I have had moments in the last few days which led me to feel pretty hopeless. Perhaps the worst was in the ITV debate when Corbyn was roundly jeered by a substantial section of the audience for stating that climate change impacted hardest on the poorest people in the poorest countries. That encapsulated for me the current far right political climate in England, dominated by boorish, selfish stupidity. I do not come from a left wing political background and I have never subscribed to the romanticisation of “the people”. Years living in the UKIP heartland of Ramsgate made me realise that “the people” en masse can be very unpleasant and racist indeed. I have always for that reason eschewed direct democracy and subscribed to a very Burkean view. That however falls down when, as now, you have a political class who are becoming even more base and vicious than the most unpleasant mob. But the growl of that studio audience, infuriated that Corbyn cared about the foreign poor, is a warning klaxon of the state of English society.
A close second despair-inducing moment was Jo Swinson’s interview following the debate when, asked if she would press the nuclear button, she replied without a millisecond of hesitation: “yes”. As I reported last week, when asked at the Lib Dem campaign launch why she would not put Corbyn into Downing St in any circumstances, she had instantly replied that he would not be prepared to instruct submarine commanders to fire nuclear weapons.
The woman is deranged.
I come from a Liberal tradition. Probably the two books which most influence my thinking are On Liberty by John Stuart Mill and Imperialism, A Study by J A Hobson. The line of British liberal thinking that comes down through writers including Hazlitt, Shelley, Byron, Carlyle, Mill, Hobson, Russell and Keynes is a tradition which looks set to disappear from British political thought. That makes me horribly sad. One thing I am sure of is that Swinson has read none of them. That the Lib Dems had moved economically so far to the right was already worrying me. Their completely illiberal opposition to Scottish Independence upset me still further. But that the party to which I belonged for 30 years and which was once led by my friend, the gentle and wise Charlie Kennedy, could now be led by an arm whirling, narcissistic, female version of Dr Strangelove, is beyond my wildest nightmares.
Let me go back to that ITV Debate. It was enormously dispiriting that of a 50 minute debate, 25 minutes were devoted to the subject of Brexit, compared to just one minute on the question of climate change. The Brexit discussion was completely unenlightening, with Johnson booming out “Get Brexit Done” at every opportunity, and even when there was no rational opportunity after the discussion had finally been moved on to other subjects.
I thought Jeremy was slightly under par. There was one point where I think he made a definite mistake. When Johnson claimed the last Labour government bankrupted the country’s finances, Corbyn failed to come back and say that it was the bankers who bankrupted the country’s finances. He could have gone on to add that banking deregulation had been the cause of a decade of global misery and Boris Johnson’s plans for Singapore on Thames would be banking deregulation on steroids.
It is not the first time this election that Labour have failed to point out it was the bankers who crashed the economy. I am not sure why. It may be a desire to seem City-friendly. Corbyn may be held back because, like me, he believes Brown was completely wrong to bail out the bankers with taxpayers’ money, and Corbyn therefore thinks it best to avoid the whole topic for the sake of party unity. Either way, to let Johnson say that Labour spending ruined the economy is to miss an open goal – the bankers are still massively unpopular.
The other point is one where Jeremy actually annoyed me. I cannot tell you how infuriating it was, as a Scot, to see Johnson repeatedly stating that Scotland would not be allowed an Independence referendum, and Corbyn making no effort at all to stand up for the Scottish right of self-determination. Given SNP exclusion from the debate, it was demeaning to see our masters discussing our future with no pretence of giving a hearing to the Scottish point of view.
Corbyn has to tackle this. The Johnson “Labour will give you two referendums” attack line is not being sufficiently countered. For Corbyn to ask Johnson whether he accepts that the Scottish people have the right of self-determination would be a killer question, and Jeremy could ask it quietly and effectively. A large majority of English people are actually perfectly happy for Scotland to have an Independence referendum.
Corbyn has tied himself in knots to accommodate the bitter cabal of Blairites and Orangemen that constitute the majority of the rump Scottish Labour Party, while its membership and voters have defected en masse to the SNP. 40% of the remaining Labour voters support Independence anyway. Rather than put himself in a false position for the sake of hopeless colleagues who have crashed Scottish Labour from domination to 12% of the vote, Corbyn should state his support for the right of the Scottish people to decide – something which I have no doubt he personally believes in, deeply.
The good news is that Johnson made an ass of himself in the debate, constantly repeating “Get Brexit Done”, and Corbyn’s insistence on discussing more important issues than Brexit cut through. You Gov’s verdict of a 51 to 49 victory for Johnson was very dubious indeed. But even that would be a major advance for Corbyn given the constant barrage of unfair media demonisation to which he has been subjected in the last five years. Almost seven million people watched the event live, a significant audience. Parity with that audience is a very good start for Labour. I suspect it really went better than that. YouGove have a long and dishonourable history as Tory push pollsters.
There are similarities here to the 2017 election. The chance for both Corbyn and Sturgeon to be seen in election coverage directly by viewers, each arguing their own case, will improve the standing of both with the electors, compared to the unmitigated vilification of normal media. (Sturgeon is being unfairly excluded from key debates but her Dundee speech today was extensively covered).
The Tory campaign of closed workplace addresses, artificial set-up encounters and a constant simple soundbite slogan is repeating the formula that failed so spectacularly in 2017. “Get Brexit Done” is going to annoy voters as much as “Strong and Stable” did, especially if Johnson continues to deploy it whatever the question asked.
I strongly expect we will see the first signs of the opinion polls starting to tighten shortly. I am half-English myself and have no desire to see Johnson inflicted on the population of Newcastle or Liverpool. But I confess I am also comfortable in the certainty that should Johnson win the election, it will precipitate Scottish Independence very soon. Nobody should despair yet. But it is certainly more comfortable to watch this from Edinburgh than from Manchester.
——————————————
Unlike our adversaries including the Integrity Initiative, the 77th Brigade, Bellingcat, the Atlantic Council and hundreds of other warmongering propaganda operations, this blog has no source of state, corporate or institutional finance whatsoever. It runs entirely on voluntary subscriptions from its readers – many of whom do not necessarily agree with the every article, but welcome the alternative voice, insider information and debate.
Subscriptions to keep this blog going are gratefully received.
Choose subscription amount from dropdown box:
Alternatively:
Account name
MURRAY CJ
Account number 3 2 1 5 0 9 6 2
Sort code 6 0 – 4 0 – 0 5
IBAN GB98NWBK60400532150962
BIC NWBKGB2L
Bank address Natwest, PO Box 414, 38 Strand, London, WC2H 5JB
Subscriptions are still preferred to donations as I can’t run the blog without some certainty of future income, but I understand why some people prefer not to commit to that.
