is parody level stuff.
RoS, not stuff that you can make up unfortunately. Why does JC surround himself with people who are so unreliable?
I sometimes wonder who represents me in politics nowadays, and to be honest, nobody does.
I hate the Tories
I hate the blairites – Tory lite
I hate the Libdems – untrustworthy scum
I hate the Greens – they have no idea
What a total mess.
Owned by Rothermere interests or the Lebedevs, the Evening Standard makes decent people want to vomit. Did the Old Bailey judge hear that a Labour MP of the 2017 intake was a “trusted ally of Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn”? That sounds potentially prejudicial. It would be prejudicial if it happened and it’s prejudicial to say in the London Heil that it happened.
Fiona Onasanya is PPS to shadow defence secretary (and LFOI member) Nia Griffith. Has Onasanya expressed an opinion about a weapons contract that caused annoyance to someone?
“It would be prejudicial if it happened“. I meant that it would be prejudicial if a jury heard it. Presumably a jury hasn’t yet been appointed. If it did happen then the judge should ask the crown counsel what on earth he is trying to do. It seems to indicate a prosecution strategy of presenting the fact that “Corbyn trusts her”, which is essentially saying “she has got a job that requires her to be trusted by important people” as if it’s some kind of background to the idea that “she perverted the course of justice” – a charge that is supposed to be tried on the evidence.
I pick lying over a speeding ticket over being fluffed by Israel in 5 star hotels. I don’t five two hoots about out punitive driving rules.
But just remember the SNP aren’t a part of the Blairite consensus in the slightest. And they certainly aren’t part of the Westminster gravy train oh no…
Meanwhile the Telegraph virtually calls Corbyn a liar, and in the opinion page they hint he cavorts with commemorations regarding terrorist.
Both articles ask you to sign up before reading all, but the jist of the story is there to see.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/08/13/year-denials-jeremy-corbyn-changed-story/
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2018/08/13/jeremy-corbyns-defence-disturbing-connections-simply-wont-wash/
” the Telegraph virtually calls Corbyn a liar ”
Good afterble consternoon. The Telegraph is off on the smell of its own farts. Fortunately going to be doing cold turkey, along with Erdogan, soon.
Is Conrad Black still in the slammer or did he get out?
The Barclay brothers are financially involved with Prince Charles. Got to wonder what Brexit will do to the British offshore money laundries in Europe.
The Haut de la Garenne children’s home scandal in Jersey got sat on. What were identified as a large number of children’s teeth were later declared not to be (!!) Apparently it was all a mistake. Cops who suggested there might be some truth in allegations against Edward Heath have had their knuckles rapped hard. There must be several disgruntled cops out there with quite a bit of dangerous information.
What are they waiting for? This is the tipping point of tipping points.
Well Michael didn’t look as settled as his could be, but this was sound imo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFIixmrKvm4&feature=youtu.be
They’ve got nothing of real substance because there is nothing of real substance. From empty to void.
Notice how the original event the laying of wreaths to commemorate 45 people assassinated by an illegitimate terroristic, air raid by Israel has been sidelined. It seems that we now condone one sort of terrorism but not another.
OK, let’s make a list of elected or appointed British politicians who have told the head of a foreign government, Binyamin Netanyahu
1) to stop interfering in British internal affairs, or
2) that as far as Britain is concerned, this man and his government do NOT represent British J__s.
and who have told J__ish media organisations based in Britain that
a) any British J__s who disagree with either of the above points are more loyal to I__ael than they are to Britain, and
b) if point a) contravenes the IHRA “definition of antisemitism”, then the truth is “anti-Semitic”.
Netanyahu is basically saying that the Znazi regime has the right to bomb and assassinate whoever it wants anywhere in the world.
The graves in question were of a) Palestinians murdered by I__ael in Tunis and b) a Palestinian called Atef Bseiso who was murdered in Paris in 1992.
Must everyone curse the memory of all who have been killed by the terrorist state of I__ael?
The Munich Olympics events weren’t extraterritorial. They happened in GERMANY. And Tunis is in TUNISIA and Paris is in FRANCE.
I don’t know the details. But one persons terrorist? ….Is another persons “legitimate government”.
I take it the case in point was that said individual killed innocents? …I frankly have no idea how anyone from Israel has the face for any moral superiority over pretty much anyone in regards to terrorism by the state, I mean how that guy in the sky interview can tell anybody to resign over being at some grave?
Forgot the insinuation of honouring a dead terrorist. What about actually backing those who unquestionably are in real time? I’m afraid when it comes to Israel criticism the bar for entry is among the worst human rights abusers in the world.
& as to the real Jeremy?
Blessed are the peacemakers. In the kind of world he opporates in he does a pretty stellar job.
@Ishmael, I totally agree with you, and wonder what the World would be like today if we had Bernie Sanders as leader in the US and Jeremy Corbyn as PM in the UK.
Your support for the terrorists of the PLO and its willingness and ability to murder J_ws where ever they are Munich for instance is well noted.
Its amazing the contortions that the left will go to in its support for the fascist terrorists of Hamas and Islam in general will go while at the same fulminating about how ‘rude’ Donald Trump is. Birds of a feather.
Anyone doubting that the left has a problem with anti-semitism only needs to spend a short time here because whatever the problem, Putin, Salisbury etc. etc. it will only be a brief moment before someone drags up either the j_w_s or Is_r*_e_l in general for blame.
Such intellectual and moral dishonesty is part of the reason Corbin finds himself enmeshed in his current dilemma. At best he is a useful idiot.
Just pose and ponder and pray tell. What is the difference between the Irgun, the stern gang Hamas and the PLO?
What is the difference between blowing up innocents by trained snipers targeting civilians and car bombs?
The differences are in the motives and let me give you another clue.
What is the difference between driving people off thier land and ethnically cleansing thier country for your own and fighting back for your rights to those lands?
Historically problems arise when a group of people living in one country have an allegiance to an outside body or religious creed which transcends the natural and legal order of the country in which they live and can bring them into conflict with both its laws and cultural traditions.
We saw this in the UK with Roman Catholics after Henry VIII established the Church of England whr Roman Catholics claimed a greater allegiance to the Pope in Rome than the English monarch We fought a Civil War over it in the 17th century. Many Jews now feel an overriding allegiance to Israel regardless of where they live, just as many Muslims feel their version of Islam takes precedence over Christianity. ( eg Coptic churches burnt down in Egypt.)
Now it is out in the open it may be time to bring out the fact that it is Israel who is interfering with British politics and to bring out that expose of Aljazeera on the influence of the Israel lobby on British politics.
@SA,
We can but hope that would happen, but I fear that the well known dreaded phone call from a notorious embassy in London would stop any of that happening.
There is really no need whatsoever to invoke any conspiracy theory because it is all out there. The plan for a new American century clearly states the aim of full spectrum dominance using any means. A lot of this is put in place. Those who rail about the dominance of Google, Facebook apple and so on remember that this is all part of this plan. Economic dominance despite being or because of holding so much debt. See how Russia, Syria, Iran and others are being destabilised and now even the old ally Turkey who have outlived their usefulness, and an attempt at China. The complete legislation and the globalisation and outsourcing are other methods of dominance internally and externally so that the true rulers of the world, the mega rich , can rule at arms length. There is no need to hide atrocities either because you could just bluff your way or threaten. Even when proven wrong, nothing will happen to punish those , like Blair and Bush, who were acknowledged to have openly lied.. Faith in international organisations such as the UN and its various sub-organisation and bodies such as the OPCW is low because they are either being subverted or support withheld.
There is no need for conspiracy theories. The history of the US based on genocide of the locals tells you all there is to know. Lofty constitution and so many great amendments have no power against lots of money.
Same old. For Australia, read the UK. For the RC Church, read the CoE. For Archbishop Philip Wilson, read Archbishop George Carey. For James Patrick Fletcher, read Peter Ball.
‘A former Catholic archbishop will serve a maximum 12-month sentence in home detention for concealing child sexual abuse, an Australian court has ruled.
The decision means Philip Wilson, who resigned as archbishop of Adelaide after his conviction, will avoid jail.
