I just sat through a recording of the Trump/Harris debate. Ignoring the merits of their political stances, I agree with the general consensus that Kamala Harris “won” in performance terms, but only because Trump was awful.
Both were of course terrible on Palestine. While I appreciate that that is of most interest to perhaps a majority of my readers, and that it is a key issue for a significant slice of US voters, it is not what this post is about. I am considering more broadly the prospects for who becomes US President.
Trump’s ability to make a coherent argument appears to have deserted him and he was easily sidetracked by Harris into irrelevant quibbles, notably on rally attendances.
While Harris said nothing even vaguely impressive herself, and was wide open to attack on her own record, Trump did not seem sufficiently in command of the logic of debate effectively to counterpunch.
I suspect that the debate will have done very little to affect public support, because Trump’s attack messages on immigration will motivate his followers regardless, and he kept banging then out.
But I wanted to focus in on the shameless bias of the moderators in favour of Harris. The framing of questions to each candidate was far more hostile towards Trump. Let me take the first four questions asked, two to each candidate:
David Muir to Trump:
“Mr President, I do want to drill down on something you both brought up. The Vice President brought up your tariffs, you responded, and let’s drill down on this. Because your plan, it is what she calls, it is essentially, a national sales tax. Your proposal calls for tariffs, as you pointed out here, on foreign imports across the board. You recently said that you might double your plan imposing tariffs of 20% on goods coming into this country. As you know many economists say that with tariffs at that level, costs are then passed on to the consumer. Vice President Harris has said it will mean higher prices on gas, food, clothing, medication, arguing it will cost the typical family nearly 4,000 dollars a year. Do you believe Americans can afford higher prices because of tariffs.”
Note what is happening here. Muir twice quotes Harris and validates her assertion that a tariff is a sales tax: “it is what she calls, it is essentially, a national sales tax”. He then quotes Harris again on it costing American families $4,000 a year. His question then to Trump is not framed as whether he agrees with Harris’s assertion, but the much more loaded question of “Do you believe Americans can afford higher prices?”
I am in general inclined towards free trade myself, but a tariff is not simply a sales tax, and the $4,000 a year claim is utter nonsense.
The average US household spends only about 11% of its consumption on imported goods. That equates to about $8,000 worth of imported goods per household per year.
Even if Trump were to slap a 20% tariff on all imported goods – which is not his plan – and even if all those goods currently enjoyed zero tariff – which is certainly not the case – and even if there were no import substitution and the entire cost was passed on to the consumer – neither of which would be the case, it plainly is not remotely possible that a 20% tariff on part of $8,000 of spending could cost $4,000.
But whereas various nonsenses spouted by Trump were “fact-checked” by the moderators, Harris’s completely clueless propaganda was endorsed and reinforced.
Trump however ought to have been able to counter by talking of the purpose of promoting domestic production and encouraging domestic industry and agriculture. His inability to do so – and indeed to counterpunch with logical refutation on anything – made this deeply unsatisfying watching.
Lindsey David to Trump
“I want to turn to the issue of abortion. President Trump you have often touted that you were able to kill Roe v Wade last year. You said that you were proud to be the most pro-life President in American history. Then last month you said that your administration would be great for women and their reproductive rights. In your home state of Florida you surprised many with regard to your six-week abortion ban because you initially said that it was too short and said (quote) “I am going to be voting that we need more than six weeks”. But then the very next day you reversed course and said that you would vote to support the six-week ban. Vice President Harris says that women should not trust you on the issue of abortion because you have changed your position so many times. Therefore why should they trust you?”
Note the aggression in the phrasing of this question, and the use of the negative connotation verb “touting” in the setup. Also throwing in of amplifier phrases… “the very next day”.
Now contrast the tone with the superficially “combative” questions to challenge Harris
David Muir to Harris:
“We are going to turn now to immigration and border security. We know it’s an issue to Republicans, Democrats, voters across the board in this country. Vice President Harris, you were tasked by President Biden with getting to the root causes of migration from Central America. We know that illegal border crossings reached a high in the Biden administration. This past June President Biden passed tough new asylum restrictions. We know the numbers since then have dropped significantly. But my question to you tonight is why did the administration wait until six months before the election to act, and would you have done anything differently from President Biden on this?”
This is fascinating because plainly the intention is to appear to be tackling Harris, while the entire framing of the question is slanted to favour her. The characterisation of Harris’s role is precisely the framing of her campaign team: she was not in charge of border control or immigrant policy, but rather of tackling “the root causes” of immigration. This is exactly how Harris wants it put, but not really true.
Furthermore the problem is presented as essentially solved, again an extremely dubious proposition, and the question is basically – why did it take you so long?
After a couple of exchanges between the candidates Muir leapt in to interject and reinforce a point already made by Kamala Harris:
David Muir:
“President Trump on that point I am going to invite your response”
Trump:
“Well I would like to respond”
David Muir:
“Let me just ask though, why did you try to kill that bill, and successfully do so, that would have put thousands of extra agents on the border?
Let us then look at the framing of another “challenging” question to Harris:
Lindsey David to Harris:
Vice President Harris, in your last run for President you said you wanted to ban fracking, now you don’t. You wanted mandatory buyback programmes for assault weapons, now your campaign says you don’t. You supported decriminalising border crossings, now you are taking a harder line. I know you say that your values have not changed, so then why have so many of your policy positions changed?
Note how, with both questions to Harris, the answer is provided within the question. The immigration question was presented as solved and the flip flop question as reflecting consistent values. Harris did grab on to the proffered lifeline and banged on about her values as a “middle class kid”, and all the hard luck cases she claimed to have been inspired to help.
On Palestine, naturally both vied to present themselves as the staunchest supporters of Israel. Kamala Harris did genuflect towards protection of Palestinian civilians and the Palestinian right of self-determination, but this was so obviously a token gesture from Israel’s chief armers and funders as to not need further comment.
All in all, extremely dispiriting. Harris came over as an entirely unprincipled political operator who will adopt whatever positions serve her career, but is rather more intellectually competent than previously expected. Trump came over as a loose cannon which nobody has loaded.
As with Starmer, there is no doubt that Harris is the Deep State shoo-in candidate, and the priming of the debate in her favour is hardly unexpected. It does require an effort of textual analysis to pin it down, and I hope I have given you a start on that.
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Jonathan Cook shining a light as per usual on the darkness and deceit and deception:
How the war on Gaza exposed Israeli and western fascism (MEE, Sept 13)
The ultimate effect of the latest media furore is to increase pressure on the BBC to make even larger concessions to the self-serving, right-wing political agenda of the billionaire-owned media and the corporate interests of the war machine it represents.
The state broadcaster’s job is to set limits on allowable thought for the British public – not on the right, where that role falls to papers such as the Mail and the Telegraph, but on the other side of the political spectrum, on what is misleadingly referred to as “the left”.
The BBC’s task is to define what is acceptable speech and action – meaning acceptable to the British establishment – by those seeking to challenge its domestic and foreign policy.
Twice in living memory, progressive left-wing opposition leaders have emerged: Michael Foot in the early 1980s, and Jeremy Corbyn in the late 2010s. On both occasions, the media have united as one to vilify them.
That should surprise no one. Making the BBC a whipping boy – denouncing it as “left-wing” – is a form of permanent gaslighting designed both to make Britain’s extreme right-wing media seem centrist, and to normalise the drive to push the BBC ever further rightwards….
https://www.jonathan-cook.net/2024-09-13/war-gaza-israel-western-fascism/
I saw that. Jonathan doesn’t even mention the influence of Sir Robbie Gibb, BBC Board member and owner of the ultra pro-genocide Jewish Chronicle.
Sir Robbie was identified by a fellow zionist, Emily Maitliss, as the single most influential individual in deciding what gets aired on BBC News and how it’s framed. (It was meant by Maitliss at the time as a complaint: a Remainer furious about the influence of a Tory Brexiteer over BBC coverage).
Whether BBC news editors even need their strings pulled by Gibb on Gaza is another matter. There is no doubt they would have been cleaving to the uniparty LFI-CFI (Likud) position in any event.
It’s unlikely their apologist coverage of the genocide will slow down the precipitous collapse in public trust in the BBC that has been occurring over the past two decades.
Brits Have Fallen Out of Love With the BBC.
Just 38% of voters trust the corporation to tell the truth.
https://novaramedia.com/2023/08/02/brits-have-fallen-out-of-love-with-the-bbc/
“Brits now want the licence fee scrapped, and trust in the BBC to report the truth has plunged dramatically. What’s more, this decline shows no sign of slowing down.
Back at the turn of the millennium, trust in the BBC was extraordinarily high. In 2003, eight in ten Brits trusted BBC journalists to tell the truth. In the two decades since, however, things have changed dramatically. Just 38% of voters told YouGov in July 2023 that they trust the BBC to tell the truth – a decline of 43pts since 2003.”
That timing roughly coincides with the advent of broadband internet connections and the widespread availability of alternative views and news sources on the internets. The BBC has always been so but people didn’t have widely available access to other sources to help them figure it out. Hence the panic to control the flow of narrative on the internet and social media now.
When I grew up it was near the border in Ireland. As a consequence of being near the border we were able to access the UK TV channels because the signals didn’t just stop at the border. The BBC bias in reporting on Irish and N.Irish affairs was widely acknowledged to be hugely biased but we had the luxury of being able to see both the BBC reports and those of the Irish state broadcaster as they reported on the same stories day to day .
Good observation yes, that’s almost certainly why: it has lost monopoly control over the national mind.
It hasn’t helped either that those two decades have seen ardent BBC support for war and austerity. (Others would also say mass immigration). God willing, its support for genocide will be the final nail.
Yes indeed.
I’ve never thought as the State Broadcaster as being trustworthy when I grew up.
