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The “news” media have been utterly irresponsible – they’ve been pushing this “freedom” nonsense for months – what would it mean to be “free” of fire precautions, or traffic and firearm laws, or even just sewage and waste disposal regulation?
The first UK lockdown nearly worked. Maybe it did work; we’ll never know now. It started too late but eventually infection prevalence was pushed very low; we could have transitioned to a suppression with trace-and-test policy like China’s. But the government dished out the 37 billion quid for trace-and-test to a friend of theirs – corruption.
The other plank that has to be in place is support for absolutely everyone. It’s pointless telling people to self-isolate if they can only get money by continuing to work. A Universal Basic Income would have empowered the population – if an employer had refused to ventilate and institute safe practices, workers would have had the economic freedom to tell him where to stuff his damn job. Working conditions would have improved within days.
There are simple, practical solutions to covid. Only ideology stands in their way.
Deaths are beginning to rise again which was inevitable given the rise in mechanically ventilated that preceded. Is there any good news? Well, hospital admissions and deaths are about one tenth of what they were with similar levels of positive tests in Jan and ventilated patients are about one sixth of the number back in Jan. Vaccination appears to have helped. There is also the issue of long covid which is just past beginning to be acknowledged.
“Freedom Day” is such a cynical politicisation of the situation. It reminds me of “Freedom Fries” back in the Iraq war. I see in the Guardian “England’s Covid unlocking is threat to world, say 1,200 scientists.” Who knows where it’s all headed but for sure covid isn’t done with yet.
Prof Chris Whitty said the number of people in hospital with Covid was doubling roughly every three weeks.
The United Kingdom is “not out of the woods yet”
Well Prof Whitty, that is almost certainly an understatement.
Still not a peep from the conspiracy theorists then? I’m shocked, shocked I tell you!
This asinine talking point of “If not now, then when…?” really is only fit for the ears of the terminally stupid, and to be uttered by cynical manipulators who lack any sensible argument.
The “when” is surely not at a time of over 50K new cases/day, and doubling each week. I heard some government apologist on radio-4 this morning (The Week in Westminster or something) explaining that now was the time, because the date had been established for quite a while now.
Got that, virus? The date has long been marked on the calendar, so don’t say you haven’t been given sufficient notice.
Another cracker was from Health Secretary Javid – there will be “no going back”, and lifting restrictions is his “absolute priority”.
No going back. Doesn’t matter how many deaths there are, how ill people become, even if every last person in the country dies – there will be No Going Back. Take that, virus – the man is serious!
It’s also curious that lifting restrictions is the “absolute priority” for a health secretary. Not defeating the virus, not preventing deaths and long illnesses, not over-running the hospitals.
Still no word from the denialists, who stated categorically that the government (all governments, worldwide, actually) wanted to restrict us forever? Thought they’d be delighted to see all these far-right governments are on their side. Thought they’d be crowing about it. Most strange.
Health Secretary Javid, now has covid, Boris is starting to be unsure about “Freedom Day” as we are almost up to 55k a day.
How has it accelerated so fast, two thirds of adults are double-jabbed
Do the jabs work properly or only partially?
Freedom Day was aimed for the hot sunny weather, well it could barely be hotter or sunnier.
Something is going very wrong but what is going wrong?How the Covid “Pandemic” Was Orchestrated
Everything you should know about Covid
By Paul Craig Roberts
PaulCraigRoberts.org
July 16, 2021
— SNIP —[ Mod: This contribution reproduced a 2,148 word article from the economist and fringe commentator Paul Craig Roberts, with not a word of original commentary. Please do not paste lengthy articles that are available elsewhere. This particular article can be found on numerous covid-sceptic websites, and is available with updates at: https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2021/07/15/how-the-covid-pandemic-was-orchestrated/ ]
The links in my above post are missing, all here:
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2021/07/paul-craig-roberts/how-the-covid-pandemic-was-orchestrated/
This one not in article
https://odysee.com/@Corona-Ausschuss:3/Sitzung-60-Die-Zeit-ist-kein-flacher-Kreis-5-Martin:f?r=6MWs3ayHwcFCXKZtazKgEszyrbBpefstCatalogue of unsubstantiated assertions I am afraid, utter nonsense. Political analysts are not scientists.
