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This is all becoming insane. Perhaps we are all victims of lockdown.
– “The prevailing superciliousness, condescension, wrath and resentment of the primary contributors directed towards absolutely anyone venturing another opinion, misguided or otherwise, renders the thread purely a source of entertainment value to me.”
Yeah, that’s entertainment. The Jam, Youtube, 03:32.
– “Perhaps we are all victims of lockdown”
Yeah, anything but the pandemic.
I’d be staying home and minimising social contact at present even if there were NO rules, because it’s obviously the correct course of action in these circumstances. It’s common sense; “oh don’t get near me, you don’t want to catch what I’ve got”, we’ve all said it to each other for decades. But suddenly, when it’s serious enough for the government to say it too (albeit weeks late. Twice.), suddenly it’s cause for suspicion, and there’s no reason to believe it works. Funny, that.
And everyone who says the pandemic’s no problem, well, they’re just lovely, and very clever, and anyone who says it’s a hoax, well just say nothing, and anyone who links to data or describes the common symptoms, well they’re mean and nasty and rude and on a moral crusade.
Well I’m sick of it, and I’m calling it out.
Come on, I’ve been gone nearly two hours; no new comments about how mean, rude, supercilious, morally overbearing and just generally nasty I am? Come on, where’s your wartime spirit? There are old and sick people need to be deprived of medical treatment, they never deserved a life anyway. There are statistics to be discredited, common sense and changeable, uncertain science to be undermined with pages and pages of argument over details.
Chimneys. Bicycles. Yes I am a robot.
Where’s the little boy? I want to shoot the little boy.
Bridges. Crosswalks. Traffic lights. Buses. Traffic lights. Fire hydrants. I’m not a robot.
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[ Mod: CAPTCHA says it would offer you a cup of tea if it had one in its database. ]So here comes my latest bullet for an innocent boy’s brain.
COVID Imact @CovidSerology
– Manaus has now surpassed the very tragic 26 April 2020 burial record of 167 with 198 burials in the past 24 hours (13 Jan 2021) for a total of 1486 burials in January with 50% higher ICU occupancy than in April. Hard to see how Manaus avoids crossing 5k pandemic-related excess DPM (deaths per million).
All lies, of course, caused by Bill Gates’ underlings like me threatening “scientists” with firing squads. And that’s how fibre-optic communication, GPS, contraceptives and colour flat screens were developed too; they’re all just hoaxes.
Well done Steph; it did take you a few weeks, but I’m posting more than just data now. Yes, I do have feelings too.
Oh and I spoke to a “friend” this evening (not that anyone as obnoxious and moralising as me as me has any real friends), she has a contact in Southend hospital. They’ve had to reduce the oxygen to 88% because they have so many patients that they can’t supply 100% to all that need it.
But of course they’re just saying that or Bill Gates would have them shot.
I’ve looked at the euromomo page and it’s interesting. For some reason I had thought I’d read that their data didn’t include UK and Ireland. I was wrong. Anyhow. You can do a bit more fiddling with their graphs. From age 45 up the graphs are almost identical. The 15-44 age group does show a smaller increase. I am not sure how they define “substantial increase” but I am guessing it is related to standard deviations. I couldn’t find their explanation on the site. I am sure it is there somewhere though. The deaths for 0-14 age group are lower in 2020. I wonder if that is related to schools closing and less kids being involved in accidents.
“Other things of note are that, in Europe as a whole, the excess deaths in the second wave are still only about 50% of those experienced in the first wave,..”
Yes but is more protracted and there will be adjustments to the end of the period because of late registrations etc.
” there is some difficulty in connecting a given co-morbidity directly to covid-19 etc etc.”
I think (and may well be wrong) that Steph is referring to the mechanism by which a co-morbidity causes a greater susceptibility to serious disease. As an example, they still haven’t worked out by what mechanism diabetes makes people more susceptible apart from the generality that diabetes makes just about any disease worse.
Started this post like 3 hours ago but got interrupted frequently. I’m not a robot either but some of those CAPTCHAs are hard 😀 Request localisation of CAPTCHA, all those photos are from USA. What is a fire hydrant?
Come on Steph, aren’t you going to say “but surely 100% oxygen is toxic”, just to get a bit of doubt in there, like the bloke who saw the mortuary must have had a faulty memory? Well I’m no specialist, but she must have meant 88% of whatever they normally use, OK?
– “Perhaps we are all victims of lockdown”
No. I’m a victim of a weeks-long emotional tirade. Node could tell you; this happened to me on the 9/11 thread when I came under sustained personal attack from multiple commenters, though he’ll pitch it as me “trying to get the thread closed down”, even though I’d reopened the thread multiple times and it was actually him that appealed to the mods to have me censored.
When I wrote about morbidity I meant that as a medical term which is the burden of disease caused by COVID-19 and obviously as a layperson Steph though I was talking about pre-existing co-morbidities in patients who also had COVID-19 which explains the confusion.