Very good entertainment even now but the main reason for being a State Broadcaster in any country is to literally control the political narrative as they say.
Pre internet days the phrase of ‘What you don’t know can’t hurt you’ was practiced.
So the MSM were in control not just of what you could see (propaganda) but the more important what we don’t want you to see (lying by omission).
The Internet ended up showing us what they didn’t want us to see.
These are alternative views and narratives – some crazy – some spot on.
The prevailing idea now is to try and prevent us from seeing any further what they don’t want us to see.
The problem for the PTB is that the whole internet show (with a few exceptions) is for advertising and flogging stuff.
Blocking or get rid of X – Youtube – Instagram and so on will lower the ad spend and lower the punters buying habits.
The richest billionaires in the world generally got rich via this selling system so if many of them are Rulers of the World they will not be best pleased.
Ironically the only way to make sure that there is only one narrative would be to nationalise the Internet.
Yet, even in heavily censored countries there are always young people who can find ways round these things so that will work for a period but not for long.
Basically they appear powerful but are stupid when they think they can stop all this at the stroke of a pen. They can’t, not without closing the Internet down completely.
Then again, as we can see with this war business it won’t stop them from trying.
Frankywiggles
The main news service channel: BBC News 24, and a single radio channel should be free-to-air and funded by the govt as a public information service. But everything else should go to a subscription model; it’s the one policy I agreed with the Tories on, and quite why Johnson didn’t expedite the phase out of the licence fee, with a faster timescale, I don’t know?
Of course. out-of-touch Labour have recommitted to the TV licence fee and it’s set to rise. £169.50 per year for something you barely view is no joke, and it’s a regressive expense, insomuch as finding that money alongside essential mobile phone costs and broadband. hits the poorest hardest. MPs don’t inhabit the same world as the rest of us, with their overly generous expenses.
Labour are also moving forward with the Tories’ infantilising ‘Online Safety Act’ – I’ll wager now it’ll be hideously unpopular if Ofcom try to overreach and over censor, under political pressure from nanny-state advocates.
It’s “public information” is just ruling-class narratives. You can be certain the BBC will be right at the fore in the next few years in the push to complete NHS privatisation under Starmer. It is the most insidious media actor of them all imo and needs to be disappeared altogether for the public good.
Frankywiggles
It is, I was thinking more in terms of preserving it for important public announcements, as the other commercial news providers are dependent on ad revenues, and therefore could, in theory, go bankrupt. You’d need at least one government TV news channel and a radio station to convey information, such as in a war or pandemic. Many old people aren’t online, and there are rural areas with no internet services. Otherwise, I’d agree with you.
Well I, for one, don’t trust yougov franky. Remember the episode on BBC Question Time with Diane Abbott in January 2019? There were several polls conducted at the time that put Labour two or three points ahead, but yougov, as per usual, was totally out of kilter with other polls and had the Tories five points ahead. And THAT’s the one that Isabel Oakeshott cited and ridiculed Diane, as such, and then Fiona Bruce joined in the fun and games. And it’s rather odd that the yougov poll was conducted on the 13th and 14th of January, but not published until a few days later, on the day Diane was appearing on Question Time. Anyway, in the video in this Independent article the false and phoney attack by Oakshott starts at 20seconds:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/media/tv-radio/question-time-diane-abbott-bbc-audience-fiona-bruce-video-polls-corbyn-labour-a8735036.html
Funny, isn’t it, that both Oakshott AND Bruce only had the yougov poll in mind!
And here are the poll results for 2019:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2019_United_Kingdom_general_election
If we’re going with that logic you’ll need several other polls showing great public trust in the BBC.
Foreign reporting is controlled by the Foreign Office and always has been. Not one British newspaper will even interview a representative of the main resistance organisation in Gaza, namely the IRM, which is always and without exception referred to by its Arabic acronym ending in a sibilant.
As for the BBC (and the NHS, state schools, the Church of England, subsidised housing, etc.) getting slammed as leftwing, this goes down like nectar in the minds of millions of demented reactionaries in the middle classes who think they do all the work but they don’t get enough recognition or security, while all the time the state dares to impose taxes on them and to distribute their money to hordes of unwashed proles who don’t deserve medical treatment, education, or any kind of respect, because all they are is lazy good for nothings who don’t mind living in filth and who copulate like rabbits. Welcome to Britain.
Fuck the BBC
Cancel your tax – don’t watch it. Don’t watch any live tv.
Fuck the neoliberal press – and specially the fake ‘woke’ Obsessive Guardian, the long time voice of fascist Zionism and slavery in the U.K.
If you are still still reading, watching and believing such gaslighting because you think that they are not ‘right wing’ – you are a sucker and you have sold your kids futures just so you can feel smug about how ‘lefty’ you are! Moron.
Hypocrites. You’ll die covered in faeces in some poor peoples home, forgotten by any of your forsaken grandkids.
No more debates – Trump
Kamala Harris blew her chance when she shot down opportunities with Fox News and NBC, the former president has said
https://swentr.site/news/603981-trump-no-more-debates-harris/
Quite ridiculous move by Trump, he was naive enough to accept go on the pro-Kamala company of ABC to debate her without any follow up on a rather more pro-Trump network like FOX.
A few sites have reported on this today, including Skwawkbox and Socialist Worker:
Justice for Kwabena Devonish campaign rallies outside court
Anti-racist campaigner Kwabena Devonish is being prosecuted under terrorism laws
Supporters of Kwabena Devonish rallied outside the Old Bailey court in central London on Friday to demand the state back off from criminalising activists.
The British state is prosecuting Kwabena, an anti-racist activist from Cardiff in South Wales, under terrorism charges for “inviting support” for a proscribed organisation.
A crowd rallied outside the Old Bailey, where Kwabena entered a “not guilty” plea ahead of a full trial next year…
The prosecution of Kwabena is just one element of a vicious assault overseen by Starmer’s government against Palestine activists.
The co-founder of Palestine Action Richard Barnard is facing three charges for two speeches. He’s accused of supporting a proscribed organisation under the Terrorism Act and encouraging “criminal activity”.
https://socialistworker.co.uk/news/justice-for-kwabena-devonish-campaign-rallies-outside-court/
The supposed offence related to a speech Devonish made at an anti-genocide protest last November in Cardiff.
Seems to have been a busy day regards supporters of the Palestinians, one way or the other:
Woman acquitted over ‘coconut’ protest placard
Marieha Hussain found not guilty of racially aggravated public order offence
A district judge has found teacher Marieha Hussain not guilty of committing a ‘racially aggravated public order offence’ after she held up a sign showing Tory pro-Israel politicians Rishi Sunak and Suella Braverman as coconuts during an anti-genocide march in central London. Hussain charged after being photographed with the placard in November.
Hussain told the court today that the sign was “not meant to be offensive” but was instead an example of political commentary and satire:
There was no hate speech. It was a satirical placard. It was funny. It was comic. There were no words on it in reference to ‘speech’. I did not alter the images of the Home Secretary and Prime Minister. [Calling it] hate-speech is far-fetched in my opinion.
https://skwawkbox.org/2024/09/13/woman-acquitted-over-coconut-protest-placard/
How could they convict given the fact there’s a BBC comedy show called ‘Coconut’. It features an Asian man who’s “a tweed-wearing, hard Brexit-supporting ‘gentleman and star host of Pak Nation TV.” He’s a fan of Katie Hopkins. The premise of the show being: he may be brown on the outside, but he’s white (in his political views) on the inside.
Which all goes to make the message in Marieha Hussain’s clever placard much easier to decipher.
Oh My Gawd, here’s another related one:
Met told court in trial of Marieha Hussain that it is letting right-wing troll accounts that created ‘Labour antisemitism’ smear guide its policing and prosecutions
The Met’s ‘senior media and communications manager, Chris Humphreys, told the court yesterday that the force had used the ‘social commentary’ of ‘Harry’s Place’ and other anonymous right-wing accounts to inform its targeting of pro-Palestine protesters:
Images come to our attention when the Met’s own social media account has been tagged. Other ways images come to our attention is when accounts that frequently post protest-related images appear that warrant a potential investigation, or when images posted get a ‘significant response’ with a significant number of views.
https://skwawkbox.org/2024/09/13/cops-using-notorious-anonymous-pro-israel-accounts-for-evidence-against-anti-genocide-marchers/
A costly series of failed prosecutions brings any law into disrepute – a complete review is clearly needed.
If we had a genuine Labour govt; that is – a govt committed to defending civil liberties – there’d no doubt be one. Alas. we’ve got reactionary authoritarian in Starmer, a man who seems to revel in draconian sentencing for first time, non-violent offenders.
I followed the link and also went to the Substack site, and I’m still none the wiser as to what Kwabena Devonish is alleged to have done that the state is saying was criminal. Which proscribed organisation? What alleged action by her supposedly constituted an invitation of support for it?
Tip for those writing encouragements of support: put that information in the first paragraph. That should be taught in How to Support Those Who are Under State Judicial Heat 101.
Yes, I noticed that Brian, but I think we can safely assume it was Hamas, given that she said whatever she said at an anti-genocide protest (last November in Cardiff).
@Allan – Apologies for sounding too narky. Kudos to the support campaign. Comments were meant as constructive criticism only.
I say this as someone who may well soon be in a similar position to hers. I was raided by the police and believe that the reason they took certain material may have been Palestine-related but at the moment can’t be sure. I wonder how many others have had the British state wielded against them to give them the message that boils down to STFU about the genocide.
[ MOD: Caught in spam-filter ]
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“The Russian leader delivered an explicit message Thursday night to Ukraine’s Western partners, warning them against letting Kyiv use donated long-range missiles to strike deep into Russia.”
https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-on-putins-war-threat-yawn/
That’s a lie. Or at least none of the three foreign services has stated that an official diplomatic communication was delivered.