James Kelly discusses the obstacles to removing Swinson from East Dumbartonshire. Personal loyalty vote, Tories voting tactically, Tories (and Labour) standing paper candidates and prestige of having your MP as a national leader.
https://www.thenational.scot/news/18046950.general-election-analysis-will-jo-swinson-lose-east-dunbartonshire/
What he omits is SPEND. The LibDems are up to their old tricks. Multiple leaflets promoting the LibDem party and or Willy Rennie, which they will claim have nothing to do with Jo Swinson and the General Election and it’s just pure coincidence that they were delivered during a General Election campaign. And why not? The Election Commission accepted this blatantly disingenuous excuse in 2017 when Swinson exceeded the permissible electioneering limit.
In the 10 month period between October 2018 and August 2019 (covering only a pointless EU Election) the LibDems spent £367K on Facebook advertising alone. Ask yourself, WTF does the cash come from?
Corbyn and Momentum have damaged NewLab. Many of the NewLab operatives have moved on to lucrative, Third sector appointments. The likes of Kinnock remain in case control can be wrestled back but the British American Project and the Deep State faction it represents have switched to the LibDems.
Sorry for the rant but Swinson really gets my goat. That arms spread “messiah” stance (acquired from Killary) is as phoney as rockinghorse shite. Thankfully the more people see Swinson the more they see through the act (as indeed was the cas with Killary).
Oh and another thing. Months ago on this blog, I wrote that Swinson had a perfectly acceptable reason for living in Chippenham (’cause I’m reasonable at the end of the day). I wrote that Swinson’s husband “is” the MP for Chippenham and they have small children to look after. CORRECTION, Swinson’s husband was rejected by the electorate of Chippenham in 2015 and given that the Tory majority is 16.5K he won’t be returning to Westminster anytime soon.
There’s a better chance than I think you suggest that she will lose her seat. Nobody can stand her.
The polls show that the more people see her, the more they dislike her. That’s extremely unusual. I can’t remember ever seeing anything like that in polls. Gordon Brown in 2010 came close but it wasn’t anything like as clear and actually I remember seeing a surge after a TV debate.
The impulse to reject everything about the Tory Boris Johnson can perhaps be mitigated for people with a history of being on the Left if one takes into consideration that on two of the issues that upset Craig, climate and nuclear weapons, Tory politics are less heinous if one takes into account how very very bad Labour politics is, undeserving of forgiveness because of traditional loyalties. Yes, Jo Swinson’s ideas on nuclear weapons are mindless. But more mindless than the ideas of the mainstream anti-nuclear movement? http://enouranois.eu/?page_id=190 And climate change sceptics are deluded, but more deluded than groupies for the IPCC? http://enouranois.eu/?p=1988 Craig Murray can probably take some comfort from the fact, as I do, that whatever the result of the coming election in the UK, Scottish independence looks as if it is set to go forward. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-YC7UmTpK0&t=111s
Haha, linking to a website obsessed with paranoia about chemtrails is not a supporting argument for your evidence-free assertions.
Ian, are these links more acceptable?
Against the Current
https://solidarity-us.org/atc/75/p1816/
Global Research
https://www.globalresearch.ca/nuclear-weapons-and-representative-democracy/1806
https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-u-n-climate-change-conferences-and-action-by-citizens-the-climate-crisis-a-new-source-of-corporate-profit/5617955
Wayne
You make assumptions that the Soviet Union had really nothing to fear because the Americans really wouldn’t have used the nuclear threat against them and had they denuclearised they would have been in a better place. This is a very slick attempt at either rewriting history or wishful thinking. In 1945 it looked very clearly that the US had deliberately used not one but two atomic weapons not for actual tactical military reasons but as a deliberate intimidating war crime that announced US impunity against retaliation and disregard for international law that has since characterised the behaviour of that nation, not only in copious writings announcing this strategy but in multiple actions during and since the end of the Cold War.
Your writing seems to be saying that if only the US had weapons and no one else had them, the world will be safer. History runs against that assumption.
Yes. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were not military operations and that is why the military were excluded from the decision. The military’s only role was to carry it out.
The implications were not considered properly with disastrous consequences.
As for Stalin, I think he made a big error to automatically assume that the USSR building its own nuclear weapons was the only option available. Other options could have been considered.
Here’s one option: Build an atomic bomb, test it and announce the test and then announce a testing moratorium and send a delegation to the US to seek a treaty banning future tests. Such a ban would have stopped the testing of the H-bomb and would have been very worthwhile.
Tony
There is a lot written about this. After the war the US was determined to rule the world by all means and they have almost succeeded. It is no secret it has been made clear many times by American strategists. Now you think that for Stalin whose country has just fought an existential war with Hitler, to just play this silly gesture is enough, you have to belong to the school of thought that US always good and benign, Stalin and USSR always bad.
So the megalomaniac that is Jo Swinson would push the nuclear button in a heart beat and kill millions. Her voting record on welfare has probably already condemned poor and disabled folk to an awful lingering end in the UK. Still she did push for a statute of Thatcher the Milk Snatcher, I’m sure that will bring much comfort to those on the breadline.
https://i.redd.it/6ysxtpztusj01.jpg
Yes well said, shame this and her voting record aren’t being nailed down publicly by the likes of bbc etc (yawn). Even to hammer it home in her own constituency might prove a coffin topper.
She is a Tory.
https://i.imgflip.com/3encvj.jpg
SA you can rest easy because if the anti-nuclear movements had a chance to become a factor in politics in 1991 and be consistent with their own assertions (this applies particularly to the non-aligned movement, END, etc.) they blew it. E.P. Thompson died and Putin very cleverly won the internal game in the ex-USSR. So if this makes you feel safe, feel safe. By the way, I admire Putin’s intelligence. I just wanted something else to happen.
The Goebbels lies are in full swing with this ‘let’s get Johnson elected’ election. After the referendum the MSM urged May to have an election to ‘destroy Corbyn’. but the opposite happened. It’s dawned on those self same MSM that it’s not going too well for Johnson so the under playing of his gaffes and lies in all too evident. They need a ‘big, big get out of jail card’ and I fully expect the Equalities and Human Rights Commission will come under even more pressure to release it’s ‘investigation’ into ‘anti semitism’ in the Labour party. The anti Corbyn haters will want it released in an attempt to inflict maximum damage on Labour. It’ll be their Zinoviev letter moment. That said, the anti Tory hatred in the UK is getting stronger and stronger by the day and getting more and more vocal on the streets, in the pubs and cafes etc.
It’s not surprising that the one poll they go to is YouGov.
“YouGov was founded in the UK in May 2000 by Stephan Shakespeare and future MP Nadhim Zahawi, at the time both active in the British Conservative Party. In 2001 they engaged BBC political analyst Peter Kellner, who became chairman, and then from 2007–2016, President.[3][4]”.
The MSM refuse to talk straight to the British people, which is no surprise really The Tory controlled BBC – let’s get it abolished and we can all enjoy £154.50 per year extra – are making no attempts to show impartiality. They gave up that ghost a long time ago. Every morning Breakfast programme goes to a constituency and sends out the same message ‘I used to vote Labour but not anymore’ which is being promoted deliberately in an attempt to get ‘despair’ going.
