The resignation letter of Craig Mokhiber, Director of the New York Office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, has gone viral on social media but most posts only show page one. Here is the full four page letter.
This needs no gloss from me. Craig is one of the world’s leading international lawyers.
I am writing this in Geneva where I am tomorrow meeting UN officials to pursue my own case: both my unprecedented in modern times jailing for contempt of court, and the current surreal persecution under the terrorism act. I shall also be raising the case of other journalists subjected to persecution under the terrorism act, including Kit Klarenberg, Vanessa Beeley and Johanna Ross.
This account from John Laughland is interesting in how precisely it accords with my own experience, particularly in being held for exactly an hour with no right to remain silent and no right to a lawyer.
By one of those astonishing coincidences in life, tomorrow is the United Nations International Day to End Impunity for Crimes Against Journalists.
I am not making it up, that really is a thing.
And the major theme of the keynote meeting is
“to bring visibility to a new Study on the impact of counter-terrorism and other criminal laws on media freedom and safety of journalists. Panellists will explore legal challenges faced by journalists and the increasing practice of resorting to restrictive legal frameworks to unduly interfere with the work of journalists.”
So I could hardly have walked in at a more auspicious moment.
Subject to an “anti-terrorism investigation”, I do not view it as safe currently to return to the UK. Whether the investigation relates to my support for Wikileaks or to my support for Palestine, or to both, I do not know as the police have not said why I am being investigated.
I honestly believe I am not fighting for me, but against encroaching fascism in western societies. It is for freedom from an ever encroaching police state and from a political class trying to enforce a monopoly of information to the public. The fight can only happen at all with financial support from the amazing readers of this blog. You have seen me through so much, and I am very grateful.
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Sigh you cannot make this up, France annonced today that they will have a conference for the war in 6 days! That is while the people in Gaza face relentless bombing and genocide. A conference? A a bloody joke.
France should of course call for Responsibility to protect like they always do, but no, not for the palestinians, they are not equals.
Is this the rule-based order west have spoken of so dearly past years, genocide, ethnic cleansing and racism?
Monsieur Macron is in a delicate situation. France has about 600,000 Jewish citizens and several million inhabitants (the majority of whom are also citizens) of Northern African origin. The Muslims have the majority (and have quite a few other bones of contention with the French state) but the Jews have higher economic status and, crucially, have in their number quite a few of the public intellectuals who play such an important rôle in shaping French discourse (think BHL, Glucksmann, etc, etc). In such circumstances, calling for a conference is always a good ploy (whether it actually takes place of not).
French discourse and reactions, including matters such as attempting to ban demonstrations in favour of the Palestinians, is also shaped by the fact that there are various members of Macron’s party starting to jostle for the position of next President . The current interior minister, a certain Monsieur Gérald Damarnin is one of those whose current actions are designed to build up public support. The minister of national education, the youthful Monsieur Gabriel Attal, another Presidential hopeful, has for his part decided to ban the wearing of the full-length dress (for women) in state schools
Perhaps Laguerre has something to add to the above.
Jews detest Zionism as much as the rest of the human race. Please don’t confuse Zionism with humanity. They follow the Talmud and they the Zionists are god…… in their eyes. There is no need for an after life….. in the Talmud……as they are living gods…… get it right goyem!
A very confused post, Highlander – what are you on about?
On second thoughts, don’t bother!
” Jews detest Zionism as much as the rest of the human race ”
How do you know that? Have you been knocking doors?
@ ” Highlander ”
You must present a fine figure of a man, with your skullcap and kilt.
moody, long interview Juan Cole – Bob Scheer:
“Palestine’s Obituary – Juan Cole offers his expertise in the Middle East to explain how we’ve gotten to the current state of affairs in Palestine and Israel.”
https://scheerpost.com/2023/11/03/palestines-obituary/
short excerpt (the whole thing either as video or transcript)
“Netanyahu’s cabinet:
“[H]e brought into his government, when he came back to power late last year, the most extreme, I mean, this is beyond fascism, the most extreme parties in Israel. The religious Zionists and the Jewish power. I mean, these people are terrorists and some of them actually have been on the State Department terrorism watch list, not allowed in the United States in the past. And he brought them into the cabinet. He made one of these guys the minister of national security, put the other in the finance ministry and then gave him responsibilities as a civilian for overseeing the Palestinian West Bank. And both of these ministers who are extremists were also squatters on Palestinian land in the West Bank and wanted to steal the rest of it to bring in more settlers.”
It was not hard to see the irony in the Western response, as Scheer points out: “The hypocrisy of Germany, which was the author of the worst crime of modern history, the Holocaust, and the French, who certainly were anti-Semitic to a considerable degree, and others in Western Europe, [are] now saying you can’t even demonstrate for Palestinian rights.”
Pointing out the individuals with a real hand in the situation, who have the money to lobby for Israel’s interests, Cole says, “[the power] lies with the people that are most comfortable with seeing the Palestinians simply ethnically cleansed.”
“Rishi Sunak has backed “pauses” in the Israel-Hamas conflict to allow crucial aid into Gaza, but rejected calling for a ceasefire.
Short breaks in hostilities could allow hostages and British nationals out of the besieged enclave, the prime minister said.
But a wholesale ceasefire would only benefit Hamas”
Maybe this has something to with Sunak wanting the genocide to continue.
“Rishi Sunak’s family company, Infosys, is co-directed by Israeli intelligence veteran Uri Levine. He came from the infamous Unit 8200.
Sunak’s wife has £460 million worth of shares in the company.”
https://nitter.net/Lowkey0nline/status/1720507687438295230#m
We all know why Sir Kid Starver wants the unabated slaughter of the oppressed Palestinians to continue.
“The UK Labour Party’s latest corporate mega-donor is a pro-Israel businessperson whose firm profiteered from South African apartheid.”
https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/asa-winstanley/labours-new-bankroller-israel-lobbyist-south-african-apartheid-profiteer
Re my above comment here Sunak speaks of values that “We” stand for, Sunak has no values worth having. Sunak adds freedoms must be protected; he’s the consummate lying b*stard politician. He then goes on to promote peace and dignity, I don’t believe one word that comes out this wretched man’s mouth.
https://nitter.net/RishiSunak/status/1720427545177301472#m
Truly disgusting – the only people worth saving are “our” kind, the people with british passports while a genocide goes on right in front of Sunak!
Here is the former director general of Al Jazeera blasing western values
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/WaDuScwMjho
Too bad that BRICS nations are as passive and complicit what is going on, they could have proved they were better than the west but apparently they are as bad.
Indeed Jack, though I’d imagine that many countries citizens are opposed to the slaughter, but their governments are either too gutless to stand up against it, or their politicians/corporations have business interests with Israel and put those interests ahead of Palestinian lives.
Those governments and global corporations that haven’t spoken out against the genocide, the first lot should be quickly booted out of office via the ballot box, the latter should see a boycott on their products.
With a US aircraft carrier in the Eastern Med, and the leaked photo of Biden talking with US Special forces heading into Gaza, and the news that the US military has been flying surveillance drones over Gaza since October 7th, one has to conclude that US troops are aiding and abetting the Zionists in the slaughter of two-and-a-half million civilians (more than one million of them are children) in the open-air prison called Gaza that has had its fuel, food and water cut off, as the UN, and the EU and the ICC stands by and witnesses the cold-blooded murders of thousand of oppressed Palestinians.
https://nitter.net/Lowkey0nline/status/17204990215658579m
Republicofscotland, I know nothing about twitter/x/nitter, so could not extemporise when the following error message was generated.
Invalid tweet ID
Australia playing its part in the genocide in Gaza.
“The Pine Gap US surveillance base located outside of Alice Springs in Australia is collecting an enormous range of communications and electronic intelligence from the brutal Gaza-Israel battlefield – and this data is being provided to the Israel Defence Forces.
Two large Orion geosynchronous signals intelligence satellites, belonging to the US and operated from Pine Gap, are located 36,000 kms above the equator over the Indian Ocean. From there, they look down on the Middle East, Europe and Africa, and gather huge amounts of intelligence data to beam back to the Pine Gap base.
After collecting and analysing the communications and intelligence data for the USA’s National Security Agency (NSA), Pine Gap is providing it to the Israel Defence Forces, as it steps up its brutal assault on Palestinians in the Gaza enclave.
“Pine Gap facility is monitoring the Gaza Strip and surrounding areas with all its resources, and gathering intelligence assessed to be useful to Israel,” a former Pine Gap employee has told Declassified Australia.
David Rosenberg worked inside Pine Gap as ‘team leader of weapon signals analysis’ for 18 years until 2008. He is a 23-year veteran of the National Security Agency (NSA). ”
https://declassifiedaus.org/2023/11/03/targeting-palestine/
I hope you don’t go to France Craig.
“Basically the proposal is that insulting Israel in France would be punishable “by two years of imprisonment and a fine of 75,000 euros” and “inciting hatred or violence” against Israel would land you 5 years in prison and give rise to a fine of 100,000 euros.