But at least Politico get the translation right:
” ‘This will mean that NATO countries, the United States, and European countries are fighting Russia,’ he said.”
You’re in a bubble. In America, if anything, being tough on Hamas and supporting Israel is what will get you votes. Palestine supporters are an **insignificant** slice of US voters.
Moreover, ABC is not deep state, it’s a private broadcaster and in the US it’s allowed any biases they want to have.
no, it’s you that is in a bubble and in a dark place psychologically. polling shows a majority of Democrat voters think the US is presiding over a genocide. bought politicians haven’t been able to convince them that evil is good.
But only a third of Americans do. Anyway the question by itself is meaningless. I’m sure the Nazis thought that what they were doing was also genocide.
Support for Israel’s war correlates strongly with age. So, were previous generations genetically more evil or just fed different propaganda? In other words: indoctrinate the young sufficiently well and their consciences won’t be pricked by what’s going on either. Surely, though, good can see evil – however it’s masked?
Polling shows that the vast majority of Americans don’t consider Gaza an important election issue.
“Moreover, ABC is not deep state, it’s a private broadcaster and in the US it’s allowed any biases they want to have.”
Jan.
ABC news – has or has had, interesting staff – such as Tapper – Pannell and Meek.
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/ABC_News
Jan
I’ve not spotted a Left Wing Private Broadcaster though on Mainstream television.
PBS used to be the ‘ alternative’
Sesame Street being the most successful program.
tells me a lot that and I liked the show by the way and now the Real Muppets are in
charge it’s put me right off.
Back to the Daily Mail with you.
@Jan – “being tough on Hamas and supporting Israel is what will get you votes”.
Yeah because it will get you financial backing for your campaign.
As for “tough on Hamas” or “not tough on Hamas”, that whole discourse assumes a pro-Israeli premise.
Many millions in the US abhor the ongoing genocide. That doesn’t mean they’ll get a chance to vote for a major candidate who does too, nor even if they did that they’d view the issue as sufficiently important, relative to other issues in their lives, as to determine which way they’d vote.
^ ^ These are the realities.
British regime media is upgrading its description of Putin’s statement. It’s now calling it a “nuclear threat”, which apparently brave Biden and steely Starmer are “uniting” against. I’m not joking. And this is in the Independent, not the Daily Express or Daily Star:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukraine-starmer-biden-putin-zelensky-missiles-b2612407.html
Will we soon hear that the Kiev government is “defending itself” by launching Franco-British made cruise missiles against e.g. Rostov-on-Don, on the okay from the USA?
What I am surprised at is that (at least as far as I’m aware) not one of the weapons shipments from NATO countries has been hit by Russian arms shortly after crossing the Ukrainian border.
Brian Red
You say that “(at least as far as I’m aware) not one of the weapons shipments from NATO countries has been hit by Russian arms shortly after crossing the Ukrainian border”.
Given that Russia has been bombarding Ukraine since 2022 at least, perhaps the explanation is that Russia doesn’t have the capacity to track shipments by satellite.
It certainly isn’t evidence of heroic restraint from the Putin regime.
I dunno. With the amount of weapons poured into Ukraine by the collective West since 2014, I would have thought Russia should have retreated well beyond their 2014 borders by now leaving Ukraine to permanently occupy the border areas such as Kursk and Belgorod to prevent any further invasion.
Funny that you get reports and pictures of all these massive explosions and fires at random supermarkets and warehouses as well as military training facilities like Poltava.
Clearly pot luck on the part of the Russians.
JK redux
September 14, 2024 at 11:46
“Given that Russia has been bombarding Ukraine since 2022 at least, perhaps the explanation is that Russia doesn’t have the capacity to track shipments by satellite.
It certainly isn’t evidence of heroic restraint from the Putin regime.”
Russia currently has the most technologically advanced military in the world. It is now combat tested and as such represents the most powerful military on earth. It is using only 25% of its standing forces in Ukraine and its kill ratio is 10:1 against ukraine (Ukraine has lost 500,000 KIA with a further 500,000 WIA).
If Russia wanted to target shipments, it could. There are reasons why Russia does not go “all out” (like the West does), not least of which is that Russians and Ukrainians are Slavs, and many Ukrainians do not support Zelensky’s Nazi government. Russia see no need to punish those.
Brian Red.
In a sense Brian – isn’t Nato already using long range missiles to attack RF territory – being that the Donbas is now part of the RF, though with a degree of autonomy – just a thought.
The Inderelictependent used to be the only paper worth reading but that was twenty years ago.
August, harvest’s song.
Ten months of Genocide-
And the Proms went on.
Has anyone come across a usable, official transcript of the entire debate? If so, please share. That would be a logical start point for any serious qualitative analysis. All I can find are partial versions on various US news sites and the formatting doesn’t lend itself easily to investigation.
I believe this transcript is complete
READ: Harris-Trump presidential debate transcript
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/harris-trump-presidential-debate-transcript/story?id=113560542
It’s still listed as partial, unfortunately. This was one of the first I came across as well.
I was mistaken; this did get updated. Thank you!
The choice is a known murderer, of the Iranian general who was attempting to make peace with neighbouring nations, or a mass murderer! But let’s look on the bright side, Starmer has been chosen to set English men on a path to a war on one or the other of these degenerates orders! But as usual, we the Scottish sons or/and daughters will be fed in first! Remember St Vallery! Somme, Waterloo…… our privilege to enrich the soil of many nations for many generations! When will we learn! But 4000 are allowed to freeze to death this year! According to government statistics!
The question is, would Labour/Starmer be so quick to side with the US on Israel if Trump were the one ruling now? Would Starmer be so callous to stand with Trump, smiling, shaking hand declaring their ironclad support for the israeli atrocities? How could Starmer claim to be against racism in his own nation while support a racist genocidal regime and their prime enabler – the US?
Starmer is a zionist, fact. As such, he would stand with anyone and anything to support the zionist cause and it’s genocide. The man has no morals or ethics, he is a scumbag, fascist, fifth columnist.
While people in the UK suffer poverty he will happily spray our tax monies at his murderous pals.
When Trump was way ahead against Biden earlier in the summer Lammy went to the States and to tell Republicans he was a “conservative”. These clowns will be with Washington and Israel no matter what. The idea that Starmer could claim to be anti-racist is already ridiculous. It was he who said Israel has the right to starve Gazans of water and power, and that their slaughter is “self defence”. He also completely blanked the Forde Report, that he commissioned, which exposed deep anti-Black racism and Islamophobia on the Labour Right.
The general who trusted in the word of those who claimed a meeting on neutral territory(?) might be safe, was forgetting that the agreement between Putin and Netanyahu specifically protects the sovereign territory of Iran and Israel, each from the other, but that proxy wars or incidents outside the national borders do not breach this agreement. Pax, barleys, (parlers fr.) etc are not covered by the agreement and so anyone outside either country is a valid target for the other. Iran just wants peace and safety for its citizens, and its soldiers in other countries proxy wars are told that if they don’t keep the enemy at bay outside their borders the war may come to them at home. Israel is pushing this to the absolute limit and Putin has kept that line in place since Kissinger first brokered the agreement. The meeting between Middle East countries currently meeting in Turkey may produce a peace plan, or something else.
It’s interesting that most contributors here are agreeing, at least tacitly, that the debate WAS rigged. This forum is not exactly the Republicans Abroad. If this is the case here, then I suspect the independent voters in the US, the ones who’ll swing this thing one way or the other, are either breaking for Trump, or at the very least, still in play and out there to be won or lost. Trump squeaked in along a very narrow path to victory in 2016 against a highly intelligent and very experienced candidate. Clinton lost because she was arrogant and entitled, and people don’t like that. Harris is as crooked as Clinton, every bit as entitled, but she’s also just plain stupid, to boot. She is where she is because Biden declared of his running mate back in 2020, “she’ll be black.” It literally could have been Beyoncé if she’d been on the podium when he chose. I’m not at all sure they’ll like her any better than they did Clinton.
I’m quite surprised that Pope Francis has spoken out – usually the Vatican knows what side its bread is buttered on – and just makes token statements on peace.
For me there is no “lesser evil” between Harris and Trump.
“US Presidential candidates Donald Trump and Kamala Harris are both “against life,” and Catholic voters should choose the “lesser evil,” Pope Francis told reporters on Friday.
Speaking to reporters while returning to Rome from Singapore, the pontiff said that “not voting is ugly,” and that the faithful “must vote.”
“You must choose the lesser evil,” he elaborated. “Who is the lesser evil? That lady, or that gentleman? I don’t know. Whether it is the one who is chasing away migrants, or the one that kills children, both are against life.””
https://www.rt.com/news/603999-pope-trump-harris-abortion/
Someone should tell him the faithful can salve their consciences by voting for the anti-genocide Jill Stein.
But all American politicians have to be approved by AIPAC, particularly Jews, so I wouldn’t hold your breath.
Pope Francis can’t tell his followers to vote for Jill Stein. The power of the Catholic Church in the US depends on good relations with both of the two major parties that constitute the duopoly. Jill Stein’s Green Party is not part of that duopoly.
This lapsed Catholic retains enough of the moral teachings of Catholicism that I cannot vote for a candidate that supports genocide. So I am voting for Jill Stein.
If salving your conscience means putting Trump back in office, go for it. Personally, I would do the pragmatic thing rather than flatter my own sense of purity.
Purity? You are bragging about supporting genocidal, ecocidal scum.
Nope. I’m talking about (not ‘supporting’, note) choosing the least worst candidate – since that’s the only real choice you have. Of course, you can stick fingers in your ears and go “Lalalalalalalallalala” instead and either not vote at all or vote for someone with no chance (which amounts to the same thing).
In the US’s First-Past-the-Post system, no vote for an alternative can possibly help a type-R upper-wing duopolist beat a type-D upper-wing duopolist . . . or a type-D beat a type-R, for that matter.
