We are frequently told that people in Venezuela have no food, clothing or toilet paper, and that popular discontent with the left wing government is driven by real hunger. There are elements of truth in this story, though the causes of economic dislocation are far more complex than the media would have us believe.
But I ask you to look at this photo of supporters of CIA poster-boy, the West’s puppet unelected “President” Juan Guaido, taken at a Guaido rally in Caracas two days ago and published yesterday in security services house journal The Guardian. Please take a really close look at the photo. Blow it up as big as you can. Scan individual people in the crowd, one by one.
These are not the poor and most certainly not the starving. As it chances I have a great deal of life experience working amongst seriously deprived, hungry and despairing people. I know the gaunt face of want and the desperate glance of need. Look at these Guaido supporters, one by one by one. This designer spectacled, well-coiffed, elegantly dressed, sleekly jowled group does not know hunger. This group does not know want. This is a proper right wing gathering, a gathering of the nicely off section of society. This is a group of those who have corruptly been siphoning Venezuela’s great wealth for decades and who want to make sure the gravy train flows properly in their direction again. It is, in short, a group of exactly the kind of people you would expect to support a CIA coup.
Those manicured hands raised in the air will never throw rocks, or get involved in violence unless against a peasant strapped to a chair for them. It is not this crowd which will suffer as public disorder is manipulated and directed by the CIA. These wealthy ones are immune, just as Davos serves as nothing but an annual reminder of how very poorly God aims avalanches.
There is real suffering in Venezuela. The CIA is working hard to stoke violence, and the genuine poor will soon start to die, both in those egged on to riot and in the security services. But do not get taken in by the complete nonsense that this is a popular, democratic revolution. It is not. It is yet another barefaced CIA regime change coup.
UPDATE Such wisdom as this blog finds is often crowd-source, and with thanks to a commenter below here is some useful information from Jill Stein.
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Poor Venezuela. Here we have a country that is being governed in a benevolent and altruistic manner for the benefit of all the people and yet it stands on the verge of collapse thanks to interference by the omnipotent evil that is the United States. What could be clearer?
Consider that the US has been unsuccessfully trying to depose the regimes in Cuba (since 1959), Iran (since 1979) North Korea (since 1950) and Russia since the ascension of Putin. Exactly how is the US so all powerful in Venezuela and yet so inept when it comes to North Korea, Cuba, Iran and Russia.
Around 36,000 US military personnel were killed in Korea, so surely they put more effort into toppling the regime in Pyongyang than the effort put into toppling Maduro. Sure Venezuela has a lot of oil but then so does Iran and Russia.
For so long as there is an ideological requirement to deny that the government of Venezuela has any part in its own downfall then all of the above will remain a mystery. One more mystery is why the world needs alternative media if alternative media is just as inane as mainstream media
That’s silly. The US may not be successful in the end, but they are capable of giving a lot of trouble to the peoples of the world, and do. They live in their ivory towers in Washington, and as nothing ever affects them, separated as they are by several thousand miles of sea or land, they are free to play games in a vacuum, and they do, to everyone else’s suffering.
How homogeneous is Venezuela?
It has been clear for a long time that the revolution has been deeply damaging to large swathes of the Venezuelan population. Especially the poor of course.
Folks here talk about “Trump’s sanctions”, but when i spent Christmas 2012 with a Venezuelan friend and his family the country was already in a terrible mess, while the ruling family were well on the way to being multi-billionaires.
We should be sceptical about anything that looks like US regime change, after the horrors of Syria and elsewhere, especailly when names like Elliot Abrams and John Bolton are involved. However, while a country like Libya under Qaddaffi managed to be provide an outstanding living to most of it’s people via oil revenues, Venezuela has been seriously mis-managed for a very long time. As others have pointed out, Iran has lived under sanctions for a lot longer.
There is no comparison between Libya and Venezuela.
Venezuela has the legacy of two centuries of white supremacy to overcome and an economy that is designed to function for only a small minority of the population.
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/top-5-dumbest-arguments-defending-trumps-venezuela-interventionism-93d31b67aa4a
Another mystery is why somebody who claims to consider mainstream media innane is so intent on spreading its corporate-globalist Davos-Set talking points.
Ghadaffi’s Libya was a real dictatorship so not much comparison there.
Source for that?
To my knowledge he was approved by a council of various tribal chiefs, around a dozen or so.
Rod: a dictatorship maybe, but one that provided a good standard of living for all Libyans and foreign workers, in spite of years of sanctions: free health care for all, with patients sent overseas for treatment if facilities were not available in the country; free education up to university level for boys and girls; subsidies on imported textbooks; safe streets with little petty crime; freedom for girls and women to dress either in western or traditional Muslim style as they chose. Altogether more than enough to put Libya beyond the pale for salafist jihadists and their neo-liberal friends in the west, who have sadly had their revenge and turned the country into a hell-hole.
What downfall? The voters will have their chance when the time comes. Or do you prefer coups to democracy?
Maybe the EU ought to impose direct rule on us poor suffering peasants in the UK…
Marr 10am BBC1
Sturgeon, Coveney, Hancock, Cooper and Rosamund Pike.
____
MPs might have to work longer hours and miss their break to get Brexit legislation through. Poor diddums.
BBC News – Brexit: MPs facing longer hours to help break deadlock
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47018418
Cooper wants to extend Article 50.
That’s the beginning. I’m still predicting Brexit will be cancelled I’ve seen nothing over the last 2 years to convince me otherwise
Maduro is holding fast. He will not be bullied.
http://news.sky.com/story/uk-threatens-to-recognise-venezuelas-opposition-leader-unless-new-elections-called-11618563
Hunt’s tweets are shown. He really is the pits.
Craig is being attacked and insulted on his Twitter by someone from a place called Boone, North Carolina, supposedly.
Ms Mensch joins in. She has never recovered from Craig’s exposure of her antics when she was an MP in our Parliament incredibly.
He’s not doing himself any favours with articles like this. We’ve gone from relatively forensic articles about the secret services anti Russia campaigns, to wild assumptions about Venezuelan dress codes.
What rot you wrote Glasshopper.
You are not doing yourself any favours by pretending the neoliberal opposition are not the representatives of Venezuela’s well to do. Just take a glance at Guaido’s policy agenda.