Here is how the bill reads:
“Bill Proposal to Complete the Penal Framework Sanctioning Anti-Zionism
Article 25 of the law of July 29, 1881, on the freedom of the press is restated as follows:
‘Art. 25. – Those who, by one of the means stated in Article 23, have denied the right of the State of Israel to exist will be punished by one year of imprisonment and a fine of 45,000 euros.
‘An insult committed against the State of Israel, by one of the means stated in the same Article 23, is punishable by two years of imprisonment and a fine of 75,000 euros.
‘Those who, by the same means, have directly incited hatred or violence against the State of Israel will be punished by five years of imprisonment and a fine of 100,000 euros.'””
https://nitter.net/RnaudBertrand/status/1720362605532140001#m
At Twitter X Craig asks us to Consider –
In Ukraine, 6% of those killed by Russia have been children. ( In Nearly Two Years – In An actual War )
In Palestine, 42% of those killed by Israel have been children. (In less than Four Weeks )
( Words in Brackets are My own adds.
Yasmine Ahmed of HRW make this argument too as a way to show western hypocrisy
Yasmine Ahmed of HRW on the ‘hypocrisy of the international community’ regarding Palestinians
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArSKSoZd4M8
Not once the west spoken for palestinians right to defend themselves or even to live in security, not once have the deliberate bombing of civilians/kids been condemned, it is breathtaking, because it is like they, the west, do not see any problem with this dehumanising approach!
In Syria since 2011
“As of March 2023, more than 200,000 civilians have been killed by Syrian regime forces and Iranian militias throughout the ongoing conflict in Syria. A further 6,950 are estimated to have been killed by Russian forces.”
“As of March 2023, the Syrian regime forces and Iranian militias have killed more than 20,000 children since the start of the Syrian conflict. The Russian forces have killed a further 2,048 children.”
https://www.statista.com/statistics/697188/child-deaths-in-syria-by-party-responsible/
Rubbish! Source??!
I agree Mark, absolute rubbish, no mention of Turkey, US, UK, anti Syrian government militias, Islamic State, other foreign insurgents including mercenaries.
“Until this changes, the responsibility lies with you as you use the Web to source research. Always look for the original source. And if you omit the citation — or just write “Source: Statista” — we’ll know you’re too lazy to do the necessary work to verify where your stats are are coming from. That reflects poorly, not just on Statista, but on you.”
https://bernoff.com/blog/my-big-problem-with-statista
I can’t express this better
So my link was equivalent to referring to Twitter which now seems mostly blocked without an account. I do agree with that blog that it’s a bad precedent to separate data from source.
Anyway
https://www.syriahr.com/en/291981/
“The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights (SOHR) has documented by names the death of 503,064 people since the outbreak of the Syrian Revolution out of an overall death toll of 613,407 people whose death has been verified by SOHR in the past 12 years.
-Civilian deaths: 162,390 civilians: 121,407 men, 15,437 women and 25,546 children
….
(“226 died under different circumstance.” so maybe natural causes)
…
do not include the following:
Over 55,000 civilians who were killed under torture in the detention centers and prisons of Bashar al-Assad’s regime (SOHR obtained information about their death during the period of their detention).
“
SOHR is a notorious anti-government partisan organisation, with poor reliability. It’s a guy who lives in Britain, in Cardiff, I think. The only reason for reading his stuff, at the height of the Syrian war, was that he spent all day on the phone to his contacts in Syria so the info was more up to date. But he’s committed anti-Asad.
SOHR is a MI6-CIA front….
Well the Assad regime is hardly going to own up.
You have to understand GA that most of the posters here live in a binary world where there are good guys and bad guys. As they’ve allowed themselves to be convinced that all evil comes from the West, anybody who opposes the West must therefore be the good guys, squeaky clean and beyond reproach. This despite Craig himself denouncing the Assad regime as ‘brutal’ and Bashir’s cheerleader-in-chief Vanessa Beeley admitting that the regime has tortured its opponents. According to HRW, Amnesty and the UN 110,000 to 130,000 have been detained without charge by Syrian forces, of which 55,000 are known to have been murdered.
The UN puts the total death toll in Syria to 2021 at 508,000 with the GCR2P putting the civilian death toll at 306,887.
Braced for predictable responses.
—
[ Mod: The predictable responses will have to appear in the discussion forum, if they’re about Syria rather than Gaza, as the debate is wandering increasingly off topic. ]
How many Syrians have been killed by the American head-chopping, heart-eating, rapers and slavers?
Ah well, maybes you should all have been quicker to condemn the killing of the Ukrainian kids.
With a tiny minority of exceptions, this site BTL has been a cheerleader for the destruction of Ukraine.
I don’t expect that to change.
BTW, Israel-Hamas is an “actual war”.
Lies like yours could lead to WWIII..
You’re guff and grasp of reality is getting worse by the day John Main.
The Russians intervened in Ukraine – a civil war instigated by the US. The zionist antisemites have occupied Palestine since 1947 and have been conducting terrorist atrocities there since the 1920s. There is no war, there was a slave uprising and now there is a white terror.
” this site BTL has been a cheerleader for the destruction of Ukraine.”
The destruction of Ukraine has been caused by the UK and US pressurising Ukraine’s government to opt for war when they could have had peace after only a month of conflict. Luckily there are few BTL commenters who are cheerleaders for this course of action but they do exist.
Yes of course the Ukrainians were just itching to drop their pants and bend over for those nice Russians but that nasty Boris Johnson bullied them into foolishly thinking that they actually wanted to fight to defend their homeland.
That reply is asinine, even for you. Obviously it matters more to you that Russia not be allowed to win easily than that hundreds of thousands of Ukranians should die. Of course, armed with the reckless courage of the non-combatant, you can quite blithely ignore the fact that a country the size of Ukraine was never going to win against a country the size of Russia. You obviously think that your dislike of Russia is more important than the lives of all those young Ukranian men. There’s a name for people like that.
So it matters to you that Russia be allowed to win easily? The fact is that despite expectations Ukraine, the poorest nation in Europe, has fought Russia to a standstill which underlines just how crap Russia is. Please don’t waste my time with ‘ah but the Russians are adopting a slow and cautious approach to minimise civilian casualties’, it’s total nonsense which doesn’t stand up to examination.
This is veering seriously off topic too!
Yes, indeed. This thread concerns Gaza, not Ukraine. (Perhaps the distraction was deliberate mischief, perhaps not.)
Atrocities are taking place in Gaza, and there are protests all round the world about the actions of the Israeli military and the states who are giving their unwavering political support.
The frequent news bulletins which some commenters were contributing here have now been moved to their own thread:
!! BREAKING NEWS !! (Gaza)
because they typically failed the ‘Contribute’ rule in the moderation rules for commenters:
“Contribute
Contributions which are primarily just a link to somewhere else will be deleted.
You can post links, but give us the benefit of your thoughts upon them.”
If you see a link or story in the “Breaking News” thread that you want to comment on, you’re welcome to discuss your thoughts here, as long as you give an opinion about it that you’re prepared to defend under challenge.
“So it matters to you that Russia be allowed to win easily?”
No, (as you knew was the answer before you asked) let’s bring this back on topic, are principles more important than lives? It seems that you think they are. Would you agree with those who say that it is more important that Hamas is destroyed than the lives of non-combatants are preserved in Gaza, for instance?
John Main, the Israel-Hamas situation is not a war: it is a slaughter/genocide of Palestinians. If it was a war, then you would see opposing armed forces, both of which would have airpower, navies, regular armies etc. Palestine have none of these; Israel have a never ending military budget, almost entirely funded by the USA.
I’m afraid there have been plenty of colonial “wars” where one side has been armed with machine guns and the other with spears.
Bayard, as far as I know that has been the way of things since the Conquistadores rocked up in South America with their Horses, Muskets & Cannons just over 500 years ago. It proved such a successful blueprint for the expropriation of valuable resources, it’s barely changed at all, apart, of course from the increased advantages obtained from technological modernisation. For example: today’s conquistador does it from 42,000 feet up, and/or a few hundred miles away. There’s none of this “seeing the whites of their eyes”
There’s good intentions here, but realistically the ICC will do nothing to prosecute war crimes by the Zionists or those other nations governments/politicians who’ve aided and abetted them in the genocide of the oppressed Palestinians.
The ICC is however (due to being a western apparatus, used, to issue warrants etc. against anyone one or nation that stands up to western hegemony). Not fit for purpose.
This, however, is interesting and indicates just how complicit dis-united kingdom’s governments are in aiding the war criminals murdering the Palestinians.
“In December 2020, a military cooperation agreement was signed by Britain and Israel. Despite the UK MoD describing it as an “important piece of defence diplomacy” which “strengthens” military ties, the British parliament and public has never seen what is in it.
The MoD has refused to publish it and has only briefly mentioned it in parliament once, in a response to a direct question from an MP.
The agreement was signed by then chief of the defence staff Sir Nick Carter and his Israeli counterpart chief of general staff, Aviv Kohavi.
It was described as an “organising mechanism for our relationship” which “formalises our defence relationship”. It provides “a mechanism for planning our joint activity, allowing collaboration on a number of areas”.
It is suspicious that the agreement is being kept at a high security classification. It is possible the accord “strengthens” the relationship between the two militaries to the degree that it places some obligations on the UK to defend Israel, through the provision of information, intelligence or material support.