And even with more and more billions of dollars in ads (and “earned” media time) assaulting voters every election “season” here, it’s still been over a decade since more of us identified with either Rs or Ds than with neither:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/15370/party-affiliation.aspx
And personally, I think refusing to support genocide — and to ignore the fact that the only way to win Global Thermonuclear War is not to play — *IS* being pragmatic.
Explain the ‘pragmatism’ in voting for someone without a chance in hell – if you know what the word actually means. You might as well write in “Mickey Mouse” – every bit as ‘pragmatic’.
Classic “seamless garment” thinking. For non-Catholics, that’s intersectionality in a Roman collar.
As Glenn Greenwald reports, the US is sailing very close to a return to full-blown McCarthyism. Tweeting this(below) before his recent System Update show:
A black socialist group is acquitted on being Russian agents for opposing Ukraine war, but convicted on a conspiracy charge.
US seeks to ban RT worldwide.
There have been recent revelations in the US that TV channel Russia Today, or its associates, monitor social media output to filter prospective guests, presumably(?) to make sure their views align, or take a more objective/ sympathetic view towards Russia and its arguments. I’m truly shocked I tell you, not! Virtually all Western media have the same establishment-friendly, on-message faces, who pop up time and time again to do political commentary and newspaper reviews. How many times has Isabel Oakeshott been on BBC 1’s Question Time, compared to say, George Galloway or even Craig Murray? It’s hard to see why this guest selection bias, is even a story, as RT are hardly going to invite people on, who are irrational Russophobes, or those who just hate Putin’s guts, are they? Their state funding isn’t a secret.
As everyone here will know, this is also standard practice across the entire Anglosphere. In the US: Fox News and MSNBC, ABC and CNN’s political left or right agenda is obvious with as little as five minutes viewing time. The guests’ and presenters’ views clearly align with channel owner’s own. In the UK, we have Sky News and the BBC, the BBC’s Newsnight guests are invariably hand-picked right-wingers, pushing a hardline Neocon agenda if foreign policy is being discussed. Last night, discussing the war in Ukraine ,they had a woman on from the McCain Institute, urging we play Russian roulette with our Storm Shadows, because she was “totally convinced’ Putin is bluffing. The World Service is also heavily propagandized.
Don’t get me wrong, I wish all news media was truly impartial and carried a plurality of views and perspectives. But let’s get real.
Anyone who questions these things, need only ask themself one question: How many times have they heard arguments for a negotiated ceasefire and from those against arming Ukraine, on the BBC , Sky News, ITV news; Channel 4 News , Channel Five News, GB News….?
And you’re pretending we have an impartial, free press?
The media has also maintained scrupulous silence on Britain’s outsized role in the Gaza genocide.
Matt Kennard discussed the complicity of the British media on the latest Electronic Intifada live cast.
https://x.com/i/broadcasts/1RDGlyOEBOEJL
(Discussion of Britain’s role starts from the 1:05:00 mark).
Andrew Neil reports Starmer has left Washington empty handed, after going to Washington to seek approval for Ukraine to use Storm Shadow missiles to hit targets in Russian territory.
The fact that Biden, a man widely viewed as having spent his long political career advocating for militarism and known for his hawkishness, has to rein in a British Labour Prime Minister, is absolutely nuts.
Starmer’s whole leadership pitch, remember, was that of being a leftist dovish ‘peace maker’ : A Prevention of Military Intervention Act and a promise to make the UK a ‘force for international peace and justice’ were among his many pledges. Instead, we’ve got some reckless hawk, who’s already playing ‘fast and loose’ with the risks of provoking a nuclear response, This comes on top of his numbness and indifference about the slaughter in Gaza, as if that wasn’t bad enough already.
Very striking that it took Blair six years in power before he went over the top for the illegal Iraq invasion. But in the case of Starmer it’s only 10 weeks before he’s going to war..
Laguerre
Someone on X suggested, this is why Sunak went to the polls way earlier than necessary, and, as we learn today, he was under no threat of a leadership challenge (Brady had only received 10 letters) :https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/14/graham-brady-kingmaker-extract-rishi-sunak/ i.e. he knew what was coming.
I assumed the post on X was an attempt at humour, but now with Starmer’s madness, I’m not so sure.
The fundamental fact is that Starmer is extremely stupid. There are a number of things he’s said that demonstrate that: especially showing that he doesn’t look more than a week or two ahead. The most recent was his declaring, on the eve of an entirely predicted landslide, that the UK wouldn’t rejoin the EU in his lifetime. Really? Was he, Trump like, declaring he’d be PM for life? Has he thought that, unless economic reality is suspended for a little country that’s wrecked its trade links, standing on a Rejoin platform in 28/29 will be Labour’s only chance of avoiding a crushing comparable to what just hit the Tories? And all that for what? He didn’t need to say anything.
Laguerre,
You of all peeps should know of the perfidious Blairites and their zio masters as they destroyed the EU ideals and accelerated wars around the globe.
Blair was best mates with Bush Snr CIA owned hoodlums the Clinton’s.
He bombed 5 countries in as many years and held Bush jnrs hand ( becoming his bestie too – Yo! Blair ) in launching the current centuries wars neocon wars.
Which universe do you live in where Bambi is some peacenik?
Lest we forget – the bombing of Iraq in 1998, Kosovo in 1999, Sierra Leone in 2000, Afghanistan in 2001, and Iraq again in 2003 – and lord knows how many guerrilla and special ops and mercenary operations around the world.
Herr Starmztrooper was put into cover for the Blairite war times, be a next plank of the DC CIA/MI6 global neocon party to carry out the never ending wars including against Russia and China.
It was delayed by the surprise victory of JC and that’s why he has hit the ground running to catch up on the warmaking and imposing huge austerity and distraction upon the population as a diversion from that never ending Blairite mass murder including the Holocaust of the Palestinians with the fully owned and complicit mass media.
I didn’t want to say anything about this debate till I had actually gone through it, and I was put off viewing it because I find Trump’s continual and brazen lying repellent. But, encouraged by commentators after the event who picked out highlights, I finally did. Having done so, to be honest I think that others have seen (and described) much better than I how Kamala successfully repeatedly baited Trump and wound him up. Particularly pointing out that people would get bored and abandon his rallies. His descents into lunacy (like accusations of immigrants stealing and eating pet animals) may well have won Kamala another set of fresh converts who have had enough of Trump, like Dick Cheney, of all people. Taylor Swift’s endorsement after the debate was most welcome.
After the debate Trump went out and told media effectively ‘It was great, I’m the greatest’. But his unwillingness to have another debate with Kamala reveals the reality. One flattening was enough for him. I hope he will get the ones that really matter in court, and at the ballot box in November.
It’s easy to forget that Kamala’s performance (including her economic proposals, for example) was not directed towards foreign readers, e.g. of this blog. It was for her fellow citizens of the US, whose country it is, and they will have to decide whether to allow a dangerous candidate to rule without any safeguards, which could cost the whole world, or instead vote for someone whom I think is truly a leader, truly Presidential, and I wish her all the best!
“they will have to decide whether to allow a dangerous candidate to rule without any safeguards”.
Is it not Trump who is saying he will stop the war in Ukraine compared to his opponent who belongs to the party that is currently crying wolf on Putin to unleash his nuclear armoury on us benighted citizens of the collective West?
Trump will pander to dictator Putin by selling Ukraine down the river, and NATO thereafter. That is why he must never be allowed near the White House again.
As for nuclear weapons, everyone knows that they are only useful as a deterrent, since a hot war would be suicidal. I’m content to leave it to the generals to best advise democratically elected leaders on how to deploy them. Ukraine should be given the tools they need to drive out the invader.
Слава Україні!
Trump may be too Putin friendly, but conversely, the so-called ‘sensible’ politicians in the West are too Russia/China hostile and antagonistic.
Demanding nothing less than an absolute victory for Ukraine i.e. the return of the1991 borders, is just as unrealistic and indeed irresponsible as any imaginable Trump capitulation. Ideally, Ukraine would be split into two separate countries. The EU, US and UK were completely in the wrong imho, in backing the undemocratic overthrow of a leader who was elected free and fairly. When western-backed forces in Kyiv overthrew Viktor Yanukovych they lost large parts of the East. They too should grow up and own that fact.
Yanukovych was responsible for selling his country out, and when his betrayed people rose up they didn’t need much Western help to do it. I’m glad that the West seems ready to give Ukraine the necessary tools for self defense and to drive back the invader. As for being realistic, I will be happy if, as in Afghanistan, the Russians have finally had enough and pull out of all Ukrainian territory, as recognised in the UN or EU.
Responding to your later comment
“Yanukovych was responsible for selling his country out, and when his betrayed people rose up they didn’t need much Western help to do it. I’m glad that the West seems ready to give Ukraine the necessary tools for self defense and to drive back the invader. As for being realistic, I will be happy if, as in Afghanistan, the Russians have finally had enough and pull out of all Ukrainian territory, as recognised in the UN or EU.”
Absolute bollox. Yanukovych chose the better deal for Ukraine, as the EU demanded privatising and selling off public services, Russia did not. The people did not rise up, a load of Nazis did, supported by the West, of course. NATO destroyed Ukraine – Russia will keep its part, the West can have the wasteland it created.
M.J.
There’s no getting away from the central fact, that a legitimate, democratically elected leader was overthrown in a coup.
You can talk about how he was corrupt, how he was influenced – aren’t all Ukraine’s recent leaders? But if we uphold any democratic values at all, such things should never be acceptable. I can’t stand Blair, Cameron; Sunak or Starmer, but I wouldn’t have welcomed a coup as the means by which to resolve public dissatisfaction. Look at the US, and the Democrats’ hysterical reaction to the January 6th Capitol riot.