Wilson, 67, is the world’s most senior Catholic cleric to be convicted of covering up sexual abuse.
His lawyers said they would lodge an appeal on Tuesday.
A magistrate said Wilson would commence his sentence immediately at a relative’s home, where he would be monitored by a tracking device. He will be eligible for parole after six months.
As he left court on Tuesday, Wilson did not respond to an abuse survivor who confronted him to demand an apology.’
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-45178004
bless, so he qualifies for take-home deliveries? at least it keeps him away from vulnerable prisoners.
We needed a laugh. Jessie the parrot had been on a roof for three days.
‘Our crew manager was the willing volunteer who went up the ladder to try and bring Jessie down. We were told that to bond with the parrot, you have to tell her ‘I love you’, which is exactly what the crew manager did.
“While Jessie responded ‘I love you’ back, we then discovered that she had a bit of a foul mouth and kept swearing, much to our amusement.”
Jessie is reported to have told the firefighters to “f*** off” before flying off to another rooftop.’
https://news.sky.com/story/jessie-the-potty-mouthed-parrot-flips-firefighters-the-bird-while-stranded-on-roof-11472206
She’s back home now and probably extending her vocabulary.
Another good article on that evil antisemite Jeremy Corbyn who must at any cost be prevented from ever becoming UK Prime Minister.
Seven or eight years ago, I heard Gideon Levy speak in London. The place was packed out. Jonathan Hoffman attempted to disrupt the speech which was excellent. Levy is a powerful speaker with great presence.
Ref Hoffman. https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/david-cronin/warped-logic-pro-israel-bully-jonathan-hoffman
I saw Hoffman escorted out from several events which he attended with a sidekick – @ UCL. SOAS. Kings College, etc . He was even at one when Mads Gilbert was speaking. He is the Norwegian surgeon who went to Gaza to help in El Shifa hospital. Mads’ accounts of the injuries he was seeing was horrific. White phosphorus which had burnt down to the bones and strange bullet wounds – dum dums.
Ha’aretz was started off in 1918 by the British. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haaretz
It is amazing that Gideon Levy has remained as a stalwart opponent of the Israel construct over many years. I admire him greatly.
He has written two books – Twilight Zone – Life and Death under the Israeli Occupation. 1988–2003. Tel Aviv: Babel Press, 2004 and
The Punishment of Gaza, Verso Books, 2010. He’s 65 now. Long may he continue to tell it like it is.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gideon_Levy
@ Sharp Ears August 14, 2018 at 09:35
I’ve ordered ‘The Punishment of Gaza’, but the other book you mentioned,’The Israelis and the Occupation: A story of denial’ seems unavailable (I vonder vhy?).
However, here he is on youtube: ‘Gideon Levy || The Israelis and the Occupation: A story of denial’:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30x0880dfn0
Thanks for that info.
The BBC should be disqualified from any future election coverage, campaign reporting, and or interviewing anyone as they are blatantly unable to stop their sniping of one party whilst using tinted specs to look at serious problems coming home to roost.
To use the research from a z…nist hardliner and leader of an Apartheid state, from 1972, is a sad indightment of their partiality, they are compromised, a true establishment mouthpiece that is sounding like the ministry of truth.
Break them up!
Apparently a car has crashed into the safety barriers near Westminster, the driver has been apprehended.
The BBC, are focusing on the car, which appears to be a complete write off. I wonder if the incident has anything to do with Boris Johnson’s burqa remarks, and will Jeremy Corbyn be in attendance (wreath in hand) at the scrapping and crushing of the offending car.
An obvious fake. Just like all the rest. But this to coincide with the anti Muslim propaganda.
@Frank,
what precisely do you mean by “an obvious fake” – don’t you believe this actually happened?
I suppose you think woolwich was real too.
Hello frank. What can you tell us about Michael Adebolajo?
Frank, are you an agent for the UK security services? Would you like us to think that Michael Adebolajo never existed, and that MI6 never got Kenyan police to torture him so they could offer him a way out if he became their agent?
See any blood?
Rigby. The man who did not bleed. If you really think this was real, i have a bridge to sell.
http://sonarz.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Amateur.png
So how does the abuse of Adebolajo fit in?
Even Wikipedia can tell me this:
– “Abu Nusaybah, a friend of Adebolajo, said on BBC’s Newsnight on 25 May that Adebolajo had complained of persistent questioning by the British Security Service (MI5) specifically concerning his knowledge of “certain individuals”. He said Adebolajo alleged that MI5 had asked him to work with them and he had refused.[60][61] He also said Adebolajo claimed he had been tortured and sexually assaulted by Kenyan troops after his arrest”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Lee_Rigby#Michael_Adebolajo
Clark. I notice that you ignore the issue of NO BLOOD!
Clark. He was recruited by MI5. Hence the very very demonstrable fake. The body moves. The body is in two different places. The police car that carries the “armed police” has no id on the roof. I could go on, the fakery is so easy to spot.
The blood on the hands is digital blood. There is NO BLOOD on either of them. One of them is wearing a light tan coat.
NO BLOOD on it.
I’ve looked at loads of these things and I’m not wasting any more time on this one. It’s the sort of tripe that Chris Spivey spews out, based on stupid photo-montage ‘evidence’. Sandy Hook, London Bridge, the Glasgow bin-wagon ‘false flag’, on and on and on. Not a jot of merit in any of them that I’ve been able to find.
These stupid assertions would need a conspiracy of half the local population. Events create consequences. You’d need crisis actors living in some enclave somewhere, fake police, fake paramedics, fake coroners, entirely controlled police stations, fake hospital workers, entire fake A&E departments, multiple entire fake newspaper staffs, fake office staff to handle all the bureaucracy generated, and a load of fake passers-by. You’d have to stop proper police and ambulances turning up etc.
This is what is meant by “paranoid conspiracy theory”, because you’d need such a high proportion of the general population to be conspirators, you’d have to be paranoid about the general public to believe it.
Secret police were infiltrated into environmental protest groups, had relationships with the women and even fathered children. Each was one person infiltrated into a group, and they were eventually unmasked. There is simply no way of getting away with hoaxes on the proposed scale.
Frank, I’ve worked in theatre and film on and off all my life. You’d be amazed at the work that goes into a production. Even in a theatre or film location, a tightly controlled environment with no uninvolved passers-by in the production area, with practised, highly disciplined actors, carefully worked out stage directions, rehearsed to the Nth degree over and over again, things still frequently go wrong. The thought that you could translate a murder production into an urban street and pull it off perfectly convincingly first time – it’s just laughable. Join your local amateur dramatics society and find out what I mean for yourself.
But don’t expect Mog or any of the other “usual suspects” to tell you. No. They may well even encourage you.
I helped make Nadira’s film Locked In. It took two weeks, working fourteen hours a day, to make seven minutes of completed film. And that’s in a controlled environment where no one who’s not involved is allowed anywhere near the set.
@Frank,
Your comments regarding this latest attack and the killing of Lee Rigby are an absolute disgrace.
You need medical help, but to be honest I believe that you are beyond that.
The guy arrested was wearing a suit and black African in etnic appearance, from the videos..
@MaryPaul – Have you got a link? The pictures I’ve seen show him wearing a horizontally ribbed jacket, not a suit. (click.
This is what gets me about Ash, she can’t help racialising people, “They” invented… Did I? Am I “white”. https://twitter.com/AyoCaesar/status/1029288062575099905
In one breath the she undermines the work she profess to support. For an educated woman she ain’t half stupid.
“They” …Is this not a racist stereotype/category SHE is propagating?. ? I tried to reason with her on twitter, but her brain is fucked up.
It’s like she can’t see it. It’s ok FOR HER to talk about “white” people as a harmonious group, all guilty for the notions very creation?
That my friends, …takes some “education”.
She blocked me, for logic. ..
This is the inclusive left?
Dr Martin Luther King Jr, summed up rather clearly in my opinion, in a interview he gave after an oration, I can’t quite find it now.
In which he said that the white man had successfully demonised the colour of the black man’s skin.