I’m against the neocon agenda for Venezuela, but don’t tell me opposition to the dismal government is all well-to do types. It is the poorest that are hit hardest by incompetent governments.
And when is Craig going to report on the eye-watering wealth accrued by the Chavez family?
opposition leader is an Elite American educated oil company many
https://grayzoneproject.com/2019/01/25/venezuela-us-coup-leader-juan-guaido-state-oil-company-imf/
Obama/Trump’s sanctions against Venezuela
https://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/14073
And some good analysis from people who spend time there
https://therealnews.com/stories/attempted-coup-in-venezuela-with-abby-martin-greg-wilpert-paul-jay
Do tell.
Link us up, please….
“These are not the poor and most certainly not the starving. As it chances I have a great deal of life experience working amongst seriously deprived, hungry and despairing people. I know the gaunt face of want and the desperate glance of need. Look at these Guaido supporters, one by one by one. This designer spectacled, well-coiffed, elegantly dressed, sleekly jowled group does not know hunger. This group does not know want. This is a proper right wing gathering,”
Funny, I have heard this argument before. The xenophobic far-right anti-migration crowd used exactly the same argument to prove that the refugees coming on the Balkan route were fake refugees. They had nice and clean clothes. Most even had a smartphone. That didn’t sit well with the fascists who wanted to see dead and starving refugees in tatters.
This marks an absolute low in this blog.
Whatever anti-socialist propaganda there may be, millions of Venezuelan migrants moving to neighboring countries and a million percent inflation speak a clear language. You can’t fudge that by a picture with nicely groomed people.
Any leftist who doesn’t want to completely destroy the little credibility there remains in the left ought to condemn the Maduro dictatorship in clear terms.
He’s talking about the vultures that are poised to swoop. What have you to say about them?
Humbaba
When Cameron announced the eu referendum did anyone imagine a British PM would narrow the discussion down to the lowest common denominator of Hitlerian bigotry and racism? No . But May has not only done it, she us apparently 100% blissfully unaware of the extreme dangers of permitting this evil narrative to stand.
Trump is doing exactly the same thing. He can ignite a similar narrative in his Caribbean back yard to feed into his white supremacist power base of cowboys. Trump doesn’t care about economic mismanagement in Venezuela. He cares about BIG tax cuts for people like him.
If Craig’s bullshit alarm is going off that means he doesn’t trust trump, not that Maduro is squeaky or politically clean. Enough evidence has been shown that Maduro has acted illegally and unconstitutionally in order to defeat US interference in his country.
Don’t worry about the earthquake, worry about the tsunami
They have free elections in Venezuela.
The opposition boycotted the last one because they knew they had no support.
No other country has its foreign currency assets frozen in the US and UK. Which is stopping a properly finctioning economy.
If the arostos who own and run the consumer industries in VV let them perform their function – there would be no empty shelves. Maduro didn’t make the mistake, it was Chavez, who thought the 50 odd ‘aristo’ imperialist Spanish families would accept that as fair settlement.
The European/US slavers and conquerors just won’t accept a fair settlement – if their proxy troops land their bootd, then expect the people to not be so ‘charitible’ when they win again. Time to build a few guillotines.
How was it a free election when Henrique Capriles was barred from standing and Leopoldo Lopez was under house arrest?
Same as the ones that took place in Catalonia with their leaders in prison – for calling a election.
‘Dan’ who is a hospital doctor set up the Lifeboat News after the Medialens editors closed down their message board. The site is a very useful source and I refer to it regularly for info. Craig’s blogposts often feature on there.
He has now become fed up with moderating the recent bickering. It would be a shame if he packed it in. I hope he doesn’t go. Have sympathy for moderators!
‘Clarification.
January 27, 2019, 9:36 am
My talk about my work was not to make the point that I am stressed but rather that there is rather a lot more to life, and death, than arguments on a message board. That after 14 hours of dealing with the hopes and fears of the dying and their relatives, the bickering on this board seems totally bizarre.
Makes me wonder whether it doesn’t even have a purpose. How many have left silently because of it?
What better way to spike a useful left resource. For all I know WV, Walter and Tman could all be the same person.
I have deferred any use of force for the reasons I mentioned but I have had enough of it. Does not escape my memory that the MLMB was pulled after similar dispute. I’m not going to get dragged into discussion about the judgements I make. I’m not going to change anyone’s mind. If the board elects to move to a different site moderated in a different way I will facilitate that move.’
Cheers,
Dan
Poor Dan,
I know what he means, but through all the bickering, the information that comes to the fore is priceless. It’s ugly repetitive and there are many cul-de-sacs but without these new forms of communication this coup would have happened and many would still be in the dark. The human world is an ugly horrific place and that will lead to some ugly debate, but it is necessary if we are ever to wrestle power away from the elite
Anonymous have released another set of Integrity Initiative plans. Make Muslims love NATO. Target anti frackers. Plan for nuclear war.
What a lovely lot. Remember that our taxes are funding the outfit.
https://www.rt.com/news/449848-integrity-initiative-muslims-nato-nuclear/
Quite apart from autonomous being a subsidiary of integrity nitwits , the Muslims all lov NATO anyway . When did a Muslim ever come on this blog and crticise British foreign policy . They all see their future role as the administrative class of empire2. They are all natural alt right No Dealer entrepreneurs.
Many work directly as spies for Integrity Initiative, making sure they are inside the capacious rectum of British foreign policy and making ultra racist Takfeer of the ordinary Muslims in Somalia Libya Syria Iraq etc.
Disinformation is disinformation and if it’s published by anonymous they do have to promote the idea that Muslims oppose NATO, whereas in reality British foreign policy is to divide and rule by using some Muslims against others.
How the Muslims, including the enslaved Muslims of Africa Asia and places like Myanmar don’t understand their participatio in empire2 baffles me. It’s categorically clear in the Qur’an that those who work for the enemies of the true religion of Islam are hypocrites and will never be forgiven by God even if some political people like Craig might see their disobedience to the Qur’an as a sign of them being ultra super clever
Cleverer than God? Clever enough to mistake poo for a banana.
Giyane Could you clarify the connection that you say Anonymous (not Autonomous) have with Integrity Initiative.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anonymous_(group)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_Statecraft
Sharp Ears
When Moazzem Begg was charged by MI5 after visiting Syria there was a demonstration supporting him in Birmingham. At that demonstration there were a few English people and a lot of well-dressed Asians, the ones who work with and are supported by MI6 and represent Political Islam. Moazzem Begg has no connection to political Islam. His only reason to return to Syria was to gain evidence about Britain’s absolute complicity in this Arab Spring revolution, which MI5/6 didn’t want him to publish.