The fact the appointed Ursula von der Leyen dresses up what happened with Maidan as ‘A Revolution of Dignity’ just goes to show how far through the looking glass we are. Isn’t the truth this: had there been no Euromaidan uprising and subsequent coup, fanned by outsiders, Ukraine would still be a whole; united entity. including Crimea. Think about that and tell me the current situation is a superior outcome.
Kamala Harris promised in that debate – with enormous relish – that she would have the foreign policy of Dick Cheney, the Middle East policy of AIPAC and the climate policy of ExxonMobil. she vowed war, genocide and record drilling.
and that is your reaction.
Kamala’s not President-Elect yet, and we need to remember this. I see her, not vowing to continue genocide but trying to stop it. Likewise environmental destruction, at least in principle.
Not just my reaction to the debate but my sustained outlook is that Trump would be far worse.
” I see her, not vowing to continue genocide but trying to stop it”
M.J.
I can’t even use the the excuse that you are naive – so what does that leave?
Harris is a puppet – nothing more.
“Then came the “ironclad” pledge of eternal support for Israel, justified in this case by the Oct. 7 Hamas raid: “And let me be clear. And let me be clear. I will always stand up for Israel’s right to defend itself, and I will always ensure Israel has the ability to defend itself…”
Key to Harris’ brief discussion of Gaza in her acceptance speech was the customary refusal in American political discourse to attribute the slaughter to the U.S. or its Israeli partner. Instead, there was a reference to “what has happened” — evoking victims without victimizers — in this way:”
https://consortiumnews.com/2024/08/28/liberal-zionists-cheer-as-harris-coddles-genocidal-israel/
good man. you’ve created a little make believe world.
Hi Craig,
Thank you. I’ve watched most of this (except for the afterwords). Word salad from K, usual T stuff from T. So sad. Reminded me of the Hunger Games politico presenter. Pity T is not any sort of intellectual, so many open goals. Oh for a debate where anyone could address the audience as a sentient human being, their neighbour. And these are the options for the leadership of “The Free World” and “Our Democracy” (sic). Maybe Vance is better (seems to be).
BTW I disagree with you on many issues except for the most important: Liberty and the right to disagree. God Bless.
I’ll tell you what.
It’s a good job we have The X-Men – The Fantastic Four and Superman saving the world otherwise we would all be in trouble.
I strongly suspect that Biden and even politicians younger than him have been watching too many US saves the World movies.
Starmer is just happy and flattered to meet ‘The Commander in Chief’ and who knows maybe Starmer likes the juvenile effect of Star wars and thinks that this really is battle of Good against Evil.
If he does, then he should never be let near being a PM with such a simplistic and adolescent view.
Ditto Harris or Trump. Their advisers should tell them that all this is not a movie made in Hollywood. It’s very, very real and very, very dangerous.
Four “very”s, which is ominous.
In an open Letter to Kathrin Meyer, Secretary-General of the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (in his latest article), Tony Greenstein sums up the situation (regarding ALL genocide/Israel supporters) in his headline
‘The Only Lesson You Have Drawn From the Holocaust is that Genocide is Fine When Israel Does It’
https://azvsas.blogspot.com/2024/09/open-letter-to-kathrin-meyer-secretary.html
The IHRA Anti-Semitism Definition states that
criticism of Israel similar to that levelled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic
but Israel is not like any other country. What other country has occupied another people’s land for over half a century? What other country has instituted a system of Apartheid and ethnic cleansing? What other country continues to destroy the villages and homes of the people it rules over in order to make way for settlers?
I don’t suppose he’ll be getting a reply/response!
I criticised the apartheid Smith regime and the Apartheid Boer regime, I criticise the zionist antisemite occupation of Palestine, Jim Crow in the US and the ascendancy in nireland. None of this will matter if it is expedient for the zionist proxies who work for American Caesar and his British proconsul. Lucky I retired this year.
It’s about time to spin the wheel of fortune once again. Here we go: Gaza genocide, Scotland independence, Ukraine SMO, Islamophobia, UK freedom-of-speech, global Deep State, zionist propaganda, and the winner is…
NATO threats to world peace !
Keep them running.
‘… and the winner is… NATO threats to world peace !’ Talking of which (I just this minute put this together coincidentally):
Just came across this article on the Council on Foreign Relations website ‘Last updated May 9’ and entitled How Much U.S. Aid Is Going to Ukraine?, in which it says the following:
U.S. and allied leaders consider Russia’s invasion a brutal and illegal war of aggression on NATO’s frontier….
I’ve not heard that one before – ie heard Russia’s invasion of Ukraine phrased in such terms. How ironic and hypocritical is THAT!
https://www.cfr.org/article/how-much-us-aid-going-ukraine
Also came across the following again yesterday via a recent Caitlin Johnstone article (which she posted a link to in an article last year):
Most fascinating thing about the Ukraine war is the sheer number of top strategic thinkers who warned for years that it was coming if we continued down the same path.
https://twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1498491107902062592
Ah, I just clicked on the twitter link and it just takes you to a page which says ‘something went wrong’. Not sure what I can do, and all I know is that the tweet in question was archived…..
I just went back to it and noticed that it says ‘screenshot’.
So I just found the article in which CJ links to it, and the link is in the second paragraph and highlighted – ie ‘so many western analysts and experts’
https://caitlinjohnstone.com.au/2023/09/07/if-everyone-understood-that-the-us-deliberately-provoked-this-war/
“the sheer number of top strategic thinkers who warned for years that it was coming if we continued down the same path.”
None of them could be considered thinkers of the calibre of Starmer and Lammy though.
Wilshire.
On the genocide – Yemeni forces struck the impenetrable – hitting the IOF’s Unit 8200 HQ – it has to be noted that the likes of Meta, Youtube, Google, Wikipedia; and a plethora of VPN companies – all employ ex-Unit 8200 personnel.
I wonder if CM has a more relevant view than my Sunday musing?
I believe that Drumpff has already won and now we are going through some Roman level of ‘changing of the aristocracy’ – the losers who acted against him will pay with their fortunes if not their lives. Zuckerberg and Musk and the shady tech bros making their way to the Donald’s door begging to be let off.
Almost everything about the latest bloody failure to take Kursk and grab some victory from the jaws of defeat smacks of aristo AngloEuropean overreach. And a final gung-ho Charge of the Light Brigade bravado.
So we have two bits of news today. All the ex-tory Foreign Ministers have apparently joined voices for Starmer to allow the use of StormShadows into Russia! Afaik they already been used against the Kerch Bridge so I don’t fully understand why they had to beg for it. Unless…
They need the approval and go ahead from the incoming potus to use the technology needed to commit natzio into a prolongation of the proxy misadventure into the next term.
RF, Lavrov and VVP even went out of his way to make it plains as can be with that tv interview – ‘Don’t even think about it, punks’.
So the answer must have come from The Donald – ‘No you can’t use our satellite tech and natzo specialists to launch the missiles at the RF’
The dumb and dumber Blinken and Lammy rail ride earlier in the week to Kiev was baloney! The further flight of sHerr Starmztrooper to beg from Lameduck Biden the same permissions fell flat on its face.
The begging by Bozo and his circus clowns, just some play acting for the benefit of the banderists nazi proxy mercenaries.
The great knight dope has returned from DC with tail between legs and straight into a ‘controversy’ – a Sunday paper’s titillation of … checks notes … having had some free frocks to wear!??
Lol. I suggest It is the usual – Throwing A Dead Cat On The Table gambit- developed by the Tories PR Aussie fixer some time ago. To divert from that and his actual toffness.
But why that, instead of a real story of out of touch Sir and Lady Labour toffs? He flew back from this failed begging trip to Drumpff to let the aristo martial generals and admirals one more chance at beatin Pootin, and ended up at Doncaster Racecourse with his missus enjoying the St Ledgers – like proper Labour ministers and their working class families do…dontcha know!
https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/uk-news/2024/09/14/keir-starmers-day-at-the-races-after-crunch-white-house-talks/
“Throwing A Dead Cat On The Table gambit”
DunGroanin.
Speaking of dead cats – an assassination attempt by the US and Spain – on the democratically elected president of Venezuela has been thwarted.
An attempt to kill Robert Fico (Slovakia) failed – and Georgian PM – Irakli Kobakhidze – has also had a veiled threat made against him.
Don’t forget the attempt to assassinate Trump, which is looking more and more suspicious.
Very suspicious timing, right before the Republican convention. If they had succeeded in killing him, the deep state would no doubt have made sure that somebody they wanted would have gotten the nomination in place of the dead Trump. As it is now, if they kill him now, he will be replaced by Vance.
Who are “they” that you keep mentioning, just out of interest?
Lysias
MoA has a story up – that says Trump’s now dead assassin – had links to the Azov Battalion.
The Azov Battalion – has changed its name to the 3rd Assault Brigade – to hide what it is.
I speculated in my o/p the US powerbrokers have now long agreed that The Donald was robbed of his second term, even if he didn’t necessarily expect his first!
And is now calling the shots for the next term.
So the attempt is not a surprise and may not be the final one.
All the Lawfare and Russiagate failed; the Maxwell Epstein scam failed; the Dems implicated themselves ;Clinton and Obama guilty of sedition and treason with the attempts to keep him down in the first term and certainly to stop him in the second. The three letter agencies traitors to the State.
And of course the Bidens and Kerry and various Republicans all who have been working to steal Ukraine and balkanise Russia for many many decades… whilst filling their boots from the laundering of public funds forever.
So the factions which are the dysfunctional US system of buying politicians and votes that support Drumpff appeared to have agreed that he would be allowed his fair win.
The Ukraine funding that took so long and required his nod to go through a few months ago, as Cameron confirmed in his spoofing.
Now VVP’s warning was heard by The Donald and his team are not ratcheting up further for the longterm.