The ICC should want to see a copy of the agreement to assess the UK’s military role in Israel’s campaign in Gaza.”
The dis-united kingdom’s military forces such as the SAS are in Gaza aiding the Zionists.
“British covert forces recently operated with Saudi Arabia in a secret war in Yemen.
“The UK military’s “D-Notice” committee, which seeks to stop the media publishing information it claims would damage national security, requested on 28 October all media editors to not publish information relating to SAS operations in Gaza.”
“The dis-united kingdom has a large airbase in Cyprus, British covert forces recently operated with Saudi Arabia in a secret war in Yemen. ”
The dis-untied kingdom has a large airbase in Cyprus at Akrotiri its only 230 miles from Gaza, GCHQ its communication interception facility at Ayios Nikolaos, passes on info to the Israeli SIGINT National Unit (ISNU), which monitors and targets Palestinians.
https://www.declassifieduk.org/the-icc-must-investigate-british-ministers-for-gaza-war-crimes-heres-how/
After another day of relentless bombing in front of the whole world I wonder what the future have for the 20-something corrupt lousy arab states that have not done 1 single thing to help the palestinians during this carnage in Gaza and have not done anything regarding the situation in the West Bank (where Hamas is not ruling – so it is not a we-do-not-like-Hamas issue for them).
I mean Al Qaeda/bin Laden was “born” in response, partly, to the corrupt nature of the arab leaders that collaborated with the americans to the detrimental interests of the arab people.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motives_for_the_September_11_attacks#Stated_motives
But whatever argument bin Laden had back then it is nowhere near how severe the arab leaders treacherous behavior are this time, Of course we will see al qaeda 2.0 after this Rest assured there are probably quite a few arabs that will not sit still after watching what is unfolding now.
It is time for regime change/coup in the arab states, especially in Egypt, Saudiarabia and Jordan. Those are the most rotten, despicable rulers I have ever seen, turning a blind eye when brothers and sisters being slaughtered right in front ot them.
They have so much money, so much influence so much weapons but they do nothing, scum.
After Israel is finished with Palestine, they will be next.
Way I see it Jack, the rulers (and quite a few of the ordinary people) of countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Lebanon, Egypt, etc. would really like for Israel to eliminate the psychopathic nutjobs of Hamas, once and for all.
And who can blame them? They would then have peace.
Interesting to see your double standards though. When two nominally Christian countries start slaughtering each other, other Christian countries that stand neutrally on the sidelines are lauded. Yet when any nominally Islamic country is at war, the default position is supposed to be that every Islamic country must jump into the fray.
A bizarre world view, IMHO.
If you think this is about religion – it isn’t.
Zionism is not religion.
You don’t have to be Jewish to be a Zionist.
Catholics (Germany) V Protestant (Britain/US) in WW2?
I don’t know who you are but you are talking nonsense.
This is politics (the continuation of politics by violent means) and if the US says stop then Israel will fall into line – eventually.
The Frankenstein Monster the West helped to create will have their electric charge cut off.
There is a reason why Blinken is blinking and it is this:
Strangely – when Iran wanted to guide their sophisticated missiles they previously had to rely on US satellite guidance – they now use Chinese satellites for guidance.
That (as far as accuracy goes) is what the Yanks call a ‘game changer’ if things get out of hand.
The Israelis (Zionist – politically very right wing) are in revenge mode but they have no plan. The US is trying to guide them into a plan.
If they don’t agree with the US they may be on the road to ruin.
If the Iranian missiles start flying Israel will empty.
Half the population have Dual Passports and who could blame them for getting out of the way if it all gets out of control?
The decision is in Netanyahu’s hands.
The “nominally” in my post was there for a reason.
This is about two belligerents with a pathological, visceral hatred for each other. It suits a few with their own agendas to claim the conflict can be “switched off” by external influencers. It can’t be.
That’s about all any of us can say with confidence. Your invented assertions are make believe.
Sweeping generalisations and blinkered bunkum John Main,as per..
oh were the Nazis and jews just two groups with pathological visceral hatred of each other? Nazis and Roma? Nazis and homosexuals. like somebody said, lies like yours are pushing us toward world war 3.
How about the Nazis and the Bolsheviks Pretzel?
It’s the inability to accept that both sides are at fault which is going to prolong this conflict.
“This is about two belligerents with a pathological, visceral hatred for each other. ”
to which I can only reply ,
“Your invented assertions are make believe.”
“It’s the inability to accept that both sides are at fault which is going to prolong this conflict.”
If your interpretation is that both sides are equally at fault then you are a very poor interpreter of history Piers.
If you have violent colonisers who appropriated indigenous territories and colonised a people treating them as prisoners, you cannot have equivalence. It is the inability of people to appreciate this glaring difference which is leading to genocide.
“Bayard”
Your reply scoops the jackpot.
It takes some chutzpah to deny that the two belligerents have a pathological hatred of each other, given their often repeated and widely reported statements insisting they each intend to wipe the other from the surface of the earth.
But congratulations, you did it.
Did I say “equally” at fault?
It’s the inability of people to appreciate that Hamas are at fault at all which is prolonging the genocide.
JM, You imply that the two sides would continue fighting regardless of whether their aims are achieved or not, whereas in reality, both sides are engaged in trying to stop the other side from attacking them. Admitted, it looks like the Israelis want to clear the Palestinians from Gaza, but that is not because of some “pathological, visceral hatred”, it is because they want land and the natural gas that’s offshore. It’s just one of the myths you like to peddle that this whole disaster has blown up simply because the Israels hate the Palestinians and the Palestinians hate the Israelis, whereas, if the Israelis had left the Palestinians alone and not stolen their land none of this would have happened.
“It’s the inability of people to appreciate that Hamas are at fault at all which is prolonging the genocide.”
I’d have to agree with you there, pity you spoiled it by modifying your statement into complete bollocks. So long as the leaders of the West maintain that Israel is not at fault, then so long will the genocide be kept up. Those few people that exist outside you head that are denying that Hamas are at fault are having absolutely no effect on the people carrying out the genocide. What do you expect, that if a few more people condemned Hamas, all their fighters would come out of the tunnels with their hands up, saying, “we now see we were wrong, shoot us?”
how about the Nazis and the Socialists, Pears? or do you equate Socialists and Bolsheviks?
“If you think this is about religion – it isn’t.
Zionism is not religion.
You don’t have to be Jewish to be a Zionist.
Catholics (Germany) V Protestant (Britain/US) in WW2?
I don’t know who you are but you are talking nonsense.”
Indeed Mark he is talking nonsense.
King Charles III visited Israel and took in on the visit a trip to graves of his Christian Zionist family members.
Needless to say King Charles III says one thing in public, but his actions say another.
https://www.mintpressnews.com/is-zionist-king-charles-behind-israel-genocide-in-gaza/286185/
Just read the French stupidity proposed above:
5 years in jail for being ” Anti-Zionist ”
Not anti-Jewish – just because someone is Jewish which obviously awful.
No – ” Anti-Zionist!”
The western world’s moral compass is spinning like fury.
As usual the Liberals come up with the worst proposals.
John Main
“Way I see it Jack, the rulers (and quite a few of the ordinary people) of countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Lebanon, Egypt, etc. would really like for Israel to eliminate the psychopathic nutjobs of Hamas, once and for all.”
Well, you’re completely wrong. The only people in favour of ‘normalisation’ with Israel are autocratic rulers who can take no notice of public opinion. Thus UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, but not Saudi. Jordan, because Abdullah is dependent on American subsidies. Sisi much the same. But it’s a dangerous game ignoring public opinion; you can get strung up from a lamppost.
You would say that, wouldn’t you?
“Bayard”
I made no mention of Palestine or the Palestinians in my first post. I’m thinking the intricacies of this debate is beyond you, but I’ll try again.
This is a war between two implacable belligerents, each sworn to the annihilation of the other: the state of Israel, and Hamas.
Maybes we can agree that the majority of peace loving Palestinians are simply caught up in this war and are suffering as collateral damage that both sides deem acceptable – maybes not.
if it is a war between Israel and Hamas, why did Israel fund Hamas and help it gain power?
Logically then, Israel is fighting for the destruction of Israel via its Hamas proxy.
Yikes, you have out-pretzeled me. Congrats.
logically Israel was opposed to a 2 state solution so it funded an opposition that opposed a 2 state solution, and helped it get into power, and now gets what it wants — an excuse to complete the ethnic cleansing Gaza. which it is in the process of doing as dotards and sycophants cheer.
“This is a war between two implacable belligerents, each sworn to the annihilation of the other: the state of Israel, and Hamas.”
That’s wrong too. There is a lot of evidence that the war is about a lot more than hatred. It, like most wars, appears to be a resource war. Hatred is just the means of getting people to fight and support the fighting. Hamas never had the slightest chance of annihilating the state of Israel, something that should be obvious to the meanest intelligence. Something that also should be obvious to the same mean intelligence is that the reaction of Israel to “Operation Al-Aqsa Flood” would be exactly what it has been. Why Hamas did what it did may be mysterious, but it sure as shit wasn’t to annihilate the state of Israel.