Yea, To me all this “back, white” stuffs all part of western culture I haven’t identified with since I spent time in china town (Toronto)..Since then it means nothing to me.
Snowflake identity.
& it’s strange because being from a working class background, most people don’t actually seem to regard themselves in this manner, like it’s not a big issue in every day life. It’s the dam “intellectuals” & high ups who seem to propagate this in the modern day more than anyone.
Like “never forget the binaries plebs”, reminding people over and over. Same with the holocaust “education” imo. People aran’t allowed to move on from the past. & Those that get into politics will reproduce the same old frameworks. Then call themselves “anti racists”.
She is pointing out that the racial categories and hierarchies that exist today were created by European elites.
There is an irony in people like O’Neill and publications like the Spectator being uncomfortable with whites being categorised and discussed in the same way other groups have been for centuries.
Alex Massie really sticks it to Corbyn here in the Spectator, adding “whitewashing nonsense peddled by his fans.”
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/08/the-myth-of-jeremy-corbyn-a-kind-and-gentle-man/
Thank you for your link to the Spectator, which I have just read, and noticed there was no reference to Mr Corbyn not really being a vegetarian, as everybody knows he had just eaten Alex Massie’s hamster.
That would be the spectator that employs actual anti-semite Taki Theodoracopulos of course.
One thing the bullshit of the daily mail does is flush out the hard of thinking.
First they came for Alex Jones and I said, Good! The guy’s a disgrace.
Then they came for the conspiracy theorists and I said, Look! Google haven’t censored them they’ve just changed the search algorithm so they are impossible to find.
Then they came came for the the peace campaigners and I said, But Google, Apple and Facebook are private companies, they are perfectly entitled to act suddenly in concert and wipe millions of posts and videos. Didn’t you read the terms and conditions?
Then they came for champions of the Palestinians and I said, It’s their own fault, they should have used their own server.
Then they came for me and I said, You can’t censor me!
And they said, We don’t need to.
Actually they came for the supporters of the Palestinians marginally sooner than the others.
I know I might sound dismissive, but I have been banging on for years about Facebook, Twitter etc. being unsuitable platforms for countering the corporate media.
My point is about taking personal responsibility. If so many of us hadn’t abdicated our responsibility to think critically and happily parroted sensationalist disinfo; if more of us had bothered to point out to our fellow commenters that they were pushing logically inconsistent bullshit based on echo-chamber exaggerations; if people hadn’t spontaneously formed gangs to bully critical voices away from sites they frequent, or turned a blind eye when such was occurring – the likes of Alex Jones would have been largely irrelevant, and these platforms wouldn’t have been handed the excuses and incentives for performing internal censorship.
But no; we were enjoying ourselves too much to bother about any of that. We were feeling big and clever and invincible.
I agree with everything you say, Clark. We are to blame, but only so far. Who really knew what Google would turn into? I know for a fact I used to admire them and I’m not exactly sure when that feeling turned to one of unease.
It happens repeatedly. Companies start small; a couple or handful of inspired individuals with some admirable ethics. And because their ideas are new and clever, the company grows fast, and as it grows it becomes part of the corporate network, and subject to the usual corporate biases.
“Who really knew what Google would turn into?”
Those who were behind it.
Of course. They can see the future perfectly, ‘cos they’ve had it all planned out for centuries! So there’s no hope.
Page and Brin certainly knew that their “free” (actually gratis) search engine was a data-mining tool, but they couldn’t have predicted who all their future customers would be. When they were offered DoD money, well; would you have turned it down? Or would you have thought “we can rise above that”?
Stick to this sort of thing; it’s much better.
I care little about the personal histories of Sergei Brin and Larry Page. Those are easy to talk about because they’re public. Far more important is the research strategy of the military, the spooks, and globalised big business, which isn’t public. That makes it easy to assume it doesn’t exist, especially when books are available about “Life in the ‘Plex”, etc, full of distractional limited hangouts. The US Defense Dept, CIA, GCHQ, etc., are not all “straights” who suddenly realise what geek kids have been getting up to in garages or in their graduate studies and come round and offer them some money, as if it’s the music industry – and most of the music industry doesn’t work like that either. In the 1960s military and spooks were handing round the LSD too. Advertisers working for Nike even invented the identity of “urban youth”. The culture is under control. For resistance to get somewhere, people have got to turn off their computers and internet connections.
“Software that’s good at searching big data sets” wasn’t so hard to predict in say 1980.
What is it about “freedom” and the spectrum of different definitions that are current among the tiny closeted world of male programmers based in one small part of the US west coast? The differences between free beer and free something else, and libre and gratis, are largely irrelevant, given that NONE of them condemn the market and capitalism. It’s all capitalist, the lot of it. Brin and Page’s aim was always to rake in a huge amount of money. “Free software” in its various strands doesn’t dent capitalism one bit. I say that even if I have respect for a lot of what Richard Stallman says. How can one not respect a guy who refuses to buy stuff except anonymously, and who insists on referring to Facebooks’s “useds” rather than its “users”? I hope he will realise at some point that he took a wrong path many decades ago. It’s hard in the country he comes from because there’s this shitty ideology of pioneers and enterprise and “the little man” there, blanketing the reality that capitalist competition and even capitalist “inspiration” always leads to monopoly or at least oligopoly, certainly to the concentration and centralisation of capital.
Thanks for the encouragement re. the other post. I was pleased with this one too 🙂
The difference between gratis and libre, between free beer and free speech, between no payment and no restriction, and the obviously greater importance of the latter should be clear enough to anyone.
The major reason to respect Stallman is that he invented the General Public License and copyleft.
Would I be correct in assuming that you don’t use a Free (ie. GPL3) Software operating system? (Android doesn’t count; it’s under GPL2.) Tell me that and I’ll tell you what I based my assumption upon.
N_, take a look at this:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/Linux_Distribution_Timeline.svg
This is one of the results of freedom in software development.
For instance, have you even taken control of your own software systems yet? You don’t have to use software controlled by enormous corporations notably Google, Apple and Microsoft. You could search out your local Linux User Group and pay an independent individual to install software that’s licensed to you instead.
This won’t affect Facebook, Twiiter etc. much (though it will a bit), but it will help cultivate your own mindset towards taking responsibility, instead of forever suckling from the corporate teats. They’re not going to encourage your weaning, are they?
Clark
I don’t agree. Many of us have been highlighting important stuff for years, endlessly. What is the answer if people aren’t listening?. So many people are completely disengaged…their eyes glaze over if you mention politics. They’re not aware, they don’t want to be. It’s all, “Oh, I don’t do politics, I don’t vote.” But ask them about the latest “reality” show and they’ll give you chapter and verse on every character in it. How do we handle that?
There has been a significant dumbing down exercise going on and it’s terrifying how widespread it is.
You’ve got it back to front, Jo. You can’t just force political points upon people; you need to listen to them. Then, once you’ve discovered which issues they are concerned about, you can start explaining the political influences that have created their problems.
This is where the whole conspirology / conspiracist / conspiraloon conglomerate lets itself and everyone else down. Convinced they bear uniquely world changing knowledge, drunk with the sense of superiority that such belief imparts, they fall into disrespecting their audience as sheeple – the dismissive contempt is right there in your comment; are you blind to your own arrogance?
Y’know, maybe some UK people really aren’t that bothered that a social media platform that they use for flirting and keeping up with their friend’s activity (which is, actually, what it was launched for) has just de-platformed some marginal US right-wing lunatic who rants about the conspiracy to kill everyone with vaccines. Of course, you know that they should be, ‘cos it’s the thin end of the wedge, innit?
that social-media walled-garden also just de-platformed a very
influential ‘alternative’ news source for Venezuela.
the still online website off-guardian.org speculated
that last weeks’ failed super-hi-tech assassination attempt on the
Venezuelan president was with combined the ‘surprising’ lack of our
accurate media analysis of such, maybe the takedown of the acclaimedly
accurate FB “Venezeuela Analysis” page could be related? Sherlock
would say “YES”. . .