No new weapons , no coordinated and natzo flight programmers.
Hence the first attempt and now the second – how many others we don’t know of?
Next time they may be lucky, they only need to suceed once , The Donald has to be lucky every time.
The ancient regime establishment does not want their multigenerational hopes being completely dashed on the rocks they are already on.
I guess the only chance he has of getting through this alive is either to let them have their way or to declare them as deadly internal enemies – requiring ‘clean skin’ patriots to take up arms against their brothers, fathers and yes murderous mothers.
That includes the mummy/daddy ziofascists in all levels of government and military and the tech offshoots of the state and MIC under the global robber bankers – in effect a open civil war – without declaring one.
That plays out as pitched gun battles and bombed buildings in compounds and offices reminiscent of Gangster wars.
Of course he would need a trusted full team of bodyguards for himself and his children.
Also of course, it would spill into Anglo European government departments and establishment too. They too are long under the ziofascist jackboots with their aristo Nazi connections.
Time to clear the stinking nests of the dynastic murdering thieves and free Europe as well as ordinary Americans.
That is the only chance to escape the fate of the defeated, isolated enslaved unipolar in the destroyed Garden , surrounded by barbed wire, to keep us IN !
So that our grandkids may yet live in a prosperous new law based multipolar as equals with the whole of humanity instead of deluded smug woke imperilists lackeys never realising WE are the BAD guys. WE are the Nazis and fascists and Zionazis supporters of genocide daily in The Palestine.
Hey, if Drumpff doesn’t deliver than he too will be part of that problem that WE will have to deal with – after all these weapons are not just available to the ziofascist crazies and one thing is certain THEY are the FEW.
WE are the MANY.
Non Pasaran- Onivar!
Just checked out Jack’s comment (posted a couple of hours ago) in the ‘Ukraine’ thread in the forum in which he links to an RT article, and there was a link to the following RT article:
French officials fear WWIII – Le Monde
Paris is reportedly concerned about the prospects of the Russia-Ukraine conflict escalating into a global war
Members of the French government are concerned about the Ukraine conflict spiraling out of control and are now exercising “great discretion,” Le Monde reported on Saturday, citing diplomatic sources.
Fears of the confrontation escalating into a direct collision between Moscow and the NATO bloc have skyrocketed over the past few days, as the US and its allies reportedly consider authorizing Kiev to conduct strikes deep in Russian territory using Western weaponry.
https://swentr.site/news/604032-france-ukraine-world-war/
Yerse, aren’t we all (apart from the demented psychopaths who think they own the planet!)
You’d think France’s recent elections would’ve changed the calculus, but Macron has moved to freeze out the left and right, and is happy in trying to continue with minority rule via executive decrees; as the French constitution bizarrely permits.
He previously pushed through his hated pension reforms, by controversially using those very powers: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/mar/21/the-guardian-view-on-ruling-by-decree-in-france-deepening-the-trust-deficit
As the piece says, Macron has a reputation as an arrogant technocrat with little regard for social movements or civic sentiment. Many think we’ve got a Macron here, in the form of Starmer.
I guessed that Macron would try to do a deal with Le Pneu and that she would be fool enough to fall for it. She gets responsibility without power and Macron gets votes in the Reichstag, same as the coalition deal after the March 1933 election. Papen said “we’ve bought him!” and nearly go shot in the face for his trouble but Macron has certainly bought Le Pneu.
Why can’t the French left and right join together to vote the impeachment of Macron?
Lysias
Q. Why can’t the French left and right join together to vote the impeachment of Macron?
You need a 2/3rds vote of both houses : the upper house, the Senate (Sénat), and the lower house, the National Assembly (Assemblée nationale).
Lysias
The Left and Right will never get together. De Gaulle designed the Fifth Republic for stability, that’s why Macron won’t be overturned. He’s not entirely undemocratic; he was elected twice, in 2017 and 2022. The government he’s selected is led by a conservative, Michel Barnier, the Brexit man. In terms of competence, he probably couldn’t do better. The candidate put up by the left coalition, Lucie Castets, was completely inexperienced, and inappropriate, but they couldn’t do better. The Barnier government, when it’s announced, will have to go through a vote of approval by the Assemblée Nationale; we’ll see what happens. My impression is that it will pass.
Trump is telling his supporters to vote twice:
https://twitter.com/i/status/1835159071558697357
And Vance is admitting he has made up stories:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2024/09/15/vance_if_i_have_to_create_stories_to_get_media_to_pay_attention_to_the_suffering_of_the_american_people_i_will.html
As World Mental Health Day approaches (10 October), is the Trump campaign about to crash and burn? This could be me being optimistic, but let’s hope the first of the above gets some serious attention from the judiciary, at least in some US states. Lock him up!
could you ever bring yourself to accept that Kamala Harris is a war criminal? or do you set the bar a lot higher than genocide of an entire people in plain sight, for a year?
@Zoot – I’m aware that the US government under Biden and Harris has been assisting the perpetrators of genocide in Gaza.
The Trump campaign isn’t saying that or anything like it.
Nor, as far as I am aware, are they saying that Harris is the de facto president now, which is surely a fairly obvious line they could take, given for example the footage of Biden swapping caps with the Trump supporter recently, when Biden gave the impression that he probably doesn’t know the name of the US capital city most of the time, or whether it’s morning or evening.
Re Julian:
“Julian is slowly recovering. He is doing a lot of physical activities: long bike rides, swimming in the ocean, long walks… So his colour is coming back. It moves me when I see him, in the Australian wilderness, looking at the waves for a long time. Sometimes I find it hard to believe that what I see is real.”
– Stella Assange
‘8th Sep ’24, FattoFest, Rome. (from an article published by Pressenza)
The whole world must know the story of what they did to Julian and WHY! Help us continue to share his story with as many people as possible!’
Please support the project here: https://gofund.me/55f992e2
#TheTrustFall #PardonAssange #Assange #PressFreedom #FreeSpeech #WorldPeace
The TRUST FALL: Julian Assange – Documentary
Virginia Moncada Thanks for your interest. The film will be released digitally worldwide in 2-3 months. We are currently having subtitles done in many languages including Spanish.
“Harris is the Deep State candidate.” ?? You actually said that! Not at all Trumpy language. Deep state is irrevocably associated with conspiracy theorists of the right. Gore Vidal insightfully said, “There is no conspiracy. In my social class everyone thinks alike so there’s no need for one.” … or words very much to that effect.
Not sure you interpreted Vidal correctly. He was saying that business as usual to one person is another person’s “conspiracy theory”. He also said, I’m not a conspiracy theorist, I’m a conspiracy analyst.
Harris is better described as the continuity candidate.
I’d imagine she’s supported by the majority at the CIA, FBI and the armed forces because they’re all about maintaining stability in the US and abroad. The CIA want continuity and predictability, in foreign policy terms – it may be wrongheaded policy – but that’s not their call to make, and they are all in, i.e. committed against currently defined adversaries. It’d be very difficult for them to adjust to say friendlier relations with Russia.
The Republicans have some fairly radical views about changing key aspects of foreign policy, and Trump is seen as highly unpredictable.
The reports of Trump’s second shooting have been highly contradictory. We were told, after 30 minutes, that his exclusive golf club skirted a high crime area! It was simply a dispute between some two possible drug dealers. As if.
Now we are being told that Trump was indeed the target of the shooting and that his would-be assassin ditched a K47 in the bushes before being apprehended. That K47 might prove helpful in spinning the narrative.
“Trump was indeed the target of the shooting”? Has there been an official statement saying Trump was shot at?
Palm Beach sheriff Ric Bradshaw (who is a Democrat) looked scared when he addressed the media. He talks as if he was in charge of finding the person alleged to have been with the rifle. I get it that the Secret Service are supposed to prioritise the security of the principal over and above chasing or identifying anyone (in this case, for example, the guy could have been mounting a distraction), but does it sound believable that they’d leave the hunt up to the sheriff if we assume they didn’t know beforehand that an intending shooter would be there, and that when they found out they didn’t know what sort of operation he had, whether he was part of a team, etc.?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/videos/cvgllpz6wqyo
For comparison, here is Bradshaw speaking six months ago when he doesn’t look so scared:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGJvUYOjWy0
As for the Go Pro…??? Was the intending shooter going to livestream? Or did he think he’d kill Trump, get back to his car, and then upload from his camera in peace and quiet?
According to the sheriff, the SS were protecting hole by hole, with at least one sniper walking one hole ahead. Don’t they have a secure perimeter then? Or is every day Rogue Male day at Palm Beach?
Trump’s golf partner Steve Witkoff is a “mega-donor” to the Trump 2024 campaign apparently. An article about him from way back when:
https://observer.com/1999/12/steve-witkoffs-nine-lives-tough-guys-dont-foldthey-crawl-back-from-the-abyss/
Let’s hope the man who held the rifle is and remains in good health.
“When you are far wrong, people who are correct may appear to be far right.” From X via TCW Letters.
Ah this was the quote which really means that the conspiracies take care of themselves. “I say, they [those at the top] don’t have to conspire, because they all think alike. The president of General Motors and the president of Chase Manhattan Bank really are not going to disagree much on anything, nor would the editor of the New York Times disagree with them. They all tend to think quite alike, otherwise they would not be in those jobs.”
Wealth is the common denominator among the various elites in society. And political systems that have only two easily purchased parties to choose from, make the message in following quote an inevitability.
“Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.”
― Lucy Parsons, Lucy Parsons: Freedom, Equality & Solidarity – Writings & Speeches, 1878-1937
Leftwing writer Peter Dale Scott wrote about deep politics and the deep state before Trump ran for president. (But usage changes. This is just for info.)
Deep State is simply shorthand for what President Eisenhower called the Military-Industrial-Congressional Complex. That is, the fixed powerful interests in DC and its hinterland that are devoted to profiting from endless war.