The Tories are in disarray and are a laughing stock and only held together by the hatred of Corbyn by the MSM. Just like the Tory Brexit disaster, this election is highlighting how vicious the lying toerags Tories are, And it’s not surprising it’s tearing the UK apart even more. Which will get into full swing if, and it’s a big if, the Tories get re-elected. If so, there will be a border poll and a united Ireland and a very very troublesome Scotland.
What becomes clearer and clearer is that capitalism is a busted flush that can’t satisfy the needs of the 99% of the people on the planet. The dictatorship of capital has become a stain on humankind and needs sweeping away and replaced by the dictatorship of the proletariat and the co-operative organisation of the country for the good of the many.
Craig – thank you for trying to lift our spirits. I will keep fighting to the last for Corbyn but I have also had to give myself a good talking to re: December 12th. Despair is a pointless indulgence, but so is blind optimism. We are going to lose this election. It’s clear today that Dr. Strangelove in drag will assist the Tories if there’s a hung parliament, and that she means what she says about refusing support to Labour. So Labour would need to win an outright majority, which just isn’t going to happen. So I am girding my loins for December 12th. I think we have to anticipate and even expect defeat, whilst nevertheless hoping for victory, the better to ward off the very deep despair that would set in between 10pm and 2am otherwise. I think there are four grounds for hope long term. 1. Team Corbyn have worked very hard to re-establish Labour as a socialist party. Of course the Blairite centrists will try to take the party back, but from what I read they have been out-manoeuvred in adavance. 2. Brexit won’t get “done” any more than it would have ever given us “back control.” Johnson will either leave with No Deal at the end of 2020 or break his promise to do so – either way, he reaps the whirlwind. 3. The idea that a government led by a lying charlatan and stuffed by fourth-raters would survive a brief honeymoon period and maintain their popularity is delusional 4. The young are becoming more and more politically engaged. (Extinction Rebellion; the large take up in voter registration among the young this time round.) They will not tolerate the shite a Johnson government will ladle out to them, and once the poorest and the working classes realise that they’ve been shafted yet again by the Tories, and Brexit was/is a chimera, there will be a groundswell against them. What we’re witnessing is the last phyrric victory af a clapped out, reactionary, jingoistic old guard. It seems pretty clear to me that we will lose this battle, but we will win the war.
“Dr. Strangelove in drag will assist the Tories if there’s a hung parliament”
Or even if there’s not. She’s one of the most unprincipled people in politics today, and that’s saying something.
“…we will lose this battle, but we will win the war.”
And mindful of earlier comments about Zinoviev; all curiously reminiscent of the 1924 election. As a quick reminder, the election was precipitated by the Liberal Party joining the Conservatives in voting down a short lived Ramsay Macdonald minority government, in the (false) hope that they could capitalise on the perceived unpopularity of Labour and shepherd the Labour vote back into the warm hands of the Liberal Party. However, the strategy fell apart when the Conservatives went on the attack with a ‘keep the Bolsheviks out’ campaign, shaped to appeal to Liberal voters. Into this mix landed the ‘Zinoviev letter’, a crudely forged missive purporting to show Soviet/Russian collusion with left wing parties across the world. The Tories won the battle, and with a landslide result. Yet the Labour vote soared by 25% consigning the Liberals to the third party status they have now held for nearly a century, and doing the one thing that FPTP is designed to prevent: an insurgent party (in this case Labour) reaching the hallowed turf of being one of the big two. That was the set up for the real war which resulted in a social democrat polity which lasted from the Second World War through to Thatcher.
I think this will end very badly for the Lib Dems; their bid for second party status has been entrusted to Jo Swinson in the hope that she will consolidate the Remainer Left with the Centre Right; It has left the Remain movement sharply divided, and I suspect that ultimately the charge of Brexit ‘faciltators’ will stick, particularly amongst the Centre Left. Whilst it is clear that the Centre Right cannot support the ‘toxic’ left, it is equally clear that the Left cannot support Tory enablers. That should leave the Tories with a clear run for a decade, if they can avoid a monumental gaffe. At which point, enter Boris Johnson…
Don’t pay the BBC fk all for their corrupt “licence fee”.
I don’t.
Well said, grafter.
The SNP voteshare will probably fall, given the prosecution of Alec Salmond on the evidence of 10 women who say he sexually abused them.
Clearly Scottish Tories have a strong presence in the Scottish judicial system, given how today’s court appearance was timed to coincide with the launch of the Labour manifesto..
Timing is everything, even in chess.
They’ve been playing an awfully, awfully long time.
And will continue to so do long after the old father has erased the party names for new ones.
Given the english establishment’s fraudulent case against the former FM, you mean.
Have you read the original story written by Leslie evans and leaked to her fellow UU bigot clegg of the Daily Retard. It was bad slash fiction and was thrown in the bin during the civil case yet is enough for the criminal courts to raise a claim of attempted rape. Total bollocks.
Please to be explaining how the most scrutinised politician in Scottish history, in a country where 99.9% of the scum hacks were desperate to destroy him, a country where he suffered an assassination attempt during the referendum which the yoons hushed up, a country where half the population would have seen him strung up from a lamp-post. That politician could have committed all those disgraceful acts IN PUBLIC and nobody said anything.
I have some magic beans and a handy bridge available for a reasonable price to anyone who actually believes the prosecution case here.
“the english establishment’s fraudulent case against the former FM”
Haha. Always blame foreigners, eh?
I have to laugh at the way you spell “Scottish” with a capital “S” and “english” with a lower-case “e”. Grow up!
Bad news: the Labour manifesto is not hard on private schools. A government could abolish them. (Even under existing legislation schools have to be registered with the state.) The manifesto does not even say it will remove their charity status! All it says is that it will “close the tax loopholes enjoyed by elite private schools”, which may only mean that it will impose VAT on school fees. That is not good enough for me, so I will not be joining the party.
The manifesto also contains c*ck about “climate crisis” and “climate emergency”. Apparently “climate diplomacy” has to be put at the heart of British foreign policy. Ah, the white man’s burden!
They say they will end mixed-sex wards in hospitals. What this means for those who believe they are “third gender” is unclear. Whether Labour policy is discriminatory against hermaphrodites I leave as an exercise for the reader. They also promise to “put LGBT+ equality at the heart of government”.
Some of the stuff reads as if it’s written for under-fives: “Labour will ensure all workers have full and equal rights from day one”. Seriously, does that sound very encouraging if you work in a nail bar or a car wash?
Good news: as in 2017 there is a clear promise to grant immediate recognition to the state of Palestine.
I also like their policy on building more council houses. It’s much better to live in a council house than in private rented accommodation. Ideally when the next bank crash happens (or, better, before then) I would like a Labour government to nationalise the banks. That would give the government ownership over the charges on property titles that are known as “mortgages”. The government could then exercise these mortgages, all on a single day, thereby taking ownership of a large part of the housing stock, which could then be let back to occupants on secure tenancies. That would give people more security. It would also crash the property market, which would be wonderful. If there are those in Abigail’s Party land who don’t appreciate that, then f*ck them.
Funding renters’ unions is also in the manifesto. Good idea. Anything that’s one in the eye for landlords is a good idea.