” “I agreed to speak to them and meet at a hotel in East London. Both MI5 and me had our lawyers present.”
In the meeting Begg said MI5 were concerned about “the possibility of Britons in Syria being radicalised and returning to pose a potential threat to national security. I told them that Britain had nothing to worry about, especially since British foreign policy, at the time, seemed in favour of the rebels.” ”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/02/moazzam-begg-contact-mi5-agents-papers
I’m not too familiar with his present situation. I really can’t stand political Islam / Islamism in any shape nor form, especially those who advocate war in other countries while enjoying the Western benefits system in Britain.
At this Birmingham demonstration for Moazzam there were also Anonymous mask=wearers being pushy and invasive in an otherwise quiet show of solidarity. From that experience I come to the personal conclusion that the masks were used in order to intimidate our support for a clear-cut case against injustice, to intimidate genuine and heart-felt opposition to the British government’s secrecy and use of terror and terrorist proxies, where they failed to intimidate a live witness in Syria to their corruption.
Containment . I can’t elaborate more than that.
so you have no evidence.
So you have no evidence.I have the evidence of what I saw
What makes me sure, that Guaido is US-backed man is fast, very fast, immediate recognition of him as a president. He never run for elections, never he were a candidate for presidency. Who is he? I don’t know. But US appears to know well.
He is an elected politician, but not the leader.
None of us normal folks in England knew much about Boris Yeltsin until he was backed to take over from Gorbachev. I am sure you Russians knew who he was!
Rhys Jaggar
Very few seems to know who he is,
as far as Yeltsin I think it was very much the same, I guess Tatyana could elaborate on that.
Not really, he was the elected president of the Russian Federation (and former mayor of Moscow), in one of the freer elections that occurred in the |Soviet Union, so not surprising he felt he had more legitimacy in Russia when the Soviet Union collapsed. Of course the likes of Putin and the KGB never really accepted that Yeltsin had more political legitimacy than they did. – but it will be interesting and revealing to see Tatyana’s interpretation of history back in 1991.
khm 🙂 I was 13 years old in 1991 🙂 the name Yeltsin was of interest for me only because it is similar to Zeltsmin, a boy I was then in love with 🙂
What I know from wiki – Yeltsin was the head of Russian Soviet Republic (you know, USSR consisted of many Soviet Republics, the name of each included the name of prevailing ethnic group) and Gorbachev was the head of the whole union. Gorbachev prepared an agreement on a new reformed Union with some Republics, but Ukraine pronounced independance and agreement appeared to have no sense.
A week later, together with the heads of Ukrainian and Belorussian Republics, Yeltsin signed an agreement that the Soviet Union ceases to exist. It was secret meeting, and agreement was signed against the results of referendum, where soviet people clearly stated they want to keep the union.
Gorbachev at the moment in fact had no power, he resigned and Yeltsin took the place of the President.
I never really understood the unpopularity of Gorbachev in Russia, the popular press in the UK presented him as some kind mild mannered reformer, but we were then let to believe he became some kind of pariah in Russia, torn between the more radical forces of urgent reform (privatisation) and conservative elements wishing to maintain a more powerful world position,, either way he couldn’t win.
My partner had two trips to Russia, the first, a short one, to avoid the traditional UK Christmas – Only to be greeted on Christmas day by Father Frost – and the second for a degree in Russian – that was after Gorbachev had been replaced. In spite of all the information I could gather, no clear picture emerged for me on why there was so much hostility to Gorbachev. Instead I have a picture of ordinary people in a country struggling to survive and somehow achieving this by all kinds of ingenious ways. We had been fed stories about the new leaders in Russia, about corruption, intimidation and so on, and yes, I believe life was undoubtedly hard during that transition period (something we will find out about when he have successful shot ourselves in the foot with whatever Brexit deal we can make). Given the kind of forces that were working on Russia was the fall of Gorbachev inevitable, what is your view, if you have one?
pete, I can only judge on what I have vitnessed.
My granny lived in Voronezh region, she met WWII at the age of 12. She went through all the hardness of it and appeared to be a simple uneducated peasant woman after the war ended.
She cleaned public buildings in her village – that was her occupation after war. As many ordinary citizens in rural areas, she kept domestic animals (you must know proper english word for it).
She had 2 swines, named Borjka and Mishka (diminitive for Boris and Michael).
—
My memories hold the perception that most people were very sorry for the breakage of USSR.
And to make it totally clear, the opinion of my grandma on what is better for the village – it had more weight than the opinion of some remote ‘man-in-chief’. It was common practice to learn true state of maters from ‘people on the land’ than from ‘people who get ‘prizes’ for running the land’.
People similar to kashmiri could possibly argue the fact itself, that simple workers have ability to even decide what is good and what is bad for their land. I assure you, that the lack of education is never the obstacle. We have many clever smart but uneducated people who bring reasonable ideas. What you really need is – a bunch of good translators. In fact, all thee people are the same, their intellectual abilities are averagely the same.
It is wrong to think that knowlege of one more foreign language, or one more Math theory makes you more clever than the rest of people. It is wrong. We all have the base in our understanding. What differs educated from un-educated people is KNOWLEGE OF SPECIAL TERMS. Every fenomenon that you think you’ve discovered while educating yourself – in fact is simple finding a proper name, an exact term, to describe what is already known to humankind.
When you think that educated people have smart conversation, in fact you observe people who use (the previously learned) the codenames for faster access to key objects of discussion.
found wiki page in russian
after graduating with diploma of an industrial engineer, he studied at The George Washington University, USA.
in 2009 together with then mayor of Caracas he founded a social-democracy political party ‘Voluntad Popular’ which has 14 places out of 167 in Venezuela’s National Assambley
January 5, 2019 appointed the speaker of the National Assambley
January 13 – detained by security service SEBIN, but soon was released
January 23 – announced himself the President
—
January 23, the same day, USA, Canada, Paraguay, Columbia recognise him as the President.