Unless I’ve missed it, it hasn’t been remarked on that the UK government has issued a D notice to the media to stop reporting of Special Forces activities in Gaza!
https://socialistworker.co.uk/news/british-state-tries-to-cover-up-its-military-operations-in-middle-east/
[ Mod: FYI, ‘Walt’ announced it three days ago, and ‘Republicofscotland’ mentioned it a couple of hours ago. ]
I guess it’s difficult to kill all those Palestinians without help, good old UK government, helping its funders.
Thanks for the link Stevie Boy.
Given that our police forces have already been declared racist, misogynistic and consumed by a macho culture; and the Tory government (if the Covid inquiry submissions are anything to go by) is racist, misogynistic and consumed by a a similar macho culture – heaven knows how much of an extreme version of those two our security services are.
They are quasi police and government combined; plus operating in secrecy where they assume no one will ever find out. I wonder how far down the route to subhuman droids our special operations personnel have been driven, by their ‘military conditioning’?
For instance, would they burn babies alive, or chop childrens’ heads off, if ordered to do so by their superiors?
I despair.
IMO, It’s worth mentioning that UK Police Forces (some not all) have received training from Israeli forces, as have military personnel. And, joint training has also been held in the UK.
https://www.ibtimes.co.in/israeli-army-trained-london-police-tactics-strategy-during-gaza-crisis-says-report-616521
Special forces have evolved from a secret wartime necessity to a quasi, state funded terrorist organisation.
Israel generates three quarters of its electricity supply via its gas fields. It has a naval ‘iron dome’ system which US missile expert Professor Postal (MIT) states has only a 5‒10% success rate.
The officer also said that Hezbollah is in possession of precise missiles, of Iranian manufacture, that can hit Israeli gas-drilling rigs.
“We must always be alert, there is no Iranian naval presence here and the Syrian Navy does not go out to sea, but Iranian missiles in the hands of Hezbollah can be launched from small vessels, manned or unmanned. Hezbollah radiates naval power even without having any ships or submarines. The Iranian presence is a game-changer.”
Ballistic or cruise missiles fired from the Lebanese or Syrian coast can reach the Israeli rigs within 2.5 minutes. If the rig is “cold” and no gas is being pumped at the time, the damage will put it out of commission for a few weeks, but if it sustains a missile strike while gas is being pumped, the entire rig will be destroyed.
The decision regarding shutting down rig operations is made between the energy company and the government, with the Navy in an advisory role. The cost of security for the rigs, some $3 billion, is also a matter of dialogue between the two parties.
https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5096684,00.html
I don’t even think it is ‘encroaching’ anymore.
It is here.
The attempted stitch-up of Alex Salmond heralded it.
That was Scotland’s ‘JFK moment’.
analysis of current Hezbollah – Israel behaviour
(not sure if one needs to agree with all this but there is some info)
“What is the role expected of Hezbollah in the Gaza war?”
Elijah J. Magnier
https://ejmagnier.com/2023/11/02/what-is-the-role-expected-of-hezbollah-in-the-gaza-war/
“Ongoing tensions along the Lebanese-Israeli border have escalated to unprecedented levels. More than 60,000 Israeli settlers have been evacuated from areas adjacent to the wall, a move that underlines the seriousness of the perceived threat. The evacuation is not unilateral. Hezbollah on the Lebanese side has also moved thousands of its residents to safer locations. This mutual evacuation indicates the anticipation of a large-scale conflict, and both appear to take every precaution to minimise civilian casualties.
Interestingly, despite the hostilities, there seems to be an unspoken rule of engagement. So far, both sides have primarily targeted military installations, avoiding large-scale civilian casualties. This restraint, especially on the part of a non-state actor like Hezbollah, is remarkable. It suggests maturity and strategic thinking that seeks to avoid the international repercussions of civilian casualties.
Hezbollah’s use of precision-guided missiles, even against seemingly insignificant targets such as communications equipment, sends a clear message. It’s not just about destroying the mark; it’s about demonstrating its capabilities. Using such advanced weaponry against smaller targets implies good training and a significant stockpile of these missiles, suggesting a willingness to engage in a protracted conflict. This ‘show of force’ acts as a deterrent, signalling to Israel the potential cost of a full-scale invasion or attack.”
p.s. reminder: Israel keeps its WMDs not as museum exhibits. And they are the only nuclear power in the region again not without reason.
Netanyahu has been a soldier half his life. Just like a major chunk of the Israeli political nomenklatura.
Hezbollah will likely stick to border skirmishes because they need to remain a credible deterrent threat, with the prospect of Israel attacking Iran. The Iron Dome is finite and could certainly be exhausted by Hezbollah and Iran firing at scale. Hamas fired between 2,200-5,000 rockets in a 20 minute burst and that intensity overwhelmed the Iron Dome. Iran and Hezbollah would be a different proposition altogether.
well if they are genuine, they will not undertake action that will increase the killing spree of the IDF.
There is no way Hezbollah can protect 2 mio. people.
I guess the Israelis know this and use it as leverage aka 2 mio. hostages.
hell, who knows, in the end Netanyahu will find a way for long-term escalation without blowing up everything and then after he pacified the situation with some “magic trick” like Oslo 5.0, which he ignited in the first place, garner a Nobel Prize.
The reputational damage to Israel from their excessive actions will be incalculable. Even their most loyal allies are struggling to defend these insane levels of destruction, to life and property. And that’s before the looming humanitarian disaster. The Muslim world already hated them, but they are losing the West too.
I’d imagine, privately, leading Western politicians must be completely exasperated. This is not how a civilised nation conducts itself in response to a terrorist attack. It also undermines Western criticism of Russia, making the West look totally hypocritical.
With great power comes great responsibility, obviously doesn’t translate to Hebrew.
A German museum fired a guide after she described the situation in the West Bank as “Apartheid”.
German Interview with her:
https://www.jungewelt.de/artikel/462276.repression-gegen-antizionisten-das-ist-eine-antisemitische-einstellung.html
her CV:
Udi Raz is a doctoral student at the Berlin Graduate School Muslim Cultures and Societies and was until recently a freelance museum guide at the Jewish Museum Berlin.
I post the entire thing since its not that long (if I may):
“(…)
“That’s an anti-Semitic attitude”
Tour guide at the Jewish Museum Berlin dismissed for statement on the West Bank. A conversation with Udi Raz
Interview: Jamal Iqrith
Q: You worked as a freelance museum guide at the Jewish Museum Berlin. Last week you were dismissed for making a statement about the West Bank. What did you say?
I had been working as a specialist on the subject of “Germany after 1945” on guided tours since April. There is a specific area in the museum called the Israel Room. There are various installations there that focus on the triangle of Israel-Germany-Jewish people. Among other things, I talked about my own biography there, for example why I live in Germany as an Israeli and Jewish person. Among other things, I referred to the human rights situation in the West Bank and to a report by Amnesty International from 2021, in which the NGO concludes that the human rights situation on the ground should be understood as “apartheid”. Regardless of the legal term, it is primarily important for me to emphasize that the human rights situation there is unacceptable.
Q: Was this the first time you have used this term and do other colleagues do the same?
I’ve been saying that since I started working there. Others obviously don’t use the term.
Q: How did they justify the dismissal to you?
They told me that because I had used the term “apartheid”, I would not get any more orders. That was literally the reason given. At the same time, the head of the education department, Diana Dressel, confirmed to me several times during my last interview that I had often received praise and that my teaching skills were excellent.
Q: Has the museum taken a political stance on current events in the Middle East?
Shortly after 7 October (start of the Hamas offensive, jW), the museum published a statement in which it expressed solidarity with Israel. In response, however, we were clearly told internally that we were also allowed to address topics that were “sensitive”. We should just always emphasize what we are referring to. It was clearly communicated that we shouldn’t be afraid, even if we held certain views that the company didn’t necessarily share.
Q: The Springer press repeatedly uses the term “Israel-hater” for critics of the Israeli government. What do you think of this?
I should perhaps make one thing clear: I am Israeli myself. My family lives there, as do many of my friends. The place is very close to my heart. So it is also in my interest that there is a just peace on the ground. Calling people “Israel haters” says the most about the people who use the term. Namely about what they understand by a plurality of Jewish voices in Germany.
Q: In the end, DIE ZEIT (major legacy weekly paper) did not want to publish an interview with you. Environmental activists are currently being attacked for making statements in solidarity with Palestine. Demonstrations are being characterized as “Islamist gatherings”. How would you describe the current climate in Germany?
I see the current developments as a further restriction of the democratic sphere in Germany. Many people are driving this process forward in the name of Germany. A country that wants to offer Jewish people protection. Germans currently want to achieve this by protecting a racist country and claiming that this country represents Jewish people. As if there would be no Jewish life without this country and as if Jewish people must be fundamentally racist. That is an anti-Semitic attitude. And I can’t put up with that.