Steph: I can understand why Clark is upset at you, actually. To you, this is an interesting little debate which should be conducted in a polite manner. What about this? What about that? Isn’t this curious? Why should that be then? With the default position being, everyone else is taken in with this ridiculous hoax that the entire world’s medical, political, media, civil service, social authorities is perpetrating – even the undertakers must be in on it. All at the behest of – you fill in the rest.
What you are doing is causing doubts, giving people license to abuse the rules intended to stop this pandemic. That is not polite, and people understandably get annoyed. You – personally – are responsible for a lot of harm, from the deaths of innocents, to the abuse of shop workers trying to suggest that people follow the rules, to medics literally working themselves to death trying to stop it.
Why you personally? Because you – and Node, and Dave, and everyone like you – are helping spread falsehoods, nonsense, lies, and encouraging deadly behaviour. Every time you pop up with your silly little articles and give them further readership. Every time you encourage liars and lunatics when they tell others there’s nothing to worry about.
I wonder if you did this about smoking? There was a whole industry, the merchants of doubt, dedicated to making people skeptical about the dangers of smoking. Did you think it cute to take their side, and so encourage people to carry on smoking? Do you also do this with climate change? Or is this the one thing on which you’ve decided it would be really clever to be a contrarian.
Maybe you think it’s clever to call all medics and authorities liars, and call people like me stupid, gullible sheep, while endangering society. How dare you. That is not polite.
And also Steph, the fact that you stated that you come here just for entertainment value was something that I personally also found offensive. If you are asking genuine questions about a very serious life and death situation, you don’t also just want to be entertained.
But the ultimate responsibility does not lie with Steph and the other contrarians. All of us have been immersed lifelong in a political and media environment that we know cannot be trusted (WMDs in Iraq?), but at the same time subconsciously inculcates certain attitudes. Here is an example:
- Report on face masks’ effectiveness for Covid-19 divides scientists – Guardian
- Experts clash over research into efficacy of public wearing even homemade face coverings
- “A row has erupted among scientists over a new report into the use of face masks by the general public”
How did the Guardian find this “division”, “row”, “clash”, “eruption”? Did a reporter walk into some university and find a load of scientists shouting at each other? Did some scientists hear that the Guardian had an article coming out, and phone the Guardian switchboard as a matter of urgency? Or is it more likely that some Guardian writer ‘phoned around some universities to find some “human interest”, to secure some “column inches” and the associated payment? No matter. How about this one:
- Coronavirus: should everyone be wearing face masks? – Guardian again.
This time, just to make the point, we have a face-to-face in red and blue circles to make our “scientists” look like gladiators! I could cite hundreds of examples, and we haven’t even descended to the gutter tabloids yet. Remember it was Delingpole of the respectable broadsheet Telegraph who gave space to Yeadon. Dave thinks that some pathologist or whatnot that the Daily Mail has run several articles from is “the expert” to be trusted.
Is it any wonder that Steph thinks that “science” is “divided” and “changeable”, and can all be dismissed as “opinion”?
When did the corporate media ever tell us that evidence is what matters rather than “experts”?
And in the realm of conspiracy theory, the corporate media (with their near universal reach) inculcate by example. Media Lens have an excellent article on this:
Conspiracy Theories Malign And Benign – Face Masks And Israeli Training Of US Police
Last week, Mail on Sunday columnist Peter Hitchens tweeted on the use of face masks:
“the primary purpose of enforced muzzle wearing in public spaces (which protects nobody against anything) is to humiliate the wearer and make him or her accustomed to unquestioning obedience to authority”.
This was indeed a conspiracy theory – literally, and also, in our opinion, in the deranged and dangerous sense commonly used by journalists.
Remarkably, Hitchens was suggesting that governments around the world have ordered the public to wear face masks as part of a vast global conspiracy, presumably involving thousands of professional scientists, to train us in obedience to authority. Perhaps Hitchens also believes that the enforced wearing of seat belts in cars and on planes is part of the same sinister plan ‘to humiliate’ democratic citizens ‘and make him or her accustomed to unquestioning obedience to authority’.
Why, that’s exactly what Dave has claimed on this very thread! Yet Dave is no sheeple who’d shoot a little boy in cold blood to force him to conform to a lie! No way; Dave has seen right through the “MSM”. And he isn’t the source of the “superciliousness, condescension, wrath and resentment” either.
Because the corporate media indoctrinates subconsciously, I have to assume that I’m susceptible too; I wouldn’t be conscious of it, that’s what “subconscious” means. I therefore simply won’t have it in my house. No telly, no radio, no newspapers, no browsing from corporate media homepages. I’ll follow a link; that’s how I found the Guardian examples above. But I won’t let the corporate media set the agenda.
Instead I inspect the evidence, and check that the scientific consensus is consistent with it. And nearly always, it is.