—
Venezuelan Deputy Prime Minister for Communication, Culture and Tourism, Jorge Rodriguez:
“So that our country was aware of the ongoing psychological operation: this senor (Guaido) said to Diosdado, that he could not any longer stand the pressure from the United States, that he was constantly called by (oppositionists – Ed.) Leopoldo Lopez and Maria Corina to convey messages from Marco Rubio ( US Senator – Ed.) and Ivan Duque (President of Colombia – Ed.).”
According to Rodriguez, on January 22, Guaido met with the head of the national constituent assembly of Venezuela Diosdado Cabello and the trade union leader Freddy Bernal at the Hotel Lido in Caracas.
For proof, the deputy prime minister distributed a videotape showing how a man resembling Guaido enters the hotel.
Guayido himself denies having met with Cabello.
Tatyana and Pete
“My memories hold the perception that most people were very sorry for the breakage of USSR.” ~ Tayana
“In spite of all the information I could gather, no clear picture emerged for me on why there was so much hostility to Gorbachev.” ~ Pete
Here’s the answer/picture for both of you: https://imgur.com/xXS4jN0
@David, thanks for that, I was unaware that any survey had been done. I have to say that had I been Russian and living in Russia I would have voted the same, to preserve the status quo, not out of any loyalty to the state but working on the assumption “better the devil you know rather that one that you don’t” I obviously need to work on my Russian history.
of course: Venezuela Opposition Head Declared Himself President After Pence’s Call – Report
https://sputniknews.com/latam/201901261071838339-venezuela-guaido-us-support/
Just not true he was elected to the National Assembly in 2015 who then elected him as their Chair. Given the 2018 Presidential Election which Maduro won was clearly rigged – it is easy to see how the National Assembly considers itself to have more democratic legitimacy than Maduro, and they are doing the right thing in seeking new elections.
“Resident dissident” comment tells us about the psyop going on, the election was “clearly rigged” they say.
Watch out for comments alike.
And your point is,Res Dis.? In your very own country MP’s huff and puff when they are found out to have cheated the electorate at the ballot box and when the Electoral Commission, citing many defrauded elections by the main parties, demands to have the powers to prosecute these rascals, a loud outcry is heard.
Elections are rigged, defrauded and voters cheated out of real results all over the world.
Can we have an eight day ultimatum please on the bombing of Yemen, just to keep us on a balanced carpet. To see countries bowing to Trumps agenda, when they full well know that he is a puppet of troublemakers such as Rockefeller and Russo is a grande obscenity. I wonder what Micron would feel like if we are recognising Jean Luc Melenchon as the legitimate president of France, I’m sure that many of Frances ex colonials would support it, with a little arm twisting as normal.
This ganging up against Venezuela, visa vis peace talks with the Taliban, is somewhat telling, getting at Venezuelas heavy crude, to power one’s diesel fueled war machine sounds like an agenda to fuel another world flagration.
Guaido is the Speaker (President) of the National Assembly. He comes next in the line of succession if the President and Vice Presidente posts become vacant. He and his supporters argue that Maduro and his Vice President are usurpers since January 10, when they took office, because the May 2018 election was a sham. Only about 35% of the electorate voted, many opposition candidates were banned or arrested, and the Government issued new “Fatherland ID’s” that were distributed in areas controlled by Maduro. Those who did not possess this new Fatherland ID were either prevented from voting or harassed. I do not agree with Guaidó’s strategy, especially because it was “consulted” first with the US. However,what I’ve been trying to say here is that tricks, chicanery, rampant corruption in the high spheres of the government and outright repression have deprived the Maduro regime of any political legitimacy in the eyes of most Venezuelans. If it is not Guaidó it will have to be someone else after proper new elections are called. In fact, Guaidó has proclaimed himself acting president, until new electios take place. To think that Maduro will cling to power until January 2025 is ludicrous. I hope that Venezuela is allowed and helped to get ot of this nightmare, without US intervention. Mexico and Uruguay have called for a national dialogue, although previous attempts failed miserably because the hard liners in the Chavista camp refuse to recognize the urgent need for free elections.
I think what is required here is a cool, calm analysis of Venezuelan finances since Chavez took office.
It appears to me that the boom in revenues from oil nationalisation occurred in the Noughties but, rather than building a Sovereign Wealth Fund whose management could contribute forever to Venezuelan prosperity, a one-off massive investment in poverty reduction, literacy, education etc was initiated. It is also likely that plenty of officials siphoned off billions too.
The danger with such fixed cost programmes is that when the revenues take a hit, overall finances go belly up if the economy has not been proactively diversified to withstand the regular oil shocks that have occurred since oil transformed the world as we know it.
The other problem for Venezuela is the dollar trading system for oil, making US sanctions a real problem. It suggests that non-dollar oil trading did not begin soon enough, causing a need for external finance to overcome withheld revenues.
This finance has come not just from US but also from Russia and may e others too, in effect making all future oil revenues unavailable to the country, merely the means to repay foreign debt.
The lesson to learn I think is a proactive explanation of what will happen to government bounties like oil revenues, ensuring that a balanced budget remains and a Wealth Fund is built up, gradually and steadily increasing living standards rather than going bust on an idealistic splurge. It takes real statesmanship to achieve that in the face of robber barons with US backing.
Unfortunately, corruption and criminals go hand in hand with oil states, so this may be pie in the sky. But Norway, Russia and a few arab plutocracies managed it…..
To me, right now, Venezuela is up to its eyeballs in debt and vultures from foreign lands are arguing over who gets to eat the carcass.
One thing is certain: oil privatisation wipes out the sole means of Venezuela repaying its current creditors, so the vampire squid and Exxon Mobil may be warring factions in this tragic opera…..
Rhys,
“…the dollar trading system for oil, making US sanctions a real problem”
May be, just may be, it is the reason for the current abrupt coup. Look, Russia is trading more and more in national currencies, avoiding dollar. China sells their oil futures for their national currency. Europe and India buy from Iran for Euro instead of dollar. Turkey thinks of doing the same.
If only Maduro really asked russian Ministry of Finance to help with the crisis, if only Rus MoF proposed to trade in national currency, without dollar – with Venezuela’s biggest on the planet oil reserves – it may be the reason for USA to immediately interfere.