(…)”
Today
“The Turkish president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, told reporters that Gaza must be part of an independent, sovereign Palestinian state once the Israel-Hamas war is over, adding Ankara would not support models “gradually erasing Palestinians from history””
Must be a slap in the face to the Kurdish. Who Ataturk’s adopted daughter pilot used to drop bombs on (main airport still named after her) while the army hunted them down in the mountains while they hid in caves smothering the babies to keep silent. Then banned from speaking their own language. And, aside from the extrajudicial kidnappings, whose elected politicians Erdogan keeps imprisoning, including still the “Kurdish Obama”
“On December 22, 2020, the ECHR condemns Turkey and called again for the release of Selahattin Demirtaş. The Court deemed the lifting of the parliamentary immunity and the subsequent pre-trial detentions as politically motivated because this step came only after the governing Justice and Development Party (AKP) had lost its majority in parliament.”
Rather off-topic diatribe. The Kurds, like the Armenians, have moved a lot, so it is difficult to say what their homeland is, unlike the Palestinians, whose frontiers are well-known, but being stolen.
Surprised by your response
“In his masterful study of relations between European and non-European peoples, Eric Wolf refers to Western concepts of so-called primitive peoples as “without history” …One might also speak of “denied history”. The application of such a phrase and idea to the people of Western Asia in fact makes a great deal of sense when one thinks of the Palestinian Arabs, Armenians, and especially the Kurdish people in the last hundred years….It should be emphasized that they have resided in a fairly compact and homogenous fashion in Kurdistan since ancient times”
https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/The_Emergence_of_Kurdish_Nationalism_and/yVdfAgAAQBAJ?hl=en
How clearly established to all were the Palestinian land boundaries, for how long?
Perhaps you haven’t noticed but Washington, Brussels and London are facilitating a 2nd Nakba so that all of historic Palestine can be occupied by people from Brooklyn, Hertfordshire and Irkutz. They don’t require spurious interpretations of Palestine’s historic boundaries to justify it. They don’t care what it looks like.
GA
“It should be emphasized that they have resided in a fairly compact and homogenous fashion in Kurdistan since ancient times”
Where precisely is this Kurdistan you mention? Nobody quite knows where its boundaries are. For example, the Syrian Kurds today live on land they didn’t live on before the 1WW. You’ll find the Kurds claim land which other peoples claim too, in Armenia for example. There’s even a claim to parts of Kirghizstan, as Stalin shipped some Kurds off there. Palestinians don’t do that.
The author you mention sounds like a Kurdish enthusiast, ready to claim as much as he can for them.
The quote about Kurdistan is from the intro by Prof Tucker, who was a reviewer asked by Prof Olson.
“William F. Tucker is Associate Professor of History at the University of Arkansas and holds an A.B. degree in European history from the University of North Carolina, an M.A.
in Balkan and Middle East history, and a Ph.D. in Middle Eastern history, the last two from Indiana University. He has authored multiple articles and book chapters on Sh¯ıism, Kurds, Mamluk history, and the history of natural disasters in the Middle East between 600 and 1800.”
“The Kurds, like the Armenians, have moved a lot, so it is difficult to say what their homeland is, unlike the Palestinians, whose frontiers are well-known, but being stolen.”
However, this is irrelevant to the point in question. “Palestinian” is a toponym, “Kurd” is an ethnonym. “Palestinians” are anyone who resides in the area now called Palestine who is not an Israeli, by and large (yes, I expect there are exceptions to this, but they are irrelevant, too) but the Kurds’ homeland is anywhere where the Kurds are currently living. Genocide is genocide, regardless of whether the people being genocided have a “homeland” or not. More to the point, it wasn’t Erdogan, or even his daughter, who ” hunted them (the Kurds) down in the mountains while they hid in caves smothering the babies to keep silent.” Blinken, Nuland and Sullivan may be a despicable bunch, but that doesn’t mean they are personally responsible for the various genocides of the Native American peoples. The British carried out the Amritsar massacre, but that doesn’t make Sunak responsible, in fact his family are much more likely to have been on the receiving end of that particular atrocity.
It is less about personalities than the interests of extreme wealth which these cyphers serve. Some of these concentrations of extreme wealth have been around for 100’s of years. When slaves were freed in Haiti in 1800 the government had to pay reparations to French slave-holders and their descendants. The debt took 100 years to repay and modern scholarship suggests Haiti’s chance as a viable polity was doomed by this debt.
Genocide, slavery and warfare were immensely profitable for private interests in the 19th century and the concentrations of extreme wealth generated by these activities remain untamed to this day and unlike Haiti, have never paid reparations. Until this issue is addressed I think it fair to say genocide on the Plains was done by America and mass murder at Amritsar was done by Britain. If either of these two polities engage in or support behaviour that resembles their colonial crimes, a pattern begins to emerge of the same methodology of domination, mass murder and genocide which typifies that shameful period.
We see Israel display the same colonial mindset in Gaza today – no compromise, just slaughter. Settlers using the madness to step up their terror in the West Bank and steal more land. This Settler violence is typical of colonial settlers in the past. With the Settlers we see how colonialism operated at the personal level. “Do what I say or your dead and I will steal your land whatever.”. The clearest example of how deeply anti-human colonialism was, and is.
Yes I wanted to make a similar point about how exactly land rights and human rights intersect. As to Erdoğan, this is a piece from last year by a research assistant at a US institute
https://dckurd.org/2022/01/25/how-will-erdogan-treat-the-kurds-going-forward/
“The Turkish launched military campaigns in these Kurdish majority towns following Erdoğan’s unilateral withdrawal from negotiations between the Turkish state and the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK). Initially, experts believed that Erdoğan was renewing the conflict in order to solidify the AKP’s position before elections. Turkish military operations and the PKK’s response led to dozens of Kurdish areas becoming bloody battlefields. Among these regions is the historic district of Sur in Amed (Diyarbakir), a World Heritage Site with over a thousand years of history, that was destroyed by Turkish military attacks. Sur was home to most well preserved and oldest historic buildings dating all the way back to 350AD, though many of these historic sites have been destroyed or damaged in the conflict along and thousands of civilians being displaced. In total, hundreds of thousands of civilians have been displaced because of the revived conflict between the Turkish state and the PKK, with nearly 150 civilians killed by Turkish artillery and airstrikes. IMC TV, a Kurdish media outlet, was shut down…
The crackdown on Kurds is not limited to Turkey’s domestic politics, even though it is the core component of Erdoğan’s political agenda
…
To date, the Turkish armed forces have constructed at least 40 military and intelligence bases across northern Iraq to expand military operations in the region and with this Turkey has created an 8-mile wide militarized zone in Iraqi Kurdistan. Several Kurdish villages in Iraq have been evacuated because of indiscriminate Turkish airstrikes. The Turkish military is using scorched earth tactics including the looting and destruction of valuable agricultural land and woodlands in order to further disrupt the economic, political, and social lives of the Kurds in Iraqi Kurdistan. Thousands of Kurdish civilians have been uprooted by Turkish military operations, leaving entire valleys empty of Iraqi or Kurdish civilians. Turkish forces are not allowing Kurdish civilians to return to their villages, a move that hints at full and long lasting Turkish occupation. The Turkish occupation of both Syria and Iraq is part of Erdoğan’s wider goal of ethnically cleansing the region by emptying the lands east of the Euphrates of Kurds, Christians, and other minorities.
So you say Türkiye is behaving like Israel, yet this thread is about the _____ in Gaza.
Ethnic cleansing is one of the many crimes of Israel; chief amongst the many is the ongoing genocide in Gaza. It is a sad day to wish Türkiye’s ethnic cleansing could replace Israel’s genocide.
Military sources in Israel according to Ynet, put the number of dead Palestinians at 20,000 human beings – over a third of these are children.
Welcome to Israel – where child-killing is the business of the state. This could hardly be said of Türkiye could it?
I am generalizing now but Sunak, Braverman also have indian heritage, India is one of the most anti-islam/islamophobic nations on earth, that could also affect their view, judgement on Gaza. For example Narendra Modi, the president of India was involved in the killing of perhaps up to 2000 muslims in 2009 anti-muslim violence.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_Muslims_in_independent_India#2002_Gujarat_riots
Hindu anti-Muslim bigotry is also why Nikki Haley and Tulsi Gabbard are such fanatical Zionists. India is one of the only nations in the global South where there is widespread support for Israel. It is based on a specific hatred of Muslims. (Rather than brown people which accounts for Israel’s widespread support in Europe.)
Oh wow I had no idea that Tulsi was a fanatical pro-israeli shill, so much for her anti-war views past years – it did not mean anything in the end.
“Oh wow I had no idea that Tulsi was a fanatical pro-israeli shill, ”
Is she?
Mother a practising Hindoo. I had no idea, so useful information with which to categorise her with ‘Nikki’ into the ulterior motive section.
Bayard
Yes evidently, just google her stance on Israel and you will see that she is shill for Israel.
The majority of USA and UK politicians are shills for Israel (including Bernie and RFK Jr). That is precisely why the Israelis are able to murder and ethnically cleanse the Palestinians. And why are they shills – money – the politicians will betray their country, their people and probably their granny for their thirty pieces of silver.
” just google her stance on Israel and you will see that she is shill for Israel.”