Entertainment by Frank Zappa:
- “I’m the slime oozing out from your TV set” – YouTube, several minutes.
You’re giving these denialists way too much credit, Clark.
It’s not as if they’re all confused by a “debate” between scientists that they’re following, or pondering the efficacy of home-made masks compared with factory produced – they’re pretending that the _entire thing_ is a gigantic hoax and nobody is actually getting ill and dying with Covid at all!
The hospitals are all empty really, didn’t you know? We’ve simply got people dying of old age, and obese smokers keeling over with heart attacks, and the crooked doctors sneakily stamp “COVID-19” on the death certificate. Maybe they did have Covid, but it’s such a mild disease (“a little flu”, perhaps) that they didn’t notice before dying of something completely unrelated.
All this, so that Bill Gates can have his killer vaccines… Agenda-21…. the “Great Reset”… pharmaceutical giants… government control… cull the population – take your pick.
No, they don’t have to believe any of that stupid, self-contradictory rot, spread it around, encourage others to behave recklessly, and basically be working on behalf of the virus. They are entirely to blame for their own behaviour, and they are largely to blame for the mess we’re in.
He’ll be alright, its the same tactic Clark has been using for years.
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[ Mod: You reckon Clark’s expressions of distress are insincere, and he’s not genuinely distressed? So you’re prepared to press forward with your taunts regardless?That seems to parallel your approach to the Covid situation, and it says a lot about your *****pathic personality type. ]
What do you mean telepathic?
Dave has not contributed usefully here and his only contributions have been to push his pro Trump agenda. He, like some of the others show lack of compassion which is part of the Covid denial.
Further to my last note, Clark – consider that these denialists are not just getting mixed messages and aren’t sure what to think. They actively look for disinformation and promote it. Having had numerous false claims shot down, which obviously takes far more work than promoting their nonsense did in the first place, they don’t pause for thought. They never admit it was wrong. No – they just look for more, and repeat, repeat, repeat.
This is what happened as Squonk’s. When Null Node took a break from disparaging the intelligence and mental health of people who disagreed with him, he challenged Squonk time and again with every bit of pseudo-science and denialist propaganda he could get his slippery hands on. Every single claim Null Node made was comprehensively debunked by Squonk with solid references, but it made no difference. NN had started out with a presumption which never changed in the slightest. In the end, Squonk couldn’t take it anymore and called NN out as being “a fucking psychopath” before shutting down that site altogether. And Null Node would do the same here if he got the chance.
Perhaps John Major was right when he said at times, one needs to condemn a little more and understand a little less. These freaks, denialists, contrarians – they are costing lives for nothing more than their own amusement and self indulgence.
psycho
*****
tele5 = 4
Looks like Dave gets awarded one of Node’s red armbands.
According to the Evening Standard, “Mr Johnson also said the government was stepping up the enforcement of travel quarantine rules at the border and in the country.” (Emphasis added.)
What?? That is a direct admission by the prime minister that quarantine rules haven’t been applied properly at the border. Come on, Keir Starmer, do your “job” and call on Johnson to resign. No point having rules designed to hinder the spread of a pandemic unless they are enforced. Blame can’t be laid at the door of partygoers and park bench sitters for the authorities not enforcing border rules properly. How many entry points are there in GB anyway? Not very many.
Jesus, Dave – so it appears you can’t count up to five either? Beats me how people like you manage to post at all.
“*****pathic” – how many stars there to represent the missing characters? I’ll save you the hard work. There are FIVE of them. Can you say “five”? That’s very good.
“Tele” has FOUR letters. 1-2-3-4. Got it? So that cannot be the right answer.
“Socio” does have FIVE letters. Count them – there’s no shame in counting out loud if you can’t read without moving your lips.
Once you’ve correctly filled in the letters, go and see someone about addressing that condition, it will be far better for everyone.
glenn_uk, people vary, even the UK government was implementing its herd immunity policy right up to March 23, while an entire tenth of the world’s population had been placed under travel restrictions; did they think the Chinese government had shut down its economy for nothing? Yes, they really did. SEP, Somebody Else’s Problem (the See Also section of that link is interesting; it includes “First they came for…” and “Sheeple’). They really were that dismissive. They’re not now.
Many people have dismissed science. Due to the corporate media’s propaganda, they see science as a matter of authority; an activity they’re excluded from. That’s why Node could post that video, and Dave refers to “the best science money can buy”. Yes, these are extreme cases, but Steph described science as changeable, which of course it is, but it doesn’t matter how much money Bill Gates gives to universities, science won’t ever go back to the phlogiston theory of combustion, and I really think a lot of people don’t get that.
Seems I can’t count up to six today. But who cares when there’s a gun to my head anyway. Eighty seven thousand dead now? Who cares?
Your upsetting me. Mods have a word.
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[ Mod: OK, here’s a word for you: “You’re”.Maybe someone will teach you how to use it. ]
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