Have you read John Michael Greer ‘Twighlight’s Last Gleaming’ (2015)? It’s a good yarn, a page turner set in the not so distant future. By the time the story opens the ‘Venezuela War’ is in the past, like the ‘Iraq War’. So, ‘Regime Change’, followed by Civil War, what’s new?
best
Phil H
I came across this foaming drivel in the Guardian yesterday by Andrew Rawnsley.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jan/06/to-stop-brexit-labour-supporters-will-have-to-revolt-against-their-leader-Corbyn
” Labour members hate Brexit and they want it reversed. With parliament deadlocked and growing public support for taking the question back to the people, a large majority of Labour voters, and an even larger majority of Labour members, wants the party to throw its weight behind another referendum. Compare and contrast with a Labour leader who doesn’t hate Brexit, doesn’t want it to be reversed and will not help facilitate another referendum if he can possibly avoid it.”
Ok , so a few Guardian readers might have withdrawn their claws, frightened by the terrible rhetoric of the ALTright cabinet, whose fake armour-plating is designed to scare the EU, but ends up scaring us people.
Fact is, Labour members and supporters massively share Jeremy Corbyn’s view of Brexit, that racism is intolerable, and free movement of people is fair exchange for free trade.
The goal of Brexit is for us labour-leaning Brits not to have to be told by the EU to continue participating ad infinitum in endless war, which like the Forth Bridge needs to be re-painted as soon as one end is completed.
Norawy + is perfect. leaving the Customs union is a disaster. Nothing could be easier and more straightforward.
2.5 years of political poker by the Tories should be put on Tuesday where the sun don’t shine. If May thinks she can just prevaricate eternally , she needs to wake up, smell the coffee and switch off The Archers.
Immigration is not going to be stopped by laws. We need the ECJ to keep any and all our politicians under control and supervision. The absolutely last thing we need is to sever ourselves from the EU so completely that war breaks out in the Irish – Northern Ireland border and US corporates devour us.
3 cheers for Jeremy Corbyn. The only man/woman in British politics today with the right idea.
Indeed, the claims about Labour members and voters the Guardian, BBC, C4 News etc keep repeating are false. The polling they base their claims on shows clearly that fewer than one in three Labour members disagree with Corbyn’s Brexit stance – and only eight percent of those who prefer remain and might want a new referendum felt strongly about it.
https://skwawkbox.org/2019/01/20/the-labour-brexit-letter-the-guardian-wouldnt-publish/
There won’ be a 2nd referendum but it has nothing to do with whether Corbyn wants one or not. The reason is simple, although never mentioned by the liberal media. It is because the numbers do not exist in the House of Commons. Barely a third of Labour MPs (71) actually want a “People’s” Vote. That means at least 100 Tories representing Leave seats would also have to vote for it, something that won’t happen because they want to keep their jobs.
So to blame Corbyn is simply dishonest. However, these are highly dishonest and unscrupulous people whose agenda is not primarily about stopping Brexit.
The CIA’s Venezuela narrative has been doing the rounds in our media for years now in preparation for their moment to seize power, nd, needless to say, using it as a stick to beat Corbyn. In addition, it’s always clear when the British establishment and their American bosses are ‘up to something’ because they shut down public comment in the newspapers – clearly with Salmond, Brexit, Corbyn and Venezuela they are getting very nervous.
The terrible forthcoming destruction of the « Caribbean Basin »
https://www.voltairenet.org/article204656.html
Oops sorry, this link was already posted by giyane
January 26, 2019 at 16:00
The Great Satan (US) and its compliant minions who back a regime change in Venezuela, use the main argument that Maduro isn’t a legitimate president however.
“First, no one “banned” the opposition from running for president in 2018. A big chunk of Venezuela’s divided opposition chose to boycott the vote. It could have won if it had united. It just chose not to, preferring other methods of regime change instead.”
“Regarding the electoral process, however, international observers said it was clean. Plus, only around 30% of eligible voters picked Maduro. That’s hardly the kind of win you’d expect in a rigged election.”
Also Maduro’s margin of election isn’t that different for other countries. Such as the UK, US, Mexico and Israel.
https://www.thecanary.co/opinion/2019/01/25/uk-government-goes-into-full-colonial-mode-with-a-mind-boggling-display-of-propaganda/
Maybe you should have mentioned France in your list of countries.
It seems that quite a lot of French people also “prefer other methods of regime change”
If history is any guide then they may well succeed.
Meanwhile as companies flee Old Blighty for Europe and further afield due to Brexit.
“Tesco is to axe 15,000 jobs and close meat, fish and deli counters across the country as part of a £1.5 billion cost-saving measure.”
http://archive.vn/LEJGq
I should add thousands of companies are poised to dump Old Blighty on a no deal, sccording to the British Chambers of Commerce.
A mass exodus is on the cards followed by the implemention of Operation Temperer.
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-11-19/operation-temperer-exposed-uk-armys-secret-plan-martial-law-if-no-deal-brexit
http://archive.vn/lGxrW
Should read implementation.
So with all those reductions by tesco and departures england will know what it feels like in venezuela. Did the tories get 30 percent of the vote like Maduro?
To appeal to
illiteratesinternet users, the US advertising and surveillance company Google is showing a picture of swans taken in dim light next to its link to today’s Brexit coverage in the Independent. The Independent’s article does in fact contain the said picture as a link to a piece on what a “No Deal Brexit” will mean for “UK habitats” [1], so I am quite sure that whoopsadaisyist loons will be in their element as they tell themselves that of course Google didn’t mean anything by their choice of picture, and it was all done automatically by machines employing algorithms, which never mean any harm, and only a delusional “conspiracy theorist” would suspect otherwise.I am also aware that the said advertising company doesn’t serve up the same links to everybody, because they vary what they present according to whatever is most lucrative and what gives them the most influence when they inject it into a given punter’s mind. But the fact is that for many internet users today, if you look at the top Brexit link on Google News, you will see two black swans. And we all know what a black swan signifies: a highly improbable event that was unforeseen by most people and that drastically changes the game.
Expect a February Surprise that will knock all previous October Surprises out of the water. It could even be a late January Surprise.
Watch that man John Bercow. Journalists think they’re cynics when they gabble on about the sticker on his (actually his wife’s) car saying “Bollocks to Brexit”, as though the man in the gown and the Speaker’s chair accidentally got caught and embarrassed. How stupid and naive does a person have to be to believe that? The way the Bercow role has been and is being played is a master class in nifty political public relations. Expect a Bercow pivot. It will be either Deal or No Deal and it could happen very soon. Scribblers won’t question his actions properly because they won’t have the nous, guts or lack of deference to disbelieve the line that he was so fair and independent when he obstructed the government and now he’s being so fair and independent when he’s helping them.