Ending the hereditary principle in the House of Lords. Tick. About time. Unfortunately they will only “work to” abolish the House of Lords, but still. The “citizens’ assembly” will of course be welcomed by lobbyists for commercial interests and probably by the Steinerite crazies too.
Reducing the voting age to 16 is a ridiculous policy.
Then there’s this bit: they promise to give “full voting rights” to “all UK residents”. The word “full” must surely be interpreted to mean “in all polls”, because nobody has “partial” rights to vote in a particular kind of poll. “Partial” means you can vote in one poll but not another, for example you might be Polish and allowed to vote in a local election but not a general election. “Full” means you can vote in everything.
So Labour is proposing to let residents who are citizens of EU24 states (EU states other than Britain, Ireland, Malta and Cyprus) to vote in a third Brexit referendum. The Tories are going to be all over this, if they aren’t already.
N_: (12.50, 21 Nov): that’s a fair point, as regards national general elections. As far as I know, other EU states only allow their own nationals to take part in electing goverments. However the 2016 EU referendum excluded those voters who were most severely affected by the outcome of the vote: non-British EU citizens living in the UK and UK citizens living in other EU countries. Fair that wasn’t, and it is to be welcomed if Labour can prevent such an injustice recurring.
Reducing the voting age to 16 was long overdue, but its worth little when a deliberately kept FPTP agenda to cheat is not.up for reform.
It seems that fair proportional voting methods are only used to elect leaders, not a system for all voters in all types of elections, cause that might mean that we would have to coalesce, to take each others view into perspective, shirley not the done thing for local or national government.
WHY CAN’T THE LABOUR PARTY INTRODUCE A FAIR PROPORTIONAL VOTING SYSTEM?…FOR THE MANY NOT JUST THE FEW?
And your alternative manifesto is ? It is easy to pick holes in the ideas of others, less easy to come up with sonething better yourself….
You just do not understand Scotland. Not a clue.
Those who care about this, know what the BritState is up to; those who don’t know what the BritsState is up to are Yoon voters, those who don’t care, don’t vote; those who don’t know and/or don’t care vote Tory, and those who really, really know what is going on are behind it and ARE Tory.
The SNP will win a huge majority in Scotland.
This Swinson person’s repeated willingness to indulge in wholesale mass murder without alternative rational reasoning is truly scary, the fact she self evidently believes it a vote winner is even scarier, and the notion it just might be, scarier still.
Even scarier by implication is that this Killary wannabe and the car wreck Johnson are the two nutters standing before Corbyn who himself should appear as a giant in comparison. . But he isn’t, he fails on the obvious as pointed out in the article and continues to make lame mistakes. Even the Epstein slur is childlike in lameness but a mistake he should never have made. Why, when he knows he is being watched by hawks, give them any ammo at all? In the next debate he’ll probably counter act any AS/racism claims within his party by saying he intends to have coloureds in his cabinet and won’t further decimate the welfare of invalids.
Failing because the press are against you en masse one thing, failing the basics, another entirely. Keys should be his – looking tiny in his hand. If he can’t walk through those two – press accepted – then he isn’t fit for the job.
The way Jeremy Corbyn took out his stapled-together sheaf of flapping-about pieces of A4 to expose Tory plotting to invite US companies to buy up whatever they want in an NHS fire sale was pathetic. F***ing hell! That could have been a great moment, perhaps almost an election-winning moment. Has nobody in the Labour campaign got a clue about visuals? Look how Benyamin Netanyahu does it. Get in the enemy’s face! It’s not just about words arranged into sentences!
Haha, yes Netanyahu, the hysterical narcissist with his cartoon bombs, is just the role model for Corbyn. Great idea.
Oh yes, that’s right, kick a man when he’s down:https://www.wsj.com/articles/prime-minister-netanyahu-indicted-on-bribery-fraud-breach-of-trust-charges-11574353669
But seriously, it couldn’t progress too soon.
N_
You begin to sound like a Marxist version of Swinson. Terrifying.
I too find this General Election dispiriting. Channel 4 News reported from ‘Scotland’ last night – from Aberdeen, Peterhead and Annan. Not exactly nationalist heartlands. Jon Snow found 3 young voters to talk to. One said they were swithering between Labour and Green parties, the second said he wasn’t voting and the third was Labour again – not a Nat in sight. The piece from Annan was all about how difficult life would be for English farmers to sell their stock in Scottish livestock markets if there was a hard border. The best input came from Kez Dugdale of all people who pointed out that the Indy Ref. in 2014 was won by middle-class Labour voters who were worried about their prospects in an independent Scotland. It’s these same people she suggested who are most worried about a Brexit Scotland and are therefore shifting their allegiance. I thought Angus Robertson was poor when asked about a potential hard border. He fudged/avoided the topic. The SNP hierarchy need to get their act together on this issue as it will be pushed ad-infinitum in the future.
What’s a Brexit Scotland? “If Britain leaves the European Union, let Scotland leave the British Union and cross our fingers and hope to be allowed into the European Union.” Specious reasons can be found in support of any insane crock of muck. As for a hard border only being problematic for the wicked English, like yeah, right. Funny how there was even larger support for the Union in 2014 among Scots living near the border than in other parts of Scotland. Why was that? Indoctrinated by English colonialists carrying knouts and speaking with posh accents, were they? The only way the SNP can cope with the question of the hard border is to try to drive down the intelligence of the Scottish electorate even further than they have done already, so that hatred of the English becomes so extreme that people stop caring whether Tesco lorries have to be stopped and searched at customs points on the M6/A74, or whether they’ll be able to get treatment on the NHS if they visit family south of the border and get taken ill.
And what’s the following about?” I am half-English myself and have no desire to see Johnson inflicted on the population of Newcastle or Liverpool. ” What about the population of London for example? But for the Scottish nationalist “London” functions as the epitome of foreignness. Strange that, because many Powellites feel the same way.
Your reference to ‘Powellites’ is important. You are quite right in suggesting that Powellism is a significant factor in politics at the present, but recall that Powell spent his later life supporting British ethnic national supremacy. That included those Scots who were willing to subscribe to racial supremacist ideas. They were in. The current formulation is quite different in a material way: this is English Ethnic racial supremacy, and the Scots are out. A third of Conservative and Unionist voters are willing to see the Union dissolved as they see Scotland as having no part to play in the Conservative English Supremacist project. I hope you can reflect on the understanding that the Indy movement is now more driven by Scotland being rejected by the English dominant political class, and rather less the pragmatics of border control.
Let me help you Marxist.
A Scotland brexit is Scotland being taken out of the EU because England voted for it.
As for a hard border between Scotland and England it’s England that worries about it most , nobody in Scotland worries about it because so many people in England keep on saying they want to rebuild Hadrians wall.
We don’t mind if you do, it will transfer a big chunk of England to Scotland.
If Scotland leaves the British union and goes back into the EU there I’ll be a border with England if England is out of the EU but that won’t be a problem at all , there are borders all around Europe , always have been , those that depict countries in the EU and countries out of the EU are mostly not a problem.