August 9, 2018
On Thursday morning our Facebook page was arbitrarily “unpublished” by
Facebook with no warning or explanation, apart from a standard message
informing us that we had allegedly violated the company’s terms and
conditions. The timing of such a move is concerning for several
reasons.
Firstly, there is the international context, in which Facebook appears
to be targetting independent or leftwing sites in the wake of
Russiagate. However, in terms of our own coverage, in the days leading
up to our removal, we had published important pieces which challenge
the corporate mainstream media narrative on Venezuela.
Specifically, we published an article giving details on the
assassination attempt against Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro, as
well as a very popular analysis criticising the mainstream media’s
coverage of the attack.
In addition, Venezuelanalysis has also been covering the growing
international campaign to End US and Canadian Sanctions against
Venezuela which are unilateral, coercive economic measures that are
illegal under the Organization of American States as well as United
Nations charters
The informative infographic, tweeted by Assange earlier, was used by
Turkey this week as part of its currency wars defence. It is certainly
worth a study, and/or analysis to confirm the veracity of the alleged
control & communication links between the fascist system components
(as defined by the odious Benito Amilcare Andrea Mussolini)
big FB image at:
https://swprs.files.wordpress.com/2017/08/cfr-media-network-hdv-spr.png
analysis with context here:
https://prepareforchange.net/2018/01/30/wikileaks-exposes-council-foreign-relations-controls-mainstream-media/
So does said de-Arsebooked news source have its own website? If so, at least link to it!
Graphic saved for reference. Thanks.
Super-hi-tech? A commercial drone with a crude bomb attached that exploded in mid-air a block away? I don’t think so.
Applying the usual logic around here it was clearly a false flag to justify a further crack down on the opposition.
It was a professional double-tap kempetai
First drone was jammed, deflagrated at quite a distance as you point-out, but the second super high-tech drone got very close.
Look, any sovereign State can do anything it wants, wherever it wants. Just has to explain “why?” sometimes.
Class.
But in Egypt they shut down the internet, & people found a way.
If revolution & social change has now come down to lobbying private companies on the internet? It’s a symptom of how people have made themselves weak, & they talk about community? What happened to actual community?
They all promote totalitarianism anyway. How many followers etc. One huge popularity contest. Maybe one day serious people they will realise activism in a shopping mall was stupid. Because “entitlement” aside, they own/control that space.
Very well said Ismael.
There are those who screamed that this was going to happen, and were ignored as ‘conspiracy theorists’.
Corbett rants about it, but is constructive enough to make the point that there are alternatives, blockchain platforms that are designed to be resistent to central control. We do have choices.
https://www.corbettreport.com/episode-344-problem-reaction-solution-internet-censorship-edition/
I was amazed that people like Medialens decided to shut their debate spaces and go onto Twitter…kind of goes against what they are about.
A book, ‘The Master Switch’ by Tim Wu is a recommend.
– “There are those who screamed that this was going to happen, and were ignored as ‘conspiracy theorists’”
Yes. That screaming really doesn’t help.
It really puts me off when I’m being screamed at. I start thinking, amid all the unquestioning sensationalism, with the conspirologists sticking up for the conspiracists and berating me for questioning and challenging in what they mutually regard as the ‘wrong’ direction, that there might not be any logic or evidence behind it at all.
Never mind. Maybe the UN-based NWO really will wipe out all but the elite with their super-secret vaccine, chemtrail and cellphone weaponry. At least it’ll be a bit quieter.
How do you think I felt, Mog; suffering from depression and suicidal ideation, trying to give others the benefit of my best talents, when RobG turned up and proclaimed that when your side won, the world would be made a better place by the likes of me being “taken out and shot”?
How many voices were raised in my defence? How many voices spoke out in opposition to advocating that I be murdered? My complaints were dismissed with “oh he’s just joking”.
And on and on it went, with some accusing me of pseudoscience and others dismissing me as one of “the usual suspects”, ridicule day after day, for months on end, and each time I reacted my reaction was added to the charge sheet, just as happens to the Gazans.
To be fair to RobG before Craig expelled him as a “left-wing Nazi” he regularly promised we would be shot or hanged, (or sometimes both depending on how his evening was going) immediately “after a fair trial”.
Only after he’d been reminded of the unacceptable injustice of summary execution. By me and, as it goes, the ‘troll’ Resident Dissident.
? ….But he is a conspiracy theorist.
Alex may have made some good single points one time or another. These are people who on the whole want to lead a narrative, never quite uncoverd or alleviated, never solutions or progress, it’s just attention seeking. & it pays.
These people are like drug companies. Alex just goes further & sells the actual drugs…Naked villainy.
Ishmael
But he is a conspiracy theorist.
…But what does that phrase even mean?
Tim Hayward makes a straight forward case:
‘Conspiracy theory’ is frequently used as a derogatory term, a term of disdain and implicit criticism. An effect of this is to discourage certain kinds of legitimate critical inquiry. But surely, in a world where conspiracies happen, we need good theories of what exactly is happening. The only people who really have anything to worry about from conspiracy theories are conspirators who stand to be exposed by them. For the rest of us, if someone proposes a far-fetched theory, we are instinctively sceptical; if they propose a theory that accounts for some otherwise unaccountable occurrences, they may be helping us learn something.
https://timhayward.wordpress.com/2017/10/18/whos-afraid-of-conspiracy-theory/comment-page-1/#_ftn6
So many people are stuck, with a Tourette Syndrome-like linguistic tic, uttering this term without considering the implications of what it really means.
Yes Mog. ‘Conspiracy theorists’ are our great saviours; protect that term with all you’ve got:
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/07/the-ubiquity-of-evil/comment-page-21/#comment-769084
protect that term with all you’ve got:
protect it from what?
It’s almost universally understood as a perjorative.
I am trying to keep open avenues of critical thinking and the validity of asking questions about whether elites have conspired against us. Telesur have been knocked off Facebook too, this is what it is ‘about’.
https://therealnews.com/stories/facebook-taps-militarist-think-tank-atlantic-council-to-police-its-content-pt-1-2
People like Monbiot, who are right behind this move to silence dissent, cites sources linked to The Atlantic Council (i.e. NATO)- who have joined with Facebook to start censoring in earnest. Monbiot has a large platform of toothless, limited, vapid, psuedo-dissent. He is a ‘Social Imperialist’.
What is the real danger here Clark? People like ‘Frank’ who ask ‘Where’s the blood?’ or the silencing of people like Abby Martin and her ‘Empire Files’ ?
False dichotomy, Mog. Both are dangerous, and together, each is more powerful than either would be singly.
When we criticise the Western governments and media, various commenters rush to the defence of the establishment and tell us that we should be criticising Russia or Iran, and we reply that we have more leverage upon our own media and governments.
Similarly, we are on this side of the curtain, where conspiracist thinking abounds. We can work to clear up our own act. We have less power over the establishment MSM side, but we can deprive their ‘conspiracy theorist’ slur of validity by pressing for some critical thinking and clearing out the misleading dross.
But it seems to me that you oppose this. You never have a word of criticism for the wacky stories that abound. All must be treated as equally valid, it seems.
I personally don’t find wildly speculative theories (on anything, including conspiracies) particularly dangerous.
Alex Jones et al would not have a platform if idiots like Monbiot, Owen Jones and Paul Mason were not promoted as the ‘legitimate voices of dissent’.
This sums it up well I think:
Let’s consider a hypothetical scenario, though. Let’s imagine a world where there were no official narratives. About anything. At all.
What if there was no dominating elite class telling the public how they were meant to interpret events and situations? What if there was only the raw, publicly available information about what’s going on in the world, and people individually interpreted that information for themselves? And what if they came to differing conclusions, and that was allowed to be okay? What if there was no elite class telling everyone that whoever doesn’t believe X, Y and Z is a paranoid conspiracy theorist, a raving lunatic, and/or a Kremlin propagandist who needs to be shunned and silenced? What if all that were solely determined by the collective, without the control or oversight of any powerful, dominating class?
What would that be like?