Not a single journo is speculating publicly that Theresa May and John Bercow, or more accurately the central movers and shakers and John Bercow, are in it together. It’s far more than any journalist’s job is worth. In Britain it’s absolutely not done to question the Speaker’s motivations, any more than a judge leading an inquiry, especially if he is a Lord, ever gets his bona fides questioned. Britain is a pathetically deferential country. The “cynicism” encouraged in its media is utterly phony. In a sense it is reminiscent of Monty Python or “That Was The Week That Was” in the 1960s – and oh look, Oxford and Cambridge universities are still with us.
It is also clear that just as the Tories wanted a Labour vote of no confidence, and they practically forced Jeremy Corbyn into tabling one, they also want Labour to call for another referendum and for either a revocation of Article 50 or an extension. [2] The media are parroting or suggesting that one of these motions might pass. But none of them would. Labour is in a precarious position. Seumas Milne and Jeremy Corbyn are doing mightily well holding out with their backs to the wall.
Meanwhile “a source” (i.e. probably the Number 10 Press Office) states in relation to planning for martial law that “The overriding theme in all the No Deal planning is civil disobedience and the fear that it will lead to death in the event of food and medical shortages.” (Source: Evening Standard.) Clearly “civil disobedience” even when the ruling scum are starving you to death and your elderly parents are in severe pain because they can’t get painkillers is characterised as being as evil and wicked as anything could be, richly deserving of being put down by the army.
Notes
(1) “UK habitats” indeed”! How “independent” is it to portray the monarchy as being as natural as the hills and lakes? Isn’t anybody left wing any more? What next? Will there be a “Communist Party of the United Kingdom”?
(2) A request for an Article 50 extension is what I call the “Oh please, please, Latvia and Bulgaria, help us stop freedom of movement from your countries to Britain” card. [3]
(3) The February parliamentary recess has been cancelled. This is probably so that the required statutory instruments can be rushed through the Commons and Lords. The number needed (not remaining, but the overall number needed) has been revised down from 800-1000 to fewer than 600. (The Hansard Society’s Brexit Statutory Instruments dashboard).
Caution: don’t put your money in the Bank of England as they may never give it back to you.
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/Bank-of-England-Refuse-to-Return-US1.2B-Venezuelan-Gold—20190127-0003.html
The British government has decided that the unelected Guaido is the president of Venezuela. This one act illustrates perfectly clearly that the British ruling elite have nothing but contempt for human rights, democracy, the rule of law, the right to self determination, and that whenever they use such terms they are engaging in nothing other than lying propaganda.
Perhaps already posted:
Bank of England Refuse to Return US$1.2B Venezuelan Gold
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/Bank-of-England-Refuse-to-Return-US1.2B-Venezuelan-Gold—20190127-0003.html
Something else of note is the fact that a solid majority of these pictured are of obvious mainly caucasian extraction. A vivid illustration of the rigid class structure therein.
Following below is an excerpt from a Mint Press News article on Ven by Whitney Webb, an intrepid young journalist along the mould of some wonderful and courageous female reporters in todays conflict zones such as Vanessa Beeley and Eva Bartlett.
“Given the precarious situation on the Venezuela-Colombia border, it is a weak point through which state actors wishing to destabilize Venezuela could easily act. Some evidence, including the aforementioned incident in August 2015, suggests that such action has already taken place. For instance, in March 2017, the Venezuelan military dismantled a right-wing paramilitary camp near the Colombian border, which was stocked with numerous supplies including stolen Venezuelan military uniforms, Colombian military uniforms and — most notable of all — U.S. army uniforms. At the time, teleSUR asserted that the discovery “substantiates claims that the U.S. Army is training right-wing paramilitaries to spread terror in the region.”
https://www.mintpressnews.com/us-follows-ukraine-syria-roadmap-in-venezuela-regime-change-push/254265/?
Demographic statistics, religious affiliation, etc, of the +31million population.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Venezuela
earlier in this discussion we talked about sanctions and my point is that sanctions cannot be the reason for this drastic financial situation in Venesuela. My point is – bad management.
here I’ll explain why I think so.
I’m a handmaker. I buy copper wire and produce goods from it. Roughly it can be compared with a Russian company that sells Russian goods, e.g. oil or gas.
So, I buy russian copper for russian money. I produce an item and sell it for 300 roubles in Russia (equivalent of $10 in 2013).
Now, sanctions are imposed on my country and inner prices go higher and demand for my goods is worse to the point it is no more profitable to keep my business. (Prices go higher because every price may containe the cost of imported equipment or goods)
What do I do? I begin selling more and more abroad, because $10 is now = 600 roubles instead of 300.
As I get more money from foreign trade, so it is the term of high profit for me. What do I do?
1. get rid of the current credits, I pay out my mortgage in 4 years instead of 10.
2. I invest in equipment and building for my business.
3. I stock bigger supply of copper, because I assume that prices will keep rising. And I branch out to get as much profit as possible.
So, you see, the sanctions are in fact a blessing!
Okay, here comes ‘moral sanctions’, russophobia and that all. People from abroad don’t want my goods. Packages return back to me unclaimed. What do I do?
I could turn back to sell at inner market, but for personal reasons it is better for me to rent my workshop at the moment. Because now I’m ‘established’, I’ve got property to live on using it.
The same made Russia – got rid of debts, we have now the lowest state debt. Invested money in russian business, it is clearly seen in my agricultural region, many local companies produce goods which were imported before. And, Russia restricts oil produce to some level, waiting for prices to rise again. And Russia branches out, finding new markets and new partners.
Venezuela’s President could also do good management, but I see money is somewhere but not in his country. How is it possible with all state-level experts? I don’t know.
During the period of increased profit it is very important to limit the purposes for which money is spent. E.g. if I spent money for luxury property, or gold reserve, or yachts, or jewelry – what would be the outcome for me today? Could I possibly make profit of it today? Especially, if all that treasuries were placed abroad?
Sanctions not letting me to use my property drive me poor and more poor. Really, I should have developed my home business, it allows some independence from foreign governments and their whims.
