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Tatyana
<i>”I suppose, there must be something in the very essence of it. For some reason, Kiev and its supporters don’t want it.
Perhaps, there’s something in their position, that would not last if scrutinized properly?”</i>I believe part of the reason for the stubborn Ukraine/Western position is that the west have spent all too much prestige, all too much money, all too much support, rhetoric in support for Ukraine and now they cannot back away so now they rather pick the choice of world war than admitting how colosally wrong they have been on this conflict. Imagine the colosall confidence drop the whole western elite/media will face after this debacle, so from that, they try to uphold the war as long as possible.
John Mearsheimer put it very well last year:
Video: https://youtu.be/9uD5DAg6e4A?t=521
(let me know if you cannot access it and I will try find another source)Perhaps, Jack, very likely it is so.
I’ve also noticed that any call for diplomacy and peace is not countered by the West with anything logical. The West’s arguments boil down to the trivial simplification of “Putin shouldn’t win”, which is essentially the same emotional propaganda, not supported by common sense or good intentions.
This “Putin argument” does not stand up to sound criticism within the framework of logic, but simply divides observers into two opposing emotionally arguing camps.
This is sad.
Maybe it’s time to leave Putin aside and talk about the people of Ukraine? They have been at war there for about 10 years. There’s a conflict there, contradictions that we could try to resolve.Good article by Aaron Maté on Zelly’s fatal error in the Oval Office:
Zelensky’s hostility to peace triggers White House meltdown
Long rewarded by Washington and NATO for undermining diplomacy with Russia, Zelensky grew confrontational — and told outright falsehoods — when Donald Trump and JD Vance told him to make peace.https://www.aaronmate.net/p/zelenskys-hostility-to-peace-triggers
Tatyana
Yes it is the typical fallacy of “zero sum game” mentality, thus according to Ukraine/West Russia must lose and Ukraine must win. They reject talks/diplpmacy because that would mean that Ukraine will have to compromise:
Zero-sum game is a mathematical representation in game theory and economic theory of a situation that involves two competing entities, where the result is an advantage for one side and an equivalent loss for the other.[1] In other words, player one’s gain is equivalent to player two’s loss, with the result that the net improvement in benefit of the game is zero
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-sum_game
Yes I also dislike the personification of the conflict, framing the war as “Putin’s war”, I am sure that if Putin were to die tommorow, the russian policy will not change and if it would change it would become more hawkish – I believe Putin is the best leader west have in Russia, it will not be easier with any other russian president I am sure. The whole focus on Putin lead the analysis completely wrong. And as you say, no one talks about the people how they feel about the war, what they believe is the best solution, what their view on Ukraine is, what their view on Russia is etc.
exactly, Jack.
Why does no one say that special “man-catcher” brigades are grabbing men on Ukrainian streets to send to the front? That Ze signed a law on mobilizing 18-year-olds because there aren’t enough soldiers?I saw Ukrainians talking about ‘war to the end’, at rallies in Berlin and Madrid, where they advocate war while being in a safe place themselves.
A disgusting position, btw, they won’t join the army and are taking their sons to EU, away from this, waiting for someone else to die while winning a piece of land for them. What’s even more disgusting is that most of them didn’t even live on the disputed lands. Some resident of Lvov just really wants Donbass and Crimea to be Ukrainian, and with all this, he hates the residents of Donbass and Crimea and wishes them death.I think now that Ze’s main sponsor has seen the famous Ukrainian school of diplomacy in action (and Ze hasn’t yet offered to play the piano for the Americans!), maybe some other options will finally appear to stop this madness.
I find myself having a little sympathy for the Ukrainian people since the Whitehouse spat. I almost have some sympathy for Ze, though I try to stop myself.
The USA and its European and UK allies deliberately provoked the whole affair since long before the Maidan coup in 2014. They used Ukraine as a battering ram with the goal of strategically defeating Russia. It was their policy. Ukraine and Ze are culpable for allowing that to happen and allowing the inducement of EU/NATO membership, without any actual guarantees of that happening, to sway them. They also allowed a toxic neo-nazi element to gain influence – albeit that too was encouraged, nurtured and funded by USA and Europe.
Grond (the battering ram from Lord of the Rings) fell apart. Now, cynically, the USA and the new Trump team want their money back. They provoked the war, they supplied the weapons to further their policy. Now that it has failed, USA wants its money back.
Like a drug dealer, intoxicating their addicted victim for free only to demand payment at a later date under pain of death. It’s abhorrent.I’ve seen Trump’s new administration described as a revolution. A revolution like the French revolution or the Bolshevik revolution where everything that went before is deemed bad, where every policy from before is overturned. I’m not sure I concur with that view completely. USA and Trump seems to want to disown the previously promulgated policy which is great as far as it goes. However, USA ought to own its mistake and own the cost. USA should get precisely zero compensation and make a commitment to aid for rebuilding Ukraine at USA expense. Same goes for EU and UK and all the other supporters.
I can’t help but feel that Ukraine, having fulfilled its assigned role, is now being asked to pay for the failure of the USA policy.
If I were Ze, I’d be releasing all the compromising communications from the USA/EU/UK as fast as and as widely as possible.
Some more fresh information on Zelensky by people from his own team:
Ukrainian officials believe Zelensky is ‘childlike’ – Spiegel
In an article on Monday, the magazine recounted how the politician came to power on a populist platform back in 2019, dishing out simplistic solutions to the many problems facing Ukraine, including the conflict in Donbass. The outlet quoted a former staff member as saying that Zelensky “didn’t just speak like a populist, that’s how he actually thought,” with an unnamed senior official in Kiev adding that “still today, he has the worldview of a schoolchild.”
https://swentr.site/russia/613626-spiegel-zelensky-like-child/
The other day it was a similar article in the Spectator:
Trump – not Zelensky – is Ukraine’s only hope – written by a person close to Zelensky under a made-up name
https://archive.ph/C2zV7#selection-1659.0-1659.94
Some excerpts:It pains me to admit that at least some of what Donald Trump has said about Zelensky is true.
The war has given Zelensky everything he ever wanted: absolute power, control over billions in foreign aid, and standing ovations from the world. From his very first day in office – which I witnessed first-hand – he was fixated on securing a second term. Publicly, he dismissed any talk of re-election, insisting it was too early. Privately, he never stopped preparing. Zelensky is obsessed with his approval ratings. Even now, he is laying the groundwork for his campaign. Since September 2024, his administration has been funneling extra payments to those who promote his image online – flooding social media with thousands of carefully curated videos showcasing him as the charming actor-turned-wartime leader, clad in his signature khaki T-shirt. But his more decisive strategy has been the systematic elimination of political opponents.
Former Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces Valerii Zaluzhnyi – the most formidable potential challenger – was abruptly dismissed last year and reassigned to a diplomatic post. Insiders report that criminal cases have already been prepared against Zaluzhnyi, should he dare to enter politics.
Today, Zelensky and his circle have consolidated nearly total control over the state. They can manipulate elections, suppress dissent, and imprison whomever they choose. Independent media are officially banned from television and radio airwaves, while opposition and anticorruption activists active online have been threatened with arrest
https://archive.ph/C2zV7#selection-1659.0-1659.94
Zelensky is simply not that nice, courageous, innocent person westerners think he is.