You may find that your results in this thought experiment depend largely on where you place your trust. If you trust the dominating class more than you trust people as a collective, you probably find this idea terrifying. What if everyone starts thinking wrong thoughts and believing wrong beliefs? What if everyone decides that humans can fly when they leap from rooftops and running with scissors is safe? What if everyone decides the Holocaust never happened and says “Hell, that means we get a freebie! Let’s get our Final Solution on y’all! Yeehaw!
If, however, you trust humanity as a collective more than you trust a small group of sociopathic, omnicidal, ecocidal oligarchs who killed a million people in Iraq, you might suspect that whatever happened would surely be better than what happens in the current paradigm.”
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/what-if-there-were-no-official-narratives-4de3ee54ed0c
Monbiot has done some great journalism about environmental issues.
Owen Jones has written an excellent book called The Establishment – And How They Get Away With It. If you haven’t read it you should. Have you? Jones is young; who knows how good he may yet become? He’s one of the very few to have reassessed due to criticism from Media Lens.
But conspiracists would dismiss both of these, and try to convince others that they’re “part of the conspiracy”. Don’t trust them! they will say. Just as they do about Noam Chomsky, Amy Goodman, Julian Assange, even Craig Murray and Jeremy Corbyn.
No that doesn’t sum it up at all. Think what would happen. “The collective” is a meaningless concept. It can’t write an article. No individual can study and analyse the totality of incoming information, and the individuals can’t telepathically link up into a super-brain.
So people would have to specialise. But then the conspiracists would disagree, claim to know things the specialists didn’t, start picking holes and calling article writers “controlled opposition” and “gatekeepers”, and accuse them of being part of some conspiracy, and pretty soon we’d be right back where we are.
What incredibly sloppy thinking!
– “If, however, you trust humanity as a collective more than you trust a small group of sociopathic, omnicidal, ecocidal oligarchs who killed a million people in Iraq…”
What? That’s George Monbiot and Owen Jones, is it? And that means it’s just great to encourage people to not inoculate their kids does it?
conspiracists would dismiss both of these, and try to convince others that they’re “part of the conspiracy”. Don’t trust them! they will say. Just as they do about Noam Chomsky, Amy Goodman, Julian Assange, even Craig Murray and Jeremy Corbyn.
Who are ‘they’ Clark?
An association fallacy.
Some think some of those names trustworthy on some issues and not on others. It is only if you are looking for someone trustworthy about all subjects that this makes any sense, and I think most people who read widely do not reasonably expect this.
All those writers have, to some extent or another, at some point or another, rejected certain inquiries a priori as ‘conspiracy theories’ which, as you yourself note, is a weaponised term employed by propagandists to silence or limit dissenting thought.
If they’d said, they reject certain theories becaise they consider them ‘too speculative’, or ‘baseless’, that would have different implications to using ‘conspiracy’ as a determinant of supposed irrationality. That is my point, and I think I have made it enough times now.
Pigden makes it more thoroughly.
I suspect that, in Johnstone’s hypothetical , you lean toward the former group, and me toward the latter.
got to go now.
I thought Monbiot a fraud when he started promoting nuclear power as the solution to climate change.
See what I mean, Mog? ^^ “A fraud” ie. he’s dishonest. I disagree with Monbiot about nuclear power, but that doesn’t make him a fraud.
You called Owen Jones “an idiot”, but you didn’t answer me; have you read his book The Establishment ?
Dave, please describe this fraudulence you accuse Monbiot of. What is his real agenda, and why is he lying?
Clark you take things too literally rather than as English is spoken. I watched Monbiot leaning towards a fellow quest being interviewed accusing him aggressively of being akin to a mass-murderer for being sceptical about climate change! Self-promotion rather than the reasoned debate you prefer methinks. And then to retain his prominent well paid perch he promotes, on behalf of the establishment, nuclear power as the solution to climate change when its an elementary scam.
Trident is the name of the submarines as well as the missiles. Its an obsolete vested interest and incredibly expensive, so the only way to keep the show on the road is by promoting nuclear power as the solution to climate change to justify the expense. I.e. they want nuclear power to provide the necessary skilled workforce to build Trident and then to hide the enormous cost within high nuclear fuel bills. Web search details and the Ecologist.
Dave, some people get very passionate about climate change. I can see why. Governments put a lot of pressure on ‘consumers’ while paying huge subsidies to fossil fuel companies, and funding war after bloody war, motivated in a great part for control of hydrocarbon resources – Monbiot opposed the Iraq war. Then there’s the habitat loss – and it doesn’t matter whether you accept anthropocentric climate change; it’s what Monbiot thinks that will affect his attitude. He was also hospitalised during an environmental action from a spike driven through his foot by private security. He’d have to be passionate to do the things he’s done, living in road protest camps etc.
There’s a big difference between ‘wrong’ or ‘misguided’ and ‘fraud’.
I’m pretty sure you’re exaggerating the relationship between nuclear power and nuclear weapons. Weapons-grade plutonium is made in military reactors these days. Many countries have nuclear power but only a few have nuclear weapons. Nuclear power is certainly a cash-cow, but nuclear expertise, nuclear physicists, nuclear engineers and nuclear reactors would all still be needed even there were no nuclear power or weapons, because science is an interdependent whole, and because industry and medicine will continue to need short-lived isotopes, neutron sources, radiation emitters etc. But I’d be interested to read that article so please link it.
Ishmael, you’re spot on about Alex Jones.
Web search Trident, nuclear submarines and the UK’s nuclear power imperative. The Ecologist.
OK, got it.
Are you shy about posting links because of what RobG said? It was nonsense.
https://theecologist.org/2016/jan/15/trident-nuclear-submarines-and-uks-nuclear-power-imperative
Interesting, well reasoned and plausible article. If you’d have said it was the submarine propulsion reactors I’d have known what you were referring to.
But that argument probably has very little relevance to Monbiot’s position. From an ecological perspective he’ll be considering the matter globally whereas that argument only concerns the UK. Someone may have persuaded him, of course, though I doubt he’d accept pro-nuke arguments uncritically. Or, like me, he may have reacted against some of the alarmist nonsense that’s circulated about nuclear dangers, for instance the intellectually dishonest anti-nuke tactic of stressing either high radioactivity or isotope longevity, while neglecting to mention that they’re inversely proportional to each other.
Some people do get passionate about climate change, but its often a platitude or a front, as they don’t practice what they preach, but want to appear virtuous against a disbeliever, even when the other person’s carbon footprint is less than theirs.
I’ve no idea what Monbiot’s carbon footprint is but as he points out himself, in a market economy, restricting our personal consumption cannot reduce emissions. It just reduces local demand, lowering the price, causing the less well off elsewhere to burn it instead.
If it gets extracted it gets burned. You can easily verify this by considering whether anything else could occur – there would have to be vast long-term storage facilities, but there aren’t. Government pressure on the public to reduce their consumption is mere hypocrisy:
https://www.monbiot.com/2007/12/11/rigged/
You’re back to calling Monbiot dishonest again. Maybe you’re only seeing what you want to see.
And replacing coal with wood chip at Drax power station doesn’t reduce carbon dioxide emissions either. The modern promotion of the scam was by Thatcher who also said nuclear power was the solution to climate change, but it was really about the politics of energy, because as right-wing and Zionist she wanted an alternative to socialist coal and Arab oil.
Dave, you’re not presenting anything like a logically reasoned argument. Rather, you are presenting disconnected suggestions. Your ideas about Thatcher’s motivations sound plausible, but have no bearing upon Monbiot’s honesty or otherwise. Neither does the fuel used at Drax.
The argument for using woodchip is that the carbon it contains has been gathered recently from the atmosphere by photosynthesis, making it carbon neutral. I don’t know how effective that is; I think there have been more recent arguments against it, but you don’t even seem to understand why it was suggested.
If you don’t know how to reason logically I think you should simply accept that you have nothing useful to say about scientific matters.
Do you not see how illogical your latest argument is?
– “The modern promotion of the scam was by Thatcher…”
Climate science is a global activity. How is Thatcher supposed to have influenced every national scientific institution in the world to declare a position which, according to your argument, their members must hold to be false?