Tatyana,
I love your posts, and your transparency
“I’m a handmaker. I buy copper wire and produce goods from it. ”
“As I get more money from foreign trade, so it is the term of high profit for me. What do I do?
1. get rid of the current credits, I pay out my mortgage in 4 years instead of 10.”
You described the essence of small capitalism. Traditional conservatism with a small “c”, rather than Big Corporate Capitalist monolithic monopolies who are eating up the world, and impoverishing nearly everyone, except a very small elite.
I particularly liked, your descripton when you fell in love when you were 13, compared with Yeltsin.
Meanwhile I just read this, which I really like, cos its the truth.
“The Gilet Jaune and ‘France Profound’
The fight for democracy in the deep countryside
David Studdert”
https://off-guardian.org/2019/01/27/the-gilet-jaune-and-france-profound/
Tony
We spent many evening with my husband and calculator to come to this plan on my hobby, Tony. Not that we knew the basics of capitalism or conservatism beforehand 🙂 It came naturally from then current situation.
More, common mortgage rate was 14% annually in Russia in 2013, now it may differ. It’s different from UK or US rates, I guess. My friend from South Carolina, US, says it is about 2% at her place.
The purpose of my post was to show that good management brings profit in any circumstance.
We all learned to sum and subtract, to multiply and to divide, to read and to understand.
Tatyana
The sanctions obviously didn’t prevent you from selling abroad. In many cases US sanctions prevent any foreign interactions with the state under sanctions. The current anti Russian sanctions are pretty mild compared to that imposed on countries like Iran, Syria and Venezuela.
Also Russia, thanks to the Soviet Union was modernised from a peasant agricultural country to a major industrial power in the space of 30-50 years, able to produce heavy industry to ultimately defeat the Nazis.
The stench of gut wrenching hypocrisy from the Great Satan (US), Britain, several European nations and a whole host of other nations with regards to Venezuela and the removal of the democratically elected President Maduro, really hits home when you realise that very little has been mentioned by them with regards to the violence, and rigged Bangladesh elections held not that long ago.
People have been killed in violent clashes in the rigged elections. Yet we don’t hear or see Trump or Hunt or a whole host of world leaders or representatives of countries wanting Maduro removed, openly criticise, or demand the removal of the PM or a new election after his opponent is jailed.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/bangladesh-election-parliament-latest-polls-vote-rigging-violence-hasina-internet-a8704146.html
If Britain stops “recognising” the Maduro government, President Maduro should interpret that action as meaning that British diplomats will be on their way to the airport and out of the country. Give them 15 minutes to pack their bags.
…and look the other way if someone pins labels saying “CIA Stooges” on their backs.
Do you like surprises? Me do 🙂
But no surprises today, I’m sorry!
Israel recognises Guaido as the President of Venezuela!
https://ria.ru/20190127/1549988725.html
waiting for Australia along with Vanuatu 🙂
Hi Tatyana,
Will you please tell me what is ‘parachabot (?)’ in Russian? Thanks
it is /ch/ and /shch/ sound resemblance in the word. It is /parashabot/ in russian pronouncing, translated ‘shitbot’, roughly.
There is resemblance in pronouncing /Porosh-enko/ the surname of Ukrainian current president, and /parash-a/ – a primitive place for *I’m sorry* having oneself delivered, a place used for a toilet. Also, one can hear a resemblence with /Russia/.
So, ukrainian angry people can use the word ‘parasha-bot’ to name /russian bots/, and russian people can use the same to name /poroshenko’s bots/.
—
I do not support any kind of hatred between our nations, I feel as I belong to both. And I know how we lived in peace and respected each other.
un-stressed sound /o/ turns to /ʌ/ (short /a:/) in russian and ukrainian.
Russia is pronounced |ˈrʌʃə|
https://wooordhunt.ru/word/russia
Parasha is pronounced |pʌˈrʌʃə|, the meaning is here
https://wooordhunt.ru/word/%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%88%D0%B0
Poroshenko is pronounced |pʌˈrʌʃe:nkə|
Thank you, Tatyana.
I often listen to Anatolij Sharij, you may know about him, he runs a blog, has over 1.8mn followers, talks common sense. He sometimes uses the word I asked you about, I couldn’t figure what it meant. Again, thanks, and take care.
PS: Couldn’t agree more with you about the need for both of the two Slavonic tribes to live in peace, unlikely with Poroshenko in charge, one can only hope he will get kicked out in March, although the Americans will do everything to prevent it, he’s their nominee, it was Victoria Nuland who promoted him after the Kiev putsch in 2014.
Sharij uses ‘porokhobot’, it referes to pro-poroshenko ukrainians only. I like the way he says about what is going on.
You Scots are £3.2m down since Trump visited Turnberry last year.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/jan/27/revealed-police-scotland-spent-32m-on-private-trump-visit
Today is the anniversary of the liberation of Leningrad (St Petersburg) in 1944.
The people there were besieged by the Nazis for two and a half years. They were starved and half a million people died, especially the elderly. Some food supplies were brought in across a frozen lake. The temperature there today is -17C.
We in the West easily forget the sacrifice of 20 million Russians in WW11 yet our pocket politicians denigrate and insult the Russians.
https://www.youngwitness.com.au/story/5872044/russia-remembers-siege-of-leningrad/
It took me a long time to accept the new name. The old name is so redone to of much that has become part of that was so great in the USSR. The Leningrad symphony orchestra the mravinsky theatre the works of Shostakovich which though not his best is so evocative of the suffering and the hope.
St Petersburg is the original name
Sankt Petersburg is of course the original name, I know that. It was originally changed by the Czar in 1914 after the start of WW1 to Petrograd because the first name was a German one.
But the major cultural developments I mentioned were during the Leningrad period.
Of course there was the 2017, 1st of October Catalan independence referendum, where unarmed voters including pensioners, women and the infirm, were violently beaten, teargassed and shot with rubber bullets, their crime? Voting on their future democratically at the ballot box.
I don’t recall Trump or Pence, or Hunt or European and world nations call for sanctions or the removal of the Spanish PM Rajoy like they’re doing with regards the Maduro. Nor did we hear an outcry of sanctions against Spain surrounding the holding for over a year (and counting) of uncharged political prisoners in Spanish prisons.
The fetid stench of hypocrisy eminating from the Great Satan and its obedient minions with regards to Maduro and Venezuela, is as putrid as the stench that eminates from them with regards to Assad and Syria.