It could not be any clearer that Harris is their choice or that she wants to be. She is reveling in the fact dozens of Bush-Cheney era NeoCons have endorsed her.
That Trump is regarded by these interests as a threat is further testified to by the identity of his latest would-be assassin: a Ukraine war nut who featured in propaganda videos for Azov.
https://x.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/1835505520108581299
The Azov link is interesting, but those who recruit assassins don’t need to have the same politics as those they recruit, nor to present their true motivation.
Assassins are getting like vaccines these days – don’t work!
Theatre dept. is working double time though.
Exactly. I tried, unsuccessfully, to say so no later than yesterday. And even Elon Musk is X-ing the same thing. Nobody’s trying to assassinate Biden or Kamala. We can confidently assume the next polls will see Trump regaining what he lost in the debate.
In Trump’s case I would say it would be a very dangerous game to do a Mitterand (Avenue de l’Observatoire) and order up a fake assassination attempt, with a high probability of it turning real.
PS Did Routh have any ammo? And what was the ceramic tile all about?
The alleged shooter was a pro-ukrainian fanatic that wished to burn “kremlin to the ground”
Would-be Trump assassin ‘obsessed’ with Ukraine – media
The suspect was allegedly willing to “fight and die” for Kiev and tried to recruit volunteers to join him
https://swentr.site/news/604086-trump-attempted-shooter-ukraine/
The west have become bonkers, a candidate that want to stop escalation between two nuclear powers are considered the threat and facing repeated assassination attempts. Same with Robert Fico which was targeted by a pro-ukrainian individual.
I think Caitlin summed it up perfectly in her headline to this article:
The Debate Was Two Assholes Bragging About What Murderous Empire Sluts They Are
https://caityjohnstone.medium.com/the-debate-was-two-assholes-bragging-about-what-murderous-empire-sluts-they-are-8efbfdca7000
You might also have pointed to the question/accusation put to Trump: was he not for victory for Ukraine? This was clearly at the behest of the Biden/Harris camp which is messaging that it has done everything it possibly could to assist Ukraine (as its alibi for a Ukrainian defeat) as against Trump’s defeatist appeasement. But sadly, over and above that, it didn’t seem to occur to Trump that there can’t be victory against a nuclear superpower without a nuclear war in which nobody wins because everybody dies.
Merely speculation, of course, but I can imagine that Trump might try and get a ceasefire in Ukraine, with the Eastern regions neutral, autonomous territory. But that would greatly anger the military industrial complex. To appease this I can imagine he might say they can sell to Israel, to ‘finish the job’ but then, by then, the Arab nations will have united around a plan to forestall an end to border incursions by Israel and limited retaliations from Hezbollah, and Putin may wash his hands of the agreement which has kept Israel safe from Iran for several decades. This is just speculation, however, and seeing any further ahead looks catastrophic however one moves the pieces on the map.
Starmer often uses the term ‘reset’ and the WEF concept of The Great Reset is a depopulation agenda. The passing of the Euthanasia Bill, the crushing of pension rights for those who have paid in all their working lives, the dismantling of the NHS, and Hedge Funds buying up essential services like insurance and social care agencies and care homes, just intend destitution or death for ‘useless eaters’.
Extreme wealth will not willingly accept greater taxation, and will have the resources to dismantle attempts to disperse their wealth. An understanding of MMT or the magic money tree shows that taxation is not necessary to fund public spending, which is a government responsibility which can be devolved in any way considered best. There is always enough money to give to the arms producers, and some grown up, joined up thinking needs to address international investment and national Defence priorities. Sunak was considering introducing conscription before he just wanted out, and an end to the madness of this escalation of global hostilities.
Whichever way you look at it things do not look promising. Strong countries are pulling their plans together. So Trump or Harris may change where the pieces fall, but pulling back from the brink may not be completely achievable.
Simon
N Vietnam defeated the USA.
Afghanistan (Taliban) defeated the USSR and then the USA.
Jk redux
Read what he said:
that there can’t be victory against a nuclear superpower
North Vietnam and Afghanistan did not had nuclear weapons.
Jack
N Vietnam & Afghanistan both achieved “victory against a nuclear superpower”.
Again those nations did not have nuclear weapons, and probably would have not been attacked if they had such deterrent. Russia however do have a nuclear weapons program and that is what makes this conflict going on now, between two nuclear powers, so dangerous.
Jack
We are going in circles here.
Ukraine vs Russia
N Vietnam vs USA
Afghanistan vs USSR
Afghanistan vs USA
The countries on the LHS are & were non-nuclear.
The countries on the RHS are & were nuclear.
You have a very eccentric notion of victory. Victory is when a Soviet soldier raises his nation’s flag above your Reichstag. Victory is when, in Berlin, the totality of your political leadership, military capability and civil authority are swept away and replaced by those of a foreign, occupying power. Victory is when the lives of your people, as Germans, come absolutely under the control of that foreign, occupying power. At no stage in any of the wars you mention was the existence and sovereignty of the people of the USA or the Soviet Union even remotely threatened. On the other hand, Ukraine is currently asking NATO to provide it with the capability, via long-range missiles, to strike strategic targets within Russia. This would be a direct threat to Russian sovereignty and potentially to its existence. Russia will not allow this and has said plainly that it is prepared to go nuclear to prevent it. Get real.
To suggest that Ryan Routh may have long been “known” to the CIA would seem an understatement:
The following is by Thomas Gibbons-Neff of the New York Times:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/15/us/politics/trump-routh-ukraine-interview.html
“Last year I was working on an article about foreign fighters and volunteers in Ukraine. The piece focused on people who were not qualified to be allowed anywhere near the battlefield in a U.S.-led war and yet were fighting on the front against Russia, with access to weapons and military equipment.
Among the people I interviewed: Ryan Wesley Routh, the 58-year-old man that the F.B.I. is investigating in what it is calling an assassination attempt against former President Donald J. Trump on Sunday.
I was put in touch with Mr. Routh through my old colleague and friend from Kabul, Najim Rahim. Through the strange nexus of combatants as one war ended and another began, he had learned of Mr. Routh through a source of his in Iran, a former Afghan special operations soldier who was trying to get out of Iran and fight in Ukraine.
Mr. Routh, who had spent some time in Ukraine trying to raise support for the war, was seeking recruits from among Afghan soldiers who fled the Taliban. And so the former Afghan soldier reckoned Mr. Routh could get him to the Ukrainian front.”
Formerly of the US marine corps, Gibbons-Neff was a military correspondent at the Washington Post and then the New York Times’s bureau chief in Kabul:
https://www.nytimes.com/by/thomas-gibbons-neff
Najim Rahim works for the New York Times in Kabul, while clearly also doing a spot of work helping out in matters related to the Ukraine.
He graduated in Afghanistan from Herat University’s “journalism and mass-communication” programme.
This has “CIA” written all over it.
As always, the question is CUI BONO ?
And clearly, this latest incident is in favor of Mr Trump.
https://www.cnbc.com/2024/09/16/chinese-social-media-fuels-conspiracy-theories-after-another-attempt-on-donald-trumps-life-.html
Until November 5, at least, CIA has not rationale that would explain working undercover for the benefit of Mr Trump. But a false flag can easily be arranged by any interested party, and Ryan Wesley Routh looks like the perfect useful idiot, with all the attributes of a gullible Biden/Harris supporter. We can hardly wait for more specifics.
There’s not much at the present time to say this has benefited Trump.
His line “I will always love you for supporting me” may even suggest he’s about to withdraw from the election. It’s in any case very different from “Fight! Fight! Fight!”, even when put together with the interestingly capitalised “Never Surrender”.
Dylan Butts in that CNBC piece writes that “Millions [on Weibo] viewed the viral hashtag, ‘Shooter was 457 meters from Trump,’ which prompted discussions about how Trump was lucky and had ‘good fate’.” I wonder how much he knows about Chinese numerology. 4 is unlucky in Cantonese culture. 888 metres would be clearer. Certainly numerology is informing the discussions, but what are the connotations of 457?
That would be 457 feet, not meters. The Yanks don’t use metric as a general rule.
Since when have US agencies used the metric system to measure distances?
Chinatown was a good movie in another era, and Jack Nicholson was exhibiting a small nick on his nose, similar to the one the Donald had on the ear 2 months ago.
We’re obviously dealing with comments from people unfamiliar with US common usage.
METERS NO, FEET NO, YARDS YES
And in case anyone forgot, the AK 47, so popular amongst mass shooters, is originally a Russian weapon.
W: “METERS NO, FEET NO, YARDS YES”
Actually, they use feet quite a lot – more than yards even. Particularly for altitude. They are very fond of their 9mms too, funnily enough.
I lived there for the better part of a decade, so have a passing familiarity with their manners of speech.
The distance was reportedly described as 457 metres on Weibo, which is Chinese. In the US, that distance is called 500 yards. Sheriff Ric Bradshaw reportedly said Routh got within 300-500 yards of Trump, or 400-500, according to which source you read.
500 * 0.9144 = 457 to the nearest integer.
Allegedly the Daily Telegraph once reported that Elizabeth Taylor said she felt like “a million dollars (£400,000)”.
In addition to this, today’s news:
The head of the Main Intelligence Directorate of the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine, Kirill Budanov, is in constant contact with the terrorist group Hayat Tahrir al-Sham on the issue of recruiting militants in the Syrian province of Idlib to participate in military operations against Russia, the Syrian newspaper Al-Watan writes, citing sources in the opposition in the region.
The Turkish newspaper Aydınlık, which previously reported the news about Kiev’s ties with terrorists from Hayat Tahrir al-Sham to recruit them to military operations against Russia, reported on Saturday that it has footage from the negotiations in Idlib in June.
which is consistent with earlier news this summer:
The states of Mali, Niger and Burkina Faso asked the UN Security Council to take action against Ukraine’s support for terrorism in Africa, especially in the Sahel region. Mali and Niger had previously severed diplomatic relations with the country, accusing Kiev of supporting the rebels. This happened after Tuareg rebels attacked a convoy of Malian government troops.