As I’ve said its promoted by a range of powerful interests for different reasons and has grown as a result overtime into a malign creed with many bad consequences such as the epidemic of fly-tipping due to recycling policies that has made waste disposal so expensive.
Dave, I’ve been looking at weatheraction.com. You recommended it before, but I didn’t know it was Piers Corbyn’s site. It seems to be where you are getting your arguments from about this subject. Piers Corbyn seems smart and sincere. Unfortunately his website is a mess of jumbled information and arguments. I don’t mean it’s necessarily wrong. I mean it’s difficult to follow his arguments from the information there, because it is not well structured.
I know that widespread scams and distortions are possible because I have read Goldacre’s Bad Pharma. But what Goldacre has done is to document the structure of the deception ie. how it comes about / is achieved (it isn’t all deliberate, though much is). That is what you would have to do in order to present a convincing case. I don’t think there is much point in me discussing this further with you, because so far you haven’t argued logically enough to do that (sorry). To take this further, I’d probably do better to seek out Piers Corbyn himself.
But I don’t regard doing so as a pressing issue. If CO2 is causing global warming, then the scientific consensus is real and fact-based, and it is important that it be accepted widely and acted upon. If CO2 isn’t causing global warming then we don’t have a climate problem, but we do have a further problem in the corruption of science, and a fairly minor extra problem in economics, which is in an enormous mess anyway. But we already know that we have massive corruption in politics and finance, and the best approach to that is to support Piers Corbyn’s brother. You criticised Jeremy Corbyn but from what I’ve read, Piers supports his brother’s campaign to reform the Labour party and get it elected. Well I’m quite involved in that already, and I should concentrate my time there. The way to fix corruption is through politics.
2 + 2 = 4, but how can I say that, I’m not a qualified mathematician! I don’t need to be because its elementary.
Equally many things determine climate, but even if you believe the scientists who say carbon dioxide plays a determining role are correct, how can the fraction generated by human activity play a determining role, when it’s a fraction of naturally occurring carbon dioxide which is itself variable!
I.e. its elementary and you don’t need to be a qualified scientist, or more specifically a qualified climatologist to see that.
Well I don’t know Dave, and I’d have to devote a lot of time to appraise all the evidence and proposed mechanisms for myself. Which is why I provisionally accept the declared position of every national scientific institution in the world. As things stand, the predictions made years ago seem to be being confirmed.
Anyone can make up the sort of “killer arguments” you present, in either direction. For instance, can humanity get away with burning the amount of carbon laid down over the course of many millions of years in about two centuries, without tipping a vital balance? We seem to be burning it about 10^5 times faster than it was produced.
Of course, if there’s data fraud, as Piers Corbyn says, the national scientific institutions themselves are being misled. That might require a lot less fraudsters. Then, the best approach would be to expose the data fraud.
Dave, why not read Goldacre’s Bad Science and Bad Pharma? They’d give you a very good idea how scientific deception is performed, what constitutes a strong argument to expose it.
Humanity has merely scratched the surface of the abundance of earth. For example there are known reserves of fossil fuel and the unknown reserves will be discovered as the need arises to look for it, and if there were no reserves or it couldn’t be accessed, alternatives would be discovered, as is the experience of sanctioned countries. Saying resources are finite is theoretically true, but not for the next few hundred million years, so don’t panic!
Really? What else can you tell me?
By coincidence I linked to an item about Corbyn @ Aletho News and read “Three Mile Island, Global Warming and the CIA and remembered making the following observation some time ago.
See Tony-Opmoc @ Aug 18th @ 22.53
UK Trident isn’t independent as the missile head is made and maintained by US. This is a disputed point but likely if only because US law wouldn’t allow nuclear weapons to be sold to another country in case they were used against US.
So when UK government announces renewal of Trident they are announcing the renewal of US nuclear weapons. But since Three Mile Island, US doesn’t have a nuclear power industry to sustain a nuclear weapons programme due to skills and costs involved as opposed to the ‘nuclear material’ needed.
So now unpopular nuclear power is promoted under the guise of saving the planet from Global Warming and thus UK nuclear programme is to assist with the renewal of US nuclear weapons, making supporters of Atmospheric Global Warming the useful idiots of the nuclear weapons proliferation lobby.
And Trump’s America First, reopen the mines, will act against nuclear proliferation, because why do you need nuclear power when you have coal which is a rich resource for many things in an industrial economy.
So you’re saying that we’ve only burnt about a millionth of the oil, and even if that’s a bit out and we’ve nearly burnt it all, there’s plenty of coal. Is that right?
and gas
Aren’t you even slightly worried by the discrepancy in your theory between “there’s a million times as much oil as we’ve burnt” and “we’ve nearly burnt it all”?
No because I said we have merely scratched the surface of the Earth’s abundance and new discoveries will be made of both reserves and new technologies which will replace the old, so don’t panic, as life and everything will go on for millions of years as it has done, but if you want to panic then a real threat to humanity is nuclear proliferation promoted under the guise of opposing climate change which an elementary scam, so takes your choice!
But Dave, if you’re happy in this instance to accept a factor of a million as an error margin, the other parts of your theory may well be similarly untrustworthy. It could appear that you’re prone to wishful or magical thinking. It’s as if you’re telling me that I can cross a busy motorway blindfolded because there’s a only one chance in a million that I’ll be puréed. Or it might be almost certain I’ll be puréed, but that doesn’t matter because I’ll go to heaven anyway.
I’m sorry to say this, but I’m seriously doubting your ability to reason logically on this matter, so let’s move on. What is the great danger to humanity from nuclear proliferation?
The world, universe and everything has been around for millions of years and is expanding, so your pedantic doubt that fossil fuels will last for a million years is certainly worthy of an award that a thousand generations of your heirs will need to await to collect.
I agree it’s a slippery slope when you start censorship.
I also worry Conspiracy to defraud the US does not require intent for conviction. Manafort/Stone are Pirates of the Ukraine but many can get caught in the net.
I wonder how many wreaths have been placed on the graves of members of the Haganah, the Jewish Resistance Movement, the Etzel and the Stern Gang – all formally declared as “terrorists” when they were attacking British and Palestinian locations during the 1940’s. It’s sadly ironic how the “men of war” with blood on their hands, attack the “men of peace” who seek to stop such atrocities!
All foreign VIPs visiting Israhell are compelled to visit Yad Vashem. These visits are reported throughout the media.
Here’s Treeza (CFoI of course) when Home Secretary.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/home-secretary-theresa-may-visits-israel
She did lay a wreath.
Theresa May, J.ws and Israel — 6 connections
Cameron’s successor, a vicar’s daughter, is a firm supporter of Israel, of the J.wish community… and of a celebrity Israeli chef
https://www.timesofisrael.com/theresa-may-j.ws-and-israel-6-connections/
Re the car crash at Westminster, interestingly, a London cab driver on the LBC radio show speaking on the incident said, that the secure lane wasn’t clearly sign posted to drivers and that someone unawares could accidently drive down it, leading to a accident.
The black cab driver added (they often hear snippets often before the general public) that the offending vehicle is legally on the the road, if not in this occasion the wrong road.
Far be it for me to say that, the London Metropolitan Police force, could capitalise on such a erroneous act of folly.
The Corbyn v Bibi story is dropping like a stone on the BBC website now. Further reporting on this face-off threatens to highlight the slaughter being conducted by the IDF and, more importantly, the moral superiority of Corbyn, so the state broadcaster has done what is required. There’s no way this is going to end well for Bibi, and the Beeb know it.
Having said that, I see Labour are ahead in the polls again. Is it time to wheel out Hodge and the other neocon cranks for another push?
Are you suggesting that our national broadcaster is not making patriotic hay with this stirring tale of a plucky Brit putting one over on some greasy, foreign gangster? You have to wonder which side it’s on.
One has to wonder “Wow, is that woman Margaret Hodge still around in politics?”