The chances are that Scotland and England would reach agreement similar to that we in U.K. currently have with Ireland
The UK is a basket with idiot politicians leading an idiot public all cheered on or booed (as the case may be) by idiot commentators.
Did Labour bankrupt UK finances or did bankers bankrupt UK finances? Oh so hard to work out what with such a paucity of evidence available. This was a US induced crisis with its roots in the policies of President Clinton. it then spread around the world due to the globalized economic framework. Nothing to do with the British whatsoever.
There was a notional choice regarding the response – but that too was effectively mandated by a cabal of Central bankers. Only Iceland was allowed to deviate. Any elected politician who looked like they might go off script was promptly removed from office (see Italy and Greece for examples). In the US Bush and Obama followed the exact same policies and in the UK Brown and Cameron followed the exact same policies, and these policies were in lockstep with those followed by the unelected decision makers in the ECB. What is the point of voting when policies are not determined by the preferences of the population?
Nothing has been resolved – you have an insolvent system propped up for the moment by asset price bubbles. Either these bubbles grow for ever which means increasing inequality or they don’t which means full spectrum collapse. The only possible way out is to dismantle the absurd levels of interconnectivity – if you are in Europe that means doing everything possible to weaken and damage the EU and if you are in the US to lend your full support to President Trump. Failure to do these things will result in economic and societal suicide.
Have you forgotten about the sub prime mortgage scandal in the US that was the precursor of the worldwide banking ‘crash’.
Questionable Trading Practices May Have Led to Bear Stearns’ Collapse
by Jason Leopold / March 19th, 2008
Last March, Scott Coren and Michael Nannizzi, analysts at Bear Stearns, issued a report upgrading the stock of New Century Financial, a company that provides sub-prime mortgages to low-income homebuyers, from “underperform” to “peer-perform.” California-based New Century’s stock rallied on Coren and Nannizzi’s research note to investors, rising 3% in afternoon trading on Thursday March 1, 2007, to close at $15.78.
In April 2007, a month after the analysts issued their somewhat upbeat report, New Century filed for bankruptcy protection due in large part to the massive number of borrowers who were defaulting on their loans.
https://dissidentvoice.org/2008/03/questionable-trading-practices-may-have-led-to-bear-stearns’-collapse/
and
https://dissidentvoice.org/2010/03/economic-bubbles-and-financial-crises-past-and-present/
Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac . . .
The Conservatives matched Labour’s spending plans:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1562023/Tories-vow-to-match-Labour-spending.html
As quite often the first half of your post is very good but then let down by your conclusions.
Do not despair this Election.
I think there is truth to this.
Johnson’s cabinet is purged of one Nation Tories.
Priti Patel just can’t help herself. “Leave the ISIS orphans to rot in the desert.” “Don’t blame the Government for poverty, it’s all the fault of the feckless poor.”
Dominic Raab runs Patel a close second.
Oleaginous Gove has kept a reasonably low profile.
Sajid Javid has kept his Ayn Rand loyalties under wraps to date.
I cannot comment on Johnson himself as being Scottish I can’t fathom why his faux “blundering toff” act has anyone enamoured.
Kuenssberg’s blatant bias is out in the open with Labour supporters booing her at the Manifesto launch. Two Tory candidates and one LibDem candidate stood down for “anti-Semitism” (real or fabricated) and not a peep from the ever “anti-Semitic” vigilant Kuenssberg.
Come on Corbyn and MacDonnell, take off the gloves and tell it like it is (while the cameras are duty bound to report).
Boris Johnson won’t precipitate Scottish independence only an act of war will. Look to how the Irish republic got out of GB that’s your only way – take up arms. You cannot expect the Scottish elite to give up their power any other way.
Shatnershug (12.28): no, Ireland got its independence only after it elected a majority of MPs who refused to go to Westminster and instead set up their own assembly in Dublin. Militarily they could never have defeated the British.
No, the British government brazenly ignored the landslide democratic vote for independence in Ireland in 1918. That’s why the Irish took up arms in the War of Independence and forced the British – militarily – into a negotiated settlement. A highly imperfect settlement, but one that had proved impossible to achieve by adhering to disingenuous British “democratic” constitutionalism.
Haha . daftie , Scotland will become independent when more than 50% of people in Scotland vote for it.
It’s that simple.
A quarter of those who voted against Scottish independence in 2014 were people from England who live in Scotland which makes it more difficult to get a majority in favour of Scottish independence but I think we now have that majority , Labour voters in Scotland have given up on Labour and nearly all of them don’t like BJ or would never ever vote Tory so they won’t vote Tory on 12/12/2019 .
Labour voters thinking of voting Lib Dem have been put off by Swinson so they won’t vote Lib Dem either which leaves SNP or the Scottish Green Party .
Nearly all will vote SNP especially having viewed on tv the way Scottish MPs were ignored in Westminster.
“ A quarter of those who voted against Scottish independence in 2014 were people from England who live in Scotland which makes it more difficult to get a majority in favour of Scottish independence …”.
No doubt they will be deported once Scottish indipendence is achieved.
“Light touch regulation” of the UK financial markets as opposed to the “Rules based” rigid system of the US was the slogan of Gordon Brown regulators.
Brown abolished “Tory Boom and Bust” and replace it with a Brown supercharged boom.
In 8 years Brown doubled the UK national debt (between 2000 and 2008).
Brown bears a heavy responsibility for the 2008 financial crisis.
”Brown bears a heavy responsibility for the 2008 financial crisis.”
They all do, no politician of whatever stripe was going to come out as a party pooper prior to the ‘Crash’ ? If anything, the ponzi crowd were fortunate that it was a Labour Government that was in place to bail them, I’d have to think a Conservative one would have been far harder on the instigators, if only for the reason that their displacement would provide for a fresh intake of rent seekers.
I agree with you. Brown, Darling and Labour etc easily taken in by the smooth flatterers of Goldman Sachs etc.Labour gave the banks everything they asked for and more !
It is a pity that they did not listen to Mervyn King the then Governor of the Bank of England, but unfortunately they were taken in by slick talking,overpaid smoothies .
Bailing out the banks wasn’t the problem. Labour had policies to deal with the outcome if they had been reflected. The Tories however saw an opportunity to fool people into thinking QE would lead to inflation, if we didn’t all tighten our belts and cut public services. It was a terrible lie, which still gets rolled out. Debt, hardship, cuts to infrastructure and services, are all simply designed to migrate the country’s wealth from the workers, or those who are relying on services, to the pockets of the global 1% and the hidden stash in Britain’s offshore banks. Labour never saw this coming. They thought it was real. But tax cuts for the wealthy, and destitution for low paid workers, and sick and elderly people has been hidden by the media, very well. Housing benefit goes into the pockets of rentier landlords who no longer even need to make housing fit for habitation. What kind of a nation have we become? The Magic Money Tree is never short of cash for weapons and wars. Government is for whoever those in power represent. And that has not been the voters for the last 20 years
Roll up! Roll up! Chuka’s on QT tonight with Jenrick, Whitford, Burgon and a writer from the Torygraph.
https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/status/1197220640828334080
PS Chuka is LD now (since June) having been Change UK and Labour before that. A turncoat of many colours.