Well, I have googled it and it appears that she has consistently opposed Islamic terrorism, including the ones funded by the USA. Yes, she supported Israel at the start of the current conflict, but if you think that makes her a “shill for Israel”, then grow up. The Times of Israel, ran the following headline in 2019, “Democrat Gabbard, who slammed Israel for live fire use in Gaza, to run in 2020” That doesn’t sound like shilling to me.
Bayard
Then you need to google a bit more, she have defend Israel through and through past years:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Tulsi_Gabbard#Israel
Look, I thought she was great too but seeing her position on Palestine she is as clueless and warmongering as any other american politicians. Thus, a shill.
“Thus a shill”
Just try looking up what a shill is. Supporting something is not the same as shilling for it. Are you suggesting she is paid to hold the positions she does? There are probably millions of people in the world who, wrongly in my opinion, support the state of Israel. Only a tiny minority of them will be doing so as a source of income.
@Casual Observer
“Mother a practising Hindoo.”
Does that make Tulsi a practicing Hindu?
“Does that make Tulsi a practicing Hindu?”
Does it even make her a Hindu in the eyes of the Hindus and is every child of a Hindu mother automatically “a fanatical pro-Israel shill”?
The chain of causality is being stretched very thin and very long here, it seems.
@ bayard
“The chain of causality is being stretched very thin and very long here, it seems.”
Not for the first and I suspect not for the last time. Unfortunately.
Bayard
Forget the mother. If you were genuinely interested you would have discovered within seconds that Tulsi is a longtime Islamophobe Hindu Nationalist and pro-Israel shill. It is not an earth shattering revelation of autumn 2023.
Joel
Where exactly would Bayard have discovered that? Please share.
I’m not sure where Gabbard is at on this issue, but she has accused democrats who call what Israel is doing in Gaza genocide
of being very hypocritical.
“Gabbard added that left-wing Democrats in Congress who accuse Israel of genocide are displaying “the height of hypocrisy.” She pointed out that many Democrats are supporters of Hamas terrorists who are actually calling for a “genocide” and the “extermination of all Jews.”
She added that the antisemitism could be seen in the massive mobs that have taken to the streets in the weeks after Hamas’ attacks on Israel. She continued that the left is “doing this under the guise” of trying to stand up for a purported oppressed people. However, the left is “apologizing” for the “barbaric” acts of Hamas.”
https://dailycaller.com/2023/10/31/kamala-tulsi-gabbard-israel-hamas-war/
like Pears above, she assumes that people who oppose the genocide support Hamas in everything it does.
“I’m not sure where Gabbard is at on this issue, ”
It appears that she is very much against radical Islam (not all Islam, as some would have us believe). That puts her against Hamas, so, if you are one of those people who believes that neutrality is not possible, that put her on the side of Israel. The propaganda and bullshit is not confined to one side in this particular conflict, much though some people seem to think it is.
Jack
Re Tulsi’s antiwar credentials: she is a *commander* in a PSYOP division of the US Army.
Joel
Again, please share your sources with the rest of us.
joel, why am I not suprised
A couple of weeks ago I was Very Happy to hear George Galloway saying he may no longer be an avid Unionist.
And now he tells us Craig will be on his Show at 7pm tomorrow…well maybe not exactly at 7pm.
And the great Voice of Norman Finkelstein will be on the show too… Don’t miss it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGPNlk_Ghv0
Thanks Brianfujisan, I missed George Galloway saying this. I have heard him for a long time supporting the Union – it always made me aware that for as much as I share similar political philosophy with him, I found his stance on the Union baffling – only able to explain it in relation to potential left wing majorities at Westminster. I probably vaguely shared his position on the Union until about a decade ago, when funnily enough I started reading this blog. The change was slow and imperceptible but was related to how I viewed the British State. I think an independent Scotland would give impetus to English political reform which is long overdue.
“There is no future In England’s dreaming”
God Save the Queen, Sex Pistols
“The enemies of Israel are NOT our enemies” said Nelson Mandela, if only he were alive today to barter a ceasefire on Gaza.
Watch the great man speak on the matter of Palestine/Israel with a ethnically mixed audience including Jewish folk.
Its only eleven minutes long.
https://nitter.net/ajplus/status/1720595005717500345#m
I don’t know where this vile woman Braverman gets her info from, but as far as I’m aware the stop the slaughter demo will be held in London on the Saturday and not on Armistice Sunday.
“I agree with the Prime Minister. It is entirely unacceptable to desecrate Armistice Day with a hate march through London. If it goes ahead there is an obvious risk of serious public disorder”
https://nitter.net/SuellaBraverman/status/1720469853520183565#m
Braverman isn’t so quick off the mark to criticise the murder of 4,000 Palestinian children by the Zionists killers.
We must take into account that her husband is a proud Zionist.
“The Jewish community is our community,” she said. “My husband is a proud Jew and Zionist.”
https://www.thejc.com/news/politics/police-must-understand-that-jews-do-count-says-braverman-4Q7armNPfrgXcW2P2VIv65
It would be interesting to know whether Ms Braverman meant “My husband is a proud Jew and a proud Zionist” or whether she meant “My husband is a proud Jew and a Zionist”.
But, as I’ve remarked before, I doubt whether Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) Jewish affiliations determine their public political stances. At best, they merely add a little to much more weighty causes and reasons.
One of the weighty reasons is that they have been bribed financially. Starmer’s leadership campaign was bankrolled by Israel lobby money. Not sure what weighty causes they are serving in facilitating unending mass murder of infants. A Holocaust?
“causes” in the sense of “reasons”, not in the sense of “missions” or “aims”.
Aguirre
What does it matter: he’s still a Zionist.
” I doubt whether Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) Jewish affiliations determine their public political stances.”
Pft…
Poppycock.
https://www.declassifieduk.org/two-fifths-of-keir-starmers-cabinet-have-been-funded-by-pro-israel-lobbyists/
The Tories don’t fair much better, Sir Kid Starver (Starmer) is utterly influenced by the Zionists his party Labour are about to receive $6 million dollars from the Israeli lobbyer Gary Lubner.
https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/asa-winstanley/labours-new-bankroller-israel-lobbyist-south-african-apartheid-profiteer
Back to the Tories and Sunak, who daren’t call for a ceasefire on murdering Palestinian women and children.
https://www.declassifieduk.org/sunak-takes-british-support-for-israel-to-new-extreme/
On top of the above Sunak’s wife part owns Infosys, which has business interests in Israel, and it employs “Ex” Unit 8200 employees.
Do you recall the alerts to smart phones (Sunday 23rd 2023 @ 3pm.) less than a year ago? Well the contract to organise that was given to Fujitsu, by the then UK government (Sunak was PM then) it was subsequently awarded it to, you guessed it, Infosys.
For your information the majority of politician are in politics for self-advancement in one form or another, its human nature.
“” I doubt whether Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) Jewish affiliations determine their public political stances.”
Pft…
Poppycock.”
Why poppycock?
In that case, what do you think determines Suella Braverman’s public stance on the war?
Do you really believe it’s because she’s married to a Jew who happens to be a Zionist?
If so, how do you account for the fact that there are lots of supporters (or at least, supporters in public) of Israel and Zionism in both the Cabinet and the Shadow Cabinet who are neither Jewish nor married to Jews?
Casting the net a little wider, how – conversely – do you account for the fact that Noam Chomsky, who is both a Jew and married to a Jew, is an anti-Zionist? How do you account for the fact that Professor Avi Schlaim, who is Jewish, is also an anti-Zionist?
“” I doubt whether Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) Jewish affiliations determine their public political stances.”
Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) public political stances determine their “Jewish” affiliations. The zionist antisemites are stooges of American Caesar who finds it expedient to pretend that he has to do what the zionist antisemites want, when what they want is a C19th robber baron state that is not constrained from doing to citizens what it does to colonial underlings. Ask Gove, the Gauleiter of gauche.
Squeeth
I’m having a problem following you – perhaps some other readers might know what you’re on about, but damned if I do.
But I’m sure there’s a point or two lurking in your undergrowth. Could you be a dear and try to rephrase more clearly?
“In that case, what do you think determines Suella Braverman’s public stance on the war?
Do you really believe it’s because she’s married to a Jew who happens to be a Zionist?”
First point: it’s no secret that both Labour and the Tories are greatly influenced by Israel, and not just because they (Israelis/Zionists) donate huge swathes of cash to both parties, many dis-untied kingdom politicians who are not Zionists/Israeli-born or even Jewish have visited Israel – some going on to kiss the Wailing Wall, a sign of allegiance to Israel if you ask me.
The above is a reason on top of Braverman supporting her Zionist husband because he is pro-Israel.
“Casting the net a little wider, how – conversely – do you account for the fact that Noam Chomsky, who is both a Jew and married to a Jew, is an anti-Zionist? How do you account for the fact that Professor Avi Schlaim, who is Jewish, is also an anti-Zionist?”
Simple: there are many, many good Jewish people in and outside of Israel who want peace between Israeli’s and Palestinians. I’d even go as far as to say some of them are ex-IDF such as Miko Peled.