She
* was directly responsible for organised child sexual abuse in Islington that she knew about and did nothing about (later getting appointed by Tony Blair as children’s minister in his government)
* later libelled one of the victims (an act that shows her character very well and also her apparent belief that she can do whatever she likes, which is reminiscent of Jimmy Savile)
* got work as the chairman of the Commons select committee on Public Accounts, overseeing public accounts to make sure they’re as clean as a whistle (nice work if you can get it, especially if your family are billionaire-bracket tax dodgers, as hers are)
* has a nephew who skedaddled from the Madeleine McCann hotel in Portugal hours after the so-called “disappearance” was reported, so fast he didn’t even check out – for reasons that have yet to be explained
* has practically equated most white members of the working class with neo-Nazis (how dare this woman say that?)
* has said “established families” should take housing precedence over “migrants” (note: we aren’t talking about migrants who slaughtered and expelled the indigenous inhabitants in huge numbers, as happened in Palestine)
I see we now have had the fake attack in London to coincide with the anti Muslim propaganda. They are so predictable.
Nought to False Flag in 4hrs 8mins.
You’re slacking.
The MSM are in overdrive on it. Almost orgasmic. On both news channels currently.
When I went out at 11ish Tom Swarbrick was presenting the LBC phone in. He used to work at No 10 as a political advisor to May! I have just returned home. The ‘experts’ he had on were from the Henry Jackson Society and Quilliam. Of course. Also a retired Met terrrrist unit officer et al.
Their propaganda is SO transparent.
https://metro.co.uk/2018/08/14/video-westminster-terror-attack-shows-police-officer-diving-way-car-7837076/
What a crazy thing to say. False flag! This was pre-crime detection at its finest. When every terrorist vehicle is tailed by an ambulance and a police riot van, then all our problems will be solved. 🙂
Oh and those twin flashes coming up from the ground when the Italian bridge ‘collapsed’, were lightning (or venus reflected though swamp gas, whatever takes your fancy). Also white powder at US/Isreal embassies, happened last month but announced today. Busy day for MI6/Mossad/BBC.
Such is the depth of the latest Corbyn debacle (wreathgate) that even the odious Nigel Farage is preaching from a high horse.
Apologies for linking to the Express. Watch the short Farage clip, in which he takesdown a Labour supporter and attacks Corbyn.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1003154/Nigel-Farage-Jeremy-Corbyn-news-national-anthem-wreath
Any right wing rags you havent eagerly linked to with Corbyn Anti Semitism smears? Keep wading in the brown stuff.
Just the last feeble buzzing of a defeated ScotsGnat.
Maybe he fears Jeremy Corbyn’s popularity might scupper his dream of independence, so demonisation is the way to go. Talk about kettle calling the frying pan. When you are having to rely on Massie and Farage, it’s getting desperate. I’m not telling him it’s just another smear.
I doubt it. On every occasion Jeremy has ventured into Scotland he’s made a blunder, clearly unaware of the Scottish perspective. For example, both Jeremy and his current Branch Manager have problems knowing what powers are devolved. Ironically, Jeremy would probably get greater support from the SNP MPs than some of his own e.g. Ian Murray.
Indeed, and currently some Labour MSPs are putting pressure on said Branch Manager to attack Corbyn over the anti-S claims.
Nevertheless JOML it’s depressing to witness the glee with which some SNP supporters have greeted the attacks on Corbyn. Having seen the appalling bias shown towards the SNP by the MSM one would hope they’d condemn it full stop. Sadly not.
Well said both Jo and JOML. It is a great shame that Corbyn misunderstands the Scottish Yes position so badly, but he must have had an overwhelming amount to cope with since his election to Labour leader, and English ignorance about the independence issue is widespread and colossal; it’s discussed almost entirely in emotional terms.
I wish those critical voices from the SNP would lay off him a bit. If elected, the reformed Labour Party would create conditions in which Scottish independence could be achieved more easily; curtailing corporate power, reforming the media etc.
Labour needn’t lose out in the long term. After the reforms currently in progress in the Labour Party (deposing the Blairites), split off Scottish Labour as a separate party and, post independence, Scotland’s PR system would elect a fair proportion of Scottish Labour MSPs.
Farage standing up for free speech!
I think I need to sign up to change my avatar to this.
https://twitter.com/alexcuadros/status/1028992383843819520
I wonder whether Alex Cuadros knows of the “Plan Andinia” that is a standard reference in neo-Nazi circles in Chile and Argentina. In the 1970s the loonies were saying that I__ael was planning to invade Patagonia.
Many journalists and academics are very narrow in their knowledge.
Stephen Bannon, however, is not.
Who is the “professor” who created the URSAL idea “as a joke”?
I don’t care tbh.
I only have eyes for the Communist Care Bear.
It is good to see Jeremy Corbyn stand up to Netanyahu publicly. Even if it’s only a little bit and in a “tweet”, no government leader in Britain, France, Germany or the US has ever done anything like it.
Corbyn should now ESCALATE. How about calling for a judge-led inquiry into the influence exerted in British politics by the Z__nist state? With the remit of the inquiry to include any collusion by British politicians, officials, or other figures.
Because
a) anybody who doesn’t realise this is beyond a f*cking joke has got their head in the sand, and
b) MI5 doesn’t seem to give a shit.
(Perhaps Andrew Parker wants to follow his predecessor Stella Rimington into a non-executive directorship at Marks and Spencer?)
How about Jeremy Corbyn calls for a meeting with Theresa May on the issue?
Or better still, she should recuse herself because she has appeared at events run by the Conservative Friends of Israel. She has a clear conflict of interest. Investigations into allegations that outside bodies are influencing a country with inside help shouldn’t be conducted by, or have their terms set by, those outside bodies’ declared friends. So if a government minister can be found who
isn’t on the payrollhasn’t got such a conflict of interest, then let him or her represent the government in this urgent matter.While he’s at it, Jeremy Corbyn could enquire as to when Britain became an “ally” of I__rael, as ministers have repeatedly stated that it is. When was the treaty and what does it say?
PS The graves in Tunis include one of a guy who was murdered by I__ael in France. One of the figures comparing I__ael to Nazism at the “Auschwitz to Gaza” event was Hajo Meyer who was literally a survivor of Auschwitz concentration camp. How about someone tells the Znazis to stick their allegations of racism where the sun doesn’t shine?
“no government leader in Britain, France, Germany or the US has ever done anything like it” It makes it seem bold put like that (though true) but hardly remarkable on it’s face.
Good points.
To be attacked by Netanyahu is a badge of honour:
Just look at this article to see how disgusting he is:
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/netanyahu-absolves-hitler-of-guilt-1.5411578
Netanyahu has no care whatsoever for the truth about actual Nazi policies and crimes or for commemorating the victims of those crimes in any genuinely human way.
The same was true for Z__nist leaders when the crimes were actually being committed. For example in 1938 the so-called “socialist” Ben Gurion said
“If I knew it was possible to save all (J__ish) children of Germany by their transfer to England and only half of them by transferring them to Eretz-Yi__ael (Greater I__ael), I would choose the latter.“
Almost 3,000 comments.
Well done to all concerned.
We’re getting closer to August 22, when comments will be closed on this thread.
Lysias; it’ll be Aug 23 tomorrow. The software maintains it at about week from the most recently posted comment.
Keep’em peeled!
They’re demonizing Seumas Milne now. He is the ‘power’ behind Jeremy Corbyn.
Note he had a ‘perch’ at the Guardian (is he a bird?) and he also had a berth there (or is he a merchant seaman?)
Complete and utter drivel from one Robert Philpot in the Times of Israel.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/the-man-behind-the-curtain-in-corbyns-oz-a-virulently-anti-israel-spin-doctor/
See that Seumas is also playing a part in Jeremy Corbyn’s production of the Wizard of Oz.
The author also ‘writes’ for the Guardian, Spectator, JC, New Statesman, etc etc. His byline on the Guardian reads: ‘Robert Philpot is director of the New Labour pressure group Progress’. We could have guessed that. The title of his 2017 book was
‘Margaret Thatcher
The Honorary J.w
How Britain’s J.ws Shaped The Iron Lady and Her Beliefs.
Heavily remaindered I should imagine.
Another link says that he was a SPAD in the NI office and the Cabinet Office. Dates not given.
Remember what happened when figures in the Norwegian Labour Party started talking too “virulently” against I__ael in 2011.