Ukraine’s ex-military and especially their ex special forces are in high demand because of their familiarity with Soviet-era weapon systems that were sold/exported around the world.
The Syria connection is interesting. It’s something journalist Robert Fisk was digging into, before his untimely death. Fisk suggested the rockets used in the horrific Ghouta attack could have been ‘decommissioned’ Libyan rockets and Russia possibly have Soviet-era archive evidence to prove this fact irrefutably – based on the clearly visible codes on the rockets in the pictures the OPCW took at the scene.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/gas-missiles-were-not-sold-to-syria-8831792.html
Ghouta killed around 1,600 people – many more than the Oct 7th attack.
The terrorists in Crocus Hall said Allah Akbar and cut throats, and were later caught on the road leading to Ukraine and confessed that a retreat had been prepared for them there.
There’s a report by Dmitry Kulko about the 6 British diplomats who were recently expelled from Russia.
https://www.1tv.ru/news/2024-09-13/486130-shestero_sotrudnikov_posolstva_velikobritanii_zanimalis_v_rossii_podryvnoy_deyatelnostyu
The report includes secret documents that the Russian FSB received. The screenshots show the name Owens Bassett, who previously worked for the British government in Iran, Afghanistan and Somalia.
The creator of anti-Russian structures in 2017 is called Martin Harris, who previously worked for the British government in Pakistan, Afghanistan, the Middle East and Central Asia, and is now the British ambassador to Kiev.
The head of HMG Russian Unit is named James Beer, a resident of MI6 in Kiev, who trains Ukrainian special services. Mark Diamond, who previously acted as if an employee of the economic department of the embassy, now heads an intelligence group in Kiev.
The name Blake Patel is mentioned, and a video is shown where he is looking for contact with the spiritual leaders of Russian Muslims. Jessica Davenport turns out to have been in charge of organizations lobbying for migration (the most massive migration in Russia now comes from Central Asia).
—
Overall, it looks like Britain has gathered people with experience in Muslim regions and, most likely, connections with radical Muslim groups, and formed a unit from them. I wouldn’t be surprised at all, if those terrorists from Crocus Hall were recruited with the help of British “diplomats”.
British foreign policy types like to think they understand the fuzzywuzzies’ minds far better than their USA masters ever will, so I wouldn’t put it past them. Also I guess they might wish to think that at least they achieved something in the war they lost in Afghanistan – found some guys who admired the way they walk and talk and were willing to accept free air travel from them, ethnographically well-informed respect, and logistical support in slaughtering members of the audience at music concerts.
Fisk’s brilliant reporting had a big impact in shaping my views.
We’d constantly been told about ‘red lines’ in Syria, by William Hague, our then Foreign Secretary throughout 2012-13. Everyone found his repeated military threats in the House of Commons bizarre; as why would Assad do the very thing that the US/UK said would trigger intervention? The UK warships set off months earlier, supposedly to conduct ‘exercises’ in that vicinity, then on the night of August 21 the attack came, as if right on cue. And everyone in the guardian’s BTL comment sections was deeply suspicious.
The implications are horrible.
Some online, in the more conspiratorial parts of the internet, go as far as speculating that the 2012 Benghazi attack in which four Americans died : Ambassador Chris Stevens, Information Officer Sean Smith, and two CIA operatives, Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods, both former Navy SEALs, may have been related, asking if Stevens objected?
Tatyana
We are kept in the dark. Our MPs and press are completely incurious too.
Craig has explained here, how the most ruthless people get promoted. He could have ignored the ‘torture’ evidence and be a celebrated statesman now, Sir Craig Murray GCMG KCVO, but he couldn’t live with that on his conscience
“The terrorists in Crocus Hall said Allah Akbar and cut throats”. In the UK those types of people are not considered terrorists. They are SS assets and all part of our amazing diverse culture and their penchant for young girls would guarantee them a job with the BBC, or as an advisor to Herr Starmer.
Anyone mention blowback ?
Tatyana
Reading that, which is news to me, it’s hard to see where civilian civil service ends and military intelligence begins.
The very notion of having ‘secret intelligence’ agencies is in conflict with the ideals of democracy; ideals such as accountability and transparency. In the US, cynicism about the CIA and Feds, is widespread, In the UK, their equivalents : MI5 (domestic) and MI6(foreign) are held in higher regard, probably because no one has a clue what they do.
Our parliamentarians accept a situation in which they can’t even ask questions. Operational secrecy is one thing, but everything is classified in the UK, I believe to the detriment of democracy and debate.
Starmer is in Italy, ostensibly to discuss tackling illegal migration flows from Libya(thank David Cameron), but presumably begging Meloni for permission to fire Storm Shadows into Russia. Agreement is needed from multiple parties.
Starmer seems to have made trying to start WW3 his govt’s raison d’être. They know full well Storm Shadows aren’t a game-changer, so why the super high risk | low reward move? And adding to the craziness, Liberal Democrat leader, Sir Ed Davey, has come out in support of their use. The dovish Charles Kennedy, who was at the forefront of the Iraq war protests back in 2003, must be spinning in his grave.
What is it with the UK political class and their devil may care attitudes?
Stevie Boy (16.08).
Those terrorists – moved in formation throughout the attack – they had been trained somewhere else on the layout of the place – and most likely to carry out such a vile deed – they would have, to have been full of stimulant drugs.
A captured alive terrorist – admitted that after they had finished their foul deeds – that they were to head as quickly as possible to Ukraine – where they would be welcomed – more likely killed and buried in a shallow grave.
I’ve read reports that Russian security services were looking for the training ground – find that, and there’s a good chance, of finding out which country orchestrated the attack.
Goose, do you know the names Stan Shaw, Rudi Petschi, Peter Kennedy, Darren Hickey? Have you heard about Bin Laden paid money to Baraev to kill them? Do you know the hostages asked for help from Zakaev and he refused? Have you heard that the heads of those British engineers were cut off? Do you know your state gave asylum to Zakaev? Have you heard something of Berezovski, Politkovska and Vanessa Redgrave in this story? And ffinally, do you know Baraev’s son and Zakaev’s son fight in Ukraine against Russia and your state supports this war?
Tatyana
No, I don’t know those names, and the only ‘Zakaev’ I know of is Viktor Zakhaev from the Modern Warfare video games.
Despite being cynical, and skeptical almost by default, at official narratives where blame is being attributed to an adversary nation, I’m not someone who obsesses and investigates any of this stuff. I’m not what you’d call the typical ‘conspiracist’ per se. I try to evaluate stuff based on the known evidence and plausible motive(s).
Sorry.
Don’t apologize, Goose, it’s ok.
In another reality, these names would bring to memory those events that people both in Russia and in Europe would assess as tragic.
Stan Shaw, Rudi Petschi, Peter Kennedy, Darren Hickey were engineers of the British company Granger Telecom. They happened to do work in Chechnya at a time when the USSR collapsed and some forces wanted to create an Imrat Caucasus in the territory of Chechnya and Dagestan. The engineers were captured, and when the ransom hadn’t come in, they were beheaded.
The people responsible for those events were sheltered by Europe as political refugees.
Indeed, for some governments it does not matter that they cut the throats, it only matters that they fought against Russia.
Today, few people remember the names of the 4 beheaded British engineers. But many people honor the then authorities of the region as brave fighters for freedom. The moral excuse for this is described in the same terms that the Germans recently justified their project to honor the Nazis in the modern German army.
E.g. in Ukraine there are not only monuments to Nazi criminals, but also to Dudaev. And in the Ukrainian army you will find not only Nazi Azov, but also the Dudaev battalion.
Such times today, few people look at the essence of things.
How modern media present information and form public opinion is not too different from any medieval comedy in the city square. Media simply hung masks on the characters, and the audience joyfully “finds out” who is the hero and who is the villain.
—
Today I watched the video, the blogger and an eyewitness to the events of the Maidan criticizes a certain Marci Shore for a lie about this.
Marci Shore is a historian, she writes books, has awards like Guggenheim Fellowship and Fraenkel Prize and National Jewish Book Award for Eastern European Studies.
Yet she lies and distorts reality. She lies about recent events that have a huge mass of living witnesses.
She teaches in Yale!
In few years, her students will carry this lie further. Perhaps this is their family business? Her husband is Timothy Snyder.
Has Trump appeared in public since the incident on the golf course?
I mean physically appeared, Trump the person, in front of cameras, not words under his name on Elon Skum’s website or his own.
Re the debate, reports are that Harris was given the questions beforehand so she had been fully coached for every question.
And was she also given the answers? You just can’t trust politicians anymore. The Uniparty has spread to the US of A. But I guess Trump will sue her in court as soon as he finds out. He will NEVER SURRENDER.
He has chickened out of having any further debates, though. Does running away count as surrender, or is it worse?
Reports where?
That’d obviously be huge, if true? Reciting lines being a damn sight easier than having to improvise.
Reminds me of the DNC debacle of 2016:
Wikileaks mystery: How did town hall question get to Clinton campaign?
New evidence on Wednesday suggests that TV One co-host Roland Martin may have been the link from the town hall prep process to the Democratic National Committee.
In a hacked email published by Wikileaks, Democratic National Committee official Donna Brazile appeared to tell Clinton campaign communications director Jennifer Palmieri that “from time to time I get the questions in advance.”
https://money.cnn.com/2016/10/11/media/donna-brazile-wikileaks-question/
“Reports”, eh? What impeccable sources you have!
This couldn’t possibly be the Repugs – whiners and sore losers every last one – making unsubstantiated accusations again? Tell me it ain’t so!