Here Mr Peled doesn’t pull his punches and comes down on the side of the Palestinians. It’s worth a watch.
https://www.aljazeera.com/program/the-bottom-line/2023/11/3/should-palestinians-israelis-live-equally-in-one-state
“But, as I’ve remarked before, I doubt whether Braverman’s (or for that matter Starmer’s) Jewish affiliations determine their public political stances. ”
In which case, why did she say what she did? Do you think she is too thick to realise that she sounds like she is merely doing what her husband tells her?
Can anyone give me the source of the 40/1 Palestinian to Israeli deaths :I’ve done a bit of research but come up with various figures, I need this information to counter the bias on a certain website.
As usual the pro isreali crowd are trying to portray the Palestinian supporters as terrorist sympathizers.
. Obviously this information has to be… I m tempted to say kosher… But you know what I mean.. Otherwise I will be shot down in flames.
I don’t have any evidence of the death ratio, but I did see a video of Satanyahu justifying his genocide by quoting some religious text.
This one of the problems if the perpetrators are using rules written by people with double figure IQs. I suspect those who support the killing spree have similar low intelligence levels as well. I wouldn’t worry about being shot down in flames by those supporting returning civilisation to the Stone Age.
There are pretty reliable UN sources on Palestinian deaths. The figures for Israeli deaths don’t really stand up to scrutiny. A figure of 1400 has been bandied around, but Haaretz could only put names to 800 of those and about half of them were IDF. There’s a lot of claims coming out of Israel now that many of those 400 civilians were actually killed by the IDF on a “shoot first and ask questions afterwards” basis. It is also possible that there has been a deal of double counting where bodies burned beyond recognition were counted both as dastardly Hamas fighters killed by the brave IDF and Israeli civilians tortured to death by dastardly Hamas fighters, which would go towards explaining some of the missing 600 names.
Why stop there? Surely Hamas only crossed the border to say hallo to their Israeli neighbours and to ask if they needed any help with the housework or the garden and were happily distributing toys and sweets to the children until the IDF arrived and over-reacted.
“Why stop there?”
Well, these concepts may be alien to you, but there are things like “truth”, “probability”, “logic” and “not looking a complete idiot” that would suggest that stopping there might be a good idea, as your comment proves.
Pears Morgaine
You left out the 75 years of history; the displacement of a people and oppression, that preceded Oct 7th. Ever since the Nakba.
Easy mistake to make, I guess. [sarcasm]
The ‘poor little Israel, what have we ever done to them? narrative, didn’t wash with the UN Secretary General either.
Fail to see how 75 years of oppression justified the killing of innocents which is not going to help the situation. It’s only going to make matters worse.
Neither does it explain the marked tendency to try to talk down the Hamas atrocities whilst amplifying those committed by Israel.
P:“Neither does it explain the marked tendency to try to talk down the Hamas atrocities whilst amplifying those committed by Israel. “
Who’s doing this? Examples, please.
“Neither does it explain the marked tendency to try to talk down the Hamas atrocities whilst amplifying those committed by Israel.”
What Hamas atrocities are these, the ones you saw in the Daily Mail, like the beheaded babies? (Before you go off on one of your flights of absurdity, I am only asking for a source that doesn’t emanate from the Israeli government.)
good point about the double counting. typical of the lies emanating from official Israeli sources.
[ Mod: Sorry, RoS, if you want to draw attention to a news story, either post it in the special thread in the discussion forum – !! BREAKING NEWS !! (Gaza) – or blend it into an ongoing conversation, explaining its relevance, and give a reasoned opinion about it; don’t just announce it and post a link. ]
—
Okay Mod will do.
A powerful letter, clearly showing how we got to this situation and setting out steps that could be taken to end this injustice.
Meanwhile, the genocide supporting UK government ensures that even the most trivial examples of supporting palestine is punished:
“Two British women have been charged with terrorism offenses for carrying posters showing Hamas militants paragliding at a pro-Palestine demonstration, the Crown Prosecution Service announced on Friday. ”
https://www.rt.com/news/586596-uk-women-terrorism-hamas-paragliders/
Yet, supporters of the mad dog zionists can openly support Israels genocide, like ‘I hope your side wins’ Sunak.
The UK really is a fascist, police state.
Stretching credulity to suggest such a trivial thing amounted to a terrorism offence. When the legislation was being debated concerns were raised in the HoC about misuse and assurances were given that these powers would only be used in the most serious cases.
Being offensive btw, is legal, at least for the time being. Look at all the politicians who rushed to defend Charlie Hebdo’s right to publish offensive cartoons. Now France wants to ban criticism of Zionism. https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231103-french-senators-propose-bill-to-ban-criticism-of-zionism/
Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité?
It gets worse…
Revealed: plan to brand anyone ‘undermining’ UK as extremist.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/nov/04/plans-to-redefine-extremism-would-include-undermining-uk-values
The documents state: “Extremism is the promotion or advancement of any ideology which aims to overturn or undermine the UK’s system of parliamentary democracy, its institutions and values.”
Basically thought crime. Interpreted too strictly (likely) criticising the monarchy or unelected House of Lords may become a crime.
It’s the brainchild of Michael Gove, a man who admitted his fondness for the purest, whitest Bolivian marching power. Must have had a real nose full when he came up with this crap.
I used to think we had regressed 200 years, to the corrupt start of the nineteenth century, but now it looks like we have gone another 200 years back again.
Labour are even worse, if that’s possible. Starmer’s reactionary centrist mob were angry when the Online Safety Bill, (now Act) was changed. Initially, it was going to criminalise speech online that was perfectly legal offline. How absurd would that have been?
The shadow Home Secretary ,Yvette Cooper, wants police to compile lists(Stasi-like much ?) of those who express views that “fall below the line of criminality’ (no conviction possible) but nonetheless someone could find upsetting. In other words, strongly held and expressed opinions in online debates etc.
One of the principles of natural justice, is that the law should be clear and easily intelligible. Not at the discretion of officials.
We really need a written constitution and our own First Amendment in the UK.
What democracy?
The promoters of such a bill should be arrested under their own legislation.
Wait a minute. This is a very carefully worded quotation, that Goose has posted.
“The documents state: ‘Extremism is the promotion or advancement of any ideology which aims to overturn or undermine the UK’s system of parliamentary democracy, its institutions and values.'”
Taken literally, this means that promotion of any alternative to FPTP (the UK’s system of parliamentary democracy) would be counted as extremist.
So, watch out all you PR enthusiasts. Promoting that kind of ‘ideology’ will probably see you doing many years in the slammer for attempting to overturn the UK’s system of parliamentary democracy.
These are sinister developments indeed (mentioned by you and even more so by Goose, above).
But, to be fair, I think one has to read “system of parliamentary democracy” as a whole, in which the words “system of” are in fact superfluous. An example of usual UK legalese, where one never uses one word when two or more will do.
Yes, the Electoral Reform Society better watch out, too.
I guess most people on this blog are extremists then, including our host.
Well tell you what. Fuck the ” UK’s system of parliamentary democracy, its institutions and values”.
I am Spartacus.
Stevie Boy, I have a pair of trousers and shoes as worn by Hamas, Is that Chief of police and absolute gobshite Mark [I am going to be cruel to Palestinian protesters] Rowley going to arrest me?
Richard Tice was on GB News this morning fraudulently ranting and raving about the ‘pro Hamas’ demonstrators and claiming that on yesterday’s demo in London people were chanting ‘Death to the Jews’, and gave the impression that everyone was chanting it. And the presenter interviewing’ him – ie Ann Diamond – just let it pass, and did so knowing that it was a big malevolent falsehood and smear, because, needless to say, if it had happened it would have been a top news story all over the MSM. Including GB News!
And not only is Tice inciting hostility towards the protesters, but like Braverman and Rachael Riley (on Newsnight the Tuesday before last), and no doubt others, their Goebbels-type lies will undoubtedly be causing concern and worry in the Jewish population. And THAT tells you all you need to know about how much they care about Jews, and their fellow Jews. Surely, on the one hand, it’s antisemitic to cause concern and consternation amongst the Jewish community with lies and falsehoods, and slanderous to demonise a large section of people on the other. One thing is for sure, it’s pure, unadulterated evil, as they themselves are of course!
Anyway, I came across this Goebbels-type article in the Express from a couple of days ago when I did a search re Richard Tice:
‘Deport foreign nationals who violate Remembrance with pro-Palestine marches, demands Tice’
Mr Tice has joined calls for the army to be deployed on the streets of London to protect the commemorations and deal with any protesters trying to demonstrate over the weekend.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1831321/deport-foreign-nationals-pro-palestine-marches-richard-tice?utm_source=mynewsassistant.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=embedded_search_item_desktop
And needless to say, apart from anything else, the purpose/goal of the demonisation is to marginalise and isolate the protesters.
Braverman double down too, why are she so hostile for considering the protests have been very peaceful?
UK home secretary threatens pro-Palestine protesters with jail time
“If anyone were to vandalize the Cenotaph, they must be put into a jail cell faster than their feet can touch the ground,” Braverman told Sky News on Saturday.
She promised that the authorities “won’t hesitate to act” if police need reinforcements to deal with “utterly odious” conduct during rallies.
https://swentr.site/news/586600-uk-secretary-warns-palestine-protesters/
Have anyone even threatened to vandalize the Cenotaph?