The response wasn’t just a car crashing into a security barrier. This is a photo of Norwegian Foreign Minister Jonas Gahr Store at Utøya two days before many of the future leading figures in the Norwegian Labour party were slaughtered. The talk was of boycotting the Znazi state and of hitting the Znazis in their pockets by divesting money invested by Norway’s sovereign investment fund which is one of the largest in the world.
Yes. I believe he also posited the idea of concerted military action against the racist gangster state.
I think you’re probably being sarcastic, but if not, then have you got a link? His attending a meeting on Utøya where divestment was advocated is a matter of record.
No I wasn’t but no link unfortunately. It may not have been at the same meeting but it was around the same time.
Just came across this N_ ref your earlier post.
’11:28
Was the suspect’s car being followed?
The Met Police are not immediately commenting on whether the terror suspect’s car was being followed.
It comes as footage appears to show police vans with their lights flashing behind the car shortly before it crashes.
The silver Ford Fiesta is seen travelling along the road next to Parliament Square before moving to turn right towards Westminster Abbey.
As an ambulance passes the car on its right-hand side, the car swerves left, crossing oncoming traffic and travelling through what appears to be a group of cyclists waiting at traffic lights.
It then crosses a pavement before entering a small road and crashing into a security barrier towards the House of Lords end of Parliament.
A police officer leaps over another barrier as the car travels towards themselves and another officer.’
https://news.sky.com/story/live-pedestrians-injured-as-car-crashes-outside-parliament-11472260
An ambulance was on site.
The following comment about Seumas Milne is particularly cretinous:
“‘He knows a lot of history and could probably walk you through all the prime ministers of Israel since 1948 without missing a beat. The knowledge is almost scholarly,’ another Guardian colleague confided to Wilby.”
Imagine being praised for one’s knowledge of history by some moron who obviously thinks history is about memorising the names of kings and queens and the dates of their reigns. DUH!
Video clip of today’s car event outside the Palace of Westminster. The BBC have helpfully spotlighted the car that injured pedestrians. But look at the other car that changes direction at 18 seconds into that clip. Who was in that?
I can’t find the link now (there is so much of the rubbish) now but I read that two Met officers were following him in a car.
They may well have been, but Neil Basu has denied it.
Boardmasters festival silent disco: 18,000 sing ‘Oh Jeremy Corbyn’
13/08/2018 ·
18,000 festival-goers sing for the Labour leader https://videopress.com/v/boEKxXf8
It has been a summer of relentless smears against Jeremy Corbyn, his team and his supporters as the Establishment desperately tries to bring him down before the Democracy Review rule changes and Labour’s annual conference next month put the party beyond the reach of the Tory-Lites indefinitely.
But those smears appear not to be cutting through. At the Boardmasters festival in Cornwall last weekend, around 18,000 young people were participating in a huge ‘silent disco’ when the White Stripes’ ‘Seven Nation Army’ played through their headphones.
The result was electrifying – and suggests that enthusiasm for the Labour leader has not dimmed even a little:
They know where hope lies.
That sound in the background as the video ends? That’s so-called centrists and Establishment smear-merchants tearing out their hair.
Be prepared for even more desperate measures as they try to make something, anything stick before the key changes over the next 6 weeks.
Big hat-tip to @djdanpropaganda and @msparadoxy
https://skwawkbox.org/2018/08/13/boardmasters-festival-silent-disco-18000-sing-oh-jeremy-corbyn/
From the Lifeboat News Message Board
Who is the acting head of the British government while Theresa May is in Italy and Switzerland for 3 weeks?
I.e. who should Nathaniel Rothschild talk to when he wants something?
With the Morandi Bridge in Genoa collapsing, I doubt he will have any trouble finding European politicians to talk to..
I meant who in Britain. I don’t understand your point about the bridge. (I briefly looked for any indication that it’s Rothschild-funded, as the Channel Tunnel was, but didn’t find anything.)
I’m still wondering who the acting head of the British government is right now.
Sure looks to me as the cause was the miscalculation of the deformation of the bridge;’s massive concrete supports which other countries have resorted to, and with the decline of repairing infrastructure, such collapses are bound to occur elsewhere. .
Looks like Britain will be seeking funds from Nathaniel Rothschild.
Where is Justin Wellby when the FOIs need him, a sixth trip to Israel needs to be earned and Jeremy Corbyn is now tottering. Even Katie Hopkins just cast aside her crypto burka and joined in the fray, surely the Archbishop will do his bit now, his wisdom is sorely needed. Its not about Jeremy Corbyn, the fate of the mullahs in Tehran hangs in the balance, surely the gentiles may be expected to contribute some cannon fodder to the cause.
I seem to remember Welby had his honeymoon in Israhell.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/11/justin-welby-avoids-own-goal-trip-holy-land-israel-palestine
We have had some real horrors taking residence in Lambeth Palace. Carey is a Christian Zionist. Welby is as wet as a lettuce. I had to go to this list to find the names. Runcie for instance. Remember his drawl? Ramsay. Coggan.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Archbishops_of_Canterbury
They all seem to have a tenure of around 10 years so at least five more years of Welby. This is one of the many links when you search for Welby + Chief Rabbi. There is not one word about the Occupation or the dispossessed Palestinians.
11 May 2017 | by Martha Pskowski
Welby joins Chief Rabbi at Western Wall
Interfaith activity is one of the best ways to honour the memory of Holocaust victims, Chief Rabbi Ephraim Mirvis declared during a joint visit to Jerusalem with Justin Welby, the Archbishop of Canterbury, writes Nathan Jeffay in Jerusalem.
It was the first time that such a high-ranking pair of Christian and Jewish leaders from the UK have gone to Jerusalem together. They spent much of their day-long trip exploring the Old City by foot, with Rabbi Mirvis, who lived there in the 1970s, acting as Archbishop Welby’s tour guide.
The two men stood side-by-side at the Western Wall, praying in their two different languages for peace. When they prayed for a second time it was at the Hebrew University, with the Christian and Jewish friends of Hannah Bladon, the British Christian student killed in a terror attack in Jerusalem last month. Rabbi Mirvis told The Tablet: “Her death was something absolutely horrific, and it’s very appropriate that we marked it together.”
During a visit to Israel’s Holocaust memorial, Yad Vashem, the archbishop said that anti-Semitism represents the “the root of all racism” in European culture.
https://www.thetablet.co.uk/news/7082/welby-joins-chief-rabbi-at-western-wall
Corbyn taking a firm stand against the latest demand for an apology (for being in a cemetery where some bad Palestinians were buried):
Jeremy Corbyn will not apologise over Tunisia wreath row – BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45185931
That’s the thing. That’s why they fear him. They’ve got nothing on him.
No financial scandal. No sex scandal.
Nuffin.
Pure and innocent, eh.
Idealist. Can’t be bought.
They hate that.
The terrorists who carried out the Munich attack were killed in Munich. None is buried in Hamman Chatt.
JC did not lay wreath on the grave of either Bseiso or Khalaf. He was at a Palestine conference in Tunis sponsored by Tunisian president. Delegates took a wreath from conference to cemetery to pay respects to the Palestinian struggle and those killed in the 1985 Israeli bombing raid – people who included Palestinian and Tunisian civilians.
The whole thing completely made up.
It’s almost like they are all acting against Corbyn in concert , like its some sort of consp…..
…sorry tailed off there.
https://skwawkbox.org/2018/08/14/there-are-no-munich-terrorists-in-hamman-chatt-cemetery/
Sorry but three were taken alive by the West German authorities but released in response to another hi-jacking. Two have since died, possibly killed by Mossad, one might be still alive but was last heard to be living in hiding.
Nobody claimed that the actual gunmen were buried there anyway but the planners and directors of the operation are.
Sorry Kempe but the story was clearly presented as ‘Corbyn lays wreath at graves of Munich terrorists‘, not ‘planners’ or ‘directors’.
Sorry also that the alleged planner is not buried there either:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10498912
An Israeli captain shows a Republican Senator anti-terrorism techniques:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4k4pMTsa1Kw