Go to the article and read the links
Show me the science in the posts above
Most of you are Marxists and we know what your agenda is and it is not freedom. See history.
You are just “useful idiots” as Stalin said. If you are successful you will meet a similar fate.If you think we are Marxists then that defines you as far right. Most covid deniers come from that quarter anyway.
The usual conspiracy theorist ploy to invite us to read lengthy articles by known conspiracists and watch hours of videos. Why has that ceased to convince?
Mods Andy seems to flout all the rules. He is impugning our motives. He posts an article which has no scientific references just lots of allegations then invites us to read it or post scientific comments.
Tell you what Andy. I accept your challenge if you write and tell me why PCR (That is Paul Craig Roberts, not Polymerase Chain Reaction, which like all these deniers apparently gives you 95% false positives) is right in your words and hopefully by linking to some real science. I promise I will respond to your challenge then.Nice one, the article by PCR linked to above gives Tanzania as an example of low number of documented cases and deaths with Covid-19. That was because the covid-skeptic president, who has since died allegedly of Covid-19 has ordered that tests should not be carried out or any covid-19 related statistics released.
Fair enough.
I have an open mind but posted it because I found Clark and others provocative. I am here because I believe we are living under tyranny. What we need is honest and open debate. I don,t think Clark and others believe in open debate.
FWIW the Westminster government should have no control over Scotland at all but you could end up with something worse.
Please stop calling Brexiters racist little Englanders. I am on the side of an independent Scotland but I would also like an independent England, an independent, Bedford and an independent me. Clark believes my income should be stolen to pay for UBI but I and others will just go elsewhere as I have already done and then who will pay?And BTW I have posted enough information for anyone to find me, let’s see you all do the same.
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[ Mod: Commenters are not required to reveal their personal details on this website. ]“And BTW I have posted enough information for anyone to find me, let’s see you all do the same.”
I don’t know who you are and it really doesn’t matter to me who you are as this is a forum for people to express their opinions and sometimes, where needed, to bolster that with scientific or other references that are credible. The links you have posted are not exactly neutral, Lew Rockwell describes himself as an anarcho-capitalist and then you send us a link to a site called Odysee with an interview of someone that lasts over an hour. Difficult to know their orientation but from the German title sounds like the Corona Alliance, and we still don’t know what you are trying to achieve here. It seems that you are just using this as a billboard to disseminate covid skeptic websites and propaganda. This is not a good start for an open discussion as you claim you are seeking.
I have a gentle theory that we may be getting to herd immunity in the U.K.
An eighth of a million have died of covid,
more than five million have officially caught covid
but that is probably a fraction of those who have had some covid,
most with barely noticing they have been ill.
Two thirds of the adult population have been double jabbed.So we are “finding” people who have some covid in them, even if they have been doubled jabbed, like our new Health Secretary.
We test double any other country, if France tested as many as are tested in the U.K. they would “find” many more people with some covid in them.
Perhaps we should now revert to only testing people who are ill?I’m Clark Killick; my name and address are on the Chelmsford electoral roll. Craig Murray could confirm my identity. I’m not a Marxist.
– “Clark believes my income should be stolen to pay for UBI”
UBI stands for “Universal Basic Income”, and “universal” means everyone, so that includes you, Andy Bacon. You therefore seem to be arguing for your personal privilege to have more than others, but do correct me if I’ve got that wrong. How much more? How much less should others have? Should they go short of, say, food, shelter or water to support your greater rights? Life itself, perhaps?
– “I found Clark […] provocative.”
So far as I can determine we’ve never met so it must be something I wrote. Care to specify, so that we can discuss it?