Incidently and its a whopper, Maduro, publicly slammed Rajoy and Spain on its handling of the Catalan independence referendum. It would appear that far from being a tyrant and a dictator, Maduro, promotes democracy for the Catalan people, whilst his detractors turn a blind eye.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-spain-politics-catalonia-venezuela/venezuela-blasts-spains-rajoy-over-repression-in-catalonia-idUSKCN1C61S9
The main crime of the Catalans was to seek to operate outwith the rule of law.
Their desire to operate without regard for the rule of law almost certainly contributed to VOX gaining representation in Andalusia. The election successes of VOX represents the first time since the demise of El Caudillo that a fascist party has won representation in Spain. Most likely VOX will win more representation in more Autonomous Communities.
So, if you want to see fascists winning elections then get right behind Catalan anarchists.
They just wanted the Catalans to have a Peoples Vote. As approved by their regional parliament. It is called local democracy.
There are political prisoners in Europe now!
The EU is allowing it!!
There is no UN debate about it.
Sad, So So Sad,
Jonathan Cook’s latest on the European neoliberals.
A liberal elite still luring us towards the abyss
27 January 2019
A group of 30 respected intellectuals, writers and historians has published a manifesto bewailing the imminent collapse of Europe and its supposed Enlightenment values of liberalism and rationalism. The idea of Europe, they warn, “is falling apart before our eyes”, as Britain prepares for Brexit and “populist and nationalist” parties look poised to make sweeping gains in elections across the continent.
The short manifesto has been published in the liberal elite’s European house journals, newspapers such as the Guardian. “We must now will Europe or perish beneath the waves of populism,” their document reads. Failure means “resentment, hatred and their cortege of sad passions will surround and submerge us.”
/..
https://www.jonathan-cook.net/blog/2019-01-27/a-liberal-elite-still-pushing-us-towards-the-abyss/
The so called manifesto is yet another attack on Putin and Russia needless to say. Some of them are Israel friendly too.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jan/25/fight-europe-wreckers-patriots-nationalist
There is no reference to Russia in that article only the following reference to Putin
“The continent is vulnerable to the increasingly brazen meddling by the occupant of the Kremlin”
Could you please explain why you are making the assumption that an attack on Putin and a more general attack on nationalism amounts to an attack on Russia?
Res dis
Disingenuous is how one would describe your post.
“The continent is vulnerable to the increasingly brazen meddling by the occupant of the Kremlin. Europe as an idea is falling apart before our eyes.”
That at the outset sets the tone, Atlanticist posing as liberals. What more proof do you need.
“Atlantacist ” hardly
“It has been abandoned by the two great allies who in the previous century twice saved it from suicide; one across the Channel and the other across the Atlantic.”
I suspect “atlantacist” is just another dog whisttle term of abuse like tory, blairite, neocon, neoliberal that you just use to avoid engaging with an argument where you do not have the intellectual equipment to do so. If you knew anything you would know that there has been a very long running debate within Russia, which will not stop with Putin, as to whether it should look cul;turally to Europe or the narrow version of nationalism espoused by ots recent leaders. You cannot and should not define a whole country and its culture by its leaders and to do so really is a generalisation that often verges on racism.
Tunnel vision is exhibited in your post. You have no idea what the nationalists in Russia are like if you think the current Russian government is extremely nationalist. Just not kowtowing to your NATO agenda means to you rampant nationalism.
But to expose your ignorance further the real right wing nationalism movements actually lurk within NATO countries such as Croatia and Hungary and the prospective member, Ukraine. These countries harbour strong fascist elements.
There is no need to use the term Atlanticist as a dog whistle because they make no secret of it themselves. Just look at the allied NGO the Atlantic Council and now the Integrity initiative.
SE
Thank you for the link. I always enjoy reading Jonathan Cook’s writings. He philosophically gets it spot on. Can you lmagine Levy and co being our salvation?
Oh you means he agrees with you and so excuses you from the hard work of thinking.
Meanwhile Sharp Ears gets away with her conflation of Putin and Russia – and her irrelevant and gratuitous reference to Israel. I do hope she plucks up courage to respond
In this case I agree with him as he is the originator of the writing. I am sure you know the difference. Or maybe I assume too much.
Beautifully penned piece by JC. Thanks for the link!
Yes Glasshopper. His writing is perfect. Never forgetting that he lives with his Palestinian wife in the belly of the beast in Occupied Palestine.
We seem to have the idea that Maduro is acting in the interests of the poor, and that any aid for the poor is inimical to the interests of the rich. Therefore the rich are acting to seek to overthrow Maduro.
Given that Venezuela has an inflation rate rapidly approaching 10 million percent I would be interested to know how this can benefit anyone whether they be rich or poor.
Rich people that have already removed their assets from Venezuela will not be overly effected by a 10 million percent inflation rate. Examples of rich people with appropriate foresight include relatives of the late Sr. Chavez.. Naturally poor people have no assets and so cannot remove them from Venezuelan jurisdiction. So could it possibly be that rich people have already bought themselves out of Venezuela and only the poor are left to benefit from a 10 million percent inflation rate.
Obviously defenders of the regime must see some benefit accruing to the poor from such an inflation rate. What I would be interested in learning is exactly what that benefit is.
The Conquistador 50 Aristo families want their imperial prize back.
The local indios and slaves are not going to give it back. They may even take what they didn’t under Chavez. Or get Alibaba to do it for them! There are millions of soldiers and militias there.
Remove Maduro, there will be any number of replacements.
The coup is DOA.
Egg on face time for the Aristos and all who rushed to support them.
That all makes perfect sense.
Sometime after Zimbabwe had expelled substantially all “white settlers/invaders” they experimented with an inflation rate of around 76 billion percent. Why not ask any Zimbabwean how they benefited from that. Or is your argument that it was all a plot by the expelled “white settlers/invaders” to reclaim their imperial prize. If so is it not odd why they have not returned.
It is always the same with you kind of people – countless millions can be consigned to the funeral pyre just so long as your own virtue signaling can proceed unhindered by reality.
The Venezuelan imperialists weren’t expelled. Their homes & businesses weren’t taken either. They didn’t lose their fortunes. Or their heads. Just the rights to the natural resources they claim.
What is your major malfunction Loony?