No Jack, of course they haven’t, and it’s all been conjured up out of thin air to demonise the protesters. And needless to say, the MSM is playing along with it. I just did a search, and the following is from an LBC article:
There are fears the march could disrupt the two-minute silence commemorating the war dead, and the daytime and evening Festival of Remembrance at the Royal Albert Hall, with the latter performance usually attended by members of the royal family.
Braverman said Armistice Day should be treated with the “solemnity with which it deserves”.
Asked what action should be taken if the Cenotaph were to be targeted, she told Sky: “Armistice Day is a day that is of profound national significance in Britain, it represents our moment of collective mourning and remembrance and reverence.
“And it must be treated with the solemnity with which it deserves.
“If anyone were to vandalise the Cenotaph, they must be put into a jail cell faster than their feet can touch the ground.”
Braverman added that any decision to ban pro-Palestine marches on Armistice Day would have to be assessed by police before an application to her is made.
“It has got to be based on their assessment and their belief that there is a risk of serious disorder,” she said.
“What we’ve seen in the last few weeks is tens of thousands of people taking to the streets of Britain chanting jihad, calling for the erasure of Israel and behaving in many instances in a flagrantly antisemitic manner.
“To me, those are incredibly offensive and it is utterly odious behaviour.”
Needless to say, Braverman is lying through her nasty, rotten teeth when she says that ‘”What we’ve seen in the last few weeks is tens of thousands of people taking to the streets of Britain chanting jihad, calling for the erasure of Israel and behaving in many instances in a flagrantly antisemitic manner…..”
And just in case anyone didn’t read the Express article I linked to a bit earlier, it finishes by saying the following:
The demonstrations by thousands of hard left activists and Muslims who have been seen waving Jihadi flags and wearing symbols glorifying the mass slaughter by Hamas terrorists in Israel on October 7 have caused concerns that the police have lost control of the streets.
The strange thing is that the police, left to their own devices, might be greater defenders of the right to protest and to demonstrate than the likes of the Home Secretary, sundry ministers and Mr Richard Tice.
The latter are the real authoritarians, not the police.
Yes, I know what you mean, but the police can’t very well start arresting people for no reason when there’s so many people about. According to the media (this from the Evening Standard):
Police made 29 arrests at a pro-Palestinian rally in central London on Saturday as sit-in demonstrations brought Oxford Circus and Charing Cross to a standstill.
In an update at 10pm on Saturday, Scotland Yard said that a total of 29 people were arrested for inciting racial hatred, other racially motivated crimes, violence and assaulting a police officer over the course of the protests.
Police used facial recognition technology to identify and arrest a man suspected of making anti-Semitic comments during a speech.
Two people were arrested after they were allegedly seen holding a placard that showed support for a a terrorist organisation, the Met said. Nine people were held for public order offences, including two that were racially aggravated.
In another video highlighted to the Met on X, formerly known as Twitter, what appear to be pro-Palestinian supporters can be heard chanting: “Smash the Zionist settler state.”
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-palestine-protest-three-arrests-trafalgar-square-b1118201.html
It’s not impossible of course that some of them were undercover police, or agent provocateurs. I mean why would any genuine protesters not only do things that would get them arrested and charged, but also do things that will be highlighted by the media and, of course, reflect badly on the protesters in general. And especially in view of all the smears being churned out by the likes of Braverman and the MSM about the protests/protesters.
A textbook case of Genocide Backed be the West in particular Starmer and Biden.
For months Neocons like Mitt Romney and Lindsey Graham have been parroting the phrase best money we have ever spent Russians are dying and no Americans are dying, these people are sick. Joe Biden lGenocide Joe] has this new talking point on US aid to Ukraine.
We send Ukraine equipment sitting in our stockpiles. And when we use the money allocated by Congress, we use it to replenish our own stores, our own stockpiles, with new equipment. Equipment that defends America and is made in America. Patriot missiles for air defense batteries, made in Arizona. Artillery shells manufactured in 12 states across the country, in Pennsylvania, Ohio, Texas. And so much more.
With this new talking point, the Biden administration is echoing Senator Mitch McConnell, who has for months been saying that the war in Ukraine is an excellent deal because American companies get paid, the Russian regime is weakened, and only Ukrainians have to die..
Just as an aside to my previous comment and how sick these people are speaking to major Israeli funder Haim Saban said…. NANCY PELOSI: “If this capital crumbled to the ground, the one thing that would remain is our commitment to our aid–and I don’t even call it aid–our cooperation with Israel. That’s fundamental to who we are”.
PAUL JAY: If the capital, meaning Washington, DC, crumbled to the ground, we would still support Israel. It’s so fundamental to who we are. She’s, I hope, speaking for the Democratic Party there.
Vijay Prashad in conversation with Craig Mokhiber (please ignore the intro music)
30 min.
https://scheerpost.com/2023/11/05/craig-mokhiber-on-uns-failures-in-palestine-and-why-he-quit/
recommended (I like Mokhiber´s hoodie, I have the same one, what makes me, obviously, a hero too. Gosh its so easy to become one…)
These are the people Starmer and Biden support.
‘Israel Today’ newspaper said today, Sunday, that Israeli Heritage Minister Amichai Eliyahu suggested dropping a nuclear bomb on the Gaza Strip would be one of the options to be considered.
“We must recognize what scares them enough to force them to flee, as death does not frighten them. Thus, we must search for ways to horrify and eliminate them,” the Israeli minister said.
“I disagree with those who refer to Gaza Palestinians as civilians. In Gaza, there are no civilians, and there is no difference between them and Hamas,” Eliyahu added.
Referring to the Israeli captives taken by Hamas and other Palestinian factions throughout Operation Al-Aqsa Flood, the Zionist minister said, “The lives of Israeli captives and detainees are no more valuable than the lives of soldiers, and we must recognize that warfare entails human losses.”
Yifat Biton, a Knesset member, reacted to the aforementioned comments, saying that “through his statement, a stupid minister is destroying ‘Israeli’ propaganda efforts around the world. The only way to reply is to dismiss him immediately.” https://english.almanar.com.lb/1963865
“‘Israel Today’ newspaper said today, Sunday, that Israeli Heritage Minister Amichai Eliyahu suggested dropping a nuclear bomb on the Gaza Strip would be one of the options to be considered.”
Some people prefer not to think before opening their fascist war-porn gobs. Wouldn’t dropping a nuclear bomb on Gaza result in another one being dropped on Tel Aviv? And so on, until the whole region becomes unfit for human habitation for centuries.
Not quite what Israel is after, I believe.
And another thing… Why have we not seen any evidence of cholera or dysentry (and every other disease we are told will follow in any area left without decent sanitation, and with many hundreds of dead bodies rotting in the rubble) spreading through Gaza City? Presumably, the IDF troops will have had vaccinations, but it seems a very strange policy to go piling into a large urban area in armoured vehicles, where vermin and disease ought to be rife.
The comment is probably a ruse to scare the Palestinian leadership and/or suggest that Netanyahu is a moderate by comparison. The fact it has been so widely publicised suggests it is.
” Why have we not seen any evidence of cholera or dysentry (and every other disease we are told will follow in any area left without decent sanitation”
What evidence would you like to see? If anyone died of cholera, how could you tell they had, they’d just be another dead body under a sheet? Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
When I did a search a bit earlier re Richard Tice and, as such, came across the Express article I linked to, I came across tie following article on their website from October 16th:
‘Is nothing sacred?’ Fury as Cenotaph is ‘desecrated’ by anti-Israel protest
Tory MPs have demanded that Pro-Palestinian protests are banned after one was set up in the last few hours next to the Cenotaph in Whitehall.
As if anyone could set up a ‘platfom’ (or would set up a platform, or think to set up a platform) next to the Cenotaph without the police noticing them doing so. I think we can safely assume it was erected by minions of the dark forces so as to discredit the hundreds of thousands of protesters, and I can only assume that the idea to ‘fear protesters were going to vandalise the Cenotaph’ led on from that.
And if no-one allowed it to be erected and gave permission for it to be erected, as becomes evident later in the article, then why on earth would it be saying:
Tory MPs have reacted with fury after a pro-Palestinian protest was allowed to be set up next to the Cenotaph commenorating the war dead in Whitehall.
And then saying: “One MP described the protest as “a desecration” of “a sacred site” and there have been demands to have it removed” when it already HAS been removed, as it says further on in the article. It’s illogical of course.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1824049/cenotaph-palestinian-protest-mps-fury-israel
I can only assume it was erected in the early hours of Monday morning AND that there are more than a few CCTV cameras in the vicinity, and given the size of the platform, obviously a large-ish vehicle would have been involved.
NB I’ve just spotted that the article was posted at 17:56, Sun, Oct 15 and UPDATED: 09:45, Mon, Oct 16, and given that it says in the article that the platform was erected ‘in the last few hours’, then it was supposedly erected in broad daylight on the Sunday afternoon. As if!!
Not to mention liberal use of the “pro-Palestinian = anti-Israel” lie, the idea that you can at the same time support Israel but be against what its government are doing being a bit too complex for the rag.