– “I don,t think Clark and others believe in open debate.”
Well you could at least try before giving up. Maybe you already did, but under some other username? Possibly my use of the term “conspiracy theorists” provokes you, but let’s be clear; you seem to be dismissing the pandemic as a vast hoax ie. a grand conspiracy, so the term seems appropriate.
Michael
The question of the herd immunity is a complex one and depends on several factors, vaccine coverage, vaccine effectiveness in reducing transmission, numbers with natural infection and also the virus itself. The delta variant has a much higher R value. The further complication is also how long the immunity lasts and in future whether a variant that is resistent to current vaccines emerges. This paper is perhaps too technical and I do not claim to understand it completely but it explains these constant interactions. Note that vaccine coverage in UK is quoted as number of adults vaccinated which leaves a sizeable number of susceptible children. Also because the vaccine effectiveness in reducing transmission is about 86%, 14% of those vaccinated are still susceptible and also the unvaccinated adults. This is why there is this sudden rise of cases which is due to the delta variant and its increased rate of transmission. I doubt we are anywhere near herd immunity in UK.Michael norton:
– “So we are “finding” people who have some covid in them, even if they have been doubled jabbed, like our new Health Secretary. We test double any other country, if France tested as many as are tested in the U.K. they would “find” many more people with some covid in them.”
PCR indeed can be sensitive enough to detect fragments of virus from old infections that people’s immune system have killed, but if the high infection prevalence found were caused merely by the number of tests performed, the graph of positive test results would have a shape similar to the graph of total tests performed. It doesn’t. The graph of tests performed is here:
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/testing
No resemblance. The positive tests graph has the characteristic rising curve of anything that grows, including a spreading infection.
A proportion of samples that tested positive are also sent to Milton Keynes for genetic sequencing. Virus fragments from old infections are revealed because they’re too short to be sequenced. And when infection prevalence is rising fast, as it is now, new, active infections will always greatly outnumber detections of old virus fragments.
If testing were reduced we’d just degrade our data source for assessing how effective the various vaccines are, and our warning about potential oncoming hospital demand. Abandoning testing is a “rose tinted spectacles” strategy, or “head in the sand” to be less polite about it.
SA – “I doubt we are anywhere near herd immunity in UK.”
We can’t be, or infection prevalence couldn’t be rising as fast as the tests show.
The total number vaccinated is shown here:
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations
35,732,297 have had two doses; that’s just over half of the entire UK population.
“Head in the Sand”
Apparently it had been said that in one week more than 500,000 people got NHS pinged.
In a few weeks time it is now suggested five million persons could be asked to self isolate, for ten days, even if they are double jabbed and have consequently taken part in a test which suggests they are not currently infected with Delta. Most of those persons will not become ill.
There is already a shortage of drivers, food is going to become scarce, transport will become more and more hit and miss, yet hardly anyone will be ill?
If Freedom Day happens tomorrow,
we will as a nation have to get on with life, that is the thing about life, either you give up and die or you decide to keep living and you just have to get on with it.
Eighteen months of freedom has been stolen from us, enough is a fucking nuff.– “in one week more than 500,000 people got NHS pinged.”
Yes, that is inevitable when attempting trace-and-test at the same times as infection is being permitted to spiral out of control. The best use of social restrictions is to get infection prevalence low enough that trace-and-test can take over, keeping it low by finding nearly everyone who’s infected. This is what China and Australia have been doing, and what New South Wales has just abandoned.
– “Most of those persons will not become ill” compared with “yet hardly anyone will be ill?” – they’re not the same thing. A small proportion of a large number can still be a large number. We’re talking of millions getting infected, so hundreds of thousands becoming ill.
Not so much “enough is enough” as “too little, too late”. New Zealand, China and Australia have all demonstrated that early, strong restrictions enable much more freedom overall, including freedom from covid.
– “either you give up and die or you decide to keep living”
People don’t decide to die of covid; the illness takes their life against their will.