I won’t be watching and I can’t fathom why the SNP doesn’t just boycott the whole farce. That said, Dr Philippa Whithead is a walking encyclopaedia when it comes to drug pricing policy and the implications of doing a trade deal with Trump. It may be educational for an audience to hear from a politician who actually has mastery of their brief.
Vote Jeremy.
Simples.
For anybody in doubt today’s manifesto launch speech is here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jw_ptbyCMl4
Labour’s, constructive ambiguity on Brexit is beyond a joke. On free movement within the EU after a Labour negotiated Brexit, the manifesto states that free movement will be “subject to negotiation”. The referendum was three and a half years ago! They had a special conference on Saturday specifically to clarify their position on free movement! FFS!
@ Vivian O’B
The programme laid out by Corbyn today is exactly what the country is crying out, and, to my mind, desperate for.
It represents, at last, the turning back of 40 years of neoliberalism which has seen wealth and power systematically and relentlessly devolved upwards in ever greater amounts into the hands of the self-serving, already wealthy and powerful, leading to the situation where we now have many people working two or three jobs just to get by, zero-hour contracts with no guarantee of work or pay, previously professional positions now receiving minimum wage, record poverty statistics, record food bank usage, 2-3 week waiting lists for a GP appointment, record hospital waiting times, schools without even enough funding to stay open for a full week, a threadbare police force now unable to take many reported crimes seriously and a justice system that is closed to all except the wealthy.
This is where neoliberalism and the Tories’ so-called ‘managed decline’ has brought us to – second rate status at best.
Corbyn and Labour’s proposals laid out today present a refusal to accept that and radical proposals to rebuild and to re-form our economy and society – what’s not to like?
The conference that you refer to, I think, was the conference to finalise the manifesto, not specifically to address free-movement. Whilst it wouldn’t be my choice, the position they have arrived at on free-movement is not without merit because if you want to negotiate a ‘soft Brexit’ then free movement would be one of the items on the table – it’s not a black and white issue, there could be a range of options on how you manage movement between the two states – though I guess that in this instance it is merely a mechanism to resolve internal party divisions.
Corbyn’s wider position of remaining neutral – the Harold Wilson position – I actually think, in the circumstances, is a very good one because it enables him to respect both sides of the debate while negotiating a new deal, and then overseeing a second referendum which, which, rather than being a divisive one, overseen by him could be a genuinely healing process.
My own position on Brexit has been thrown into flux today as I have previously supported Leave because I believed the EU, as an undemocratic engine of neoliberalism would provide a block to such national programmes as laid out today but, answering a question from Robert Peston, Corbyn said that there was nothing in the manifesto that conflicts with EU laws or regulations.
I’m not entirely convinced, neither, I think, was Peston, but if Corbyn is right I would have to rethink my position.
The brazen lies and misdirections in the run up to this GE are breathtaking. First we had the Tories brand their official Twitter feed to give it the look of a neutral fact checking organisation, of which the Electoral Commission merely lightly chided them over as usual.
Today we had the Labour branch office in Scotland at FMQs attempt to berate the FM on employment law, when it is clearly a reserved matter to Westminster, when informed it was a reserved matter by the FM, the Labour branch lackeys appeared to just shrug their shoulders as if to say so what.
With regards to Salmond. Compare the BBC page with the 13 charges bullet-pointed:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-50486713
with Al Jazeera, quote:
“Due to the nature of the case, the details of the report cannot be discussed until the court hears evidence and witness statements.”
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/11/scottish-independence-activists-wary-bad-salmond-publicity-191120194325563.html
With regards to Salmond and Prince Andrew, the latter gets a soft touch from the media, he’s decided to retire from public life, aww, that’s sad poor Prince Andrew.
Alex Salmond on the otherhand, gets the he’s a rapist!!!!!!!!!!! (Tiny writing, and quiet voice – allegedly) By the same unionist media.
Of the two I know who my money’s on as being the guilty party.
According to the BBC most of the touching went on in Bute House.
This must be timed for our General Election to do the most damage to the SNP
The CCHQ trolls on the Guardian were sounding particularly panicky this morning, and the Radio 4 commentators, who endlessly go on about how how desperate Corbyn is, while Johnson is said to positively assert his position, were sounding exceptionally unconvincing. I guess it must be that debate, and the quite good launch of the manifesto. I suspect the Tories might, like in 2017, actually believe the polling results they themselves arrange to be rigged. You should never believe your own lies, of course. I’m not a supporter of Corbyn, btw.
The two most used phrases which I’ve seen used by Johnson and the Tories on Facebook are ‘Unleash Britains Potential’ and ‘Get Brexit Done’ and they are both incredibly irritating.
However, what is infinitely MORE irritating than that is as I’ve said, I use Facebook. Not Twitter or anything else, just Facebook. I am in no way, shape or form affiliated with Johnson, the Tories, Labour, Lib Dems or any other party. I have made clear on Facebook and to anyone who asks, that I am 100% SNP, they will be getting my vote and I will be voting in favour of Scottish Independence.
On Facebook, the only ads or targeted posts that I receive are exclusively from the Tories and/or Johnson. I have NEVER been targeted or indeed seen any other promotion from any other political party on Facebook since this GE was announced.
Is it just me, or is Facebook the same for other users? There’s something not right about this and it can’t be targted ads because the Facebook algorithms know exactly where my political affinity lies.
Unless of course, the Facebook algorithm is attempting to brainwash me or convince me to vote Tory.
I am in no doubt that something underhand is occurring with Facebook.
Listen if Twitter in the Middle East and Africa is headed up by the 77th Brigade just imagine who’s running Facebook and Twitter (With political views in mind ) in the UK.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/twitter-executive-british-army-officer-psyops-gordon-macmillan-a9127036.html
Facebook is working exactly as it was designed and is no accident that you are being targeted. You and millions, if not billions, of others. Their MO was exposed three years ago, with a deafening silence from the majority of the press and sites like this, who treat it with disdain, disbelief and a cultural ignorance.
The disgusting rich LibDem ex-leader Clegg works for Facebook, that says it all.
Facebook UK, political advertising spend, 10 month period to end August 2019.
Labour £443K, Con £410K, LibDems £367K, Changelings £214K, Greens (E & W) £77K.
For the same period, SNP £5K. Why the pitiful spend? Keeping the powder dry for the big one? Getting a bigger bang for their buck elsewhere? Gross incompetence at Head office? Takes your pick.
Well, that would go some way to explaining why I’m seeing absolutely zero from the SNP but as you ask, why? They’re certainly aware of the impact that advertising on Social Media has but £5K? That’ll be the same as Mhairi Blacks Westminster expenses for a month.
Mind you, after what I’ve read today concerning the Alex Salmond trial, maybe they’re keeping their heads down for the next week in order not to bring attention on themselves.
“it can’t be targted ads because the Facebook algorithms know exactly where my political affinity lies.”
Well, that’s wrong. It depends on the targeting. You could simply target people that expressed an interest in politics. My guess, based on experience, is that that’s what they’ll be doing.
I haven’t looked into the changes made in terms of being able to target more specifically on political stuff. I’m not sure the system would allow you to filter out people who were already affiliated so that they weren’t exposed to your political marketing. And it isn’t obvious that you’d always want to do that anyway.
The people they really want to target are the undecided and waverers, of course. But it’s very difficult to define those in a way that could be reduced to variables and algorithms. Try it and see — try and define the political characteristics of someone who is undecided (remember, they don’t usually tick a box and tell you, you can’t ask directly, and they are quite likely to be people who aren’t that engaged with politics too).
The best loose indicators, if you want to target potential Tory voters, would probably be age, location, and occupation/earnings.
I heard that Google can filter for bad/good grammar (and guess how educated you are based on the quality of your writing and spelling) by analysing only a handful of words that you’ve typed.
NASA and all their technical equipment and satellite might disagree with you there. However I’m sure you know better.
“The Earth’s climate has changed throughout history. Just in the last 650,000 years there have been seven cycles of glacial advance and retreat, with the abrupt end of the last ice age about 7,000 years ago marking the beginning of the modern climate era — and of human civilization. Most of these climate changes are attributed to very small variations in Earth’s orbit that change the amount of solar energy our planet receives.”
“Scientific evidence for warming of the climate system is unequivocal.”
” Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
The current warming trend is of particular significance because most of it is extremely likely (greater than 95 percent probability) to be the result of human activity since the mid-20th century and proceeding at a rate that is unprecedented over decades to millennia.”
“Earth-orbiting satellites and other technological advances have enabled scientists to see the big picture, collecting many different types of information about our planet and its climate on a global scale. This body of data, collected over many years, reveals the signals of a changing climate.”
“The heat-trapping nature of carbon dioxide and other gases was demonstrated in the mid-19th century.2 Their ability to affect the transfer of infrared energy through the atmosphere is the scientific basis of many instruments flown by NASA. There is no question that increased levels of greenhouse gases must cause the Earth to warm in response.”
https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
It all depends on their algorithms. Did they get them right or not? The problem is that the actual evidence is very slight, and difficult to distinguish from the background noise. Jaggar maybe is too certain, but he is right about the way the science business works. Careers come before so-called truth.
As usual, I agree with virtually every word of this. Even (typo) YouGove.
Meanwhile Chanhel 4’s Countdown hostess wears a photoshopped T-shirt which calls Jeremy Corbyn a racist, which I find disgraceful.
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEIrXZBAUSWNwg_xXR9NejGYqFggEKg4IACoGCAowqvB9MMTRCTC19BU?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen
Good place for a political statement though. Prime marketing real estate…
This stupid woman accused Noam Chomsky of antisemitism.
(Noam Chomsky – eminent Jewish intellectual)
She also stated on a TV interview that you wouldn’t know she’s Jewish, because she doesn’t look Jewish !!!
This woman is a car wreck..
But MM love her :O(
I would like to see Corbyn and Sturgeon go head to head. Corbyn when interviewed in Stirling made many good points, and Sturgeon advised that the SNP is already delivering on many of Labour’s promises for Scotland. Corbyn said he would not agree a second IndyRef in Labour’s first term of office – if they get elected – and that seems reasonable given the complexity of any border controls whether of Brexit or breaking up the United Kingdom. If the Tories get back in I think Wales and Scotland will want out of the UK and. To Remain in Europe. If Labour’s Brexit keeps us in the Customs Union, and allows us to have national control over our utilities, investing in our NHS and upgrading our public transport infrastructure then those things would be an improvement on Remaining, as long as we have reciprocal rights on ‘freedom of movement’ so that all our pensioners don’t have to come home, and to ensure there is no hostile environment for spouses and children.
The EU has much to recommend it, and Corbyn would prefer to keep the high standards of food safety and environmental protections, which the Tories see as unnecessary, and he would keep us close in foreign policy too. It would be wonderful if we could also see Bernie in the White House. The world would be a better place if they could ensure rule of law governed all equally.
My greatest political or economic influence is Sir Norman Angell who wrote many books from the end of WW1 until the late 1940s calling for a common market with Europe, and explaining Keynesian economics so that Labour could deliver the improvements to quality of life for the whole of the UK through the 1950s to 1970s. It was never imagined that any small minority of globally rich individuals would ever have the clout to undo this progress in human kindness and human rights.
Today we need a new economic paradigm. MMT is jokingly called The Magic Money Tree. It has bountiful fruit for Republicans and Tories funding wars and tax cuts for the wealthy. It can just as easily spend on public services, free training and education, and jobs. The choice is political. QE for the bankers showed that threats of inflation were greatly exaggerated. Much of the missing money is in offshore tax havens, and restricting the supply of money, or replacing it with debt money in circulation, makes us all poorer for the rent we pay on our debt, shrinking the economy. MMT also requires that spending is covered by resources. Nationalised industry can protect the natural resources. Stephanie Kelton of Stonybrook University is Bernie Sanders’ Lead Economist. Kate Raworth offers a new economic paradigm called Donut or Doughnut Economics, which includes the whole economy and looks for sustainability, to support future generations as well as improve standards of living through successful trade and industry. Ed Miliband is doing good stuff in his Reasons to be Cheerful podcasts.
Internet algorithms keep different groups separate from each other to prevent cross contamination, and many of those groups are fed a diet of hate and fear, which is sad for them and for others. This wonderful page keeps dialogue open and is a wonderful beacon of truth and high standards.
Thank you Craig and all the other contributors too
“Corbyn said he would not agree a second IndyRef in Labour’s first term of office – if they get elected – and that seems reasonable”
What give Corbyn the right to deny the people of Scotland a democratic referendum when they want it. It should not be up to him or Johnson to decide it should be up to the people.
Folk like you make me laugh Corbyn said he’ll more than likely hold a second leave/remain vote, though Unite chief Len McCluskey (closely affiliated to Labour) says Labour are definitely a party of leave. That would explain Corbyns years of dithering and sitting on the fence over Brexit.
It was indeed up to the people, and they voted 55/45 to stay. Whether that was wise or not isn’t for me to say, but that’s what they wanted.
How many referendums do you think should be had on this issue? How many more should they have if one of them returns a result that you like?
The people voted on the promise (one of many the vow being the worst) thinking that remaining in the EU was a cert.
However even though 62% of Scots voted to remain in the EU we are currently being dragged out, the consequences economically of this will be very damaging indeed for Scots.
I should add that it doesn’t matter when Scots choose to have an indyref, its the will of the people that counts not Westminsters accent.
The very fact that both Corbyn and Johnson intend to deny the will of the democratic public to vote, should be enough incentive to ditch this union for good.
Sturgeon certainly supports many Labour policies, and none of the policies of any other Parties. Lib Dems are a toxic brand, fully behind the Tories when it comes to killing poor people. Britain needs a Labour Government to bring accountability back into politics. Being allowed to lie in order to win really ought to be against the Law
“Sturgeon certainly supports many Labour policies, ”
I think you’ll find its the other way around Corbyn talks about implementing policies in England, that Sturgeon and her government have already done in Scotland.
“Corbyn said he would not agree a second IndyRef in Labour’s first term of office… and that seems reasonable given the complexity of any border controls whether of Brexit or breaking up the United Kingdom.”
Who decides if it seems reasonable or not, you?
If you ever end up a battered wife, I wonder how you’d feel if strangers argued that it seemed reasonable to stop you from leaving because your wife-beater husband was involved in a dispute with the neighbours.
Battered wife?? If / then legal arguments have hung many an innocent man. But a man can murder his wife because she was a nag, or called him a pansy, and the judge will sympathise with him. Gender based terms of abuse must be banned from legal defence arguments for men charged with offences against women, or gay, or transgender people. They should have been outlawed when racism and disablism terms of abuse were made a criminal offence
Alyson at 15.30 yesterday – thanks for the heads-up re Norman Angell. I have the 1939 Penguin special issue of The Great Illusion – Now which was in dad’s bookcase and which I inherited but have never read. Will give it a go when it starts raining tomorrow…(:
The book is also available for free on the Internet Archive: https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.262442/page/n1
Until particulate pollution is cleaned from the air, contrails will continue to weave a blanket across the sky, which reduces sunlight getting to the Earth, which reduces evaporation, and traps moisture, increasing pollution at ground level, and melting polar ice. Clean energy, clean seas, clean air, and healthy ecosystems on land and in our oceans are an achievable aim, if we clean up after ourselves, recycle plastics cleanly back into carbon, and respect the environment. Australia is burning. The Amazon is burning. Adding to the burden of particulates around the globe. Respect local people and their care for the land, clean water, and safe food, and perhaps put into legislation the duty to cost cleaning up into all industry, and ensure public safety. Good government can deliver standards that will give future generations the chance to thrive. But unless responsibility is hard wired into international law the young are right to fear for their future along with the future of all life on Earth. Extinctions are well underway across the globe
You are right that it is really pollution that is the issue, not climate change. Pollution is ever present these days, and will kill us long before a 1 or 2 °C temperature rise.
“Respect local people and their care for the land”
The local people are cutting the horns off rhino’s in order to sell them to believers in Chinese voodoo-medicine. They don’t even kill them to do it, although the rhino’s do eventually die as a result (usually lying next to bleeding family members who have suffered the same fate).
This isn’t an evil of capitalism, before anyone attempts to argue that it is. It’s an evil of human stupidity and poverty, both of which could be addressed and remedied quite easily within a productive capitalist framework, if only we’d stop meddling and worrying about the price of coffee beans and mangetouts.
” “Get Brexit Done” is going to annoy voters as much as “Strong and Stable”
I guess the 27 female Labour MP’s who complained about Kate Osborne the Labour candidate for Jarrow, and petitioned the central party, unsuccessfully, to prevent her from standing because of retweeting a satirical picture would disagree with you.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7669035/Pictured-Violent-meme-shared-Labour-union-boss-shows-gun-pointed-Theresa-Mays-head.html
Liz Kendall, Jess Phillips and Yvette Cooper were among those who said in a letter that such images incite violence…_
Good grief. Still pumping out a litany of deranged nonsense when the evidence is overwhelming. It takes a particular degree of obtuseness and head-in-the-sand denial to keep that outmoded stance. You wouldn’t know a scientific fact if it buried you neck deep in rising water.
You mean the algorithms are overwhelming. Like RoS, you are just reading the press releases, not the science.
really? Amazing what you know/don’t know.
Agree with Mr Jagger !
Planetary climate is complex beyond the wildest imaginings, and anybody who sells certainty with regard to it, of either side of the argument, is undoubtedly a bunco artist 🙂
Nobody said it wasn’t complex. So is quantum physics. But decades of research and an abundance of evidence, which is increasing exponentially every day, is pointing in one direction. It is a scientific accomplishment to have achieved such insight into climate change. Making into a pseudo religious mystical complexity is just another avoidance and denial strategy. With that attitude I expect you believe the sun revolves around the earth, such is the complexity of astronomy.
Your trust in the men of science is maybe a little misplaced, especially when one considers that there may be more ‘Scientists’ alive today, than the total of all those who have gone before back to the days of Archimedes and before ? And we can be sure that each will be expecting remuneration that exceeds the minimum wage. I would refer you to the farewell address of President Eisenhower for a prediction of what ‘Science’ seems in large part to have become today.
Also, I have little doubt that when the Sun revolving around the Earth was the official dogma, those who were the proto scientists of their day, fully supported the notion. Obviously in those days, science tended to follow religion, whereas now the roles have been reversed.
Bottom line, Scientists are in no way infallible when it comes to predicting the outcomes of ongoing experiments, and like it or not, climate science falls into just that category. So, and as ever, watching both sides of the argument is probably the best course. 🙂
I see no likely alternative to this elevation but despair no matter who wins.
“It is truly laughable to call Boris far right. He is the epitome of the establishment…”
Unless the establishment itself is far right.
Good post, Rhys. Science has always been corrupted by the availability and sources of funding. In the early enlightenment the money went into labour-saving stuff like steam engines and machines. That’s where the money was. Most money and research today goes into stupid stuff like weapons development and cosmetic stuff.
Let nobody here try and pretend that by their very nature scientists are intrinsically noble or crusaders or anything like that. You’d have at least as much of a chance of finding noble crusaders cleaning toilets for a living as you would in the scientific community.
Medical science in particular has a history of involvement in genocide, experiments on humans (not to mention animals), body snatching, and other stuff that ought to keep you awake at night. Most of the big developments derived from wartime experiences.
I don’t have the knowledge/brains to make a call on climate change, whether or not it’s real, man-made or not. I see it as a middle class thing, much like the preponderance of healthy eating shows on radio and TV. All they care about is prolonging their miserable lives and money.
When the middle classes start acting responsibly towards the poor and the third world, when they stop turning a blind eye to and voting for murdering bastards like Blair, etc., I’ll consider caring about climate change. In short, if they start acting like responsible human beings, I might give it a try myself. Until then I reserve the right to regard the whole subject as an affront.
It must be great to be so smug, and play the holier-than-thou card. Job done, sit back and do nothing.
Okay, those of us who oppose the smugness of others and their holier-than-thou assumptions are to be considered the smug ones. Got it.
Scientists (that is, ordinary human beings who claim to have omniscience in one narrow field or another) get things wrong all the time, btw. Ask any thalidomide or resident of Pripyat.
In my lifetime the scientific community have done a full 180 degree turn on climate change. They told me when I was at school we were heading steadily for another ice-age and the cause was CFCs.
I’ve asked in here more than once what happened to the hole in the ozone layer that would inevitably grow and grow and let all the heat out. Nobody will tell me.
What do I know…